00:01 - Good morning.

00:03 - Morning.

00:04 - Thank you.

00:06 - My name is Karen Alger, I am.

00:08 - I serve currently as the second vice president

00:11 - of Save the annual conference.

00:15 - Always serves as a wonderful opportunity for all of us

00:18 - to get together and network for professional development.

00:22 - And personal growth as we spend time

00:25 - with our our constituents in our bureaus.

00:29 - This morning with this, panel of state agency

00:34 - representatives, we'll talk about their department priorities

00:38 - and funding opportunities that are available to boroughs.

00:42 - Joining us today are Mike Carroll, PennDOT Secretary.

00:47 - Rick Ludlow, D.C.

00:49 - Ed, deputy secretary for community affairs and development.

00:54 - That is a mouthful.

00:56 - Jessica Shirley, DEP secretary,

01:00 - and Cindy Dunn, DC, and our secretary.

01:05 - I know we're looking forward to hearing from the panelists

01:07 - and having an opportunity to ask them all kinds of questions.

01:11 - At this time, I want to turn the podium over to Ron Goretzka, our PSB

01:17 - senior director of government affairs, who will moderate this session.

01:21 - Thank you.

01:28 - Thank you, Karen, and good morning, everyone.

01:30 - It's great to be back here this morning for our state agency panel.

01:35 - It's always a, a great discussion of various issues which are affecting,

01:40 - all of your boroughs and all communities throughout the Commonwealth.

01:44 - You know, many communities across our state are facing complex issues.

01:49 - Transportation funding, public safety services,

01:53 - storm water management, compliance with state and federal regulations,

01:57 - data centers, just to name a few.

02:04 - Yeah, these these issues often

02:06 - come under state regulations from our agencies in Harrisburg.

02:09 - And PSB works with agencies to help find solutions

02:12 - to problems facing all of our membership.

02:15 - And we're very proud to work

02:16 - with these agencies to help meet the needs of Pennsylvania's borough communities.

02:21 - So, what our goal here, this morning is to hear from, our,

02:27 - our agency secretaries, for information which could be beneficial to your borough.

02:33 - But most importantly, we want to foster an interaction

02:36 - and a dialog between you and your questions and concerns.

02:40 - And, the secretary's so, like yesterday on the legislative panel,

02:46 - I'm just going to go through some short

02:48 - bios of each of our, participants this morning.

02:52 - Secretary of transportation Mike Carroll was first

02:56 - elected to the Pennsylvania State House of Representatives in 2006

03:01 - and subsequently reelected for seven additional terms.

03:05 - He also worked on transportation issues

03:08 - throughout his time in, public office.

03:12 - Mike was Democrat chairman of the House.

03:15 - Transportation Committee from 2018

03:18 - through 2022, which we, had the pleasure of working with him

03:22 - and his staff, in that capacity.

03:25 - Mike formerly worked as the chief of staff for then state rep John Ude,

03:31 - served as legislative liaison for PennDOT under Governor Robert Casey,

03:35 - and served as district director for Congressman Paul Kanjorski.

03:40 - He's a graduate of Pittston Area High School, and he also earned

03:43 - a Bachelor of Arts in liberal studies from the University of Scranton.

03:47 - And as Mike always reminds me, he's a lifelong resident of the borough.

03:51 - Please welcome, PennDOT Secretary Mike Carroll.

03:58 - I'll go to,

04:01 - next panelist is,

04:03 - the Department of Environmental Protection secretary, Jessica Shirley.

04:07 - She's currently serving as, full secretary.

04:11 - I think the last time you were acting secretary.

04:13 - So congratulations.

04:15 - In her role, she has extensive

04:17 - experience and knowledge with, DEP.

04:21 - Most recently, Jessica served as executive deputy secretary,

04:24 - overseeing all programs from February 2023 to October 2023.

04:31 - Jessica was first appointed Infrastructure Implementation Coordinator

04:35 - for at DEP from 20 from May 2022 to February 2023,

04:42 - and in this position, she oversaw the implementation of the Federal.

04:46 - Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act and the Inflation Reduction Act.

04:51 - Jessica previously served as policy Director and in this position

04:56 - she helped develop groundbreaking executive orders

04:59 - relating to PFAs, climate change, energy conservation and sustainability

05:05 - in Commonwealth operations and environmental justice.

05:09 - Jessica was involved in leading Pennsylvania's first ever Litter.

05:13 - Action Plan, which received several awards and national recognition.

05:18 - Secretary Shirley's educational background includes a master's degree in public

05:22 - administration from the Pennsylvania State University, and a bachelor's degree

05:27 - in economics and political science from Indiana University of Pennsylvania.

05:31 - Please welcome Secretary Jessica Shirley.

05:40 - Next up is Deputy secretary

05:42 - for Community Affairs and Development at TCD, Rick Veilleux.

05:47 - Rick first joined DCD in March of 2015 as the Executive.

05:52 - Director of the Governor's Center for Local Government Services.

05:56 - He was appointed as Deputy Secretary for Community Affairs

05:59 - and Economic Development in February 2017.

06:03 - As Deputy Secretary, Rick oversees the work of the entire deputy,

06:07 - including the governor, center for Local Government Services,

06:11 - the center for Community Enhancement, the center for Community

06:14 - and Housing Development, and the center for Community Services.

06:18 - Before joining DCD, Rick served four terms as mayor of Lock Haven.

06:23 - Please welcome Secretary Rick Villella.

06:30 - And rounding out

06:32 - our panel is Secretary Cindy Dunn.

06:35 - Cindy is the secretary of the Department of Conservation and Natural Resources,

06:40 - which manages 125 state parks and 2.2 million acres of state forest

06:47 - for recreation and other values, provides conservation

06:51 - and recreation, technical assistance and a large related grants program,

06:56 - and operates the Pennsylvania Geological Survey at Dcnr.

07:01 - She has helped position Pennsylvania as a leader in land conservation,

07:05 - outdoor recreation, green practices, and public land management.

07:10 - Under her direction, Pennsylvania continues efforts to address

07:14 - the impacts of climate change, as well as providing leadership

07:18 - on planting forest buffers along streams to provide water quality.

07:23 - Dunn has worked in both the public and private sectors.

07:27 - She served in several leadership posts, said at leading

07:30 - environmental advocacy

07:32 - groups like the Audubon's Audubon of Pennsylvania, the Alliance

07:36 - for the Chesapeake Bay, Chesapeake Bay Foundation, and Penn, and future.

07:41 - Secretary Dunn is a trained is trained as a biologist.

07:44 - And when she's not working, championing conservation.

07:48 - Her hobbies include birding, fishing, canoeing, and hiking.

07:52 - Please welcome Secretary Dunn.

07:58 - So we'll get into the, panelist presentations.

08:01 - At this time, we're going to hold questions

08:03 - for after all of the panel has concluded.

08:07 - And we'll begin with, PennDOT Secretary Mike Carroll.

08:11 - Mike.

08:12 - Okay, Ron, thanks so much.

08:13 - Good morning everybody.

08:14 - Why that microphone really works.

08:17 - So I won't yell at you.

08:18 - I'll start by thanking you, of course, for the work that you do in your burrows.

08:23 - It is important work.

08:25 - It's, the folks that live in your community

08:28 - rely on all of you to make what are almost always difficult decisions.

08:32 - And I know this, as somebody who served in the House for 16 years and cast votes,

08:37 - when your choices are yes and no, and there is almost

08:40 - always some distance between yes and no.

08:44 - You have to

08:45 - pick one, and you can vote no for everything if you really want to.

08:48 - It goes too far, doesn't go far enough, like the whole thing.

08:50 - But this one line, but when it comes to governing,

08:53 - you all know that sometimes you vote for a policy when active policy,

08:58 - with the full knowledge that you are not delivering perfection,

09:01 - you are trying to advance the policy for the community that you serve,

09:05 - the folks that you represent.

09:07 - And the same thing applies to PennDOT, really, on a grand scale.

09:10 - The the decisions that we make are complicated, and of course, nuanced

09:14 - for a whole slew of reasons, whether it's, statute, Constitution

09:19 - regulations, policy, and almost always there's

09:23 - a conversation about if we do something, how are we going to pay for it?

09:26 - So, like all of you, you know, the challenges are real.

09:30 - The work is complicated.

09:32 - PennDOT has a presence in every single community in this state.

09:36 - In fact, every, well, every community, not just borough.

09:39 - We are township's first and second class.

09:41 - The cities, in in Bloomsburg as well.

09:43 - So, we intersect with all of you nearly every day.

09:47 - I, we offer that we have shared constituents, the folks

09:49 - that you represent, the you serve our constituents at PennDOT as well.

09:53 - So at the end of the day, our goals are aligned with respect

09:57 - to trying to meet the needs of the folks that live in your community.

10:00 - I have had the chance to get across the state to every county more than once,

10:04 - and I have met many of the folks in this room somewhere along the way,

10:08 - you know, from northeastern Pennsylvania.

10:10 - So the Lackawanna Luzerne folks I know quite well and,

10:13 - some of the Monroe County folks, not necessarily boroughs, but,

10:16 - the local officials in that region as well,

10:19 - but across the state have had a chance to intersect with a lot of you.

10:22 - And so I'm not going to go too much longer here other than

10:25 - because I really rather get to the questions, Ron.

10:27 - And, so I'm going to just simply say thank you for the work that you do.

10:31 - The, the there'll be questions, I'm sure, about funding

10:34 - and how to pay for this, that or the other thing.

10:36 - And, and we can get into conversations about that.

10:38 - Because if I were all of you, I'd be wondering,

10:40 - how do I get a check out of Carroll to be able to do something in my borough?

10:44 - And, and so there's an answer for that.

10:46 - But it's complicated, and it's not always. Yes.

10:48 - And sometimes it's try again next year.

10:50 - But, I do value the work that you all do.

10:53 - I'm proud of the work the pendant does.

10:54 - I'm going to brag about PennDOT.

10:56 - It's it's not too many

10:57 - people are going to be brave enough to take the podium and brag about PennDOT.

11:00 - But, you know, the assignment for us is pretty hard as well.

11:03 - Meet the transportation needs of 13 million people

11:07 - and do that every single day.

11:08 - There's our job.

11:10 - Now, the good news is we have folks scattered

11:12 - across the counties in this entire state to help me do that.

11:14 - We have great contractors, consultants that help us, and we have folks like you

11:19 - that are really our partners in making sure we meet our needs.

11:23 - There's a

11:23 - perpetual conversation in Harrisburg relative to transportation funding.

11:27 - I have to at least,

11:28 - you know, raise the flag, that there is an ongoing conversation

11:31 - about additional money for roads and bridges and additional money for transit.

11:35 - And when it comes to the transit conversation, for lots of folks in rural.

11:39 - PA, I'm

11:40 - not sure they have a full appreciation of the need for transit in southeastern PA

11:44 - and the impact that that transit system, Septa and

11:48 - and Allegheny, have on the economy of the entire state.

11:52 - There are lots and lots of rural counties, that have boroughs that are

11:56 - the beneficiary of the economic activity in southeastern Pennsylvania.

12:00 - And so I know from my own experience representing communities

12:03 - in northeastern PA, there's not a there's not a willingness

12:08 - to be a number one cheerleader for Septa if you're in Taylor Borough.

12:12 - But the reality is, is that the folks that serve there,

12:16 - that live in those five counties in southeast PA, the economic activity

12:21 - in southeast PA is to the direct benefit of Taylor Borough.

12:25 - And so that applies to a lot of boroughs across the state.

12:27 - I'll pick out my friends in Taylor.

12:30 - Thank you.

12:31 - It we have to remember that that we it's not a

12:34 - one size fits all transportation network that we have across our state.

12:38 - The folks in Potter County, of course, need to have roads and bridges.

12:41 - Get it?

12:42 - But at the same time, we have to have the respect that the people in Delco

12:45 - and Montgomery, Chester, Bucks and Philly need to have an operating transit system.

12:50 - And let's have a little bit

12:51 - of an open mind when it comes to transportation funding.

12:54 - I'll end with this.

12:55 - As Ron knows this at 44 act 89, both,

12:59 - transportation bills that provided additional resources

13:03 - funded roads and bridges and transit, along with the other modes.

13:06 - And there are other modes.

13:07 - But I'll just for the sake of brevity, I'll not mention them.

13:11 - Whatever the transportation bill materializes over the next 12 months

13:14 - undoubtedly will speak to roads and bridges and transit.

13:18 - And at the end of the day, if that is accomplished,

13:21 - it will be to the benefit of Potter County and Delco.

13:24 - I'll stop there and wait for the questions. Thanks, Ron.

13:30 - Thank you, Secretary Carroll.

13:33 - Next up, Secretary Shirley.

13:35 - Good morning.

13:36 - I'll just add that I need public transit

13:39 - in southeastern Pennsylvania for air quality.

13:42 - Which benefits everybody? All across the state.

13:45 - So my name is Jessica Shirley.

13:46 - I am the secretary of the Pennsylvania Department of Environmental Protection.

13:50 - Just like Secretary Carroll,

13:52 - I really want to express my appreciation for the work that you all do.

13:56 - Every day, our agencies at the state level,

14:00 - you know, we're putting out policies, we're putting out permits and things.

14:04 - But you all is really where all of those things funnel down.

14:08 - And you are delivering to all of all of the same constituents.

14:13 - Like Secretary Carroll, I'm also going to brag about my agency for a little bit.

14:18 - And, just,

14:21 - highlight some of the work that we've done, and then I'll get into

14:24 - some of the, meat and potatoes of things that,

14:28 - you all are probably much more interested in.

14:32 - So, everyone in this room probably knows that Dep's

14:35 - mission is to protect Pennsylvania's air, land and water.

14:38 - But the second part of our mission statement is actually that we will work

14:42 - as partners, with citizens,

14:46 - residents, businesses and local governments,

14:49 - to conserve and restore our natural resources to and to address

14:55 - all current and future

14:56 - environmental challenges, including climate change and environmental justice.

15:00 - And that partnership is really critical for us.

15:03 - We are an agency.

15:05 - We have about 2700 people all across the state.

15:07 - But when we expand our network, to our partners,

15:11 - including all of the nonprofits and local governments,

15:14 - that are doing environmental protection work.

15:16 - That number of 2700

15:19 - very quickly grows, to probably hundreds of thousands.

15:25 - Dep as part of your everyday life.

15:29 - Whether people realize it or not.

15:31 - We are protecting the water that you drink, the air that you breathe.

15:34 - Each year we conduct over

15:37 - half a million laboratory tests in our lab.

15:40 - We have a lab located, right down the road, in Harrisburg.

15:45 - We protect 86,000 miles of streams and rivers,

15:49 - which is the second most amount of streams and rivers in the country.

15:53 - When you think about the size, the geographic area of Pennsylvania.

15:56 - In comparison to other states in the country, it is a it's

16:01 - a very, very important, that we protect Pennsylvania's water bodies.

16:05 - Especially considering that 80% of Pennsylvanians

16:08 - get their drinking water from surface water.

16:12 - We inspect,

16:14 - nearly 8000 drinking water facilities that provide,

16:19 - drinking water to 12 million Pennsylvanians.

16:22 - And we oversee, over

16:26 - 217,000 oil and gas wells.

16:30 - We do about 40,000 permits every year

16:33 - and, over over 100,000 inspections.

16:37 - Our goal is always to partner with local government

16:40 - to ensure environmental protection, economic growth and community resilience.

16:45 - I think we've shown over the last several years that when we work together

16:49 - with the legislature and when we are given resources,

16:52 - we can get results and, we can show that, in particular,

16:56 - with our permitting modernization efforts that we've been working on over the

16:59 - last three years.

17:01 - Two years ago,

17:02 - the governor's office and the legislature recognized that the department needed

17:06 - additional staff, to be able to do our permitting work.

17:10 - And they provided about 40 additional compliment spots.

17:13 - All across the state for permitting.

17:16 - And then last year, we, officially eliminated

17:20 - our historical permitting backlog.

17:22 - So resources, outputs.

17:25 - We were able to align those,

17:28 - and we had about 2400 permits that were sitting on the permitting backlog.

17:33 - And that is now, down to zero.

17:35 - As of last October, we also worked with the legislature to develop

17:39 - the streamlining permits for economic expansion and development program.

17:44 - I had to look at what that was because we just call it speed.

17:47 - And it was created in July 2024.

17:50 - So, not this last budget cycle, but the budget cycle before,

17:54 - to continue our permitting efforts, permit modernization efforts.

17:58 - So through this program, speed, aid applicant,

18:03 - if they would like to bypass the DEP queue,

18:07 - they can, use a DEP approved,

18:12 - qualified professional, and, they will do an initial review of the permit.

18:18 - So then we review their work.

18:21 - They make a recommendation to us, and we ultimately make

18:26 - the decision on the permit.

18:28 - But essentially, the permit applicant can pay

18:31 - for a third party qualified professional to review their permit.

18:36 - Instead of the department.

18:38 - But we would still check their work.

18:41 - But it's a much quicker review.

18:43 - Since the initial roll out on June 2025,

18:47 - we have received 21 applications for, the speed program.

18:52 - And we have issued seven permits.

18:55 - This year, continuing our permitting modernization efforts,

18:58 - we launched a new Bureau of Permitting Coordination

19:02 - and the bureau includes two divisions

19:05 - the Major Projects Permitting Division and the Speed Division.

19:08 - But you know, what is it?

19:11 - What is it for? What are we trying to accomplish?

19:13 - It's about speeding up good projects without lowering environmental standards.

19:19 - We try to provide

19:21 - certainty and predictability to permit applicants.

19:25 - And we also provide transparency through a new permitting tracker.

19:30 - You can go on to EPA's website, click on tools, and you can see,

19:34 - all of the permits in your county, in your municipality.

19:38 - What what is under review?

19:40 - What is the status?

19:42 - Where is it in the permitting process?

19:44 - Because we know that, when permitting is more predictable

19:48 - and transparent, it allows for those projects to move a whole lot faster.

19:53 - Switching over to something

19:54 - that I know is of interest to many of you in the room.

19:58 - There are, several changes,

20:01 - that I want to highlight with relation to Foss and, lead and copper.

20:07 - The P Foss MCL rule

20:09 - was published, in January 2023.

20:13 - That's the Pennsylvania rule.

20:14 - It established maximum contaminant levels,

20:19 - and maximum contaminant goals for £0.02

20:23 - foss PFOA or per floral actinic acid.

20:27 - I had to read that.

20:29 - And p PFOs or per

20:32 - floral octane sulfuric acid.

20:35 - And initial monitoring

20:38 - was kicked off in 2024 for the very large systems.

20:41 - And then in 2025, for the smaller systems.

20:44 - With regard to this rule, more than 90% of the entry points that completed

20:51 - the monitoring have achieved a, a reduced monitoring frequency.

20:56 - So they did not show, any PFOA or PFOA s, which enabled them

21:01 - to drop the frequency of how often they're testing.

21:05 - And then the federal, p fast

21:09 - rule was published in April 2024,

21:12 - and that set, lower MCL for £0.06 Foss

21:18 - on May 18th of this year.

21:21 - So just like two weeks ago, EPA announced, two proposed rules that,

21:27 - if finalized, would significantly revise their federal,

21:33 - EPA, p Foss rule.

21:37 - So at this time, the Pennsylvania rule is in effect.

21:42 - We cannot predict what will happen with the federal rule.

21:46 - It's very early in the stages.

21:48 - We have to follow that through the process.

21:50 - But, public water systems are continuing to follow,

21:56 - the Pennsylvania MCL, rule requirements

22:01 - related to public water systems.

22:03 - The lead and copper rule improvements was published in October of 2024.

22:09 - And this focuses on protecting communities from exposure to lead in drinking water.

22:14 - There are important steps that you if you have a water source

22:17 - drinking water system, should be taking,

22:19 - to get into compliance by November 1st, 2027.

22:24 - Which include, resubmitting a service line inventory.

22:28 - Efforts should be made to reduce

22:31 - the number of lines where the pipe material is unknown.

22:35 - I have one of those in my house.

22:36 - I got my letter.

22:38 - Develop and submit a lead service line replacement

22:41 - plan and submit and maintain a list of schools and child facilities.

22:46 - The public water system serves.

22:49 - Switching over to,

22:51 - another issue that I know many of you, or two issues

22:55 - that I know many of you are very much, involved with in your communities.

23:00 - Ms4 and sewage.

23:02 - Like, lots of things.

23:05 - Changes all the time.

23:07 - In our world.

23:08 - Some challenges, always remain.

23:11 - And that's storm water and sewage.

23:14 - The needs general permit for discharges

23:17 - from municipal separate storm water systems.

23:20 - Mess boards.

23:21 - Or page 13 covers the storm water discharges

23:25 - from small municipal separate storm water systems.

23:28 - We issued the draft PG 13 in January 2025 and received over

23:34 - 1500 public comments with extensive input

23:38 - from municipalities, consultants, environmental groups and EPA.

23:43 - We are currently making changes to that draft PG

23:46 - 13 to have a more proactive approach when it comes to managing storm water

23:51 - to protect communities.

23:53 - And the

23:53 - most significant proposed change is a transition

23:56 - from the development and implementation of pollutant reduction plans,

24:01 - or proposed to volume management plans or vamps.

24:06 - The shift from the PR PS to the Vmp

24:09 - was supported by a stakeholder work group that we convened

24:12 - that included municipalities and municipal organizations.

24:16 - So Vmp will allow for a more standardized calculation

24:20 - that is more easily understood by local officials and the public.

24:24 - And this is really about addressing issues that your community is already dealing

24:28 - with, like debris and pollutants in your streams, flooded basements

24:32 - and businesses, and strain on existing and aging infrastructure.

24:37 - It's not just a requirement.

24:39 - We see it as more of an investment in critical infrastructure

24:43 - to reduce flooding impacts and avoid even bigger costs.

24:47 - We're working to make the process consistent and easier to navigate,

24:50 - and will provide improved tools, training and resources.

24:54 - Municipalities will have two years to develop a plan.

24:57 - After the after the permit goes into effect.

25:01 - That will be covered by the permit through development.

25:04 - And then we'll review the plan, and the municipalities will have two years

25:08 - to implement it.

25:10 - We're making progress in responding to those 1500 comments.

25:13 - And we'll be finalizing the general permit, later this year.

25:17 - Our plan is to coordinate publication of the final page 13.

25:22 - In 2027.

25:24 - You'll be hearing a lot more about that.

25:27 - If Ms4 is need

25:29 - financial assistance, which I'm sure many of you do.

25:33 - You can always reach out to DEP or, to pen best.

25:37 - That does have, funding.

25:39 - We have the Growing Greener program.

25:41 - It is our most popular grant program that's used by Ms4.

25:44 - Permittees to implement pollution reduction plan projects.

25:48 - And Penn Best offers low interest

25:51 - loans to implement storm water best management practices.

25:55 - We're also,

25:56 - currently updating our regulations for sewage facilities

26:01 - planning program, to protect public health,

26:04 - prevent pollution, and safeguard safeguard drinking water supplies.

26:08 - These regulations have not been updated in over 20 years.

26:13 - Which means they're very out of date.

26:16 - So typically, you would see incremental changes,

26:20 - in a, in a regulation.

26:25 - 20 years went by, we're kind of past the time for incremental changes.

26:30 - So it looks like a lot of changes.

26:33 - Those regulations will be going out for public comment, extensive public comment.

26:38 - Later this year, we have done,

26:41 - a lot of outreach with our sewage advisory committee.

26:44 - The SAC, which, which does have local, officials as part of it.

26:50 - I think we had 21 meetings.

26:51 - With those folks going through line by line, those sewage regulations.

26:55 - The,

26:59 - we find the current regulations to be very confusing and inconsistent.

27:03 - Which leaves municipalities, unprotected, unprepared.

27:08 - And it forces homeowners often times into very costly repairs.

27:12 - And at the same time, it put they put, water quality at risk.

27:16 - So, they're very badly in need of an update.

27:20 - And we are working, on updating those,

27:27 - Let's see if there's anything in here.

27:29 - I'm getting a little long. Data centers. That's fun.

27:31 - 805.

27:33 - And, somebody already mentioned data centers.

27:36 - So this is, definitely the thing that a lot of folks are talking about.

27:42 - Governor Shapiro, is very committed to positioning Pennsylvania

27:47 - as a national leader in data centers and artificial intelligence, while

27:51 - ensuring that this growth strengthens communities and puts Pennsylvanians first.

27:56 - Our role when it comes to data centers is to issue the necessary permits,

28:01 - as it would any large scale commercial or industrial development.

28:04 - There seems to be a narrative out there that data centers are unregulated.

28:08 - They are not unregulated.

28:10 - They are very much regulated by almost every single program in my agency, from,

28:15 - storm water and erosion control to sewage planning and air quality.

28:21 - And even storage tanks.

28:23 - These these facilities are very regulated.

28:26 - With the AI economy expanding rapidly and global competition intensifying.

28:32 - Pennsylvania is uniquely positioned to lead thanks to its energy

28:36 - resources, world class research institutions, skilled workforce,

28:40 - and a permitting process that delivers speed and certainty.

28:44 - But Pennsylvanians have raised a very real concern about the impact

28:49 - that these, large scale data centers development could have

28:53 - on communities on their utility bills and the environment.

28:57 - So to balance the innovation that we see an opportunity for

29:02 - with accountability, that we need to make sure that these,

29:05 - data centers have the Shapiro administration is advancing grid, which

29:09 - stands for the governor's responsible Infrastructure Development Standards.

29:13 - These were just released last week.

29:16 - There is a lot of information out there.

29:19 - If you want to read more,

29:20 - but I will go over, very briefly, the four core principles.

29:27 - So the first one,

29:29 - is, bringing power generation

29:32 - to prevent increased energy costs.

29:36 - So developers need to bring their own power generation online

29:40 - or fully fund new generation to meet their needs

29:43 - without driving up costs for homeowners or businesses.

29:46 - This is something that I think everyone is very concerned about, including myself.

29:50 - The second one, they need to protect water resources.

29:55 - Projects must meet the highest standards for environmental protection,

29:59 - including strict water conservation requirements.

30:03 - The third is transparency and community engagement.

30:06 - Developers must commit

30:07 - to open, transparent engagement with local residents and leaders.

30:11 - On this, I will say I have stressed,

30:14 - over and over again and to anyone that I talked to.

30:18 - And now there's what, over 200 people in here.

30:20 - We think 300 people.

30:22 - But we have about 500 and some that are, that are, registered.

30:27 - So perfect. Yeah. So now I'm multiplying.

30:32 - When it comes to community engagement and transparency,

30:36 - this step is critical for any major economic

30:40 - development project, particularly one where folks have a lot of questions.

30:44 - Just attending a local

30:47 - meeting is not community engagement.

30:50 - Talking with local elected leaders is not community engagement.

30:55 - These developers need to sit down

30:58 - and have open houses with community residents.

31:01 - They need to answer questions.

31:03 - They need to be very open and transparent about what their plans are,

31:07 - and they need to explain, what what they want to do, what they plan to do.

31:12 - And then the communities should absolutely feel free

31:17 - to ask for the things that they need.

31:20 - I hear a lot of times, that, folks wish that

31:25 - they would have negotiated or they wish they would have asked for something.

31:28 - As local elected officials in this room ask for it.

31:33 - If you need something fixed in your community, ask for it.

31:37 - If you need new school busses for your school, ask for it.

31:42 - The worst they can do is say no,

31:44 - but you guys have the power to ask for it and you should do so

31:50 - for. The

31:51 - last one is delivering local jobs and community benefits.

31:54 - Projects must hire and train local workers and enter into meaningful community

31:59 - benefit agreements that invest in local priorities from school,

32:02 - from schools and infrastructure to long term economic development.

32:07 - Figure out what you need, what you want, and ask for it.

32:11 - Only projects that meet these standards will receive

32:14 - the Commonwealth's full support, including speed and certainty

32:17 - and permitting and access to available incentives.

32:20 - Ensuring responsible development reflects.

32:23 - Pennsylvania's values by holding developers to these principles.

32:27 - Pennsylvania can attract cutting edge technology.

32:30 - Compete for AI leadership and grow our economy while protecting Pennsylvania

32:36 - communities, affordability and the environment for generations to come.

32:40 - So I'll wrap things up.

32:41 - You all play a critical role in identifying

32:46 - your community's needs, implementing solutions and leveraging state programs.

32:50 - And we are here as a resource.

32:52 - Hopefully you folks got to engage with some of the staff that DEP had here today.

32:58 - I have a new director, of external affairs actually stolen from PennDOT.

33:03 - Thank you.

33:04 - But, we have a local government person.

33:09 - Who their, their role is to engage with local communities

33:14 - in every single DEP regional office.

33:16 - Many of them were here. Hopefully you got to engage with them.

33:19 - I think a couple of them are still here.

33:21 - They are our external affairs managers.

33:23 - I see my northwest and my my northeast folks, are still here.

33:28 - Please reach out to them.

33:30 - We had some pamphlets related to our grant programs.

33:33 - If you have any questions, please reach out

33:37 - to our external affairs managers in our regional office.

33:41 - We are committed to continuing to be a strong partner for you all

33:45 - to help local communities and boroughs thrive.

33:49 - And I encourage all of you,

33:50 - to reach out and have a conversation of how we can help your community thrive.

33:54 - Thank you.

34:01 - Thank you, Secretary Shirley, for that great update.

34:03 - Next on our panel is Deputy Secretary Rick Veilleux.

34:08 - Good morning.

34:10 - It's really good to be here.

34:11 - I'm glad I don't have to give Jessica Shirley's presentation.

34:17 - I was looking over her shoulder, and some of the words

34:21 - have every letter of the alphabet in them.

34:24 - So, those words were longer

34:27 - than the sentences that I'll use.

34:31 - I am a recovering local elected official.

34:34 - I don't know when you get over the addiction, but it's still there,

34:39 - so I get really excited when,

34:43 - in a room full of local elected officials.

34:46 - I'd ask any DCD staff to stand up and raise your hand.

34:52 - There's quite a few in the room.

34:54 - Everybody stand up and.

35:02 - You know,

35:03 - I started in lockhaven on the zoning

35:06 - hearing board in 1993 and then planning commission and city council

35:10 - and then mayor and president and council from 2000

35:14 - to March of 2015.

35:17 - And, you know, so looking back,

35:20 - you know, 33 years, it's not getting any easier.

35:24 - And I want to start off by

35:27 - thanking you for the work that you do

35:30 - because you don't hear thank you enough for that work.

35:35 - Dcd is is your partner.

35:40 - And under my umbrella on the community side,

35:43 - like Ron said in the introduction,

35:46 - is the governor Center for Local Government Services.

35:50 - So when I had the opportunity to go to the state,

35:55 - you know, the department that I wanted to

35:59 - join was the one that made the most difference in Lock Haven.

36:04 - And, you know, DCR was my second choice.

36:08 - Wanted to stay away from DP and and,

36:12 - no offense,

36:14 - but, you know, it is a challenge.

36:17 - And, you know,

36:19 - one of the things that I've been impressed with, with Governor Shapiro

36:23 - is, you know, looking at economic development

36:27 - and community development and how integral both are to each other

36:33 - and how important it is to work across state agencies

36:38 - to accomplish those goals, to make the lives of Pennsylvanians better.

36:43 - So when he came into office, he tasked DCD

36:48 - with writing an economic development strategy.

36:51 - There's five pillars of the economic development

36:54 - strategy, and DCD held 16 roundtables

36:59 - around the Commonwealth to talk about economic development.

37:04 - And that plan was issued.

37:07 - But and it could have been 400 pages long, but it was, you know,

37:12 - condensed into about a 70 page document.

37:16 - And part of that talked about housing.

37:21 - And the governor

37:22 - realized that at economic, at every Economic development roundtable,

37:28 - housing was a main topic of discussion

37:33 - and that it needed its own strategy,

37:37 - its own ten year plan, because we weren't being competitive.

37:42 - We were falling behind other states.

37:46 - And we needed, you know,

37:48 - figure out how to support,

37:51 - you know, more housing and better smart development.

37:56 - So out of the economic development strategy,

38:00 - DCD was tasked with writing the Housing Action Plan.

38:05 - It's like 60 pages long.

38:07 - It's it's very readable.

38:09 - It could have been 400 pages.

38:11 - Also, when you think about all of the issues

38:14 - around housing, but

38:18 - one of the important tasks

38:21 - was, you know, how can the Department of Community.

38:25 - Economic Development support local government

38:29 - in being more efficient, in building more housing,

38:34 - taking care of like doing code enforcement,

38:37 - you know, conducting zoning hearings and planning

38:40 - commission meetings and all of the things that,

38:45 - you know, you guys do that

38:47 - you know, the average citizen doesn't understand

38:51 - or just expects you to wave a magic wand and fix things.

38:56 - So, you know, part of the housing action plan

39:00 - with the OECD was creating

39:03 - a new deputy secretary position for housing.

39:08 - And last Tuesday,

39:10 - Kevin Bush started on the first day

39:13 - as deputy secretary for housing.

39:17 - And I was really excited when he started

39:21 - because part of my tasks over the last several months was,

39:26 - you know, to create job descriptions and work flows and, you know, the org chart

39:32 - and all of the things that go on behind the scenes

39:36 - to create a new group at OECD

39:39 - to implement the Housing Action Plan.

39:42 - And, you know, homelessness and home

39:47 - and all of the Cdbg programs that relate to housing

39:51 - are moving from under my umbrella to the new deputy position.

39:55 - And, you know, some of the governor's proposals in the budget,

39:59 - the infrastructure fund are geared around housing.

40:03 - And then, you know, working on,

40:07 - you know, all of the things that support you from,

40:12 - you know, that zoning, land use and development and, you know, Soldo

40:18 - and all of those things are being updated in the OECD's website.

40:25 - Part of all of that

40:28 - and looking at land use and, you know, figuring out working with DPI

40:32 - and PennDOT on permitting issues and speeding up, permitting.

40:38 - You know, when it comes to development.

40:40 - And and Secretary Shirley mentioned

40:43 - the data center toolkit,

40:46 - and it really is a local tool

40:50 - kit for your use.

40:53 - And, you know, I've been around a while.

40:58 - I had Hart here when I started.

41:00 - So, you know, the,

41:05 - you know, the the topic today is data centers.

41:09 - But when we look back, you know, we faced similar things

41:15 - with locating warehouses, with Marcellus Shale discussions.

41:20 - And, you know, over the years,

41:24 - you can replace the the words data

41:26 - center with other issues that,

41:30 - you know, they don't train you for.

41:34 - You know, when there's going to be a knock at the Borough Hall door

41:38 - and say, you know,

41:41 - what am I going to do?

41:42 - You know, this is, legal business.

41:47 - You know, there's got to be a spot

41:50 - in the zoning ordinance where you address, you know, this work.

41:55 - You know, it's confusing.

41:57 - You know, there's the hyper size

42:01 - and there's the micro size, and there's all the difference.

42:05 - And, you know, when I ran for election,

42:08 - when you ran for election, you know, I wasn't a thing.

42:12 - And data centers weren't a thing.

42:15 - But your friends and neighbors

42:18 - expect you to make good decisions.

42:21 - And, you know,

42:24 - it's a challenge.

42:26 - And, you know, when the high priced lawyers

42:29 - and the fancy cars roll up and you know, they come

42:33 - and tell you, you have to do this or you have to do that, or,

42:36 - and if you make a wrong decision,

42:39 - there's liability and you can end up in the courts,

42:43 - you know,

42:44 - besides all of the other publications to help you do your job.

42:49 - This data center toolkit is a really important one.

42:55 - You know,

42:56 - there's processes.

42:59 - There's things that you should make sure you do about public

43:03 - hearings, like Secretary Shirley talked about,

43:07 - you know, the things that you should doubt your I's and cross your T's

43:12 - and don't hesitate to ask for help.

43:15 - Our local government specialists or regional directors,

43:19 - we're here to support you.

43:22 - And one of my goals since 2015

43:25 - is to make DCD more responsive to you folks.

43:30 - Because, you know, I remember when I was mayor,

43:34 - I didn't want to come to Harrisburg and, you know, have to knock on the door

43:38 - and wave a flag saying, we need help.

43:42 - I wanted, you know, somebody to come to City Hall

43:45 - to sit at the table with me and say,

43:47 - you know, this is the right direction or this is the wrong direction.

43:51 - And, you know, the people that I have here

43:54 - are here to support you in your role.

43:58 - So they, you know, you

44:01 - you try to get it right, you try to make a difference and you know,

44:07 - before you know

44:08 - and and talk about, you know, all of the other things,

44:12 - you know, Ron said there's record attendance this year

44:16 - at your conference.

44:19 - And, you know, that says something.

44:22 - And I think it's because of the challenges that we face today.

44:29 - And, you know, we talk about fire service and EMS and,

44:34 - you know, police coverage and all of the challenges that we face.

44:41 - But one of the things that we don't talk about is local elected leaders

44:47 - is the challenges

44:49 - of being local elected leaders.

44:53 - We have 2555 municipalities.

44:58 - We had 2568 municipalities when I started.

45:02 - So by the year 3650,

45:05 - we might be down to a manageable number,

45:08 - but we're down to 2555 municipalities

45:14 - with 23,000 local elected officials.

45:19 - Every two years here for

45:22 - that are up for reelection 11,500.

45:27 - I think I got the math right, are up for election

45:31 - out of that 11,500, 4000

45:37 - are competitive ballot positions.

45:41 - Another 3 or 4000 are running

45:44 - unopposed and another 3 or 4000.

45:47 - There's no mean on the ballot.

45:51 - And there's a lot of gray hair and no hair.

45:57 - And older people in this room.

46:02 - And you know who's going to follow in our footsteps?

46:07 - We're passionate about local government.

46:10 - We want to make a difference in our communities.

46:12 - We want to face the challenges and do it right

46:17 - for the future of our grandchildren.

46:21 - Who's going to follow in her footsteps?

46:24 - You guys are the passionate ones.

46:27 - You know, the 500 and some that are here.

46:31 - You know, there's thousands of others, local

46:33 - elected officials that never attend a conference

46:37 - that don't do their homework, that don't, you know,

46:41 - try to, you know, do their homework before the meeting

46:45 - that will never look at a publication

46:50 - on data centers to make correct decisions.

46:54 - You know, how are we going to train the leaders

46:58 - that will follow in your footsteps?

47:01 - It's not getting any easier.

47:03 - So, you know, one of the things that DCD can do is help you do your jobs better.

47:13 - And I

47:16 - that was kind of a little heavy and thought provoking.

47:20 - So I want to end on a positive note.

47:24 - When you think about the 250th celebration and some of the things

47:31 - going on in Pennsylvania this year, it is very positive and very exciting

47:39 - because of the 250th birthday.

47:41 - But we saw the NFL draft be very successful in Pittsburgh.

47:45 - We saw the PGA events.

47:48 - We know the all star game is coming to Pennsylvania.

47:53 - There is a lot to be excited about.

47:56 - There's a lot good going on.

47:59 - You know, when we think about the 4th of July coming up

48:04 - in a little over a month, you know, it is a special time,

48:09 - especially for those of us to remember, you know, the bicentennial.

48:13 - And, you know, let's celebrate local government.

48:18 - Let's celebrate the work that we do.

48:21 - And, you know, think about the special places

48:25 - that we live in, trying to make a difference,

48:28 - to make our hometowns better places to live.

48:32 - Thank you.

48:32 - Thank you.

48:37 - Thank you, Secretary Villano, for your update.

48:39 - And next, as Secretary Dunne.

48:43 - Right?

48:43 - I don't know if it sucks to be last year's.

48:46 - Good to be last.

48:47 - I thought you said Mayor Quinn Centennial was the one thing that hadn't been said.

48:50 - I could talk about that rig, pick that up right at the very end.

48:55 - I just wanted to join my palace in thanking you for your public service.

48:58 - Governor Shapiro expects a high level of public service from all of us,

49:02 - expects us to work together, expects us to lead in and really help

49:06 - the citizens of Pennsylvania.

49:08 - And you have voluntarily stepped up to do your part.

49:12 - And that should never be underestimated, because we know it's hard.

49:15 - We know there's public criticism.

49:18 - We know

49:18 - you probably look at the social media, and there's nothing that anyone

49:21 - in public office does anywhere without, getting along strand of criticism.

49:25 - So you know, blocks on the negative voices and think about the good that we all do

49:30 - together and public service.

49:31 - And there's quite a bit out there.

49:33 - You might have noticed that Governor Shapiro really

49:36 - leans in, to recreation and the outdoors.

49:40 - And it's because if you look at Pennsylvania

49:42 - as a whole, boroughs are really a microcosm of the towns we have.

49:47 - We have an aging population in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.

49:50 - We've got to invest, to make Pennsylvania the place that young people

49:55 - want to live, work and play.

49:56 - We've got to keep our young people in the state, the ones that are here.

49:59 - We've got to capture some of the students in the higher

50:03 - education institutions that really distinguished Pennsylvania.

50:07 - And we've got to attract people into Pennsylvania.

50:09 - So outdoor recreation and tourism is something that really works in that vein.

50:16 - And we want our communities across the state to be welcoming

50:20 - and really built for time outdoors, for a good quality of life for people.

50:25 - So we at DCR have, a lot of amenities and a lot of support for that.

50:30 - As, as was said in introduction, we have 125 state parks.

50:34 - The governor just added Laurel caverns out Fayette County.

50:38 - We're investing in the ones we have

50:41 - to make them better and more accessible for our aging population,

50:44 - and more welcoming to all Pennsylvanians, more welcoming to visitors.

50:48 - And that includes the typical,

50:51 - Ada amenities, making things more accessible,

50:55 - as I said, to set a accessible fishing pier on the Pine Creek this last Friday.

51:00 - But it also includes, sensory, like making

51:05 - playgrounds more accessible for autism, welcoming all people into the public lands

51:11 - that by constitution, Pennsylvanians own every state park

51:15 - they own by Constitution, a 2.2 million acres of forest land.

51:20 - So it's only fair that every every Pennsylvanian is welcome

51:23 - there and is invited there and have programs to get them there.

51:29 - If you're not

51:30 - aware of our 2P2 grant program as Community Conservation Partnership

51:35 - Grant program, burros do take, great advantage of it.

51:39 - I don't know if Columbia Burrows here, but but, yeah, yeah, yeah,

51:43 - they really got our number, so, Yeah, they're on the Susquehanna.

51:47 - They also have created a trail out of the burrow.

51:52 - And, you know, they're going to invest it in the assets they have

51:55 - many burrows are like Columbia and are along a river

51:59 - or on a trail and have some natural amenity.

52:03 - So taking advantage of that and building access, building trails

52:08 - make it a walkable, close to home so that people can come up from work or school

52:12 - and get out there on a bike or walk, or get out there and fish or paddle.

52:17 - And this makes communities attractive, and this will keep people around.

52:21 - This will attract new people.

52:23 - You know, Rick mentioned housing.

52:25 - A lot of our boroughs have beautiful, attractive housing stock

52:29 - that is not as expensive as the stuff out in the suburbs.

52:32 - And so, you know, combining, fixing up housing and some recreational amenities

52:36 - will help bring people in and help the tax base overall,

52:41 - we fund things like

52:42 - playgrounds, pools, ball fields,

52:45 - walking trails, river access, land conservation.

52:50 - We're finding, people want even like a nice forest close to home.

52:54 - So we're getting grant applications for like community forest right in

52:58 - the matrix of developed areas that people can get in there for mental

53:03 - and physical health to get in there

53:05 - and just, chill out and enjoy a forest.

53:08 - We have grants, programs for street trees

53:11 - and, community trees as well as buffers.

53:15 - Our buffer program is for water quality, but it also helps

53:19 - quality of life and helps cool down our urban areas.

53:23 - Jessica and I were just in Hummelstown last.

53:26 - What was that?

53:27 - Thursday is that last week was a blur, but, celebrating the 10,000,000th tree

53:32 - planted by Chesapeake Bay Foundation in the Bay region of Pennsylvania.

53:36 - But,

53:38 - a nice,

53:39 - nice urban trees increase the, the value of the housing stock.

53:44 - The street trees have nice, nice street trees that are on a street

53:48 - increases, value that all the houses on that street,

53:51 - a park and a community, a nice, well-kept park in the community

53:54 - increases the value of the whole community.

53:56 - So these amenities aren't just nice to have,

53:59 - but they're really essential elements of, making a borough a community,

54:05 - welcoming and a place that people would move into and stay.

54:10 - We've seen, a lot of creative

54:13 - communities doing great, interesting projects.

54:16 - And, I really encourage you to get to know

54:19 - our regional advisors if you don't know them,

54:22 - typically, our cycle is, grant workshops in the fall.

54:27 - And we really suggest

54:29 - you have a lot of our regional park and rec advisors come out to your borough,

54:34 - walk a site, see the project, give advice on funding streams.

54:38 - I think I think Mike Carroll mentioned in the very beginning, we all operate

54:42 - by legislation or regulation or certain requirements these grants

54:46 - program have that were put in place by the legislature way back when.

54:50 - But to help understand, like Grant, you know, how to apply for a grant,

54:54 - how to be successful with a grant.

54:57 - Again, we see great projects across the Commonwealth.

55:00 - Last year, we were able to put out $82 million in grant funding.

55:04 - So this is not small potatoes.

55:07 - A lot of this is matched locally.

55:09 - Jessica mentioned, you know, this data center issue

55:13 - and this is with any developer in your area.

55:15 - What is a warehouse or data center?

55:18 - Ask for what you want and think big.

55:20 - And this can be matched for Grant.

55:22 - It could be buffers.

55:23 - It could be we have buffering something.

55:26 - It's not it is does it fit in with your community character.

55:30 - It could be spacing.

55:32 - It could be open space money.

55:33 - It could be money for parks and trails to enhance the community, to blunt,

55:39 - the negative impacts, impacts that a development might have.

55:43 - And this could be even true for new housing projects

55:47 - where you ask a housing project to build a trail that connects

55:51 - to the rest of the community and then, you know, help pay for that.

55:54 - That's the time to really ask for amenities to help your whole community.

55:59 - And again, our Park and Rec advisors can give you advice and show you

56:03 - some places that that has worked out some of the big assets in the state

56:07 - that really generate a lot of economy, the big rail trail systems

56:11 - and the little communities along the rail trails benefit tremendously.

56:15 - The first one of the big examples in the state, out in the western part,

56:19 - the Great Allegheny Passage, all the little communities

56:22 - along that trail define themselves as trail towns

56:26 - and attracted, a lot of local businesses to serve recreation

56:31 - and generate tremendous economy.

56:33 - But across the Commonwealth, the recreation economy

56:36 - delivers to 20.4 billion to the state's economy.

56:40 - So it's much bigger than people thought.

56:43 - And I think, what you gotta think about Pennsylvania is really well

56:47 - built for that.

56:48 - We've got the mountains, we've got the rivers, we've got a lot of forest land.

56:52 - We're really much more attractive than our surrounding state.

56:55 - And, that's a natural amenity,

56:58 - a gift you got that you can really take advantage of.

57:01 - And your borough, the other area that a big asset

57:05 - that every community has in Pennsylvania, streams and rivers.

57:09 - We're very rich in streams and rivers,

57:12 - across Pennsylvania, one of the best in the nation.

57:16 - And so every community's got a possibility of a boat launch, fishing access,

57:21 - making a beautiful riverfront park, a walkway.

57:26 - And so taking advantage of these natural gifts that you've got,

57:29 - can be really helpful for, for your investment.

57:32 - We have a lot of advice and funding to help with that.

57:35 - We're working with DEP and Fishing Boat Commission to remove unwanted dams.

57:41 - There's money available through nonprofit

57:44 - called American Rivers and also Dcnr, and there's about some degree

57:49 - and we can, help, like, take out something you don't want and put

57:52 - in something you do want, like a riverfront park with a great trail.

57:56 - So lots of opportunities out there.

57:58 - Each community is different.

57:59 - Each set of assets and opportunities is different.

58:02 - But, we're there to help.

58:04 - Couple areas you may not know about us.

58:07 - We quietly provide the GIS services

58:10 - that are behind all the mapping that you might be using for your planning.

58:13 - We we are in charge of the called the Geospatial Board.

58:17 - We coordinate all the lidar overflights so that when you're engineers

58:21 - or when you're when you're planning something, the the proper elevations

58:25 - and, important GIS details that everyone uses

58:29 - across the Commonwealth are provided by our geologic survey.

58:32 - Also, our geologic survey will help if you have, geologic hazard.

58:37 - If you're living in an area that has landslides or sinkholes,

58:42 - we have, experts in that area

58:45 - of geologic hazards and another area where we do grants

58:48 - that maybe people aren't aware of has we do grants to fire companies.

58:53 - We're in charge of wild land fires that can be anywhere.

58:57 - You think of wild land fire as being a forest fire up in the mountain,

59:00 - but they happen everywhere because people burn brush everywhere.

59:04 - And that includes in burrows and some places.

59:06 - So when there's a wildfire and we respond and we just finish training up our,

59:11 - staff and volunteers on wild land fire, but we give grants to the fire companies.

59:16 - And so I know fire companies are struggling.

59:19 - But you may be

59:21 - you may find that you're eligible for a grant

59:23 - that would be really helpful in wild land fire protection and that equipment

59:26 - that would be there for that would be there and available for everything else.

59:30 - So that's just a couple of the things we do in Dcnr.

59:34 - We provide a lot of technical assistance and guidance.

59:37 - We certainly would like to help you with, conservation

59:40 - and recreation in your community if you're not already working with us.

59:43 - And so thank you for your public service.

59:45 - Thank you for being here.

59:46 - As Rick said, the ones that lean in, by the way, the first time I met Rick

59:50 - was on the river, and when he was mayor of Lockhaven,

59:53 - I was leading a big canoe trip on the West.

59:55 - Brant and Rick came out and paddled that.

59:58 - 673 That was great, a paddling mayor.

01:00 - 05.110 So if you're not a paddling mayor for council, Councilman,

01:00 - 08.738 please join Rick and be a paddling elected official.

01:00 - 10.105 So thank you for that.

01:00 - 16.322 Thank you, Secretary Dunn, for your update. And.

01:00 - 17.090 Right, right.

01:00 - 21.050 You know, I have a lot of questions, but you don't want to hear from me.

01:00 - 22.428 We want to hear from you.

01:00 - 25.264 So if you have questions please come up to the mics,

01:00 - 29.335 with a very quick, succinct try to keep it very quick

01:00 - 33.105 and no statements, just questions who you're directing it to,

01:00 - 35.107 what's your borough, what county?

01:00 - 39.469 And we'll start in the back here with your question.

01:00 - 42.872 I have a question for Secretary Shirley.

01:00 - 46.118 Dan Markey, Archibald Borough, Lackawanna county.

01:00 - 49.979 We're in the middle of the huge data center boom.

01:00 - 53.859 Because of that, been dubbed the local villain.

01:00 - 58.254 So it's it's been quite contentious.

01:00 - 03.226 We have 6 to 7 proposed projects right now.

01:01 - 06.996 We've we've been invaded and,

01:01 - 10.733 that spans about 55 different buildings.

01:01 - 14.980 And these

01:01 - 18.007 data centers, they can't go down.

01:01 - 18.485 Right.

01:01 - 22.655 So, among the the 6 or 7 different projects

01:01 - 25.791 we have, proposed 1400

01:01 - 28.861 diesel generators, coming on board.

01:01 - 32.931 So, our residents have been told by the DPI

01:01 - 36.659 that the DPI does not measure the cumulative effect.

01:01 - 38.370 If and I don't believe that

01:01 - 40.105 all these projects are going to get off the ground,

01:01 - 42.441 I think a lot of it is speculative development.

01:01 - 46.145 But if in fact, they were able to all get off the ground

01:01 - 49.048 and they all got the power and they all got the water and everything,

01:01 - 54.844 is that something that DEP might be able to look into on a, on a special scenario?

01:01 - 58.147 Because not only would they have to run if,

01:01 - 59.659 if the

01:01 - 02.685 power went down, but then they also have to test,

01:02 - 06.589 every single one on a quarterly basis.

01:02 - 10.860 And, our residents are freaking out about that.

01:02 - 13.505 Thank you.

01:02 - 14.740 Hello? Okay.

01:02 - 15.941 They change the microphone.

01:02 - 19.469 I don't know if you saw that, so I'm gonna make sure this is working.

01:02 - 24.841 You highlight, one of the things that keeps me up at night.

01:02 - 29.145 But I will say that,

01:02 - 34.259 we are not the only state that is struggling

01:02 - 37.286 with this, with this particular question.

01:02 - 41.924 And it's something that we're looking at very intently.

01:02 - 46.638 We are trying to do some modeling, looking at it.

01:02 - 50.900 But the truth is, we only have the authority that we have.

01:02 - 54.813 So we are looking at all of the state and federal regulations

01:02 - 00.753 when it comes to air quality to see, what those, requirements would be.

01:03 - 03.155 What effect would it have on an area?

01:03 - 04.256 But you are correct.

01:03 - 08.117 We do not have the authority to consider cumulative effects.

01:03 - 13.589 For any environmental impact, let alone just one particular one.

01:03 - 19.228 So, I would just add to that some of the,

01:03 - 24.167 data center proposals that we've seen statewide, are,

01:03 - 27.980 proposing fuel cells and other sources,

01:03 - 31.307 that are not diesel fire, generators.

01:03 - 32.886 Those

01:03 - 36.622 projects, will not have the same, I would say air

01:03 - 41.326 quality impacts that the, ones who are proposing diesel generators are.

01:03 - 44.921 So, we have as part of the grid plan,

01:03 - 49.234 tried to incentivize

01:03 - 55.531 data centers to use, alternative, alternatives to backup diesel,

01:03 - 56.909 generators.

01:03 - 59.578 So, it is something that we're looking at.

01:03 - 00.513 I do agree with you.

01:04 - 04.173 I think a lot of them are speculative and probably will not be built.

01:04 - 07.944 But it is something that we are very much looking at.

01:04 - 10.389 And we share those same concerns.

01:04 - 12.491 Thank you. Thank, thank you for your question.

01:04 - 14.493 Next question down front, sir. Hello.

01:04 - 16.028 My name is Michael Worden.

01:04 - 19.255 I'm from New Freedom Borough and, southern New York County.

01:04 - 23.759 And my, question, I guess, would be to Secretary Sherry as well.

01:04 - 28.707 The last gentleman kind of touched this a little bit, but you had mentioned that,

01:04 - 32.768 the data centers, will supply their own power.

01:04 - 36.906 So that power, need wouldn't

01:04 - 40.109 come from the borough's power usage.

01:04 - 44.823 Our borough is is small, and we won't have data centers within our,

01:04 - 49.752 our borough limits, but in neighboring townships and boroughs,

01:04 - 52.798 what they do is going to ultimately impact us.

01:04 - 57.226 And, the other concern I had about data centers was water usage.

01:04 - 59.171 What kind of water do they take?

01:04 - 01.373 What happens with that water? Is it ruined?

01:05 - 02.275 Is it recycled?

01:05 - 05.401 How does that impact, borough like new freedom?

01:05 - 06.746 Thank you.

01:05 - 08.180 Thank you for that question.

01:05 - 10.282 I'll take the water question first.

01:05 - 14.086 So, new Freedom borough, York County,

01:05 - 18.814 you are within the SBC, the Susquehanna River Basin Commission.

01:05 - 22.427 There is an Delaware River Basin Commission

01:05 - 26.899 very similarly, has a process when it comes to water withdrawals.

01:05 - 32.437 So any type of facility that withdrawals water over a certain amount has to go

01:05 - 35.464 through a very extensive process,

01:05 - 39.402 to have that water withdrawal, approved.

01:05 - 43.072 Through that process, it's called a docket.

01:05 - 49.421 The SBC would look at, how that water is returned.

01:05 - 51.123 Sometimes it's evaporated.

01:05 - 55.794 Sometimes it's just used for cooling and then it's returned to the same,

01:05 - 00.832 water body, that there is an entire regulatory process

01:06 - 05.170 specifically to evaluate that, some of the data centers

01:06 - 09.908 that we're seeing, coming online now use significantly less water

01:06 - 13.102 than data centers that were built even just five years ago.

01:06 - 17.883 So it really just depends, on what what is being proposed.

01:06 - 21.577 And that would go through a very transparent public process.

01:06 - 26.082 With the SBC in your case, on energy. So

01:06 - 29.061 it's not required,

01:06 - 33.489 that they bring their own energy to the site.

01:06 - 40.372 That, that is required if they want to receive any type of state benefits.

01:06 - 43.432 So that's what the grid proposal, it's an incentive program.

01:06 - 47.446 However, we are very, very, very strongly

01:06 - 50.973 encouraging data centers to bring their own power.

01:06 - 54.276 Because of the concerns of,

01:06 - 57.847 the strains that are already we're already seeing on the grid.

01:06 - 00.692 So the energy conversation

01:07 - 03.795 is actually much broader than just data centers.

01:07 - 06.298 I think data centers kind of layer on,

01:07 - 09.325 to the existing concerns and things that we're working through.

01:07 - 12.928 Governor Shapiro has, worked,

01:07 - 18.276 with the I believe it's the other, 13 governors.

01:07 - 20.445 I think there's 13 governors total plus DC.

01:07 - 25.550 So it's like 12 governors and mayor, to, work with PJM,

01:07 - 29.011 which is our grid operator, to

01:07 - 31.456 figure out what the

01:07 - 35.384 constraints are, at having more supply,

01:07 - 38.854 be brought, to to the grid.

01:07 - 42.467 We've seen a lot of changes in other states.

01:07 - 46.395 We've seen the natural gas price double since the war in Ukraine.

01:07 - 50.199 It's kind of this perfect storm of,

01:07 - 53.812 that's created these high energy prices for everyone.

01:07 - 56.214 And then you have data centers on top of it.

01:07 - 01.043 We at DEP, issued a request for information

01:08 - 06.758 maybe six weeks ago, at the beginning of April, where we are

01:08 - 11.520 asking, developers if they plan

01:08 - 14.557 to bring electricity generation to Pennsylvania,

01:08 - 18.136 neutral of, type.

01:08 - 21.606 So it could be natural gas, could be solar, could be wind,

01:08 - 23.508 could be small nuclear.

01:08 - 28.113 To come to us, and we can help them

01:08 - 32.551 through the process of being permitted at PJM.

01:08 - 37.079 So there is a very extensive permitting process with our grid operator,

01:08 - 40.292 to have them hook up to the grid.

01:08 - 44.687 So we, as the state, are trying

01:08 - 49.959 to, invite developers who want to locate energy sources here.

01:08 - 54.697 To expedite that process with PJM to get that online faster.

01:08 - 59.802 There's a whole mess, of work that is going on right now.

01:08 - 03.148 Related specifically to, bringing down

01:09 - 06.151 energy costs for consumers by the Shapiro administration.

01:09 - 08.854 We could probably have an entire panel on that.

01:09 - 13.592 But just know, that this is a huge priority for the governor,

01:09 - 17.620 for DEP and probably for some of the other agencies on this stage.

01:09 - 19.664 Thank thank you for your question.

01:09 - 21.666 Next question down front, Jen.

01:09 - 23.135 Good morning. Secretaries.

01:09 - 25.670 Thank you for coming out. My name is Jen Dean Inman.

01:09 - 28.697 I'm from the borough of Austin in Potter County.

01:09 - 33.145 I'm going to give Secretary Carroll and Secretary Shirley a break

01:09 - 36.372 and come over to the deputy director and Secretary Dunn.

01:09 - 40.652 We have this wonderful over 1000

01:09 - 45.681 mile trail called the North Central Regional ATV, UTV trail.

01:09 - 47.325 I'm sure you're very familiar with it.

01:09 - 48.793 Both of you.

01:09 - 51.062 My question is this.

01:09 - 54.032 I don't know if it exists, but if it doesn't, can we create it?

01:09 - 00.071 And that is, are there any coordinated incentive programs or priority pathways

01:10 - 05.177 between your two agencies for economic development in the communities

01:10 - 09.772 along these designated trail entities, specifically, the unwrapped?

01:10 - 11.817 Yeah, I just

01:10 - 15.654 said and that event, last Friday, yes.

01:10 - 16.455 Okay.

01:10 - 20.091 And, it was really gratifying to see how well that's worked up.

01:10 - 23.895 And we had suggested a council governance be set up

01:10 - 25.664 so that it could be locally managed.

01:10 - 27.699 And Mike Carroll and his deputy

01:10 - 30.726 were directly involved with that, because that end, right, that

01:10 - 34.797 connects PennDOT roads, borough

01:10 - 39.101 community roads and some Dcnr trails that already exist.

01:10 - 42.280 So it's a great it's a great project.

01:10 - 45.183 The economic development from the Dcnr

01:10 - 48.244 angle is through, Pennsylvania Wilds initiative.

01:10 - 51.523 Pennsylvania Wilds unites 13

01:10 - 55.026 counties and, there's a planning board

01:10 - 59.331 that involves the county planning directors of every one of those counties.

01:10 - 03.401 And they they are the mechanism through which we do planning.

01:11 - 06.462 By the way, Austin, if you haven't been, the Austin is such a cool place.

01:11 - 10.175 Go to go talk about interesting history if you're interested in learning

01:11 - 10.943 stuff in America.

01:11 - 13.478 250 Austin is extremely cool.

01:11 - 16.248 Was a great museum, has a has an interesting old dam

01:11 - 18.950 and some interesting stories that go with it.

01:11 - 21.953 So check that out if you're traveling around in America.

01:11 - 26.558 250 but, we, we use the Pennsylvania Wilds framework

01:11 - 30.862 for the community development work that goes on and economic development.

01:11 - 33.322 We also have our Office of Outdoor Recreation

01:11 - 36.001 that's focused a lot

01:11 - 39.871 on these places called conservation landscapes and heritage areas.

01:11 - 42.507 So, so, so, so that's part of the lumber heritage area.

01:11 - 45.010 And they look for opportunities in businesses

01:11 - 48.203 that kind of pop out and say they want to be involved.

01:11 - 50.148 With that, I don't know

01:11 - 53.809 if you have any specifics on on Austin and that whole Valley.

01:11 - 59.214 I'm just looking for like a more active, like you're going out and finding

01:11 - 03.319 or you have a list of businesses that need somewhere to go and.

01:12 - 04.397 Absolutely, man.

01:12 - 08.257 Yeah, yeah, I don't have specifics, but

01:12 - 14.706 I want to build on kind of strategy, how I look at it

01:12 - 20.302 and kind of what I hope would be a good tip for for you.

01:12 - 23.381 And Cindy mentioned that we first met

01:12 - 27.543 on a kayak trip on Kauai, doing the West Branch of the Susquehanna.

01:12 - 33.525 Well, when I was mayor, if I knew a state

01:12 - 37.295 official was doing something, I would drive.

01:12 - 38.563 I would paddle.

01:12 - 43.368 I wasn't much of a runner, but you know, any way that I could

01:12 - 47.096 tackle them and say, you know, this is really important.

01:12 - 53.302 You know, how can we get some of your help in supporting what we're trying to do?

01:12 - 55.447 You take advantage of that.

01:12 - 00.309 But one of the things that we've done since I've been at DCD

01:13 - 03.946 and we grew our planning team, but,

01:13 - 07.516 you know, maybe Dcnr

01:13 - 11.029 is doing a park project

01:13 - 14.933 or some thing where they're making an investment, but

01:13 - 18.002 there are investment can only go so far,

01:13 - 22.140 but you need to improve a roadway or a connection

01:13 - 27.102 or infrastructure to make the park project more successful.

01:13 - 28.569 You know,

01:13 - 31.683 DCD can do those

01:13 - 35.411 parts to kind of put the jigsaw puzzle together.

01:13 - 37.655 20 years ago.

01:13 - 40.458 You know, we could go to just one agency.

01:13 - 43.786 Somebody like one of us would come with a big check

01:13 - 47.189 and say, you can do the whole project.

01:13 - 49.033 That doesn't happen anymore.

01:13 - 51.536 It's like putting a jigsaw puzzle together.

01:13 - 55.006 And one of the conferences I was at, somebody said it was like putting

01:13 - 58.500 a jigsaw puzzle together without the lid of the box,

01:13 - 02.046 and it was accurate.

01:14 - 03.348 It really is.

01:14 - 07.509 So building the capital stack and it could even be,

01:14 - 11.280 you know, roadway work or multimodal or,

01:14 - 15.617 you know, other pieces that go into making a whole project.

01:14 - 20.198 And, and our local government specialists and our local planners can help

01:14 - 21.299 you do that. Yeah.

01:14 - 22.767 And they could bring in our

01:14 - 26.538 regional advisors and as a team could help piece that together for you.

01:14 - 30.008 And then the staff of PA wilds is really good at helping knit

01:14 - 34.169 it all together and helping find some private dollars for the matches.

01:14 - 37.773 It's not the grants, we just need the businesses.

01:14 - 41.052 We need somewhere for the riders to go.

01:14 - 43.688 Right. And and we're not the only community.

01:14 - 47.892 There are several communities on the Thousand Mile Trail that need this.

01:14 - 50.495 I noticed that, Secretary Carroll, you have a comment?

01:14 - 51.996 Yeah, just real quickly, I mean it.

01:14 - 55.667 There's a new PennDOT policy to allow consideration of ATVs

01:14 - 58.694 and side by side on state roads, certain state roads,

01:14 - 02.431 in the event that secretary not mentioned Tioga County,

01:15 - 06.468 at the front of the line with respect to rolling out the ability to put,

01:15 - 10.648 ATV in side by side on PennDOT roads, that was not something

01:15 - 13.675 that was in the realm of the possible a year or two ago.

01:15 - 17.312 But, you know, considering the traffic in this, the site distances,

01:15 - 22.451 we are now entertaining applications from municipalities for ATVs on local roads.

01:15 - 26.264 I'm afraid we've run out of time for our session.

01:15 - 31.436 But I want to thank, the panelists, not only for joining us this morning

01:15 - 35.173 and providing all their, great updates, but also for their dedication

01:15 - 36.407 to our Commonwealth

01:15 - 41.546 and for partnering with SAB, to, to solve some of these problems.

01:15 - 43.539 So thank you very much, Karen.

01:15 - 50.822 I'd like to thank the, each of you

01:15 - 54.850 for coming today and, giving us the information.

01:15 - 58.120 It was very enlightening.

01:15 - 01.299 Ron, thanks for moderating.

01:16 - 09.323 And.

01:16 - 29.451 I. Think.