00:01 - Good morning and welcome to day four of week two

00:06 - of our budget hearings.

00:08 - This morning, we're so glad to be joined

00:12 - by the Department of State.

00:16 - Before I begin. Chairman Strus.

00:19 - Do you have any introductory comments?

00:20 - Yes. Thank you, Chairman Harris. Good morning everyone.

00:22 - Thank you for being here.

00:24 - For the Department of State, the governor is proposing a general fund

00:27 - spend of roughly 44.4 million for the upcoming fiscal year,

00:33 - an increase of 1.3 million, or 2.9%, over the current fiscal year.

00:38 - Just a couple of highlights that, I'm sure we'll get into that.

00:41 - We would like to learn a little bit more about.

00:43 - A $1.4 million initiative within the voter registration

00:46 - and education appropriation for voter education and direct outreach, and then,

00:52 - an executive authorization for 1.3

00:55 - million and a new line for publishing constitutional amendments.

00:58 - So, we look forward to hearing your testimony today, and we'll get started.

01:02 - Thank you.

01:03 - Thank you. Chairman.

01:04 - We definitely want to welcome, the secretary of the Department of State,

01:09 - Secretary Al Schmidt here, as well as all of

01:13 - those, Department of State,

01:17 - my friends from

01:18 - the northeast part of the state always like to remind us

01:22 - about everyone who's a secretary, who's from the northeast.

01:26 - I do want to make mention that the secretary of state

01:29 - was once a city commissioner in the city of the first class.

01:35 - And we thank him for his work there.

01:38 - And we thank him for his work here and glad to have him.

01:41 - Also, we have so let me introduce all those folks.

01:44 - But Jonathan Marks, I would say, is probably the second most recognized

01:48 - face in the Department of State for all of us elected officials.

01:52 - I think you will all look at him and noticed why we all know Mr.

01:56 - Marks.

01:58 - Before we begin in the middle of

02:00 - the table is our timekeeper.

02:04 - Each member

02:05 - will have five minutes to ask a question.

02:08 - When they.

02:09 - When you begin, when they begin, the light will be green.

02:13 - When they have 30s left, it will be yellow.

02:15 - And when it turns red.

02:16 - Please conclude with your comments before we begin.

02:21 - If everyone could stand even on the back bench because you may have to come up,

02:25 - we're going to swear everybody in.

02:36 - Do you solemnly swear that the testimony you're about

02:38 - to give us the truth, the whole truth, so help you God?

02:40 - Yes, sir.

02:41 - All right. Everybody may be seated.

02:44 - And let me see.

02:49 - Secretary.

02:50 - Would you like to have a statement, or would

02:54 - you like to go directly to questions?

02:59 - It should just be on.

03:00 - Oh, sorry.

03:01 - It literally says always on, I apologize.

03:03 - Good to see you again, chairman.

03:05 - Thank you for having me.

03:07 - Good to see you as well.

03:08 - Chairman and members of the committee

03:11 - appreciate the opportunity to testify before you today.

03:15 - Just very briefly, I've submitted, written remarks.

03:18 - But as you know, the Pennsylvania Department state has a very diverse

03:22 - portfolio of responsibilities, all very important,

03:26 - ranging from a responsibility to oversee elections in the Commonwealth

03:30 - to safeguarding the health and safety of, Pennsylvanians.

03:35 - Just very briefly, in this past year, we've continued to,

03:40 - experience significant, improvement in the department.

03:44 - Have worked closely with our counties to improve and unify

03:48 - election administration as much as, we have the ability to do so.

03:53 - In Pennsylvania, we revised our election materials

03:57 - so that counties can use the same Mail-In ballot

04:01 - envelopes for in-person voting, revise the provisional ballot

04:05 - envelopes to drive down any error rates that could occur.

04:10 - In in our regulatory programs,

04:14 - our, processing times are

04:16 - down by at least 75% across the board,

04:20 - some more than 85%, which helps people provide services to Pennsylvanians

04:25 - and, and make a livelihood for themselves and their families.

04:30 - I'm joined here today by,

04:34 - Deputy Secretary Jonathan Marks.

04:36 - Deputy secretary, who's responsible for our elections team.

04:41 - Deputy Secretary Carrie Johnson,

04:44 - responsible, responsible for our regulatory programs.

04:48 - Acting Commissioner Ariane, from BPO, a

04:52 - and our outstanding, budget director, Kim Mattis.

04:57 - So I'm happy to answer any questions that you might have.

05:00 - Thank you. Sir.

05:02 - Thank you sir.

05:02 - We're going to start with Representative Friel.

05:05 - Thank you, Chairman and Secretary Smith, thank you for coming out today.

05:10 - As you said, elections is one of the most important things that you guys do.

05:13 - And I'm going to talk a little bit

05:15 - about elections this past November in Chester County.

05:20 - As you know, about 70,000, third party and independent voters

05:25 - were left out of the initial poll books that were delivered.

05:28 - And, the investigation

05:31 - that went into that found the cause was, you know, small cause of human error,

05:36 - which, you know, mistakes can happen, right?

05:39 - We know that.

05:40 - But in something as important as our election,

05:43 - we have an obligation to minimize those mistakes.

05:46 - Can you talk about just like, how rare a mistake like this is?

05:51 - And what the department and the county can do

05:54 - to ensure that nothing like this happens again?

05:57 - It is extremely rare.

05:59 - And the only time that we've experienced that, where a county

06:02 - does, a poll book, it's kind of public extract

06:06 - to extract, eligible voters for that election, for a general election

06:10 - that did not include all registered voters

06:13 - and only included major party, voters.

06:16 - And it was a result and we've met with, we've met with the delegation, we've met

06:20 - with the commissioners, we've met with vendors, we've met with everyone.

06:24 - And it's very clear that that was the cause of, what occurred.

06:30 - However rare it is and however

06:33 - well the county did in addressing the issue once it became apparent.

06:37 - There are certainly in my experience of, running elections

06:40 - for ten years in and one of our counties in Pennsylvania,

06:44 - there's no such thing as a small problem on Election day.

06:48 - If a street gets torn up because of a water leak or,

06:52 - a gas line issue, that prevents voters from reaching a single polling place,

06:56 - that is a major issue.

06:57 - So we approach all these issues,

07:01 - as though they're critical, which which they are.

07:03 - Anytime any voter is impeded from making their voice

07:06 - heard is a significant issue for us.

07:11 - No, I appreciate that.

07:12 - And just to, you know, put a exclamation point at the end of that,

07:19 - we had these these voters left off the polls.

07:22 - And, I think it was good to know that

07:26 - provisional ballots, the the process

07:28 - that was in place that when something like this does happen,

07:31 - that every eligible voter was able to get in there, cast their vote

07:36 - and have it counted in that election, is that is that true of the investigation?

07:40 - Found that to be the case?

07:42 - That is accurate, sir.

07:45 - One other thing I wanted to mention is that the default for,

07:49 - Holbrook, extraction of voters for general election.

07:55 - The default is to include all voters.

07:58 - So, on our end, we've made just a couple of changes.

08:02 - One is to, reach out to the counties

08:06 - to make sure that they're, doing things correctly

08:10 - and confirming to make sure something like this doesn't occur again.

08:14 - And when any issue occurs, especially one like this,

08:17 - have, many years ago made provisional ballots available for voter.

08:21 - So if a machine is down or there's a whole book issue

08:25 - or whatever else might occur to prevent a voter from casting their vote

08:28 - on the regular voting system, then they have the ability

08:31 - to vote by a provisional ballot, a paper, or a provisional ballot

08:34 - that is then adjudicated. After the election, everyone,

08:38 - I want to thank you for for addressing that issue.

08:41 - And also in the time that you guys, that day and the days after were there

08:45 - to assist the county with both the investigation

08:48 - and our delegation with understanding what occurred and

08:51 - and how it was resolved and, and brought to our satisfaction

08:54 - that at least we took care of the voters, that day.

08:57 - And I'm really hopeful that we're

08:58 - not going to see a mistake like that again as we go into this election cycle.

09:01 - So thank you, sir.

09:02 - Thank you sir, and thank you again for having me and Chester.

09:06 - County for your Voter Hall of Fame event, some time ago was a really impressive

09:11 - showing of the dedication of voters in your county.

09:14 - Yeah, we had some 50 years in a row, without missing a single vote.

09:19 - That was pretty impressive.

09:20 - So thank you, sir.

09:22 - Well, that's it.

09:22 - That is impressive. Thank the gentleman.

09:24 - Representative Brown, Secretary Schmidt,

09:28 - the governor's budget proposes

09:31 - $2 million for voter registration and education.

09:35 - And that's all a whopping $1.4 million

09:39 - or a 250% increase.

09:45 - Now, if

09:45 - the General Assembly had enacted new laws that change the way Pennsylvanians vote,

09:51 - or perhaps instituted a common sense voter ID law, I would understand

09:57 - the need for additional voter education and outreach.

10:00 - However, voting methods have remained unchanged

10:04 - basically since about 77 from 2019

10:09 - and likely will not be changed in 2026.

10:14 - So what does this initiative entail and why is the funding necessary?

10:19 - And you're certainly right, representative, for better or worse,

10:23 - election reform has not, happened in Pennsylvania

10:27 - that might address, some outstanding issues

10:30 - that our counties struggle with, which is incredibly important to me.

10:34 - But all elections, even though equally important,

10:38 - whether it's for a president, the United States or, county

10:43 - commissioner, turnout very significantly in these elections

10:48 - and in, general

10:52 - federal general elections like this one, there are certainly a lot

10:55 - more voter engagement and a lot more voter education that is needed.

11:00 - And that explains the 1.4 million increase,

11:03 - in terms of reaching out to voters and making sure that they're aware

11:08 - of the basic things that are required in order to to vote in this election.

11:13 - It helps lift the burden from our counties.

11:15 - So they're not carrying the weight of that in a federal election cycle.

11:20 - And I would commit to you now, as I've committed to,

11:23 - this chamber before, and have done

11:28 - throughout my career, there would never be any voter engagement.

11:33 - That would be different for one voter.

11:35 - That would be different for another voter.

11:36 - That's all of your party, regardless of where you live, regardless of your,

11:40 - age, regardless of anything, we want to make sure that all voters

11:44 - are equally informed of important deadlines,

11:48 - dates, requirements, and all the rest.

11:50 - So can you give me a specific example of an education piece that would be used?

11:56 - There's a couple of things that are mailers that that can be done

11:59 - to help, notify voters of the important dates

12:02 - and what's required, when they, when they vote, there

12:08 - there are text messages and there are other approaches

12:10 - that you can take to notify voters to make sure that they're aware of,

12:15 - basic requirements for voting in,

12:18 - in Pennsylvania to alleviate the burden that counties have to carry

12:22 - with those voters calling up to let them know, for example,

12:25 - when the mail in ballot deadline is, if they choose to vote by mail,

12:28 - to make sure they know where they can go, to look up

12:31 - where their polling place is, if they choose to vote in person.

12:34 - All right. I'll look forward to seeing those.

12:36 - It's quite a hefty price tag, though.

12:39 - Back in September of 2023, Governor Shapiro

12:42 - implemented a new policy whereby Commonwealth residents

12:46 - who were obtaining a new or renewing a driver's license or ID card

12:51 - would be automatically registered to vote unless they opted out of doing so.

12:56 - In his initial press release, Governor Shapiro has said that, quote,

13:00 - automatic voter registration is a commonsense step

13:04 - to ensure election security and save Pennsylvanians time and tax dollars.

13:09 - Within that press release, the governor suggested that this provision

13:12 - would ensure election security and save taxpayer dollars.

13:17 - During last year's hearing, your agency was unable

13:20 - to calculate how many taxpayer dollars were saved.

13:24 - To this point, has your agency looked into, this issue

13:28 - to see if taxpayer dollars were saved and if so, how how much?

13:33 - Processing an electronic application, which is essentially what AVR is,

13:37 - takes a fraction of the time, if I recall, it takes about an eighth

13:41 - as much time to process an electronic application

13:44 - that might come through either registering to vote online, or registering

13:49 - to vote through automatic voter registration at a PennDOT office.

13:53 - The burden that the clerks at the county level carry, in processing

13:58 - paper applications is is significant compared to electronic application.

14:04 - So do we have a dollar amount attached to that?

14:07 - There is no way for us to calculate exactly how many dollars

14:11 - would be saved by the program, other than knowing, having done

14:15 - that for ten years, the comparison of electronic voter

14:19 - applications versus paper applications is is really significant

14:24 - for the amount of time the counties have to spend processing

14:27 - those applications, in addition to the cost savings

14:32 - as a result of the time that the clerks take to do it,

14:35 - automatic voter registration through PennDOT is more accurate.

14:38 - There isn't a clerk looking at a paper application form trying to figure out

14:43 - if that address is 630

14:46 - 8 or 8308 the name is certainly spelled correctly.

14:50 - The information is all correct.

14:52 - So it is faster to process and more accurate

14:55 - when done through an online application or through AVR and AVR.

15:00 - In terms of our analysis of what has occurred

15:03 - since its implementation, and I think September of 2023,

15:07 - it hasn't benefited any party one way or another.

15:10 - It's almost exactly the same.

15:12 - A percentage of ours that registered as D's that registered.

15:15 - You know, I was just looking the total savings.

15:18 - But thank you. Of course. Thank you representative.

15:20 - Thank the gentle lady. Representative Sanchez.

15:23 - Thank you, Mr.

15:24 - Chairman.

15:25 - Good morning, Mr.

15:26 - Secretary. And the other officials.

15:29 - Have a question for you around.

15:33 - Data privacy and security,

15:36 - particularly in the context of election data, we deal with a lot of people's,

15:42 - information, you know, like a home address,

15:45 - of voters and the voter registration and, you know,

15:50 - as I'm sure you're well aware of in the climate of political violence,

15:55 - there's a lot of, elected officials

15:58 - information, personal information on file.

16:01 - I know we're is the season.

16:03 - We're filing petitions with lots of addresses, home addresses on them.

16:07 - What are some of the steps

16:10 - that, you've taken?

16:13 - And it can be agency wide, but to to safeguard this data.

16:17 - And I know you've done some things to to make that

16:20 - a little less publicly accessible in the interest of safety.

16:25 - Right.

16:25 - And balancing the importance of safety with the transparency that we're required

16:29 - to provide, especially in the challenge period

16:32 - after candidates file, where,

16:36 - not only to the petitions have to be made available, but also

16:41 - residency and other other factors like that.

16:44 - In the last couple of years.

16:45 - So the department has taken steps to one, make sure that

16:48 - that information is only available for a short period of time.

16:52 - It it's not available in a way that if you do a Google search, it would come up.

16:55 - You have to go through the portal, you have to go into the document

16:59 - to be able to see that, and

17:05 - essentially those steps were to make that information

17:08 - a lot less accessible and only accessible for a limited period of time for,

17:13 - for, for obviously legitimate reasons.

17:17 - Do you mind if I ask, Deputy Secretary Marks to please adhere to my comments?

17:22 - The secretary. Sure.

17:23 - Thank Secretary.

17:24 - And, yes, and we have also, redact addresses

17:28 - when appropriate from our records.

17:30 - That's something that we do

17:32 - in consultation with our county, with our counsel is me.

17:36 - And we've also done additional training with our county election officials.

17:41 - There is a process, in the voter registration law,

17:46 - and in our regulations that allow individuals

17:49 - who may have a reason, a safety concern,

17:53 - to have their home address redacted from any publicly available files

17:58 - or information that either the department may may have, or the county may have.

18:03 - And thank you for for those efforts.

18:05 - And let me shift gears a little bit,

18:08 - but it's probably still going to be Deputy Secretary Marx's terrain.

18:13 - Here.

18:13 - Wanted to thank you, Deputy Secretary, for, working through

18:18 - we advanced some legislation last year for the Electoral College Reform Act,

18:23 - which is a fancy way of saying we're putting a few more dates

18:27 - and some certainty into the process if we'd like to do that.

18:30 - And I appreciate the work with that.

18:32 - We're hoping to bring that forward again this year.

18:36 - To try to, you know, try to actually get it done.

18:39 - Is that something the department would welcome to

18:43 - to have some deadlines in there.

18:44 - And I know you were helpful in shaping some of those with us and telling us,

18:48 - you know, some of the realities and what we could do and couldn't do.

18:53 - I, certainly the department

18:57 - would support any, you know, changes to statutory

18:59 - deadlines, commonsense changes that, you know, enable counties

19:03 - to do the important work they have to do, both pre-election and post-election,

19:08 - while also considering the very tight timelines that, you know,

19:12 - particularly in a presidential election year, we have to meet, to, to meet,

19:17 - the Commonwealth's obligations under federal law.

19:20 - You know, without

19:22 - you know, I don't want to analyze a particular piece of legislation

19:26 - as I sit here, but we certainly be supportive of of

19:29 - making updates to deadlines to make sure all of that important work gets done.

19:33 - And, counties are able to do what they need to do to ensure

19:37 - that their vote totals are accurate before they certify.

19:40 - The more certainty when it comes to election administration,

19:43 - the better, provided it's all obviously within the confines of the law.

19:48 - I testified in front of, I think it was the Senate.

19:55 - So the.

19:55 - Senate Rules Committee or Senate Admin Committee in DC,

19:59 - in advance of being passed up there about the importance,

20:04 - for our election administrators at the, at the state and county level,

20:10 - to have the certainty when it comes to

20:13 - when the deadlines are and what's required to be completed,

20:16 - by each of those deadlines to make sure that everything is perfectly clear.

20:21 - Great.

20:21 - I'll have to look at that testimony.

20:23 - And thank you both very much.

20:25 - Thank you.

20:26 - Gentlemen.

20:26 - Representative Nelson,

20:30 - thank, Mr. Chair.

20:31 - Welcome, Secretary.

20:33 - Deputy Secretary Markson, good to see you.

20:35 - I'd like to start my questions today in the area of, professional licensing.

20:41 - It's my understanding that your department, the governor, had requested,

20:45 - a report or analysis about licensing, and maybe that just came out today.

20:51 - You know, I think, I appreciate the governor's desire to help recruit

20:56 - and keep people here in the state and kind of make it easier

20:59 - on our small businesses and individuals to start.

21:03 - Can you

21:03 - touch on that report a little bit and maybe provide some examples

21:07 - where we might be able to, smooth the pathway

21:11 - in the area of licensing, switching

21:12 - it more to certificates and something like that?

21:15 - Yes, certainly.

21:15 - Representative, and the governor made very clear from day

21:20 - one in the administration to me of the need to eliminate any unnecessary

21:25 - red tape, so-called red tape in the Pennsylvania Department of State

21:29 - to make sure that when people are seeking licenses, as I said before,

21:34 - to provide services to their fellow Pennsylvanians

21:37 - or to, to make, make a living, that we should do everything we can

21:42 - to eliminate it,

21:42 - as long as we are always safeguarding the health and safety of Pennsylvanians.

21:47 - One of the issues that, the governor mentioned just up here,

21:51 - a couple weeks ago, was that the Pennsylvania, Pennsylvania.

21:55 - Department of State would conduct a review to see where Pennsylvania's requirements

21:59 - are for different, professional licensing, for different professions,

22:05 - for licensing relative to other states, contiguous states.

22:09 - And that report is due today.

22:12 - I've obviously reviewed a draft of that report and will include

22:16 - comparisons for, for you

22:19 - and this body and the administration to consider

22:22 - whether the requirements for training,

22:26 - should be what they are right now.

22:29 - So that's great.

22:30 - And one state, let's say it's 1000 hours in Pennsylvania, it's $1,500.

22:35 - Is 1500 the right amount or is a thousand adequate?

22:38 - I agree with you there.

22:39 - And maybe moving forward we can look together to help streamline those.

22:42 - You know, we got rid of the hair braiding stuff last year.

22:46 - I think our barbers are thousand 200 hours or 1250 in new Jersey.

22:51 - They're only 900.

22:52 - So, yeah, it's a positive thing.

22:54 - And if we can be of assistance, you know, in streamlining that

22:57 - we definitely want to be a part of it.

22:59 - Thank you.

22:59 - Representing the next part of my questioning shifts to Eric,

23:02 - you know, our electronic registration information center.

23:06 - In particular, you know, the trend states have been leaving, Eric.

23:11 - Now there's only 25 member states,

23:14 - I think, in the nation that are participating in this.

23:17 - So, I'm just wondering, you know, Pennsylvania's

23:21 - role, within Eric, is that value added.

23:27 - I'm a big believer of election integrity, and we've been

23:29 - working on this double voting, which is what Eric's supposed to address.

23:32 - But Ohio, West Virginia, Virginia, new Jersey, Kentucky, I mean,

23:37 - that's in just some of our contiguous states and surrounding states.

23:41 - That's 25 million voters that are not getting cross-checked through.

23:45 - Eric, is there something else that Pennsylvania

23:48 - should be doing or working in a different way so that, you know,

23:52 - we can ensure that, certainty that you were just talking about.

23:56 - Yes. And I share your interest in election integrity,

24:01 - Eric, is a valuable resource for us to make sure that we don't have

24:04 - voters registered in more than one location, whether it's within

24:08 - Pennsylvania or Pennsylvania in some other state that belongs to Eric.

24:13 - You're absolutely right.

24:14 - Undeniably, a number of states have left Eric, and that leaves them,

24:18 - with fewer resources and us with fewer resources.

24:22 - When they leave those states that have left

24:26 - and some have joined, I think New York is joining right now

24:29 - or just, passed the legislature and the governor just signed it.

24:32 - So in New York, I can tell you a state will be joining,

24:35 - which will help Northeast Pennsylvania, for sure.

24:39 - But those states have,

24:42 - it's very clear, have struggled with establishing unilateral

24:47 - 1 to 1 data sharing agreements with other states

24:50 - so that the information that is required to do those sorts of checks

24:55 - that are necessary, can be shared in a way that is safe and secure.

25:00 - We can't entrust,

25:04 - in some sort of unsecure way, Social Security numbers,

25:09 - driver's license numbers or anything else like that with other states.

25:12 - Eric, by the way, just just just timely thing real quick.

25:15 - One thing because our seconds are left and I know we only have a couple.

25:18 - I'm sorry. It's really in Pennsylvania.

25:20 - It's only a two year window for Pennsylvania investigators.

25:25 - To address a double voting.

25:27 - Like, the way that it's dressed and as a felony, would.

25:30 - You're with the Department of State be supportive for maybe extending that

25:34 - so it would mirror the federal, you know, so our investigators

25:37 - would have a longer time to look because two years is really quick.

25:42 - I can't really speak

25:42 - to the amount of time necessary, but I can speak to how important it is.

25:47 - As of yesterday afternoon, evening,

25:51 - there was a case that we referred that we identified from working with Eric

25:56 - of a double voter in Pennsylvania in Bucks County and Florida.

26:00 - As a result of our referral

26:02 - and working closely with our federal partners and law enforcement,

26:06 - there was a conviction yesterday of that individual who had voted in Pennsylvania.

26:11 - And one other location is rare as it is that that occurs.

26:14 - We have to remain constantly vigilant and always be

26:18 - investigating and investigating, as you're saying, in a timely manner,

26:21 - so that it isn't something you get around to one day.

26:24 - And we've added resources in the department to assist with that effort.

26:28 - Thank you, Mr. Secretary.

26:29 - Thank you.

26:29 - Chair, thank the gentleman.

26:31 - Representative Abney.

26:33 - Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

26:34 - Thank you, Mr.

26:34 - Secretary and your team, for being here today.

26:37 - I wanted to talk a little bit about, polling place, safety and intimidation.

26:42 - I'm looking at a guidance that the Department of State

26:46 - put out in September of 2020 for,

26:48 - guidance on rules in effect at the polling place on election day.

26:53 - And there's a

26:53 - section on here around police officers and other peace officers.

26:56 - It says generally, police officers are not permitted in the polling place,

27:00 - uniformed or plainclothes police officers must remain

27:04 - 100ft or more from the entrance of a polling place.

27:07 - The exceptions on this rule,

27:09 - when a police officer is personally voting,

27:11 - when a polling place is located in a building that also houses

27:15 - a police station, and when police officers are summoned to preserve the peace

27:19 - if necessary, the local election officials or three voters in the precinct

27:23 - may call upon local officials,

27:25 - including constables, sheriffs or police officers, to clear a path to the door

27:29 - if it is obstructed or preventing voters from voting.

27:32 - Maintain order

27:34 - and quell any disturbance if it arises.

27:37 - Uniformed police officers, such as constables or sheriffs stationed

27:40 - in the polling place, may have the effect of intimidating voters.

27:44 - The department recommends that counties balance the potentially

27:47 - intimidating effect of uniformed, constables

27:51 - in the polling place, with the need to preserve the peace.

27:55 - We also had the attorney general, Dave Sunday, here, I think earlier this week,

28:00 - on the website, it says that it is illegal

28:03 - under Pennsylvania law to use any means to intimidate or attempt

28:07 - to intimidate voters, either inside or outside of a polling locations.

28:10 - Intimidating behavior can include words or actions.

28:14 - Furthermore, it is illegal for anyone to block

28:16 - or attempt to block by any means the entrance to the polls.

28:20 - Intimidating behavior should be reported merely to your county Board of elections.

28:24 - So I'm just curious.

28:25 - I'm looking at this, this guidance, particularly the section that says uniform

28:29 - peace officers, such as constables or sheriff's station in a polling place

28:33 - may have the effect of intimidating voters.

28:35 - Certainly we want to encourage all qualified electors and voters

28:38 - to come out, if they so choose on Election Day and vote, wondering if a guidance

28:43 - similar to this, will be provided again to our county

28:46 - commissioners, and or our county elections officials.

28:50 - And our guidance is obviously

28:52 - consistent with, and is driven by the laws in Pennsylvania.

28:56 - So our guidance is really reflecting what those laws provide,

29:01 - and the restrictions around uniformed police officers being present

29:04 - at polling places while voting is, is occurring.

29:08 - We review those, the guidance that we have across the board

29:13 - every year to determine if they have to be updated in some way.

29:17 - And if an update to that specific piece of guidance,

29:22 - our stakeholders or we feel are necessary, then we would certainly update it.

29:26 - I also want to switch gears a little bit to the sure system.

29:29 - Can you give us a little bit of an update status update of how it's going,

29:33 - where it is

29:33 - in the process, in kind of what counties should expect with this new process?

29:37 - Yes, certainly.

29:38 - The system, as you know, is the,

29:40 - voter registration database that all of our counties rely on.

29:44 - The Department of State maintains it, but it's really our county partners

29:48 - that interface with it every day, as I as I did for, ten, ten years,

29:53 - soon after we,

29:56 - had to terminate that contract with a previous vendor,

30:00 - who had been contracted earlier to, replace, provide, sure.

30:05 - Replacement system.

30:07 - We immediately began,

30:10 - not only approaching our county partners to make sure

30:14 - that everything's informed by them, the end users of this whole system.

30:18 - But also, moving along as expeditiously

30:22 - as possible, and responsibly as possible.

30:26 - The Shaw replacement system, we put out an RFP

30:30 - and less than a year ago, signed it with a new vendor.

30:34 - And we've been working with that vendor, informed by our county partners

30:38 - on on a replacement system.

30:40 - How are

30:40 - we going to how are you all looking to measure success if it actually works?

30:44 - Like what are the things that we're you're looking to track to see if it's working?

30:49 - I would say in terms of the use of the Shaw system,

30:52 - I would say obviously the integrity of the process, its safety and security.

30:55 - So it can't be in any way

30:56 - compromised from a cyber security breach or anything else like that.

31:01 - And very importantly,

31:02 - and I'm sorry I keep saying this, but to make sure our county partners

31:05 - have a system that they can rely on, that they work with every day

31:09 - to make sure that it is the best for them, because we're really providing

31:12 - the Commonwealth is really providing a system for them to use to create

31:16 - a statewide voter registration database, make it easier to work with.

31:21 - Shaw has been around for a while and becomes increasingly expensive

31:25 - and becomes increasingly difficult to work with and extract the sort of information

31:30 - that you need, in advance of Election Day.

31:34 - But, ultimately, we want to make sure that everything we do

31:38 - is informed by our county partners because they're the ones that interact

31:41 - with it every day. Okay.

31:43 - Thank you, Mr. Secretary. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

31:45 - Thank you. Representative. Gentleman.

31:46 - Representative Mako.

31:48 - Thank you, Mr.

31:48 - Chairman and Mr. Secretary.

31:50 - Good to see you again, sir. Likewise, sir.

31:53 - In your opening remarks, you mentioned the,

31:56 - the improvements that your department is making.

31:59 - You said you went from 75 to 85% more efficiency.

32:03 - Now, I want to ask you about the,

32:06 - the new Pal system, the licensure, IT system modernization.

32:10 - Did I get that right? Okay.

32:14 - Yeah.

32:14 - So from my understanding, I guess you contracted last year, may of last year.

32:19 - When is when can we expect that to come online?

32:22 - And what's the what would be the final cost of that?

32:25 - Initially, we had been looking at, as I testified before, about

32:29 - we've been looking at rolling it out into separate phases from working with,

32:34 - the people who would, be using the system every day

32:38 - and working with the vendor and working with our performance management team.

32:42 - It was clear that that, approach didn't make sense.

32:45 - But right now, the plan is to implement Pal's in in 2027.

32:51 - But that isn't a matter of just, like, waiting around for a new system

32:55 - to come online.

32:56 - As a as I mentioned, our processing times

33:00 - have had, been improved dramatically since,

33:05 - January of 2023,

33:08 - the amount of time it takes for someone to get, their call

33:12 - answered in response to that call is down dramatically.

33:17 - And, I think the user experience has, has improved

33:21 - with some of the changes that we've made.

33:23 - May I ask Deputy Secretary, Kenji Johnson to, to add to my remarks?

33:31 - Thank you, Secretary, as I would,

33:33 - I would echo the secretary's, statement, but also,

33:36 - also emphasize the fact that, because of the nature

33:42 - of the implementation, we moved to a, one roll out because we did

33:46 - not want to impact all of the successes that the secretary mentioned.

33:50 - So in terms of the processing times, in terms of, responsiveness,

33:54 - with customer service and in relation to the call volume,

33:58 - we don't want to do anything that would impact, all of that,

34:01 - all of those efficiencies with the, with the,

34:04 - the transition to the new system now and I mean, a

34:08 - that sounds makes me feel better hearing that got more efficient.

34:12 - But now we're moving to a new system.

34:13 - I've been on professional. I, I know you gentlemen know this.

34:16 - I've been on professional licensure for ten years,

34:18 - and every year it seems like the Pal system has just been brutal.

34:23 - It's just a new issue.

34:24 - We throw millions more at it and then the licenses, their fees

34:28 - are kind of going up to help pay for covering down on some of those costs.

34:31 - And I guess I'm just curious if this new system, we finally got pals, right.

34:36 - And then we're going to move to the pals 2.0.

34:39 - Have you,

34:43 - solicited any feedback from the licensees,

34:45 - on this process to help streamline it?

34:50 - Speaking to seeing

34:52 - as they are paying for the system to move forward.

34:55 - Do you mind if I ask?

34:56 - Absolutely. Commissioner client from DPI.

34:59 - Yes, we have, asked, stakeholders for feedback on what will be better

35:03 - for the new licensing system.

35:04 - Some of the benefits that you'll see in the evoke system

35:07 - is that the evoke system will be mobile friendly.

35:10 - Okay.

35:10 - Now applicants will be able to complete

35:12 - applications on their phones and other mobile devices.

35:15 - Currently.

35:16 - That's something they cannot do in the user.

35:19 - I'm sorry. No no no okay. Keep going.

35:21 - The user experience, and the new evoke system will be better,

35:25 - internally and externally, internally for my staff, there are many,

35:31 - work flow issues they have in the house today,

35:33 - like some things that require 15 clicks

35:36 - to get to the processing of a license will now be cut down to two clicks.

35:40 - Yeah.

35:41 - In addition to that, the new evoke system

35:43 - will also accept paper applications for our technology challenge.

35:47 - Folks, that's something public doesn't appreciate that.

35:51 - No. I had

35:54 - when I was going to rudely interrupt you, I was just thinking

35:57 - of the security of the mobile app.

36:01 - I guess, do we have a guarantee that there's

36:03 - a security feature in place for those mobile apps?

36:07 - Because we were just talking about,

36:09 - the previous speaker

36:10 - was just talking about how do we secure and make sure everything

36:13 - in our elections is secure, but also when you're dealing with licensure, you.

36:17 - I mean, I'm sure you're dealing with PII and all that as well. So,

36:23 - we do we do have a security in place.

36:25 - And then I see my light is on, shameless plug

36:28 - for HB 644.

36:32 - The cosmetology booth rentals.

36:34 - We're trying to actually eliminate systemic inequity.

36:38 - So, Yeah, shameless plug for that.

36:41 - Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

36:42 - Thank you.

36:43 - Gentlemen represent Representative Waxman.

36:46 - Thank you. Chairman. It's great to see you.

36:49 - Thank you so much for for being here with us.

36:51 - It's always good to see you.

36:52 - I, likewise represented.

36:54 - I wanted to first start off by asking you about automatic voter registration.

36:59 - Specifically when this was under discussion, I the opportunity

37:03 - to work on that issue a little bit before I was, joined the legislature.

37:06 - And there was a lot of conversation about sort of the Partizan breakdown

37:10 - that this might produce.

37:12 - And I think it's very striking when you look at the numbers,

37:15 - it's really not a benefit to either party.

37:18 - In fact, most or a huge chunk of people are picking

37:22 - to register as independents and not with either political party.

37:26 - I'm wondering if you could just comment a little bit

37:27 - about how that, you know, has played out, if that's surprising to you.

37:31 - And I know we do a lot of attention to PennDOT,

37:34 - but there are other ways for people to access this automatic voter

37:37 - registration as well.

37:38 - And I'm wondering if you see that being an impact.

37:42 - Yes.

37:43 - And you're and you're right, in terms of the breakdown, as I mentioned before,

37:46 - it has an advantage one party or another, automatic voter registration

37:50 - is essentially updating voters registration in a more real time way.

37:55 - So if things trend toward one party or another,

37:59 - it captures it a little bit more in real time.

38:02 - As you know, voter registration really lags behind voter behavior,

38:05 - like a voter will start voting a certain way for years,

38:08 - and then eventually get around to changing their party affiliation

38:12 - and in a closed primary state.

38:13 - And this speaks a little bit to to your question about people registering,

38:19 - not in a major party.

38:20 - We are, of course, a closed primary state in Pennsylvania.

38:23 - So when you ask if it's surprising, it's surprising to the extent

38:27 - that those voters are are,

38:31 - are choosing to not participate in other Democratic or Republican

38:34 - primaries, obviously, any voter can vote however they want in the general election,

38:38 - but that is a trend not unique to Pennsylvania.

38:41 - It is across the country.

38:43 - We have seen more and more of that.

38:44 - It's only that Pennsylvania is one of those states with a closed primary system

38:48 - that has a significant number of people registering third party.

38:51 - Yeah, it's very interesting to me.

38:52 - We've, you know, given voters a way to easily opt in.

38:56 - But I think there is a message being sent to both parties about voters

39:00 - kind of feeling about the system as it stands

39:01 - and choosing to opt out from the party, from the political parties.

39:04 - I think that's a very interesting trend. Okay.

39:06 - So I want to just shift gears with a second question, which is about AI,

39:11 - and this is a much broader question, which is I am curious how your department,

39:17 - when it comes to elections and campaigns, is seeing this new technology play out.

39:22 - And the example that I'll use was just last week, I was gathering

39:26 - nomination petitions to get on the ballot, and I pressed a ring doorbell.

39:31 - And normally when you press a ring doorbell, it goes in, you can communicate

39:35 - with whoever's behind.

39:36 - Well, this was a brand new AI one,

39:39 - and it actually said no to me before

39:42 - I could even get in and talk to the voter like it knew what I was asking for.

39:45 - You're holding a clipboard at the clipboard.

39:48 - I was, you know, I was you can imagine.

39:49 - And, it was kind of surprising to be denied by a robot.

39:53 - It's a get a petition.

39:55 - And so I'm just it to me, there's just so many interesting things

39:59 - that that come out of that.

40:00 - And I'm just curious broadly, generally, what are you seeing out there

40:04 - the way that that in the last cycle or two, this technology has showed up

40:09 - and AI is, across our programs.

40:14 - It's developing so rapidly.

40:16 - It's really been a moving target.

40:18 - And that the the advances in its maturity are remarkable.

40:23 - And it was very clear that in the election space,

40:27 - it has matured to the degree that it can do significant harm.

40:31 - Right, when it comes to, making it appear that a candidate said

40:35 - something they didn't say or a member said that they didn't say,

40:40 - visually or or speaking or whatever else.

40:44 - It has tremendous potential to improve voter education as well.

40:49 - But whether it has reached that level of maturity or not,

40:51 - I don't know, because we can never be wrong, right?

40:54 - It can never tell the voter the wrong day, the election.

40:58 - It can never tell the voter the wrong day.

41:00 - That's required for the deadline

41:02 - to register to vote or anything else like that.

41:04 - So it has enormous potential.

41:06 - We're already seeing its potential to do harm,

41:09 - and looking forward to its potential to, to improve voter education.

41:13 - And now, just as a follow, you know, what kind of challenges budgetary

41:17 - does this create for your department trying to hit a moving target like that?

41:22 - Well, for us and our communications team, it's really been a matter of monitoring,

41:26 - activity where bad actors

41:29 - are exploiting AI to mislead voters, to make sure that we can respond

41:34 - to any of that in real time, to the extent that we can, using,

41:39 - our social media platforms so that if something does,

41:45 - does,

41:46 - appear and is getting some sort of viral traction

41:49 - that we can make sure that we share the truth related to it.

41:52 - Those are exceptional cases when that occurs.

41:55 - But, you know, we want to make sure that that voters aren't deceived when,

42:01 - there is something I created that is,

42:06 - untrue.

42:07 - Okay. Well, thank you so much.

42:09 - Thank you.

42:09 - General.

42:09 - Right, I apologize, I just wanted to add one thing.

42:13 - We are we also collaborate with other states, other jurisdictions

42:17 - through the I think it's hashtag trusted info campaign.

42:21 - You know, we, like other states, drive people to

42:24 - this is the official information.

42:26 - What you're seeing on social media may or may not be true.

42:29 - So we work we collaborate with other states to make sure that people know

42:33 - where to go to get official information about elections.

42:37 - And thank you. Thank you both.

42:39 - Thank you gentlemen. Thank you. Representative. All summer.

42:42 - Thank you, Mr.

42:43 - Chairman.

42:45 - Thank you, Mr.

42:45 - Secretary and Team, for being here today.

42:47 - Thank you for hearing, all your all your answers

42:51 - to several questions here today.

42:54 - Mr. Secretary,

42:56 - within the governor's budget book budget, it suggests that the governor

43:00 - is also proposing licensing reforms

43:04 - that would make the process for licensed social workers to obtain their credentials

43:09 - the easiest licensure experience

43:13 - in the nation,

43:16 - while maintaining rigorous standards

43:18 - to ultimately draw the most of most

43:21 - more of these professionals to Pennsylvania.

43:25 - The budget book also states that the estimated number of licensed

43:29 - social workers will need to be increased by 12%

43:34 - by 2030

43:37 - to support the needs of the public.

43:40 - Can you expand on the social worker initiative

43:43 - and how it will make it the easiest licensure experience in the nation?

43:51 - The the

43:51 - objective is to, to make

43:54 - that process easier without in any way reducing, safeguards

44:01 - to protect the health and safety of, of Pennsylvanians.

44:04 - Part of this is working with,

44:08 - we're working with educators to make sure that questions

44:12 - that would otherwise be asked on sort of exams are covered.

44:17 - It nothing would prevent someone from getting a certification

44:20 - and taking that, extra step to sort of get a license.

44:24 - We know the need is there.

44:26 - We've seen other states do this with great success.

44:29 - So that's why it's it's worth sort of taking a look at to see

44:33 - if we can reduce unnecessary red tape that really serves no, no purpose

44:38 - and just creates a barrier for, someone to provide those services.

44:44 - So is it, is the theory to,

44:48 - basically get as many folks licensed and then qualify them at a later date?

44:53 - I'm just trying to understand that.

44:56 - I think it's more a matter of integrating,

44:58 - education and the licensing, further down the line

45:03 - to make sure that, everything that would be covered,

45:07 - in a licensing sort of exam process is covered

45:11 - so that when they graduate, they are able to to practice.

45:15 - Again, nothing would prevent someone

45:16 - from either, taking an extra step to get that certification.

45:21 - Nothing would prevent an employer from requiring that, extra certification.

45:26 - Do you mind if I ask, Deputy Secretary Johnson to please do.

45:31 - Thank you. Secretary.

45:32 - Yeah, I just I just want to,

45:36 - just, assure you that

45:38 - the, the, report that you, will be able to look at,

45:43 - after I believe it's made it today.

45:47 - Well, could I ask you to speak it to make sure.

45:50 - So, the report, that the department has put together

45:54 - is is part of a comprehensive, examination of,

45:58 - licensing requirements to drive, the governor's agenda to ensure that,

46:04 - not only are we committing

46:05 - to workforce development, but also, committing to public health and safety.

46:09 - So, you know, we were given the charge,

46:13 - to examine all of the administrative, regulatory and legislative,

46:19 - circumstances surrounding licensure and what what,

46:23 - what acting commissioner, under the Secretary's,

46:27 - leadership has done is really looked at all of the administrative improvements

46:32 - that we can make.

46:33 - And you're seeing those successes with respect to the license

46:37 - licensing times, processing times coming down,

46:40 - the regulatory, the regulatory aspects of those,

46:46 - licensing requirements, those require board interaction.

46:49 - And then, of course, the last component of that is the legislative,

46:53 - the, the legislative, infrastructure around licensing requirements.

46:57 - And that's where, reports like this help drive the discussion

47:01 - with, with the General Assembly.

47:03 - We, created that report as a tool

47:06 - for you to use, so that we could

47:09 - provide the support that you would need to help make the informed decisions.

47:13 - So we we hope that whatever, and

47:16 - whatever capacity we can be supportive, we can we can do that.

47:19 - As you look, as you look to make those changes.

47:22 - Thank you.

47:23 - Can you, Mr.

47:24 - Secretary, can you, will you will this new initiative,

47:29 - what kind of cost are associated with this?

47:32 - And how will it it affect

47:36 - any increases to the Bureau of Professional Occupations and Affairs

47:43 - with the review itself?

47:45 - That our policy team and and working with others is conducted,

47:49 - that that is not, it's a lot of work, but it's not a significant expense.

47:54 - It's not like we're bringing on additional people

47:56 - to do it or anything else like that.

47:57 - It's a focus of the department and a focus of our, policy team.

48:02 - I don't imagine it creates any additional burden on our boards.

48:07 - But ultimately, as deputy Secretary Johnson said,

48:11 - this is really all up to the legislature and for the administration.

48:16 - We you you all decide what those requirements should be.

48:20 - Our boards in the Department of State enforce what what you decide.

48:25 - Thank you, Mr. Secretary.

48:26 - Mr. chairman, thank you very much. Thank you.

48:28 - Gentlemen. Representative Khan.

48:32 - Thank you, Mr.

48:32 - Chairman. Thank you, Secretary Schmidt. Thank you for your team.

48:35 - You make Roxborough proud.

48:36 - And I just want to say we're claiming you in Roxboro.

48:40 - Philadelphia.

48:40 - That's our secretary.

48:43 - So two questions about election security.

48:46 - First one is about misinformation.

48:48 - There's been a lot of talk about elections being rigged.

48:52 - A lot of this is coming from the president who's saying that

48:55 - he won elections, that he didn't because they were rigged.

48:58 - There's a lot of misinformation and disinformation out there.

49:02 - What can we tell our constituents that may be swayed by this misinformation

49:07 - and these lies about our elections being safe, free and fair?

49:13 - I should have worn my Roxboro.

49:15 - I didn't go to Roxborough high schools, you know,

49:17 - but I should have worn my Roxborough High School sweatshirt.

49:20 - Here today, to testify in front of my representative.

49:24 - Our job at the Department of State is to be a trusted resource

49:28 - for information and to encourage voters to turn to trusted sources of information

49:35 - when it comes to being educated about elections,

49:38 - it is undeniable that the interest in elections has increased

49:42 - just exponentially in the next couple of years.

49:46 - The question is, is the reliable information that they are consuming?

49:53 - Adequate?

49:54 - Or are they turning to sources of information

49:58 - that are, you know, inaccurate for us?

50:03 - It is very clear, undeniably, that our elections in

50:07 - Pennsylvania have never been more free, fair, safe and secure

50:10 - with a paper ballot record of every vote that's cast, that's used into audits

50:14 - after every election to ensure that the voters, intent

50:18 - is accurately recorded and their voices heard.

50:22 - Thank you. Thank you so much.

50:24 - The second one is about voter intimidation.

50:26 - We talked a little bit earlier.

50:28 - A representative from Allegheny County talked

50:30 - talked about briefly about voter intimidation.

50:33 - I'd say if there's one concern that that has

50:37 - some of my constituents being kept up at night,

50:40 - it's the thought that there may be federal interference with elections,

50:46 - intimidation, federal agents showing up at polling locations.

50:51 - What can you

50:53 - tell my constituents?

50:55 - What can you tell our constituents to allay their fears?

50:58 - Let them know that we are going to be protected here in Pennsylvania,

51:02 - and then we're doing everything we can to ensure

51:04 - there won't be any voter intimidation at the polls.

51:08 - Pennsylvania, as well as any number of other states, have, obviously

51:12 - been in contact with our federal partners, whether it's Department of Justice or,

51:16 - or the Bureau or, Homeland Security

51:20 - and others,

51:21 - to make sure that the federal government is aware of these sort of concerns

51:26 - that, people are hearing, and to make sure that voting,

51:30 - can be conducted in a way where there is not interference,

51:34 - as you know, elections in the United States,

51:37 - determined by our Constitution, are really run at the state level.

51:41 - And states have a responsibility to administer elections, working with

51:46 - their federal partners.

51:48 - Thank you.

51:49 - Thank you so much. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Representative.

51:52 - Thank the gentleman, Representative Barton.

51:54 - Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

51:55 - And, good morning, Secretary Schmidt and Department of State Secretary Schmidt.

52:00 - I, like the good gentleman from Philadelphia.

52:03 - I did live in Roxboro for a little bit,

52:05 - but I proudly served Schuylkill in Berks County now, so,

52:08 - But I lived right by Roxborough Memorial Hospital, for a brief time.

52:12 - And it's a polling place, by the way.

52:14 - Pardon me.

52:15 - The Roxborough Memorial Hospital is, kind enough

52:20 - to allow a part of its facility to be used as a polling place.

52:23 - I voted for President Reagan.

52:25 - Pardon me. Yeah. President Reagan at that polling spot.

52:28 - So, that tells you how long ago it was when I lived in Roxborough.

52:32 - If Mr.

52:34 - Secretary and, would like to talk to you about county election expenses.

52:38 - And so, the executive, authorization

52:41 - for county electric, election expenses

52:44 - is projected to be $400,000 for fiscal year 2627

52:50 - as compared to $1 million in the current budget year.

52:53 - Now, these funds, as you're aware, reimburse counties for special election

52:57 - costs.

52:58 - For for member of the General Assembly and the statewide recounts.

53:03 - The Pennsylvania Election code provides that special election shall be held

53:07 - at the next ensuing primary, municipal or general election schedule,

53:11 - at least 60 days after the issuance of the writ of vacancy

53:15 - or such other earlier date, which is at least 60 days following

53:21 - the issuance of the writ as the presiding officer may deem appropriate.

53:25 - Now, the speaker of the House has scheduled for special elections

53:29 - for Pennsylvania House of Representatives,

53:31 - to which just occurred this past February, and two on March 17th,

53:37 - just a few months before the primary election, which is May 19th of this year.

53:43 - Now, just last week,

53:45 - an article from Vote Beat Pennsylvania stated

53:48 - that Pennsylvania has held 47 special elections

53:53 - for vacant state, legislative and congressional seats since 2017.

53:59 - That's more than any other state.

54:02 - 22 of those elections occurred outside of general

54:05 - or primary election, costing taxpayers $4.4 million.

54:11 - Seth Bluestein of City commissioner, from, the city,

54:16 - the first class said he understands from legislators perspective

54:19 - why those special elections are needed, to to be held quickly, quickly.

54:24 - But he also adds that, and I quote from an election administration standpoint,

54:29 - to hold an election less than two months before a general, when the election

54:33 - could have been on the same ballot was very frustrating.

54:38 - Also in the article, there was a reference to Louisiana,

54:41 - which only called special election if six months or more remain in the term.

54:46 - Otherwise the vacancy is filled in the next general election.

54:51 - If that were the

54:52 - law in Pennsylvania, the two special elections in Philadelphia

54:56 - in 2024 would not have taken place, saving taxpayers

55:00 - $1.5 million, as those offices

55:04 - were also on the November ballot.

55:08 - I'll get to my question.

55:10 - Do you think, Secretary Schmitt, that the speaker of the House

55:14 - should make a stronger attempt to schedule special elections during a special

55:20 - or general election in order to save vital taxpayer dollars,

55:24 - given financial concerns, the Commonwealth?

55:28 - Firstly,

55:31 - it's it's great that you've, referenced Commissioner Lou Stein.

55:35 - He was my chief deputy commissioner for, for a long time in, in Philadelphia.

55:40 - And I'm very proud of a lot of the work that he's he's done there.

55:43 - And he replaced me as, Republican City commissioner,

55:46 - after I left to join the Pennsylvania Department

55:49 - or left and later joined the Pennsylvania Department of State.

55:52 - For us, our role and responsibility is to oversee elections

55:57 - and to assist the counties in the administration of elections.

56:01 - It is really up to the legislature and the law to determine when they should,

56:06 - take place.

56:07 - We've put, you know, on our budget, ask $400,000,

56:11 - because in doing a review of past years, that amount seemed,

56:18 - seemed, appropriate

56:20 - for inclusion in the budget for reimbursement

56:24 - to the counties for special elections should cost

56:27 - some have been more expensive, some have been less expensive.

56:30 - And it also really varies on the cycle.

56:32 - As you know, last cycle was a municipal election cycle,

56:36 - which is one where you have the sort of turnover that you described.

56:40 - So if I could just interrupt

56:41 - my yellow lights, I'm sorry, and I'm sorry I babbled too much about Roxboro.

56:45 - So, but the the financial impacts do accrue through the Department of State.

56:50 - And so, Pennsylvania is an outlier.

56:53 - I mean, we have more special elections than anybody else.

56:56 - Are there any suggestions to bring us into line with the rest of the country?

57:00 - And when it comes to special elections and saving money for our taxpayers,

57:04 - and I and I read that article from Carter

57:06 - Walker at at Vote Beat, I thought it was very interesting.

57:10 - Its findings track with at least our recent experience

57:13 - when it comes to reimbursements for special elections.

57:16 - But again, our job is to oversee elections and work with our county partners

57:21 - and the administration of them.

57:22 - My time is up, Secretary. Thank you chairman.

57:24 - Thank you sir.

57:25 - Gentleman. Representative Kincaid.

57:27 - Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

57:30 - I so I

57:31 - received a number of calls and emails, about this from constituents.

57:35 - And so, an invitation went out to all the secretaries of state,

57:41 - from the FBI election executive,

57:45 - about a call that was held this past Wednesday, on February 20th,

57:50 - February 25th, to discuss preparations for the cycle, as well as updates

57:54 - and resources available to be provided to you

57:57 - and your staff.

58:01 - Given President Trump's repeated calls to nationalize elections,

58:04 - this was something that was of great concern to my constituents.

58:08 - And I'm wondering if you can talk about did did you attend that call

58:11 - or did someone from your staff attend that call?

58:13 - And if so, can you talk about, you know, what was discussed?

58:18 - Yes. I was on that call, as was Deputy Secretary Marx.

58:22 - We work every election, municipal or,

58:26 - federal election with our federal partners.

58:29 - Pennsylvania, just like any number of other states.

58:32 - Is curious to receive information from the federal government

58:36 - about what kind of resources they would provide to the states,

58:40 - whether it's cybersecurity testing, whether it is physical infrastructure,

58:44 - security testing, or, information sharing when it comes to potential threats

58:49 - or anything else like that.

58:50 - So yes, it was Department of Justice, Department of Homeland Security,

58:54 - the FBI, the Postal Service, Inspection Service,

59:00 - and other federal partners that were there to brief us

59:03 - on the resources available to us and their role in this process.

59:10 - Was it

59:12 - an unusual call or was it sort of the normal contents of of a call like that?

59:16 - I think our working with federal partners is something

59:18 - that occurs in every election.

59:21 - It was unusual in the sense that I don't know that we normally get

59:24 - an email kind of general blast to all secretaries to attend

59:29 - a briefing like it, but, the information that was shared

59:32 - was consistent with with our, experience.

59:37 - And many secretaries participated and,

59:39 - and asked questions of our federal partners,

59:43 - Deputy Secretary Marks, is there anything you want to add to that?

59:46 - And just, you know, it sounds like you're getting calls.

59:50 - And the crux of the question is about, you know,

59:54 - the feds federal government's role in elections.

59:57 - 073 We didn't hear anything on that call that that indicated

01:00 - 03.909 that there was going to be an effort to take over elections.

01:00 - 07.580 I think there seemed to be a general understanding that elections

01:00 - 10.840 are, per the Constitution run by the states.

01:00 - 14.310 It was mostly informational, as secretary said,

01:00 - 16.388 I appreciate that.

01:00 - 20.416 I think that that will help, alleviate some fears from my constituents.

01:00 - 24.897 And, is the department taking any steps

01:00 - 28.024 to ensure that elections in Pennsylvania remain secure?

01:00 - 32.371 And and under state control?

01:00 - 34.139 Again, as this rhetoric

01:00 - 37.834 from the federal government comes to to nationalize elections.

01:00 - 41.437 Yes. And one thing that I just want to mention, too, is,

01:00 - 44.516 secretaries on the call,

01:00 - 47.543 asked about, for example,

01:00 - 50.289 federal law enforcement being present,

01:00 - 53.683 specifically Ice being present at polling places.

01:00 - 57.153 And the federal government expressed that,

01:00 - 01.867 there was no plan or intention to do any of that in answering

01:01 - 06.029 the questions asked by the secretaries and advance of every election we work

01:01 - 07.606 not only with our state partners,

01:01 - 10.700 but also with our county partners to do tabletop exercises

01:01 - 15.214 to make sure that our elections are safe and secure, and that if anything,

01:01 - 19.385 sort of interferes or disrupts the, process of election

01:01 - 23.389 administration, that our county partners are prepared to deal with it.

01:01 - 26.916 And the Pennsylvania Department of State is prepared to do deal with it.

01:01 - 32.388 We do those every election, regardless of, of, what else is going on.

01:01 - 35.868 Obviously, we're aware of the environment and how the environment changes,

01:01 - 39.038 and it helps inform our tabletop exercises

01:01 - 42.065 in, in preparation, before elections.

01:01 - 44.771 Thank you. Thank you. Mr. Chairman. Thank you. Representative.

01:01 - 48.681 Thank the gentle lady, Representative Ryker.

01:01 - 51.083 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Secretary, it's good to see you this morning.

01:01 - 51.818 Likewise, sir.

01:01 - 53.385 Just real quick.

01:01 - 53.920 And I'm.

01:01 - 57.456 I'm fairly new to the legislature, but I see we have we have $1.3 million

01:01 - 00.483 budgeted for advertising and constitutional amendments.

01:02 - 05.188 And it's an absolutely critical part, and it's it's a very unique part of our,

01:02 - 09.859 our political system, where the people actually get to engage and say yes or no

01:02 - 11.770 as to how these things are,

01:02 - 14.773 you know, whether these amendments are to be approved or not.

01:02 - 18.868 Could you briefly just sort of walk me through the process on your end?

01:02 - 20.846 You know, how you advertise or what

01:02 - 23.873 at what point that you advertise these things?

01:02 - 26.719 Yes. And the department has,

01:02 - 31.047 in place now, for,

01:02 - 35.327 more than four years,

01:02 - 40.065 at least five years, maybe six, a system to make sure

01:02 - 44.994 that when constitutional amendments do come, out of the legislature

01:02 - 48.741 and are passed, that the department is doing all of its,

01:02 - 52.168 responsibilities to make sure that they are advertised and,

01:02 - 57.416 you know, it's 2 to 3 newspapers of, general circulation and all the rest.

01:02 - 58.917 We included that in the budget.

01:02 - 00.486 It is not something

01:03 - 03.946 possible for us to ever really predict, because it's really up to the legislature

01:03 - 07.559 whether there will be amendments or not, on the ballot.

01:03 - 11.764 But it would be irresponsible for us to not include that as a budget item.

01:03 - 15.701 Obviously, if it's funded and they don't occur, it's not like that

01:03 - 19.705 money is spent or or moved in some other way,

01:03 - 22.374 but it is an obligation of the department.

01:03 - 26.602 And do you mind if I quickly asked, Deputy Secretary Marx to, to add to that and,

01:03 - 30.940 just very high level the process,

01:03 - 34.620 first passage, of a constitutional

01:03 - 37.713 amendment has to be published in a general election,

01:03 - 41.026 per the consent 20 Constitution,

01:03 - 46.331 that publication occurs in two newspapers of general circulation

01:03 - 50.793 in each county, for three months prior to the election.

01:03 - 54.330 So it's, August, September and October.

01:03 - 57.743 One second. Pass the passage.

01:03 - 00.345 It can go on the ballot.

01:04 - 04.040 I had any regularly scheduled election,

01:04 - 07.543 at which point the department again publishes,

01:04 - 12.582 not only the proposed amendment, but also the language,

01:04 - 18.163 or the text of the, ballot question, the question that will be presented

01:04 - 21.233 to voters as well as a plain language statement

01:04 - 25.628 that is prepared by the attorney general on the majority of voters

01:04 - 28.740 vote in favor of that constitutional amendment amendment.

01:04 - 32.668 And I'm sure that amendment is, made effective, could I?

01:04 - 34.746 I wasn't sure what at which juncture,

01:04 - 36.915 because it is to your or to your point, sir, you

01:04 - 40.719 you said it has to be passed in two consecutive sessions, and,

01:04 - 41.688 so I wasn't sure if you did it

01:04 - 44.714 after the first passage and then, again at the second.

01:04 - 47.826 You know, I, I just looking at the legislation

01:04 - 50.896 that we've passed, I don't think we passed any in the last session,

01:04 - 52.731 any constitutional amendments that would require.

01:04 - 53.433 So I wasn't sure

01:04 - 56.492 if that was you to your point, Secretary, whether that was, you know,

01:04 - 00.329 a line item that we might not be using this year, but,

01:05 - 02.574 you know, supposed to and we do pass something later

01:05 - 04.643 on this year that there might be a potential

01:05 - 08.537 that we'd have to advertise, as this session concludes.

01:05 - 11.250 Is that is that a fair understanding of this?

01:05 - 11.751 It is.

01:05 - 16.922 And and again, we have to include it to be, to be responsible

01:05 - 20.549 because it is a significant amount of money to, to do that advertising.

01:05 - 25.097 So if it would occur, it would have a significant impact on our budget.

01:05 - 27.699 And that's why it's included as a line item.

01:05 - 30.068 And I want to also want to add that everyone in the department

01:05 - 34.797 who has anything, any responsibility related to any constitutional amendment,

01:05 - 38.634 any part of the constitutional amendment process

01:05 - 41.380 has to take training every year and sign off that. That's good.

01:05 - 45.817 And I obviously there was well before your time, obviously there was

01:05 - 46.452 there was an issue.

01:05 - 49.478 But I just wanted to, you know, make sure that again,

01:05 - 53.549 you know, if, if, if I agree, the responsible thing is to,

01:05 - 57.019 you know, to ask for that money in case that something happen in case

01:05 - 00.699 later this year we do pass something that would require some advertising.

01:06 - 02.768 I'm not sure if that that will be the case.

01:06 - 04.937 If you know the House in the Senate being the way they are.

01:06 - 08.240 But, you know, I at least appreciate you thinking forward

01:06 - 09.641 enough to be able to put that in there.

01:06 - 13.145 And I just, again, wasn't sure where we stood with all of that.

01:06 - 15.169 So thank you, Secretary. Thank you, representative.

01:06 - 18.051 Young.

01:06 - 20.452 Thank you gentlemen. Representative. Young.

01:06 - 21.853 Good morning everybody.

01:06 - 26.024 Secretary Schmidt and the rest of the team and also,

01:06 - 29.928 Deputy Secretary, Secretary Randy Johnson.

01:06 - 31.730 Please tell your wife I said hello.

01:06 - 33.131 She was one of my welcoming committees

01:06 - 35.300 when I first came here to the Commonwealth.

01:06 - 36.568 She's amazing.

01:06 - 40.696 My question is about, the more folks

01:06 - 46.078 that are working in the polling sites now, we know that the numbers are dwindling.

01:06 - 49.138 We're having a lot of troubles with making sure that

01:06 - 52.375 those people who were there for a long time, we depended on them.

01:06 - 54.886 They are now going away.

01:06 - 00.125 And so not only at the polling sites, but also at our,

01:07 - 04.987 election directors, county direct election directors spaces as well.

01:07 - 10.059 So what are we doing to not only support the new individuals,

01:07 - 14.296 but to reduce the turnover at these polling sites?

01:07 - 16.209 And they

01:07 - 19.177 are, as you know, representative on Election Day,

01:07 - 22.238 the most important people when it comes to election administration,

01:07 - 27.386 it's certainly not secretary state, it's not even a county, Board of Elections.

01:07 - 30.489 It's really your neighbors who volunteer

01:07 - 34.383 for more or less a 14 hour a day getting there before the polls open

01:07 - 37.920 and after the polls close to serve in those roles.

01:07 - 39.431 They are essentially volunteers.

01:07 - 41.633 They're paid very little for that service.

01:07 - 45.504 And we have seen significant turnover, not just that county election

01:07 - 50.433 administrator level, but at the at the polling, polling place level as well.

01:07 - 56.515 It's why we formed, a couple years ago, a training unit in the Pennsylvania.

01:07 - 59.975 Department of State to provide training that had never been provided before.

01:08 - 05.724 So that we can, help, train our county partners with all the turnover

01:08 - 09.351 with so many new people, you know, somebody who's responsible for,

01:08 - 14.032 I don't know, recycling at the county level for ten years.

01:08 - 17.803 And then, all of a sudden they're responsible for administering

01:08 - 21.931 elections and that is an easy thing to do with incredible scrutiny.

01:08 - 25.877 So our polling unit, which is led by an experienced county

01:08 - 29.681 election director, has provided all of the services, provided

01:08 - 33.618 this training, the participation level is phenomenal,

01:08 - 37.389 not just from new people, but from people who have been around for a long time

01:08 - 39.324 administering elections at the county level.

01:08 - 42.127 And that helps, I think, also bring about a degree of uniformity

01:08 - 45.130 when it comes to election administration in Pennsylvania,

01:08 - 45.865 and to make sure that

01:08 - 49.968 they're not just left out, they're trying to figure out how to run an election,

01:08 - 52.995 but we can provide them with the resources and training that they need

01:08 - 55.307 so that voters can make their voices heard.

01:08 - 57.776 So for that specific question and what I heard you say is

01:08 - 00.846 that is the type of training that you're now introducing to these people

01:09 - 03.748 who are interested in coming into this space.

01:09 - 08.019 We've been doing it a couple of years now, and the response has been, terrific.

01:09 - 12.515 And the modules that we create are really reflecting the requests

01:09 - 16.785 from, newer election directors coming in at the county level

01:09 - 21.891 to let us know what sort of training that they need to do a good job,

01:09 - 27.363 and to provide training then to their poll workers at the precinct level.

01:09 - 30.633 It is an enormous number of people in Pennsylvania that,

01:09 - 32.944 as you can imagine, are needed on Election Day.

01:09 - 37.883 Philadelphia, you know, my home county alone, is 1700.

01:09 - 41.953 And the three precincts with five people volunteering

01:09 - 45.824 for 14 hours, on a on a on election days to do it.

01:09 - 47.616 So it is, it is a very heavy lift.

01:09 - 49.595 And we need to make

01:09 - 52.621 sure that the people who serve in that role are valued.

01:09 - 54.166 So thank you for that.

01:09 - 59.437 And what type of polls election audits do you do, and what type of technology is

01:09 - 02.941 used to help the public have a full faith

01:10 - 06.202 in the results and post elections?

01:10 - 09.705 Do you want to add anything to the, poll worker question?

01:10 - 11.516 And I can do it off record.

01:10 - 13.718 I just wanted a shout out for a local high school.

01:10 - 17.146 As you know, the General Assembly 20 years ago, about 20 years ago,

01:10 - 20.292 allowed 17 year olds to serve as poll workers.

01:10 - 21.860 And there are a lot of local,

01:10 - 26.264 communities, teachers and in this case, the swim, swim team,

01:10 - 30.535 coach, new recruit, recruited poll workers, dozens over several years.

01:10 - 33.896 So, you know, that's something that we try to lift up as well.

01:10 - 36.441 To answer your question very quickly, I'm sorry.

01:10 - 40.478 Counties in Pennsylvania, there are two different types of audits

01:10 - 43.606 that, occur after every election in Pennsylvania

01:10 - 48.186 to make sure that, the tabulation of votes, it is done

01:10 - 51.680 accurately and to identify any discrepancy between,

01:10 - 56.485 the tabulation of votes and their certified election results.

01:10 - 00.389 One is an audit of a certain percentage of ballots.

01:11 - 03.301 Another is a different sort of audit.

01:11 - 05.937 That is,

01:11 - 10.308 a much more random sampling of, of election results

01:11 - 13.936 to identify any discrepancy that that that would occur.

01:11 - 20.009 We do a, essentially a drawing, that is also random,

01:11 - 25.881 so that counties, essentially ordered random batches of ballots

01:11 - 29.227 to ensure that their certified election results

01:11 - 35.124 will match the, the the the results, from from the audit.

01:11 - 40.105 And if any discrepancy occurs, obviously that would, that would be a concern.

01:11 - 41.439 And it's there for that,

01:11 - 45.067 for that purpose so that people can have, confidence in election results.

01:11 - 46.711 I appreciate your responses.

01:11 - 47.079 Thank you.

01:11 - 50.148 And I will say before I leave it, I too had 217

01:11 - 53.285 year olds who also participate in election polling.

01:11 - 55.120 So thank you for that.

01:11 - 56.988 Thank them for, their service.

01:11 - 00.015 Please thank the gentle lady, Representative Flood.

01:12 - 01.459 Good morning, Secretary.

01:12 - 02.460 Thank you for being here.

01:12 - 06.398 And, I just want to say it's it's been great working with you,

01:12 - 10.225 with some of the election issues that we've had in Northampton County.

01:12 - 14.673 Election integrity, should be and needs to be paramount,

01:12 - 18.767 not just in Northampton County, but across Pennsylvania.

01:12 - 23.806 We all want an election system that we can trust in, so people want to vote.

01:12 - 27.252 And, and when that happens, you know,

01:12 - 31.080 and they trust in that system, then I think that, you know,

01:12 - 34.926 we will have less of the issues that we've been facing.

01:12 - 38.263 I want to talk about, the Shaw system.

01:12 - 41.290 There's been some questioning on that prior.

01:12 - 44.669 Back in late 2023, the Department of State canceled

01:12 - 48.530 a planned upgrade to the Pennsylvania's election system.

01:12 - 52.935 The Shaw vote it modernization

01:12 - 56.905 system, the system modernization for managing voter rolls.

01:12 - 02.778 From what I understand, the new Shaw was signed about a year ago.

01:13 - 07.359 The governor is recommending a $20.6 million

01:13 - 10.552 for the statewide uniform Registry of Electors appropriation.

01:13 - 12.831 It's about the same as the current year.

01:13 - 13.799 Initially,

01:13 - 18.570 that goal was to have the new Shaw system ready for the 2024 presidential election.

01:13 - 20.338 We know that that didn't happen.

01:13 - 25.367 We're eight months away from the 2026 general election.

01:13 - 30.749 Can you provide us with an update on where we are with that system?

01:13 - 34.877 And are you able to confidently predict

01:13 - 39.715 that the new system will be ready in time for the 2026 general election?

01:13 - 43.728 We canceled to walk through the chronology very quickly.

01:13 - 49.892 We canceled, had to cancel the contract with the previous vendor and I believe,

01:13 - 53.195 after doing our review in 2023,

01:13 - 57.032 I believe we canceled it in December of 2023.

01:13 - 59.511 There was a mutual thing with us and the vendor.

01:13 - 03.281 It was clear that that, was not going to lead to success,

01:14 - 06.551 that it was not going to provide the sort of security to the system.

01:14 - 09.487 And, fulfill the needs of the county level.

01:14 - 14.316 So that was not, that was not, a very easy decision to make.

01:14 - 17.886 But we were prepared to move and very quickly on,

01:14 - 23.902 working with our county partners and, and producing an RFP to get it a new system.

01:14 - 27.439 Requirements

01:14 - 31.009 sort of advertised for vendors to, to bid on.

01:14 - 34.837 And we, like you said, signed that agreement a little less than

01:14 - 36.881 than a year ago.

01:14 - 40.351 The new Shaw replacement system

01:14 - 45.113 would certainly not be in place by general 2026.

01:14 - 48.626 That is not something that we would have

01:14 - 53.097 ever, envisioned, especially since we only,

01:14 - 56.124 entered into this contract a little bit more than a year ago.

01:14 - 01.539 We would never release system, to make available for such an important purpose.

01:15 - 05.868 That is, anything less than, as good as it could be

01:15 - 09.872 with our county partners again, informing every, every step of the way.

01:15 - 12.951 And it's

01:15 - 16.378 really a matter of making sure that when you release a system like that,

01:15 - 19.524 it's done responsibly with your county partners,

01:15 - 23.519 the end users of the whole system, and to do it, and to

01:15 - 27.055 to make sure the timing works out as well as it possibly can,

01:15 - 30.235 you would not want to roll out a new system.

01:15 - 33.262 I would think, in a general presidential election,

01:15 - 37.408 you wouldn't want to roll out a new system in October of a presidential

01:15 - 38.476 election year.

01:15 - 40.478 So but there is great urgency to it.

01:15 - 42.514 And I assure you, the Department of State

01:15 - 46.251 and our county partners are is eager as as you are.

01:15 - 49.912 And anyone can be to to get a new system in place that is,

01:15 - 51.689 that fulfills our needs.

01:15 - 56.685 Well, and I and I appreciate that, you being honest about that timeline

01:15 - 00.198 because I think that's really important with this new system that I'm sure

01:16 - 03.268 you're actively involved in making sure we can trust.

01:16 - 07.129 And can you guarantee that when this new system is implemented,

01:16 - 11.409 that it will be secure, it's going to maintain accurate records,

01:16 - 15.980 internal controls and transparency, in record keeping,

01:16 - 21.410 which were issues identified in the 2019 performance audit by the auditor General.

01:16 - 24.746 Yes. We would not release a system that that,

01:16 - 27.191 sounds like a

01:16 - 30.728 double negative would not release a system that would not fulfill

01:16 - 32.230 all of those requirements.

01:16 - 36.167 We will release a system that does fulfill those, those requirements.

01:16 - 39.437 Will there be any oversight of the counties and making sure

01:16 - 42.464 that the training is effective and they're connected properly?

01:16 - 46.301 And I'm in my asking this because we've had issues in our county.

01:16 - 51.316 And so I just want to make sure that, there's some sort of state oversight

01:16 - 52.183 with that.

01:16 - 52.484 There is.

01:16 - 56.521 And we work hand in hand, with the counties from the very beginning.

01:16 - 59.190 That's what's so important about the development of the system

01:16 - 01.960 is working hand in hand with the counties from the very beginning,

01:17 - 06.388 so that we're providing a system that is safe and secure that you discuss,

01:17 - 09.625 and also one that our counties are comfortable interfacing with

01:17 - 12.403 since they since they work with it every day.

01:17 - 13.905 Is there anything you'd like to add?

01:17 - 17.332 I was I would just say, to your point,

01:17 - 21.336 accountability is built in this system and it's going to be a lot more intuitive.

01:17 - 24.148 And we expect that some of the errors we see in

01:17 - 25.783 the current system will be avoided,

01:17 - 29.311 just simply because the system itself is a lot more intuitive.

01:17 - 33.782 We'll also have more visibility into what counties are doing,

01:17 - 38.186 and counties will have more visibility in their themselves into what their staff.

01:17 - 41.566 Okay.

01:17 - 42.067 Thank you.

01:17 - 45.093 I appreciate, having this dialog with you.

01:17 - 46.472 Thank you.

01:17 - 49.765 Representative, thank the gentle lady, Representative Webster.

01:17 - 52.243 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:17 - 55.937 I think I have a quick question, so I shouldn't get the hook on time later,

01:17 - 59.408 but I do want to I want to engage in a couple of the earlier,

01:18 - 02.553 inputs, deliberately.

01:18 - 06.257 At Methacton High School in my district, we had so many high schoolers

01:18 - 10.285 involved in the poll worker scenario, we had to do half day shifts.

01:18 - 12.463 And so I recognized Mr.

01:18 - 14.065 Made, in fact, in high school

01:18 - 18.160 for an enormous program that put together, civics for those kids.

01:18 - 21.105 And, Mr.

01:18 - 25.033 Secretary, my mother worked 38 years at Roxborough Memorial High School,

01:18 - 28.470 Memorial Hospital, 38 years.

01:18 - 32.550 So I would never imagine that this firm would have such a presence here today.

01:18 - 34.543 I wanted to get in on that. Yeah.

01:18 - 39.090 I think this is a pretty straightforward question,

01:18 - 42.617 but I think it's important to the dialog as we go along.

01:18 - 46.822 In the academic, literature, there's a,

01:18 - 51.860 a very strong relationship between and I'm talking about incarcerated

01:18 - 55.664 individuals and voting rights, a very strong,

01:18 - 59.034 connection between,

01:18 - 02.580 getting their voting rights back as they leave

01:19 - 07.242 in their incarcerated scenario and, and less recidivism,

01:19 - 11.079 people who get involved in their, in their community, in their

01:19 - 14.583 and their voting rights and don't end up back in the

01:19 - 19.363 in our justice system and I think there's been momentum

01:19 - 23.759 in the House, particularly around veterans who have been incarcerated.

01:19 - 27.038 Right, and helping them get their rights and benefits back

01:19 - 30.899 as they move back into the back, into the general population.

01:19 - 34.669 So I guess my question is, are there is anything in your mind that

01:19 - 38.707 that we could be doing legislatively to help remove any additional barriers

01:19 - 42.577 so that individuals who get involved in the justice system

01:19 - 46.081 and, and serve, you know, their time

01:19 - 51.129 and that they can return back to the to the general population and be successful,

01:19 - 55.433 and at least from my perspective, and, and what the House has voted

01:19 - 01.139 on, particularly to have our veterans be successful and representative.

01:20 - 04.709 I know this is an important issue for you and has been, for some time

01:20 - 07.578 in terms of legislative changes that would be necessary.

01:20 - 11.039 That's something that we can discuss whether there would be anything,

01:20 - 15.343 legislatively that would improve that.

01:20 - 18.780 We work with our county partners to make sure that,

01:20 - 22.693 that when it comes

01:20 - 25.730 to, voter

01:20 - 30.468 registration, and I've, I've also met with, Secretary

01:20 - 35.297 of Corrections about this as well, to make sure that obviously only,

01:20 - 40.669 people eligible to register to vote and vote are registered to vote and vote

01:20 - 45.073 and the universe of people, whether they're incarcerated misdemeanors

01:20 - 50.445 or pretrial detainees or, any of the other categories of,

01:20 - 53.558 of people who are eligible to vote,

01:20 - 56.585 even while incarcerated, have access to,

01:20 - 01.332 to their to their right to vote, many of our counties,

01:21 - 06.361 including the counties where, where,

01:21 - 09.340 our prison system is located.

01:21 - 13.368 Do I know, Mercer County and some others do a lot of outreach

01:21 - 16.972 to work with them to make sure that when people are leaving

01:21 - 21.443 the custody of the state that they have access to, registering to vote.

01:21 - 26.014 Yeah, I do know that as particularly for for some of our veterans,

01:21 - 29.951 the issue is having a home of record, right?

01:21 - 34.389 Because they may not have that the day that they leave the jail system.

01:21 - 36.992 Right. We're we're thinking hard about how to

01:21 - 38.470 how to

01:21 - 41.439 accommodate that so that those rights can be restored.

01:21 - 44.108 Right. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks for your discussion.

01:21 - 44.843 Thank you. Representative.

01:21 - 46.110 Ma'am. Chair.

01:21 - 48.646 Thanks. Gentleman recognizes Representative Kroupa.

01:21 - 49.481 Thank you, Mr. Chair.

01:21 - 51.782 And thank you all for being here today.

01:21 - 55.453 Representative Friel stole some of my questions.

01:21 - 59.991 And, so, as you well know, there were issues on Election Day in Fayette County.

01:22 - 01.959 I represent the southern half of Fayette County.

01:22 - 04.595 I want to, first of all, thank you and your team

01:22 - 08.466 for meeting, with with the delegation via zoom.

01:22 - 10.701 We went over a lot of those issues.

01:22 - 13.738 And I don't want to spend all my time on that today, particularly given how.

01:22 - 15.373 Well, Representative Farrell did.

01:22 - 18.876 But, can you confirm that we are still on track,

01:22 - 21.903 that the issues that happened with those electronic poll books,

01:22 - 26.017 that the steps, that you've taken to put in place, that our

01:22 - 29.320 our 2026 elections, that that will not be an issue

01:22 - 32.747 in 2026 are moving forward with respect to the wrong files

01:22 - 36.918 being transmitted from the state to the counties for our electronic polls.

01:22 - 37.629 Right.

01:22 - 40.722 And, I appreciate the opportunity to work with you.

01:22 - 45.736 And the delegation on that issue to help you inform us about steps

01:22 - 46.605 that we could take.

01:22 - 49.807 And as you know, we've committed to, a couple of things.

01:22 - 52.810 One, and to be clear that the failure

01:22 - 55.837 that occurred was a failure of the Department of State.

01:22 - 58.449 The county did a phenomenal job.

01:22 - 03.011 Addressing that challenge on Election Day in, in real time.

01:23 - 08.383 It was the only time that has ever occurred, at the Department of State.

01:23 - 14.799 We provide a service to that county that, we provide to some other counties

01:23 - 19.260 where we do some of that work for them to assist them with preparation of,

01:23 - 24.833 public, public extract, and all the rest.

01:23 - 29.780 But, one of those things is, adding additional steps

01:23 - 33.441 internally in the department, as we described, when we met the other day,

01:23 - 37.112 and also to make sure that when we provide those services to counties,

01:23 - 40.358 that the counties and their vendors check

01:23 - 43.361 the information that's provided to make sure that it's accurate.

01:23 - 45.663 Is there anything you'd like to add to that?

01:23 - 49.700 No, I just I just wanted to note that the, those, changes that we made,

01:23 - 55.139 we actually implemented sort of a dry run, in the most recent special elections.

01:23 - 55.574 Great.

01:23 - 58.967 So we're ready to go for 2020.

01:23 - 02.737 And I commend you on your ownership of the issue that there were

01:24 - 05.916 there was no finger pointing, particularly the our Election Bureau

01:24 - 10.121 directors are under a tremendous amount of stress and from from, very early

01:24 - 11.089 on, the Department of State

01:24 - 13.958 took ownership of that mistake, and I appreciate that, but I do.

01:24 - 15.593 Before moving on to my next line of questioning.

01:24 - 19.530 It is just the reason why it's so important, as you all well know, is

01:24 - 23.792 you know, the right to vote is the foundation of of this great nation.

01:24 - 27.162 And when anything makes the voter feel like their vote doesn't count,

01:24 - 29.273 and we want to avoid that at all costs.

01:24 - 33.601 I'm moving on slightly to the Pennsylvania Election Integrity grants.

01:24 - 37.806 The taxpayer funds, distributed counties to support administration of elections,

01:24 - 42.053 which affect a effectively eliminated the Zucker

01:24 - 45.146 buck issue and private funding of some of these issues.

01:24 - 49.751 My understanding is the Commonwealth allocates 45 million for this program.

01:24 - 52.763 Fayette County received over 400,000.

01:24 - 57.868 My understanding is a recently dcd was making, some requests

01:24 - 02.997 for some information, apparently through some type of, of accountability audit.

01:25 - 07.211 And I fully support every layer of taxpayer

01:25 - 11.372 funds, including especially grant money should be accounted for.

01:25 - 14.051 I think what is causing a little bit of heartburn

01:25 - 17.912 is that the way the DCD is now requiring that it be reported

01:25 - 22.359 after the fact is a little bit different than the way some of the election

01:25 - 25.887 bureaus were originally, tracking it and accounting for it.

01:25 - 29.858 So how closely is DCD working with the Department of State,

01:25 - 35.096 to manage and, manage these funds to,

01:25 - 40.068 To make sure that

01:25 - 43.447 and forgive me, has the Department of State reviewed or approved the reporting

01:25 - 47.675 and documentation requirements that are now being requested by DCD?

01:25 - 55.960 Well, as you know, the the act 88 made it so that TCD is providing that

01:25 - 58.953 funding stream and not the Pennsylvania Department of State.

01:25 - 00.698 We are consulted.

01:26 - 03.667 By dcd on different election

01:26 - 07.138 related matters about eligibility and other things like that.

01:26 - 10.007 But we don't administer the program.

01:26 - 11.275 No, we do, we do.

01:26 - 16.447 So, we conduct office hours with counties every couple of weeks,

01:26 - 19.774 and we will invite dcd, and we do collaborate with them.

01:26 - 24.112 My understanding of the specific issue, the pain point for counties

01:26 - 27.482 is the, the post reporting,

01:26 - 31.695 is that the form, is different.

01:26 - 34.365 It's a spreadsheet, and there are a number of fields on there

01:26 - 38.626 that they're not familiar with because most election grant funding they get,

01:26 - 42.873 typically comes through the department, you know, election security grants.

01:26 - 44.942 And this is a little unfamiliar.

01:26 - 50.772 But we've certainly committed to working with dcd if we can somehow,

01:26 - 55.653 you know, streamline that or, you know, provide additional instructions.

01:26 - 00.524 But ultimately it is, you know, it's a DCD form and DCD process

01:27 - 03.718 and they have, you know, they have to make sure they, you know,

01:27 - 08.923 do the appropriate level of auditing to make sure the money is being spent.

01:27 - 09.701 Thank you.

01:27 - 12.336 I have so many more questions I want to ask, but my red light is on.

01:27 - 13.537 Thank you so much for your time.

01:27 - 16.607 May I just very quickly add and having visited, as I've said

01:27 - 21.679 before, all 67 of her counties, I can't tell you how grateful our county

01:27 - 25.039 election administrators are to the legislature for,

01:27 - 29.887 for providing resources in act 88 that they can use to acquire

01:27 - 34.091 additional equipment or help pay for things that their counties otherwise

01:27 - 37.752 don't have the ability to pay for or are not otherwise paying for,

01:27 - 40.788 that assist with the administration of elections.

01:27 - 41.932 Thank you.

01:27 - 44.101 Thank the gentle lady, Representative Mallory.

01:27 - 44.669 Thank you, Mr.

01:27 - 45.869 Chairman. And thank you, Secretary,

01:27 - 48.472 to your entire team for being here with us today. Sir.

01:27 - 49.607 I want to

01:27 - 54.502 I represent a district in Montgomery County, in the Lansdale Hatfield area.

01:27 - 58.773 Straight up 309 corridor, and in Montgomery County.

01:27 - 02.343 And I think we touched on this slightly, but I want to ask you a point in question

01:28 - 04.288 with regard to the electronic polling books.

01:28 - 07.925 Montgomery County is looking to go that route and utilize

01:28 - 10.952 electronic polling books for for their election rolls.

01:28 - 13.998 Is there a piece of legislation that is needed for,

01:28 - 16.700 for them to be able to do that in that implementation?

01:28 - 19.727 There really wouldn't be any legislation that's required for them to do it.

01:28 - 24.708 Almost half of our counties use electronic books at this point.

01:28 - 26.143 I think that's about right.

01:28 - 29.170 30 of precisely.

01:28 - 32.850 So they would be just adding on to that that already utilized,

01:28 - 34.051 piece of technology.

01:28 - 37.688 It is, and it has several advantages, obviously,

01:28 - 41.792 when it comes to voters checking in when it comes to updating,

01:28 - 45.829 who voted immediately after the election as opposed to manually scanning

01:28 - 49.924 in, names, one at a time.

01:28 - 53.604 It allows for that to happen, very, very quickly.

01:28 - 54.705 There's a number of advantages

01:28 - 58.475 to electronic books, and that's why some counties have chosen to go that direction.

01:28 - 59.643 I appreciate that.

01:28 - 02.313 And while we're on the line of streamlining the process,

01:29 - 06.684 we in the legislature and those who are, hoping to join the legislature over

01:29 - 10.721 the past several weeks have been working to gather petition

01:29 - 12.222 signatures to get back onto the ballot.

01:29 - 14.358 We heard about that process a little bit earlier.

01:29 - 16.427 My question to you is this.

01:29 - 19.229 And it's pretty pretty, straightforward.

01:29 - 22.066 That process, would you agree that

01:29 - 25.460 that entire process of petitioning is Ada compliant?

01:29 - 28.440 With the

01:29 - 32.109 process of gathering signatures for nomination petitions, correct.

01:29 - 35.103 Whether that process is

01:29 - 38.382 Ada requirement, compliant?

01:29 - 42.553 You mean the filing of it or also the to participation

01:29 - 45.656 within the process of a a,

01:29 - 48.716 person wanting to sign that petition?

01:29 - 50.994 Would you agree that that process

01:29 - 54.021 that they currently go through now is Ada compliant?

01:29 - 56.867 And here's the reason why maybe I'll help you with this.

01:29 - 57.068 Yeah.

01:29 - 01.138 So there have been instances of individuals at a door

01:30 - 04.766 that may have Parkinson's disease, may have a neurological disorder,

01:30 - 09.380 may have an optical, disability of some sort that prevents them

01:30 - 13.183 from being able to participate in that part of the electoral process.

01:30 - 17.678 Now, when you go to the to the actual election day, we have accommodated

01:30 - 21.816 for, people to be able to participate in that process, either be

01:30 - 23.494 maybe they're deaf, maybe they're blind,

01:30 - 26.954 maybe they have a neurological, dysfunction or disorder of some sort.

01:30 - 30.768 Would you agree that we should probably make this part

01:30 - 34.171 of the process of our elections more Ada compliant?

01:30 - 35.973 That is my question for you.

01:30 - 40.201 So, I'm certainly sensitive to this issue.

01:30 - 43.237 My dad is Parkinson's, and my mom has Alzheimer's.

01:30 - 47.108 So it is certainly something that,

01:30 - 50.621 the challenges that it presents.

01:30 - 55.516 I'm well aware of, when it comes to, nomination,

01:30 - 00.488 signature petition gathering is admittedly not something that I've,

01:31 - 03.834 consulted with our team about.

01:31 - 07.862 I certainly, sincerely will and get back to you about it.

01:31 - 10.340 I appreciate that it's something that has come up.

01:31 - 13.367 I'm sure all of us have experienced this within our communities.

01:31 - 17.205 And when you ask someone to sign in you physically, they physically cannot.

01:31 - 21.151 It just it's another way that kind of disenfranchizes

01:31 - 24.912 them from participating in the process when they have the right to do so.

01:31 - 28.559 I thank you for your, answer on that.

01:31 - 30.027 And I really do appreciate it.

01:31 - 31.528 Thank you for your time.

01:31 - 33.130 And, thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:31 - 36.123 Thank you for your.

01:31 - 46.334 Thank the general gentleman, Representative Marcel.

01:31 - 48.046 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:31 - 49.313 Thank you so much for being here.

01:31 - 50.781 And I did want to just mention,

01:31 - 52.683 I appreciated the gentleman from Montgomery County

01:31 - 54.785 bringing up the last issue I actually encountered.

01:31 - 56.153 That was someone in my district.

01:31 - 58.121 The last time we were circulating petitions,

01:31 - 00.324 he was legally blind and really wanted to sign.

01:32 - 01.358 It was trying to figure it out.

01:32 - 03.427 So happy to talk to him afterwards.

01:32 - 06.854 But it is, a problem in our communities that we should be addressing.

01:32 - 08.365 I wanted to turn and go back

01:32 - 12.326 to discussing the voter registration and education appropriation.

01:32 - 15.105 I know you had mentioned it in presidential years.

01:32 - 18.399 Sometimes you need more, budget for that area.

01:32 - 25.182 And, I was looking at the past levels of funding over that period of time.

01:32 - 30.244 Going back actually all the way to fiscal year, 2013 to 2014.

01:32 - 35.926 And so in 2013, 2014, it made sense that we increased that budget

01:32 - 40.121 because voter ID had been pass, which is act 18 of 2012.

01:32 - 41.965 That was signed into law.

01:32 - 44.935 But then it was challenged, obviously from a court perspective.

01:32 - 49.540 But there was additional money that was allocated that year, essentially

01:32 - 53.367 expecting that there's something that we need to be spending that money on.

01:32 - 57.281 And then when you look at the the next 12 years, which includes three

01:32 - 00.851 presidential years in there, the funding is pretty flat.

01:33 - 02.953 I mean, it goes up and down, but, I'm happy

01:33 - 05.289 to give you these numbers afterwards.

01:33 - 07.691 But I just wanted to share that because I know you had said,

01:33 - 11.319 like in presidential year, sometimes you may need more money in that area.

01:33 - 14.765 And so when we're looking at for this budget,

01:33 - 19.293 the governor wanting a 250% increase it.

01:33 - 23.698 I'm just wondering what specifically, when we don't have a new election law,

01:33 - 26.734 that we're trying to make sure that voters are aware of?

01:33 - 31.072 Is there something that is a significant change that we might be expecting?

01:33 - 32.916 Whether that's voter ID

01:33 - 34.685 or something else, that's a drastic change

01:33 - 37.321 that you would need that additional funding for.

01:33 - 39.189 It's not really so much of a change.

01:33 - 43.660 And and you're right about funding on it having been, flat over

01:33 - 48.131 previous years, we have requested additional funding for it, in the past.

01:33 - 52.526 I know that we certainly did in, 2024.

01:33 - 56.564 Because in federal election years,

01:33 - 00.334 voter turnout increases so much the burden that our counties

01:34 - 05.082 have to bear to, to educate voters about what I mentioned,

01:34 - 08.109 the deadlines and all the requirements and all the rest in advance.

01:34 - 12.589 That is something that, we would be in a position to do to help them

01:34 - 15.616 with, with the deadline,

01:34 - 18.686 also to make sure that new voters are,

01:34 - 20.697 are, made

01:34 - 23.924 aware of what the requirements are and, and all the rest,

01:34 - 27.695 you get new, more new voters in a federal election year.

01:34 - 30.907 And that is, again, something that our our county partners, it's a burden

01:34 - 33.934 that they usually carry that we can help alleviate.

01:34 - 39.373 But voter education, again, as I committed before and commit again,

01:34 - 42.686 no voter education will take place in a way that is in any way

01:34 - 46.256 specific to any party or geographic location

01:34 - 49.950 or anything else, like that will be uniform to everybody all the time.

01:34 - 52.529 I appreciate that the spending would be uniform

01:34 - 55.699 across the Commonwealth like you just stated, but I guess I'm just

01:34 - 00.895 really having a problem understanding why there's such a 250, you know, percent

01:35 - 06.834 increase when during 12 years with presidential polls

01:35 - 11.181 and midterms and all of it generally is somewhat flat.

01:35 - 14.718 So I'm just trying to understand like what this money is actually for if it ends up

01:35 - 19.046 making it into the budget this year, where would that money actually be spent?

01:35 - 23.627 Because from what I can see, like there really isn't that much of a difference.

01:35 - 28.155 Not that large of an increase, not a 250% increase.

01:35 - 32.193 And again, it is they are

01:35 - 37.574 they are resources that we've requested before and I no, did not receive

01:35 - 42.503 some years ago mailings to know voters are a significant portion of that.

01:35 - 47.117 Messaging to voters

01:35 - 50.611 to let them know advertising whether it's radio or digital,

01:35 - 54.791 that would be a significant portion of the voter outreach and voter education

01:35 - 55.792 that we would do.

01:35 - 58.628 Secretary marks, is there anything you want to add to that?

01:35 - 59.763 No, I think that's right.

01:35 - 03.457 And certainly the cost of those that kind of advertising is going up.

01:36 - 06.737 So is there like a specific link.

01:36 - 09.673 Is there a list of things like you just mentioned advertising.

01:36 - 11.575 Is that newspapers, is it online?

01:36 - 14.678 I know that's an issue that I think they're dealing with above.

01:36 - 18.849 As as Secretary said, we want to make sure we're covering, you know, every voter

01:36 - 22.977 in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, Secretary mentioned new voters.

01:36 - 24.788 You know, we've also had,

01:36 - 28.682 quite a bit of litigation, over the past several years regarding elections.

01:36 - 33.163 And, you know, part of our effort is also making sure people understand

01:36 - 37.000 what the current rules are, that they have to meet.

01:36 - 40.795 So, you know, it's really just making sure there's no confusion,

01:36 - 44.641 so that when people show up at the polls or vote by mail,

01:36 - 48.269 they know exactly what they need to do to ensure that their vote is counted.

01:36 - 49.846 And I appreciate that.

01:36 - 51.248 And I agree with that.

01:36 - 55.042 I would just say that because it's just such a stark difference.

01:36 - 58.088 It would be great if you guys could show us

01:36 - 01.057 a little bit more detail about why you need 100.

01:37 - 03.560 I'm sorry, 250% increase that area.

01:37 - 06.429 Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Yes, we can we can certainly provide that.

01:37 - 08.298 And it's also good to be back here.

01:37 - 12.369 Last year when I was sitting right here, you said, are you going to come back

01:37 - 16.230 next year and say the compacts are not done yet and I'm happy to be here.

01:37 - 20.043 Since then, the compacts were completed and we're grateful for the work.

01:37 - 24.271 The legislature did, help move that process along once we had worked out

01:37 - 26.683 whatever issues the department had encountered

01:37 - 28.919 in the past with our federal partners. Thank you so much.

01:37 - 29.687 I appreciate that.

01:37 - 33.147 Thank the gentle lady, Representative Casa Roski.

01:37 - 33.858 Thank you.

01:37 - 36.326 And thank you for being here today.

01:37 - 39.729 Chairman, next week, the Scranton gang might be a little insufferable

01:37 - 43.700 because I know they are claiming Roxboro, but we have, like, next week.

01:37 - 46.236 We got transportation aging.

01:37 - 49.906 Colonel Parris left us from Scranton, so we don't have the state police anymore,

01:37 - 52.809 but next week, we have our Scranton folks coming.

01:37 - 55.445 So you can have the Roxboro gentleman today.

01:37 - 56.813 You can blame him,

01:37 - 00.074 but next week, maybe a little bit more, insufferable with the Scranton crew.

01:38 - 02.319 Thank you for being here today.

01:38 - 06.356 I, Representative Waxman spoke a little bit about AI

01:38 - 10.360 in the election space, but, I wanted to talk a little bit about.

01:38 - 14.464 And it is it's out of the the AI is kind of like they say the, the,

01:38 - 16.366 toothpaste is out of the tube

01:38 - 20.303 and the guardrails and how to kind of, you know, make some regulations with AI.

01:38 - 22.739 And there are good space for I understand that.

01:38 - 26.200 But when it comes to health care, when it comes to our,

01:38 - 30.146 our professional, licensed,

01:38 - 35.719 nurses and physicians and physical therapists using AI and their space.

01:38 - 38.746 I just wanted to know, you know,

01:38 - 41.191 sometimes they actually, I can actually impersonate.

01:38 - 42.959 And as a licensed professional nurse

01:38 - 47.922 myself, I am, worried about the patient population and having that.

01:38 - 50.300 I kind of being going too far.

01:38 - 53.827 And I didn't know what you and the department can do to kind of regulate,

01:38 - 58.532 or put some, you know, monitors on AI when it comes to professional licensed,

01:38 - 02.412 what can undoubtedly be a resource, but it's not a resource

01:39 - 08.885 that any individual should, expect to provide, a responsible level of care.

01:39 - 13.390 And, and we know, and I know the governor has spoken to this too

01:39 - 17.251 about how I, bots essentially,

01:39 - 20.354 impersonate health care providers.

01:39 - 23.457 We have that responsibility to the Department of State to license

01:39 - 24.935 health care providers.

01:39 - 28.972 And it's one reason why, the governor asked the Pennsylvania.

01:39 - 33.867 Department of State and announced, I believe last week, that,

01:39 - 39.073 that we've created a task force related to AI in this space

01:39 - 45.079 so that, when complaints come our way related to AI systems,

01:39 - 48.024 purporting to be

01:39 - 52.386 health care providers, that our prosecution team,

01:39 - 56.857 and our investigation team can, and will,

01:39 - 00.403 prioritize those complaints

01:40 - 05.775 to make sure that any party involved in it is held accountable, that we bring it

01:40 - 08.378 to our board's attention for enforcement action

01:40 - 11.948 or anything else that we can do, because it is such a very,

01:40 - 14.317 a very important issue and a very dangerous one

01:40 - 18.178 if people were relying on that information for health care decisions.

01:40 - 19.023 Thank you.

01:40 - 20.857 I didn't I actually didn't know about the task force.

01:40 - 23.760 That's good to know because I know AI in health care, certainly.

01:40 - 28.365 With rural access dwindling and the need for more professionals,

01:40 - 29.233 and they're having a hard time

01:40 - 32.302 retaining and recruiting them in the rural parts of Pennsylvania.

01:40 - 36.239 When it comes to health care, I understand AI and bots and such access is

01:40 - 39.309 is something that is an access for patients, but that

01:40 - 41.644 I did not know about the task force. So that's good to know.

01:40 - 44.180 And as you can imagine, when it comes to mental health, when it comes

01:40 - 49.309 to any number of things, the dangers that that prevent, that it presents,

01:40 - 52.822 despite the fact that it can obviously be, a resource,

01:40 - 55.916 but it's no substitution for individual care.

01:40 - 58.719 No, I cannot replace nurses. Thank you.

01:41 - 04.100 Thank the gentle lady.

01:41 - 05.902 The nurse who can.

01:41 - 08.271 Yes. Right. Representative van Zyl.

01:41 - 09.339 Thank you, Chairman Harris.

01:41 - 11.374 And thank you, Secretary Schmidt, for being here.

01:41 - 11.642 Yes, sir.

01:41 - 14.668 Secretary Schmidt back in, I want to say 23.

01:41 - 17.580 When I was on state government, you gave some testimony

01:41 - 20.808 when you were the commissioner of, Philadelphia City.

01:41 - 24.878 There were some heart wrenching stories of some folks who were here legally.

01:41 - 28.124 And they were they were registered to vote, not knowingly.

01:41 - 31.151 And it ended up denying them, naturalization.

01:41 - 34.898 Are you satisfied since then that we have resolved

01:41 - 38.425 the issues of non-citizens registering to vote through to motor voter?

01:41 - 41.738 And are you speaking about state government committee

01:41 - 46.943 and 23 I want to think it was a 17.

01:41 - 48.678 I could be wrong, you know, two years ago.

01:41 - 51.748 Yeah, I know if I was if I was a commissioner then,

01:41 - 52.949 then it would have been. Yeah.

01:41 - 55.585 But it was in 24 when you were given testimony.

01:41 - 57.153 Yes, I did testify to it.

01:41 - 01.491 And, and the and the and the issue was that I, that I raised the city

01:42 - 05.752 commissioner and, approached the Pennsylvania Department of State about

01:42 - 11.024 was when, people who were not eligible to register to vote non-citizens

01:42 - 16.864 are, are, were sort of captured in that process

01:42 - 22.636 that it harmed both, and potential to harm both election integrity

01:42 - 26.950 and them as individuals, because if they were not eligible

01:42 - 32.989 to register to vote or voted, then, it's grounds for if they seek to become

01:42 - 36.583 new Americans, grounds for their rejection and possible,

01:42 - 39.229 deportation from the United States, isn't it?

01:42 - 42.956 Wasn't there something kind of got, you know, hung out to dry, so to speak?

01:42 - 47.661 I I'm, I'm aware of several examples of it.

01:42 - 52.699 I've gone and met with people that that has happened

01:42 - 58.272 to, in the past and spent, as you know, years working on that issue

01:42 - 03.677 to make sure that not only is election integrity, safeguarded and strengthened,

01:43 - 07.490 but that people wouldn't have that, process occur to them.

01:43 - 07.992 Yeah.

01:43 - 11.761 In the past few years, maybe since then, as your department

01:43 - 13.897 reached out with with Penn daughter got together.

01:43 - 16.766 Do we have any new any recent,

01:43 - 19.793 safeguards in the automatic voter registration program?

01:43 - 20.738 Yeah.

01:43 - 25.508 After, raising this issue and working with the Pennsylvania Department of State,

01:43 - 28.535 the Pennsylvania Department of State working with PennDOT,

01:43 - 33.207 changed the motor voter system so that when a non-citizen

01:43 - 36.219 would go to a, PennDOT

01:43 - 39.622 office, they would no longer encounter

01:43 - 43.383 any of the voter registration kind of interface and would not,

01:43 - 49.022 be inadvertently sort of captured in that whole process.

01:43 - 52.569 So if you are not a citizen and you are eligible for a driver's

01:43 - 55.596 license in Pennsylvania and you go to a PennDOT office,

01:43 - 59.766 a non-citizen will not encounter the voter registration system.

01:44 - 00.377 Okay.

01:44 - 01.644 And the reason I bring this up

01:44 - 04.671 is, you know, we know of the two folks who got the CDL,

01:44 - 07.850 issued through Pennsylvania, but there are folks

01:44 - 11.511 that are non-citizens, they can obtain a driver's license, correct.

01:44 - 13.990 What what safeguards do we have?

01:44 - 17.260 So if there is a non-citizen here who can obtain a license

01:44 - 20.287 where as opposed to somebody who is here illegally, that, that,

01:44 - 23.323 are not allowed for a license or to register to vote.

01:44 - 27.928 So when a non-citizen is eligible for a driver's license in Pennsylvania

01:44 - 32.275 and they go to a PennDOT office, they're showing the, their state papers,

01:44 - 35.369 their foreign passport, all that documentation,

01:44 - 38.572 that would make them eligible to receive a driver's license.

01:44 - 41.608 As I said, they don't encounter any of the voter registration system.

01:44 - 46.613 But as part of that process, PennDOT bounces, that applicant off of,

01:44 - 50.150 the Department of Homeland Security to ensure that they are here, eligible

01:44 - 55.255 and eligible to receive, a driver's license as as part of that process.

01:44 - 57.700 Is there anything you want to add? No, that's.

01:44 - 00.794 And from there, their record is tagged,

01:45 - 05.198 that they're here, that they have legal presence.

01:45 - 09.178 And, because of that tag, they're kept completely away from the

01:45 - 10.404 voter registration,

01:45 - 12.049 screen.

01:45 - 14.784 So they're not given an opportunity to register to vote.

01:45 - 18.478 You asked about recent changes just in the past few years.

01:45 - 20.723 We did expand working with PennDOT.

01:45 - 25.328 We did expand the number of, languages that the motor voter screens

01:45 - 30.724 are translated into from 14 to 31, so that if somebody inadvertently,

01:45 - 34.003 sees those screens, they can see in their own language

01:45 - 38.131 what their requirements are, including the requirement that they be citizens.

01:45 - 40.510 Yeah. And I think just just one last question.

01:45 - 44.147 So whenever we get our information from a Homeland Security,

01:45 - 48.175 do we do anything additional just to verify that one more step that,

01:45 - 52.145 you know, this information is legit, you know, do we just take Homeland Security's

01:45 - 55.749 word for it, or do we go and trying to do our own little homework on it?

01:45 - 59.629 PennDOT, Department of State really isn't part of that process.

01:45 - 00.431 PennDOT.

01:46 - 04.667 Essentially pings off the Department of Homeland Security

01:46 - 09.062 to check an applicant to see if they are in the United States illegally

01:46 - 14.334 and if that is approved, and it's an almost instantaneous, process.

01:46 - 18.438 Then they would be eligible to receive a driver's license.

01:46 - 19.283 The examples

01:46 - 23.419 that you used about the city, CDL, people, they did not register to vote,

01:46 - 26.656 they would not have encountered voter registration screens or anything else

01:46 - 27.424 like that.

01:46 - 29.892 All right. Perfect. Thank you Secretary. Thank you. Chairman.

01:46 - 30.794 Thank you. Gentlemen.

01:46 - 33.029 Representative Brennan.

01:46 - 33.897 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:46 - 36.399 I have, two lines of questioning here.

01:46 - 37.423 One is on,

01:46 - 41.862 Mail-In voting, and the other is, independents voting in the primary.

01:46 - 46.909 Regarding, Mail-In voting, I, I first became, concerned

01:46 - 50.046 about this issue of making sure everyone has a full opportunity

01:46 - 54.174 to have their vote cast and counted and the concerns about these smaller

01:46 - 57.411 errors that could happen that could lead to a vote not being counted.

01:46 - 02.825 During the 2020 presidential, litigation, I was one of the attorneys on that.

01:47 - 07.196 And I saw the arguments that were raised, at that time by by President Trump

01:47 - 12.092 that, frankly, would have, sanctioned some disenfranchisement in the Mid-State.

01:47 - 15.638 Well, undermining efforts that were made

01:47 - 19.208 elsewhere to, to make sure these mail in votes are being counted.

01:47 - 24.781 So, you know, I'm wondering, we we have people making small errors.

01:47 - 25.815 What's being done?

01:47 - 28.885 What, improvements have been made,

01:47 - 34.157 to make sure that that folks, can, can be sure that their votes are being counted

01:47 - 38.528 when they, when they make Mail-In ballots and that they're not, you know, the,

01:47 - 41.063 the I of due process concerns with small errors,

01:47 - 44.867 making sure that we tell these people that there's been a small error,

01:47 - 47.236 give people an avenue to make sure that they can vote

01:47 - 50.239 provisionally or that their votes count, and certainly want to make sure that we're

01:47 - 53.109 we're making those, possibilities

01:47 - 56.269 for error, less likely to occur, occur.

01:47 - 59.773 So I'm wondering what the department's doing, you know, when when authority,

01:47 - 04.211 the Pennsylvania Department of State has is to require

01:48 - 07.547 what appears on a mail ballot envelope,

01:48 - 11.318 that the voter is completing

01:48 - 14.988 before returning it to their county board of elections.

01:48 - 18.201 We worked with, stakeholders on this.

01:48 - 20.069 We worked with experts in this area.

01:48 - 23.530 We worked very closely with our our county partners and,

01:48 - 29.178 redesigned the mail ballot envelope to, bring attention

01:48 - 32.539 to what is required from voters to complete before returning it.

01:48 - 35.885 We rolled that out

01:48 - 38.912 and have now had a couple of elections behind us,

01:48 - 41.924 that have shown it

01:48 - 45.986 having a significant decrease in rejection rates for voters,

01:48 - 49.523 making sure that it's very clear that they need to sign it

01:48 - 53.727 and all the rest, and making the process much more user friendly,

01:48 - 58.298 that that was so successful that we just completed, same thing,

01:48 - 02.636 for provisional ballot envelopes to make sure that they're designed in a way

01:49 - 06.015 that voters can easily,

01:49 - 10.019 understand what's required of them so that,

01:49 - 14.447 votes are not rejected as a result of a, a fatal defect that a voter might,

01:49 - 20.229 might,

01:49 - 23.256 complete, when returning the envelope.

01:49 - 25.902 And as there been any, developments in terms of,

01:49 - 29.305 you know, making sure that people know if there's been an error in their,

01:49 - 32.575 their ballot, that was always a concern for me due process wise.

01:49 - 33.776 If the government's going to take anything

01:49 - 36.803 away for folks that we give them notice and opportunity care,

01:49 - 39.973 is there there are developments on that in terms of letting people know.

01:49 - 44.511 I mean, we we encourage counties, that is a county level,

01:49 - 47.523 thing, not a Pennsylvania Department of State thing.

01:49 - 50.784 So we encourage counties to make sure that they share with voters

01:49 - 52.328 when ballots come in.

01:49 - 55.364 They obviously have to time stamp them and they have to record them in.

01:49 - 57.767 The sure system is having arrived.

01:49 - 01.003 And if they become aware of,

01:50 - 04.230 an apparent fatal defect like it's not signed,

01:50 - 08.144 to, one way or another or reach out

01:50 - 11.171 to voters to, to make them aware of that federal defecting.

01:50 - 14.874 And regarding independence, voting in the primary, 1.4 million,

01:50 - 18.545 of our fellow Pennsylvanians are registered as an independent.

01:50 - 21.524 A lot of times it's our it's our veterans.

01:50 - 24.727 There's currently several bills to have, independents

01:50 - 26.195 permitted to vote in the primary.

01:50 - 29.465 I'm wondering, is Department of State preparing for that?

01:50 - 33.235 Are they, and anticipating any issues that could that could come up

01:50 - 35.705 with, with independents voting in the primaries?

01:50 - 38.140 And I'm just wondering the level of preparation,

01:50 - 41.310 and any administered ability concerns that the department might have

01:50 - 44.337 that we should look for in terms of legislation as well,

01:50 - 47.717 it's really a project of the administration and,

01:50 - 51.520 the General Assembly to determine whether to allow independents

01:50 - 53.656 to participate in our in our primary system.

01:50 - 56.759 There are some states that do it the way that Pennsylvania does, many

01:50 - 59.919 that do not have open primaries and other sorts of,

01:51 - 03.723 approaches to to voting in primary elections.

01:51 - 08.137 Obviously, if there were changes to legislation

01:51 - 12.766 allowing non-major party voters to vote in primary elections,

01:51 - 16.045 then we would work closely with our county partners

01:51 - 19.982 and do the sort of voter education that would be needed to make sure

01:51 - 21.751 that those voters are aware that they can,

01:51 - 24.720 and the department is prepared to be able to handle those types of issues, should

01:51 - 28.491 they, come up or should a bill pass, what would be a significant change?

01:51 - 31.694 And we would certainly work with our county partners to,

01:51 - 34.721 to make sure that voters would be aware, should that a change occur.

01:51 - 36.532 Thank thank you for your time. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

01:51 - 38.300 Thank you, Representative.

01:51 - 41.327 Thank the gentleman.

01:51 - 45.207 That's it.

01:51 - 47.009 Chairman Rowe.

01:51 - 47.711 Thank you, Mr.

01:51 - 49.345 Chairman. And thank you, Mr.

01:51 - 52.014 Secretary and the rest of you folks, for being here today.

01:51 - 52.849 Thank you. Chairman.

01:51 - 56.209 When I was driving over here today to the Capitol,

01:51 - 59.622 there is a story on the radio station.

01:51 - 04.226 I was listening to the news about a person who voted in Pennsylvania

01:52 - 07.897 by mail in the same person had voted in person

01:52 - 10.924 in Florida in the same election.

01:52 - 13.569 So that person voted twice.

01:52 - 16.906 Now, our system is based on one person, one vote,

01:52 - 21.301 and if the same person votes twice, they're stealing democracy.

01:52 - 25.171 So, it's really hard for,

01:52 - 29.852 the federal government to keep track to make sure the same person's not

01:52 - 33.989 registered to vote in more than one state, like the person was in the news story.

01:52 - 38.127 I listened to, the Department of Justice.

01:52 - 41.154 They have sued different states, including Pennsylvania.

01:52 - 42.698 They want information.

01:52 - 43.699 They just want to make sure

01:52 - 46.926 that the same person isn't registered to vote in two different states.

01:52 - 50.363 They want to make sure that non-citizens are not registered.

01:52 - 56.069 But you folks are resisting giving them the information they need.

01:52 - 00.240 I'm just curious, why you don't just give them the information?

01:53 - 02.184 Because I think we should all have the same goal.

01:53 - 06.155 We want to make sure only citizens are registered, and we want to make sure

01:53 - 09.616 that the same person is not registered in more than one state.

01:53 - 11.161 Yes, chairman.

01:53 - 16.132 And you'll, be glad to know that it was the Pennsylvania Department of State

01:53 - 19.101 that identified that voter and referred them to law enforcement

01:53 - 22.171 and work with law enforcement every step of the way to make sure

01:53 - 25.941 that they were held accountable for having committed voter fraud.

01:53 - 29.912 As rare as that occurs, we are nevertheless,

01:53 - 34.207 something that we always, scrutinize for and investigate whenever,

01:53 - 37.586 whenever it does occur,

01:53 - 40.613 the DOJ requests that you reference,

01:53 - 45.118 it is the position of the department that,

01:53 - 50.432 not only would we not provide the Social Security numbers, driver's

01:53 - 54.928 license numbers, and all sorts of other, personally identifiable information

01:53 - 59.499 to the Department of Justice, like this,

01:54 - 05.181 that we are not even legally allowed to state law.

01:54 - 05.916 Federal law

01:54 - 10.286 and the Constitution of the Commonwealth would prevent us from sharing that.

01:54 - 15.248 That is why we declined to provide that information to the Department of Justice,

01:54 - 18.460 as have many other states,

01:54 - 21.921 across the United States, red and blue alike.

01:54 - 26.926 Kentucky, Utah, Idaho.

01:54 - 32.031 It's really not been a red or blue or Republican Democratic issue.

01:54 - 36.278 It's been an issue of states, having the responsibility

01:54 - 39.906 to safeguard their voters private information.

01:54 - 44.687 And in their cases, in our case, we would not is our position.

01:54 - 47.957 We could not even legally provided provide that information.

01:54 - 50.526 Even with all due respect, Mr.

01:54 - 55.731 Secretary, the federal government already has everybody's social security numbers.

01:54 - 57.700 They're the ones that give them out.

01:54 - 59.768 They just want to be able to match them up.

01:54 - 03.663 I was curious about common names earlier today, so I did a search.

01:55 - 06.675 They estimate there's over 40,000 people

01:55 - 10.203 in the United States with the name James Smith.

01:55 - 12.848 So if you're trying to figure out if a person named

01:55 - 15.875 James Smith is registered in more than one state,

01:55 - 20.546 there's no way to do it unless you have their Social Security number.

01:55 - 24.817 And it just seems like, I'm curious, like what

01:55 - 29.999 what which article and which section of the Constitution prohibits

01:55 - 35.161 the Department of State from giving information like Social Security numbers

01:55 - 39.308 to the federal government, or what specific state law says

01:55 - 43.636 that the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania cannot give

01:55 - 47.016 voting information to the federal government?

01:55 - 50.219 Well, chairman, I would be happy to provide our letter

01:55 - 53.413 to the Department of Justice in response to their request.

01:55 - 57.884 And this matter is being adjudicated, obviously, across the country

01:55 - 58.995 in federal courts.

01:55 - 03.399 I think three states so far have had federal court decisions,

01:56 - 07.703 all of them upheld, the states

01:56 - 11.674 denial, of providing that information to the federal government

01:56 - 14.243 that they were either prohibited from doing it, but the federal government

01:56 - 18.037 had, had no, authority to demand it.

01:56 - 21.684 Well, I just think it's unfortunate how much money are we spending?

01:56 - 24.687 Like how many hours of attorney time?

01:56 - 27.423 How much money is this cost?

01:56 - 30.717 And to fight against giving information

01:56 - 33.953 that could just be given to make sure the same person

01:56 - 37.766 you know doesn't vote twice, or to make sure that non-citizens are not.

01:56 - 39.492 Buddy, how much is being spent on this?

01:56 - 44.964 In terms of the litigation that we have?

01:56 - 46.108 Well, the litigation has come

01:56 - 49.135 from the federal government to us, not the other way around.

01:56 - 55.250 And safeguarding, the personal information of 8.88.9.

01:56 - 59.278 Pennsylvanians is not something, that we would,

01:56 - 04.517 that is something that we take very seriously

01:57 - 10.189 and not something that we would do unless, required to do so and had confidence

01:57 - 13.826 that that information would not in any way be compromised or shared.

01:57 - 16.905 All right. Thank you, Mr. Secretary.

01:57 - 17.674 Thank you, chairman.

01:57 - 20.242 Thank the gentleman, Representative Bellman.

01:57 - 21.844 Thank you, chair. And, thank you, Mr.

01:57 - 23.379 Secretary, for being here.

01:57 - 26.739 I wanted to expand a little bit upon, some previous questions.

01:57 - 32.287 And just ask you what can be done to draw youth, into the election process.

01:57 - 34.671 What else can we do to draw youth into the election process?

01:57 - 38.994 Well, I think there's a there's, a couple of things.

01:57 - 42.722 One, is obvious,

01:57 - 46.502 obviously, as a result of automatic voter registration in Pennsylvania, I mean,

01:57 - 49.805 voters still have the ability to opt out if they choose not to register to vote.

01:57 - 54.634 So no one's being forced to do anything if they don't choose to, to do so.

01:57 - 58.671 But automatic voter registration, previous studies have shown,

01:57 - 02.317 has been helpful in making sure that more younger people,

01:58 - 06.345 when they get their driver's license, provided that they're eligible

01:58 - 10.083 because of age, are able to register to vote.

01:58 - 14.596 Voter outreach, stakeholder groups,

01:58 - 17.623 nonprofits, any number of other organizations,

01:58 - 22.995 really, do the most outreach when it comes to those sorts of things.

01:58 - 27.233 It's not something that the Department of State does in any kind of like

01:58 - 31.971 targeted way, because it's not targeting one voter over or over any other.

01:58 - 35.308 But obviously, we want young people to register to vote

01:58 - 39.946 and to begin, a lifetime of, of voting so that,

01:58 - 43.058 some secretary down the road can go

01:58 - 47.453 to, Voter Hall of Fame and, and a county and,

01:58 - 51.100 and, and acknowledge someone for voting for 50 years in a row.

01:58 - 53.902 And that's because they registered to vote when they were first,

01:58 - 55.838 when they were first eligible.

01:58 - 56.839 Yeah. I thank you for that.

01:58 - 59.641 And I remember when you were commissioner, you would always send out a graphic

01:58 - 04.113 about who voted, and which demographics, and voted and how much they voted.

01:59 - 06.515 So, I know you you noted the data.

01:59 - 10.853 Well, and, and that was, leaning into another one of my questions,

01:59 - 14.347 which was just in how can we overall increase voter turnout?

01:59 - 16.125 In Pennsylvania, there's still a lot of people

01:59 - 18.293 that just choose not to participate.

01:59 - 21.320 But, if you like to add anything else to that.

01:59 - 22.432 Yes.

01:59 - 26.692 So, representative, I was just speaking in terms of my, current capacity

01:59 - 30.062 at the Commonwealth when I was commissioner.

01:59 - 33.108 Every person, when they voted for the first time,

01:59 - 37.503 every younger voter, I, sent them a letter, signed the letter,

01:59 - 41.707 provided all sorts of other information to really acknowledge

01:59 - 44.920 the important achievement of registering to vote and voting.

01:59 - 48.490 I would work with our schools in Philadelphia to essentially

01:59 - 52.852 teach social studies all day to seniors, to talk about the importance of voting

01:59 - 57.099 and making voter registration materials available to them, work closely

01:59 - 00.126 with, public, private and parochial school system.

02:00 - 02.905 When I was a city commissioner to do that sort of,

02:00 - 07.442 personal outreach that a county official can do that

02:00 - 09.578 we can't do, Pennsylvania Department of State.

02:00 - 12.214 Obviously, we want every voter, regardless of age,

02:00 - 16.442 whether they are seniors in high school or senior citizens, to eligible to

02:00 - 20.246 who are eligible to vote, to cast their vote and make their voice heard.

02:00 - 21.558 All right.

02:00 - 26.252 And my last question is, as we, approach the 250th anniversary,

02:00 - 30.590 of America, with, Pennsylvania, and Philadelphia,

02:00 - 34.836 being at the center, I'm just curious, as your role as secretary

02:00 - 38.731 of state, personally, what does America 250 mean to you?

02:00 - 42.034 And then also, how can we use this moment,

02:00 - 45.338 to really strengthen democracy, for the future?

02:00 - 48.841 The, the,

02:00 - 54.347 the organization really leading it has events throughout the Commonwealth.

02:00 - 58.360 I've been fortunate to be invited to several of those, and

02:00 - 59.561 participate in them.

02:00 - 02.588 I think one involved reading to students all day.

02:01 - 06.292 I think it was I forgot what the book was called.

02:01 - 08.570 It's like D for democracy or something like that.

02:01 - 12.040 It was sort of reading to students about the importance of voting

02:01 - 16.035 and the importance of, this milestone, for our republic.

02:01 - 18.548 Thank you, I appreciate it.

02:01 - 19.748 Thank you. Chair.

02:01 - 21.049 Thank you. Gentlemen.

02:01 - 24.076 Chairman Struzan.

02:01 - 26.556 Thank you, Chairman Harris.

02:01 - 28.924 Just, help me understand.

02:01 - 31.760 The person that voted in two different states.

02:01 - 33.962 How was that person identified?

02:01 - 36.064 How did you find out about that?

02:01 - 39.792 Pennsylvania is part of a system called Eric,

02:01 - 44.830 which is a consortium of states that voluntarily enter into that,

02:01 - 50.946 that network so that we can work together to identify cases

02:01 - 56.108 where a voter has voted or registered to vote or vote and, or voted

02:01 - 00.680 in, in more than one state or even within your own state.

02:02 - 04.092 The Eric system is, something that our state

02:02 - 07.863 and dozens of others depend upon to help identify voters.

02:02 - 13.435 When you move from one state to another to to to update, voter records,

02:02 - 18.064 to make sure that counties are aware of, that the voter is moved

02:02 - 22.077 so they can conduct the list maintenance that they're required to do

02:02 - 25.104 to keep our voter rolls as accurate as they can be.

02:02 - 26.049 Okay. Thank you.

02:02 - 27.215 I was just curious about that.

02:02 - 31.053 And then, if you could just follow up with the request that, Representative

02:02 - 36.849 Marcel had on the additional funding request for voter education.

02:02 - 40.362 What that would be specifically used for

02:02 - 44.357 and how it would be distributed to the counties.

02:02 - 47.002 Absolutely, chairman. We'd be happy to provide that to you.

02:02 - 48.637 Okay. All right. Thank you all for being here.

02:02 - 51.540 Thank you. Thank you, chairman. Thank thank the gentleman.

02:02 - 54.767 I think that real quick, a few questions that we can have

02:02 - 57.145 some appreciate you and the department being here.

02:02 - 01.450 Years ago, I spoke about, you know, you were a city commissioner

02:03 - 05.420 in Philadelphia, when you were a member of the city commissioners.

02:03 - 07.522 What was your voter registration?

02:03 - 10.292 At that time?

02:03 - 12.260 My party affiliation. Yes.

02:03 - 13.328 Republican.

02:03 - 16.322 So you are a Republican member of the city commissioners?

02:03 - 18.500 For those that don't know, Philadelphia,

02:03 - 21.694 the majority party here is three commissioners, correct?

02:03 - 24.339 Two from the majority.

02:03 - 25.774 Well, there's three commissioners.

02:03 - 28.510 One seat is always reserved for the minority party.

02:03 - 29.878 Correct? Correct.

02:03 - 33.773 And you had the minority seat as a at that time registered Republican, correct?

02:03 - 34.751 That's correct.

02:03 - 38.220 I was elected in 2011 and then reelected in 2015

02:03 - 41.247 and then reelected in 2019 as a Republican.

02:03 - 42.392 Correct? Okay.

02:03 - 46.619 I've been a registered Republican since 1994.

02:03 - 48.563 I was ten, but. Okay.

02:03 - 51.590 I'm sorry you put it out there.

02:03 - 52.657 I'm not.

02:03 - 55.271 So so,

02:03 - 58.264 Secretary, let me ask you a question.

02:03 - 01.376 Do you believe elections in Pennsylvania

02:04 - 04.379 are safe?

02:04 - 05.647 Elections in Pennsylvania

02:04 - 09.551 have never been more free, fair, safe and secure.

02:04 - 10.719 They are absolutely safe.

02:04 - 15.190 As proved by two audits after every election and a voter

02:04 - 20.786 verifiable paper ballot record, that is now required in Pennsylvania.

02:04 - 24.657 Can undocumented persons vote here in Pennsylvania?

02:04 - 27.969 Undocumented?

02:04 - 31.473 Can an undocumented person vote in Pennsylvania?

02:04 - 33.775 They would not be eligible to register to vote.

02:04 - 37.303 It was certainly not in any way encounter automatic voter registration

02:04 - 39.481 or anything else like that.

02:04 - 44.519 They would, have to provide all sorts of information and a voter registration

02:04 - 49.615 application or process, to verify identity before being registered.

02:04 - 52.561 Do you believe so? So that's a no.

02:04 - 53.628 Correct. Okay.

02:04 - 57.957 Do you believe that there is widespread voter fraud here in Pennsylvania?

02:04 - 59.602 There is

02:04 - 02.671 no evidence of widespread voter fraud in Pennsylvania up here.

02:05 - 05.698 Right. So in your opinion,

02:05 - 08.210 as a registered Republican

02:05 - 11.237 and the Secretary of state of this Commonwealth

02:05 - 14.740 charged with elections,

02:05 - 17.419 you believe

02:05 - 20.779 that there's not widespread fraud in Pennsylvania, correct?

02:05 - 26.661 Regardless of my party affiliation, facts are facts, and there is no evidence

02:05 - 30.165 to suggest at all that that is, an issue

02:05 - 33.425 that occurs in any widespread way at all.

02:05 - 36.795 And when it does occur is the example that I just cited.

02:05 - 39.307 When it does occur, it is identifiable.

02:05 - 42.277 And, working with law enforcement partners,

02:05 - 45.113 make sure that people are held, held accountable for one.

02:05 - 48.140 So you believe that Pennsylvanians

02:05 - 51.520 should be able to have the faith

02:05 - 55.514 that their elections and the outcomes of their elections

02:05 - 58.660 are free from interference

02:05 - 01.329 and and safe in this Commonwealth.

02:06 - 03.765 I only ever pause because you're saying, do you believe?

02:06 - 06.668 And it's really not a question of belief. It's a question of knowing.

02:06 - 08.570 I know that to be true.

02:06 - 09.539 Oh excuse me.

02:06 - 10.805 So. Okay.

02:06 - 11.474 I'm sorry.

02:06 - 13.808 So it's not a belief, you know.

02:06 - 15.810 So let's do it that way. Mr. Secretary.

02:06 - 19.772 You know that elections here in Pennsylvania are safe

02:06 - 24.286 and are free and are not rigged in the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania.

02:06 - 25.687 You know these things to be true.

02:06 - 27.989 I know those things to be true because there's no evidence.

02:06 - 31.183 So it would be so far for someone to believe

02:06 - 35.497 that elections are rigged and that they are not free and fair.

02:06 - 38.524 And the Commonwealth would almost be as ridiculous

02:06 - 41.794 as not putting your hot sauce in the refrigerator.

02:06 - 47.442 Mr. Chairman, I don't have

02:06 - 50.469 anything in my briefing materials to address to the hot sauce.

02:06 - 52.013 It's exciting.

02:06 - 53.081 I'm unfamiliar with it,

02:06 - 56.141 and we would be happy to get back to, the chairman about that issue.

02:06 - 59.054 Thank you, Mr. Secretary.

02:06 - 02.524 Thank you to everyone from the Department of State for being here.

02:07 - 04.593 And,

02:07 - 06.595 a little brevity, my friends.

02:07 - 11.790 That will conclude our budget hearing with the Department of State.

02:07 - 16.495 We'll be back here at 1:00 this afternoon.

02:07 - 21.009 Well, we will be with the Pennsylvania Public Utilities Commission.

02:07 - 21.143 What?

02:07 - 24.169 That this committee hearing is adjourned.

02:07 - 25.403 So we did have a hearing