00:16 - >> CAN YOU START OFF JUST

00:17 - TELLING ME ABOUT SOME OF YOUR

00:19 - EARLIEST MEMORIES IN NEW YORK?

00:21 - >> HMM.

00:24 - WELL, I DON'T HAVE MUCH OF A

00:26 - TIME LINE.

00:26 - MY EARLIEST MEMORIES REVOLVED

00:29 - AROUND MY FATHER AND SPORTS AND

00:32 - MY NURSE.

00:34 - MY MOTHER WORKED.

00:35 - SHE WAS A DESIGNER IN THE

00:36 - SPORTSWEAR INDUSTRY, SO,

00:38 - LITERALLY, FROM THE DAY THAT I

00:39 - CAME HOME FROM THE HOSPITAL, I

00:41 - HAD A NURSE BY THE NAME OF

00:42 - MAY BURGEN, WHO WAS A YOUNG

00:43 - IRISH WOMAN AT THE TIME.

00:45 - LITERALLY HAD GOTTEN OFF THE

00:47 - BOAT LIKE TWO MONTHS BEFORE.

00:48 - I DON'T KNOW HOW MY PARENTS

00:50 - FOUND HER, BUT SHE WAS AN ANGEL,

00:52 - JUST AN ANGEL.

00:54 - AND SHE PROCEEDED TO -- OF

00:55 - COURSE, SHE WAS A GOOD IRISH

00:57 - CATHOLIC, SO I WENT TO MASS

01:00 - UNTIL I WENT TO SCHOOL, UNTIL --

01:02 - UNTIL KINDERGARTEN, I WENT TO

01:04 - MASS EVERY DAY AT NOON.

01:05 - OF COURSE, IT WAS IN LATIN, SO,

01:07 - YOU KNOW, IT DIDN'T MAKE MUCH OF

01:08 - AN IMPRESSION UPON ME.

01:10 - I REMEMBER GOING TO MASS.

01:11 - I REMEMBER MAY AND HOW SWEET AND

01:13 - KIND SHE WAS.

01:16 - MY MOM WAS GREAT, BUT MOM WOULD

01:18 - COME IN AT NIGHT, AND SHE'D BE

01:19 - PRETTY TIRED, AND SHE'D SORT OF

01:21 - WAVE, AND WE'D HAVE DINNER AS A

01:23 - FAMILY.

01:24 - OF COURSE, MY DAD PLAYED A

01:26 - CENTRAL PART IN MY LIFE AND...

01:30 - WAS MY -- IF I HAD A ROLE MODEL,

01:33 - WAS MY ROLE MODEL, AND I SAID IN

01:35 - THE BOOK THAT I WROTE THAT HE'S

01:37 - BY FAR THE FINEST PERSON I'VE

01:39 - EVER MET.

01:41 - AND MY MEMORIES WITH MY DAD WERE

01:43 - ABOUT SPORTS AND POLITICS.

01:45 - NOT...

01:46 - SURPRISING THAT IN LATER LIFE,

01:49 - MY LIFE HAS BEEN MOSTLY ABOUT

01:50 - SPORTS AND POLITICS.

01:53 - SO, I REMEMBER -- LIKE, I

01:54 - REMEMBER, YOU KNOW, HOW YOU

01:56 - CLOSE YOUR EYES AND YOU CAN

01:57 - PICTURE INCIDENTS FROM YOUR

01:58 - PAST?

02:00 - I REMEMBER BEING LIKE 5 YEARS

02:03 - OLD.

02:04 - WOULD'VE BEEN 19...

02:06 - MAYBE I WAS, YEAH 5 OR 6 YEARS

02:08 - OLD.

02:09 - I REMEMBER BEING SOMEWHERE, AND

02:11 - WE WERE OUT TO DINNER -- MY

02:13 - FATHER, MY BROTHER, ROBERT, AND

02:16 - MY MOM AND I.

02:17 - AND A FRIEND OF MY FATHER'S CAME

02:19 - OVER, A MALE FRIEND OF MY DAD'S,

02:22 - AND WE WERE TALKING ABOUT

02:24 - BASEBALL, AND MY DAD SAID,

02:27 - "EDDIE CAN NAME THE STARTING

02:29 - LINEUP OF THE -- OF THE GIANTS,"

02:31 - THE BASEBALL GIANTS.

02:32 - AND I REMEMBER RIPPING OFF THE

02:34 - NAMES OF THE STARTING LINEUP OF

02:36 - THE -- OF THE GIANTS.

02:37 - PLUS, I COULD -- I COULD NAME

02:39 - THE ROTATION.

02:43 - SAL MAGLIE, LARRY JANSEN, AND --

02:45 - AND JIM HEARN WERE THE BIG

02:47 - THREE.

02:48 - THE GIANTS HAD A BIG THREE IN

02:49 - THOSE DAYS.

02:51 - AND -- AND...

02:54 - I REMEMBER THE OTHER MAN WAS SO

02:55 - IMPRESSED THAT A 5- OR

02:56 - 6-YEAR-OLD KID COULD DO THAT.

02:59 - BUT WE WENT TO MAYBE 20, 25

03:03 - BASEBALL GIANTS GAMES A YEAR.

03:05 - AND MY DAD DIDN'T HAVE SEASON

03:06 - TICKETS.

03:07 - HE HAD HIS OWN SMALL BUSINESS,

03:08 - BUT HE DIDN'T HAVE SEASON

03:09 - TICKETS AT ALL.

03:09 - WE JUST WENT, MY BROTHER,

03:11 - MYSELF, AND MY DAD, AND THEN WE

03:14 - STARTED, WHEN THE GIANTS MOVED

03:16 - TO YANKEE STADIUM, I THINK, WE

03:18 - GOT SEASON TICKETS TO THE

03:19 - FOOTBALL GIANTS, AND WE WENT TO

03:22 - PRETTY MUCH EVERY FOOTBALL GAME,

03:24 - BUT MY DAD ONLY GOT TWO TICKETS.

03:26 - SO, ONE GAME, HE WOULD BRING MY

03:28 - BROTHER.

03:29 - AND ONE GAME, HE WOULD BRING ME.

03:31 - MY BROTHER WAS THREE YEARS OLDER

03:32 - THAN I WAS.

03:33 - AND I REMEMBER ONE OF THE

03:34 - SADDEST MOMENTS WAS, MY DAD DIED

03:37 - IN 1958, AND THAT WAS THE YEAR

03:41 - THAT THE GIANTS...

03:45 - PLAYED IN THAT INCREDIBLE GAME

03:47 - WHERE ALAN AMECHE SCORED THE

03:49 - TOUCHDOWN IN OVERTIME, AND WE

03:50 - WENT TO THE GAME, MY BROTHER AND

03:52 - I.

03:53 - MY BROTHER WAS IN COLLEGE AT

03:54 - THAT TIME.

03:56 - AND WE WENT TO THE GAME...

04:00 - WITHOUT HIM, JUST THE TWO OF US.

04:02 - AND IT WAS BITTERSWEET BEING AT

04:04 - THE GAME WITHOUT HIM.

04:06 - AND THEN THE NEXT YEAR, THE

04:08 - BASEBALL GIANTS MOVED TO

04:09 - SAN FRANCISCO, AND I WAS ALMOST

04:10 - GLAD THAT HE WASN'T AROUND TO

04:12 - SEE THAT 'CAUSE THAT WOULD'VE

04:13 - BROKEN HIS HEART, AS WELL.

04:15 - SO...

04:18 - THE MEMORIES THAT I HAVE REVOLVE

04:20 - AROUND SPORTS WITH MY DAD...

04:23 - MEMORIES OF MAY BURGEN, MY

04:25 - NURSE, AND MEMORIES OF...

04:28 - OF MY DAD'S INTEREST IN

04:29 - POLITICS.

04:30 - AS I SAID IN THE BOOK, HE NEVER

04:33 - WAS A COMMITTEE MAN OR ANYTHING.

04:35 - YOU KNOW, NEVER HAD ANYTHING TO

04:37 - DO WITH ORGANIZED POLITICS, BUT

04:39 - HE LOVED THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

04:41 - HE THOUGHT THAT FDR HAD

04:42 - LITERALLY SAVED THE COUNTRY.

04:44 - HE LOVED ADLAI STEVENSON.

04:46 - I TALKED ABOUT IT IN THE BOOK,

04:48 - HOW HE AND I WOULD GO OUT TACK

04:52 - UP SIGNS FOR STEVENSON, YOU

04:55 - KNOW, ON -- ON WOOD CONSTRUCTION

04:57 - AREAS IN NEW YORK.

04:59 - WE DIDN'T HAVE MANY TREES.

05:03 - AND I REMEMBER, AS I RECOUNT IN

05:04 - THE BOOK, THE ONLY TIME I SAW

05:06 - HIM CRY IN THE ENTIRE 14 YEARS

05:09 - OF LIFE WE HAD TOGETHER WAS, WE

05:11 - WERE WALKING TO THE GROCERY

05:12 - STORE ON ELECTION NIGHT, 1952.

05:15 - I WAS 8.

05:17 - AND THERE WAS -- WE HAD NO TV.

05:19 - THERE WAS TV, BUT WE DIDN'T HAVE

05:21 - TV YET.

05:24 - AND WE WALKED TO THE GROCERY

05:25 - STORE AROUND 9:00 OR 9:15, AND

05:28 - ON THE RADIO...

05:31 - THE ANNOUNCER SAID, "IT LOOKS

05:32 - LIKE GENERAL EISENHOWER IS

05:34 - CARRYING ENOUGH STATES NOW TO BE

05:35 - ASSURED OF BEING THE NEXT

05:37 - PRESIDENT.

05:38 - AND WE WALKED HOME ABOUT 2 1/2

05:40 - BLOCKS IN THE DARK AND THE COLD,

05:43 - AND FOR THE FIRST AND LAST TIME

05:45 - DURING MY 14 YEARS OF LIFE WITH

05:47 - MY DAD, I SAW TEARS ROLLING DOWN

05:50 - HIS -- HIS CHEEKS.

05:52 - I NEVER SAW THAT AGAIN, NOT AT

05:53 - FUNERALS OF RELATIVES OR

05:55 - ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

05:57 - HE CRIED THAT NIGHT, AND I SAID

06:00 - ALSO IN THE BOOK THAT OF ALL THE

06:01 - THINGS I'VE DONE -- AND, OF

06:02 - COURSE, I WAS 14 WHEN HE DIED,

06:05 - SO HE NEVER LIVED TO SEE ME DO

06:06 - ANY OF THEM -- BUT DISTRICT

06:08 - ATTORNEY, MAYOR, GOVERNOR, THE

06:10 - THING THAT WOULD'VE IMPRESSED

06:12 - HIM THE MOST WAS BEING CHAIRMAN

06:14 - OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY.

06:16 - IT WOULD'VE BLOWN HIS MIND THAT

06:18 - HIS SON WOULD'VE BEEN CHAIRMAN

06:20 - OF HIS BELOVED DEMOCRATIC PARTY,

06:22 - WOULD'VE BEEN ASKED BY THE

06:23 - PRESIDENT TO DO THAT.

06:25 - AND MY DAD WOULD'VE LOVED

06:27 - PRESIDENT CLINTON, TOO, SO IT

06:28 - WOULD'VE BEEN JUST MIND-BOGGLING

06:30 - TO HIM.

06:31 - BUT THOSE ARE MY EARLY

06:33 - MEMORIES -- SPORTS, POLITICS,

06:34 - AND, AGAIN, THIS WONDERFUL IRISH

06:36 - NURSE WHO I SAW UP UNTIL, YOU

06:41 - KNOW, SHE PASSED AWAY.

06:42 - I WOULD GO TO NEW YORK AND LOOK

06:44 - HER UP AND FIND HER WHEREVER SHE

06:46 - WAS LIVING, AND SHE KNEW THAT I

06:48 - GOT ELECTED...

06:50 - DISTRICT ATTORNEY AND MAYOR, AND

06:52 - MY MOM LIVED TO SEE DISTRICT

06:53 - ATTORNEY AND MAYOR.

06:55 - DIDN'T LIVE TO SEE ME ELECTED

06:57 - GOVERNOR, BUT SHE DID.

07:01 - SO, THOSE ARE MY MEMORIES --

07:03 - SPORTS...

07:06 - SPORTS, POLITICS, AND MAY --

07:07 - MAY BURGEN.

07:08 - >> WHAT'D YOUR DAD DO FOR A

07:09 - LIVING?

07:10 - >> HE WAS A CONVERTER IN THE

07:11 - TEXTILE INDUSTRY.

07:12 - WHAT A CONVERTER DOES -- AND

07:14 - IT'S A BRUTAL JOB.

07:15 - A CONVERTER IS THE MIDDLEMAN.

07:18 - MY GUESS IS, THERE ARE PROBABLY

07:19 - NO CONVERTERS TODAY, BUT WHAT

07:21 - THE CONVERTER WOULD DO IS, A

07:25 - MANUFACTURER WOULD ORDER FROM

07:27 - THE CONVERTER 10 BOLTS OF IRISH

07:30 - LINEN.

07:31 - AND THEY WANTED SIX OF THOSE

07:33 - BOLTS KELLY GREEN, TWO BRIGHT

07:36 - YELLOW, AND TWO CRIMSON.

07:39 - IT WAS A CONVERTER'S JOB TO

07:41 - ORDER THE BOLTS OF LINEN FROM

07:43 - THE FACTORY, TO GET THEM FROM

07:45 - THE FACTORY, SEND THEM OUT TO

07:48 - THE DYE...

07:51 - PLACE WHERE THE DYEING WAS DONE,

07:53 - GET THEM BACK FROM THE DYE

07:54 - PLACE, AND GET THEM TO THE

07:57 - SPORTSWEAR MANUFACTURER ON TIME.

07:59 - THE KEY WAS ON TIME.

08:01 - SO, I REMEMBER GOING DOWN TO MY

08:02 - DAD'S BUSINESS.

08:03 - HE HAD AN OFFICE HARDLY BIGGER

08:05 - THAN THIS OFFICE THAT I HAVE

08:07 - NOW, AND THERE WERE SOME DESKS,

08:09 - BUT MOSTLY, THERE WERE JUST

08:11 - THESE BIG BOLTS OF LINEN AND OF

08:13 - WOOL UP AGAINST THE WALL 'CAUSE

08:15 - THEY WERE CONSTANTLY BRINGING

08:16 - THEM IN FROM THE FACTORY,

08:18 - SHIPPING THEM OUT TO THE DYER,

08:19 - GETTING THEM BACK FROM THE DYER,

08:21 - SHIPPING THEM TO THE MANU-- THE

08:24 - SPORTSWEAR OR THE CLOTHING

08:25 - MANUFACTURER, AND IT WAS A VERY

08:28 - HIGH-PRESSURE JOB BECAUSE THE

08:32 - KEY WAS GETTING THEM THERE ON

08:34 - TIME, AND THERE WERE MANY THINGS

08:36 - THAT COULD GO WRONG.

08:37 - THE PEOPLE WHO MANUFACTURED THE

08:40 - ACTUAL CLOTH ITSELF COULD'VE

08:42 - BEEN LATE.

08:43 - THE DYER COULD'VE BEEN LATE.

08:46 - SO IT WAS A HIGH-PRESSURE

08:47 - BUSINESS.

08:48 - YOU WERE ALWAYS FIGHTING TO MEET

08:50 - A DEADLINE.

08:50 - I THINK IT CONTRIBUTED TO MY

08:52 - DAD'S EARLY DEATH, JUST THE

08:54 - PRESSURE OF THE BUSINESS.

08:56 - WHAT I WROTE IN THE BOOK...

08:59 - WHAT...

09:00 - FIRST TIME I EVER SEEN HIM, I

09:02 - KNEW WHAT A TERRIFIC PERSON MY

09:03 - DAD WAS.

09:04 - I MEAN, I ALWAYS BELIEVED THAT

09:06 - BECAUSE I SAW THE WAY HE TREATED

09:08 - PEOPLE AND WHATEVER, BUT WHEN HE

09:10 - DIED, THE BUSINESS DIED WITH

09:12 - HIM.

09:12 - THERE WAS NO BUSINESS.

09:13 - >> HE WAS THE OWNER?

09:14 - >> HE WAS THE OWNER, AND HE WAS

09:17 - THE SOLE EXECUTIVE IN THE

09:19 - BUSINESS.

09:19 - HE HAD SIX EMPLOYEES.

09:21 - THEY WERE MOSTLY

09:22 - AFRICAN-AMERICAN AND HISPANIC.

09:25 - AND ALL MEN 'CAUSE THEY WERE

09:27 - LIFTING THESE BIG BOLTS.

09:30 - AND THE BUSINESS SHUT DOWN

09:31 - IMMEDIATELY, BUT ALL SIX CAME TO

09:33 - HIS FUNERAL, EVEN THOUGH THEY

09:34 - KNEW THAT THEY WOULDN'T BE

09:36 - WORKING ANYMORE, ET CETERA,

09:38 - BECAUSE HE ALWAYS TREATED

09:39 - PEOPLE -- HE WAS THE BEST.

09:41 - HE TREATED -- AND...

09:43 - AND IT WAS FUNNY.

09:45 - MY BROTHER AND I WERE NEVER

09:46 - RAISED IN FORMAL RELIGION.

09:48 - WE DIDN'T GO TO SUNDAY SCHOOL.

09:50 - WE WEREN'T BAR MITZVAHED.

09:52 - WE NEVER LEARNED HEBREW.

09:55 - AND MY DAD EXPLAINED IT TO US

09:56 - WHEN WE WERE YOUNGER.

09:57 - HE SAID TO US...

09:59 - "WE'RE NOT GONNA SEND YOU TO

10:00 - ORGANIZED RELIGION.

10:02 - YOU KNOW, THERE ARE A LOT OF --

10:04 - THERE'S A LOT OF PHONINESS IN

10:05 - ORGANIZED RELIGION.

10:07 - AND HE SAID SOMETHING WHICH I

10:08 - REPEATED ONCE AT A DINNER.

10:10 - I WAS BEING HONORED BY A JEWISH

10:12 - ORGANIZATION, AND I WAS TRYING

10:14 - TO EXPLAIN...

10:16 - MY SENSE OF IDENTITY AS A JEW.

10:19 - I THINK I DID A PRETTY LOUSY JOB

10:20 - 'CAUSE I QUOTED MY DAD.

10:22 - HE SAID THESE WE WEREN'T RAISED

10:23 - IN FORMAL TRAINING IS, SOME OF

10:26 - THE MEN -- AND THESE WERE

10:28 - BUSINESS ASSOCIATES, I'M SURE,

10:30 - WHO HAD PROBABLY CROSSED HIM --

10:32 - HE SAID, "SOME OF THE MEN WHO

10:33 - SPEND THE LONGEST TIME IN SHUL,"

10:36 - WHICH IS A WORD FOR SYNAGOGUE,

10:38 - "AND SHUL ON SATURDAY ARE THE

10:39 - BIGGEST CROOKS FROM MONDAY TO

10:41 - FRIDAY."

10:43 - I WAS USING THAT IN THE CONTEXT

10:44 - TO EXPLAIN WHY WE WERE NEVER

10:46 - FORMALLY EDUCATED IN RELIGIOUS

10:48 - TRAINING AS JEWS BUT THAT I

10:50 - STILL FELT A STRONG IDENTITY AS

10:52 - A JEW, AND MY FATHER SAID,

10:53 - "REMEMBER YOU'RE A JEW.

10:54 - DO EVERYTHING YOU CAN TO HELP

10:56 - JEWISH CAUSES," AND I THINK I'VE

10:58 - LIVED UP TO THAT IN LIFE, BUT

10:59 - WHEN I SAID THAT AT THE DINNER,

11:01 - THE ONLY THING THAT WAS IN THE

11:02 - JEWISH EXPONENT, THE JEWISH

11:04 - NEWSPAPER IN PHILADELPHIA, WAS

11:06 - THAT I HAD CALLED PEOPLE THAT

11:07 - WENT TO SYNAGOGUE CROOKS.

11:10 - OY, YOU KNOW?

11:11 - BUT...

11:14 - BUT THAT WAS ESSENTIALLY WHAT HE

11:17 - BELIEVED, AND HE SAID TO US -- I

11:19 - REMEMBER DISTINCTLY.

11:20 - HE SAID REMEMBER THAT WE WERE

11:22 - JEWS, AND HE SAID, "AS FAR AS

11:24 - GOD'S CONCERNED, FOLLOW THE

11:25 - GOLDEN RULE, AND YOU'LL BE IN

11:27 - GOOD SHAPE.

11:27 - DO UNTO OTHERS AS YOU WOULD HAVE

11:29 - THEM DO TO YOU."

11:30 - HE SAID, "IF YOU FOLLOW THAT AND

11:31 - IF THAT BECOMES THE GUIDING

11:33 - FORCE IN YOUR LIFE, GOD WILL --

11:36 - GOD WILL TAKE CARE OF YOU."

11:38 - AND I'VE TRIED TO LIVE THAT WAY

11:39 - IN EVERYTHING THAT I'VE DONE.

11:41 - >> WHAT WAS YOUR DAD LIKE TO BE

11:42 - AROUND, PERSONALITY?

11:43 - >> OH, HE WAS FUN.

11:45 - HE WAS NOT A BIG MAN.

11:46 - I GUESS HE WAS AROUND 6 FEET,

11:48 - MAYBE EVEN A LITTLE SMALLER, BUT

11:51 - A STRONG MAN, BROAD.

11:53 - AND HE WAS ALWAYS FUN, AND HE

11:55 - WAS ALWAYS DOING SURPRISES.

11:57 - AND ANOTHER MEMORY I HAVE FROM

11:59 - MY CHILDHOOD WAS, LIKE, FAIRLY

12:01 - CLOSE, MAYBE A YEAR BEFORE HE

12:03 - DIED OR EVEN LESS.

12:06 - I WAS HAVING A TOUGH TIME

12:08 - STUDYING FOR AN EXAM AT SCHOOL,

12:10 - AND IT WAS A SUNDAY NIGHT.

12:12 - AND HE ALWAYS COOKED.

12:13 - MY MOTHER [CHUCKLES] NEVER

12:15 - COOKED.

12:16 - HE COOKED WHEN WE HAD A COOK,

12:18 - BUT WHEN THE COOK WAS OFF, HE

12:20 - WOULD COOK, AND THAT HAPPENED

12:21 - EVERY SUNDAY NIGHT.

12:23 - AND THEN HE DECIDED TO GO OUT

12:24 - FOR ICE CREAM, AND HE SAID TO ME

12:27 - AND MY BROTHER, "WHAT FLAVORS DO

12:29 - YOU WANT?"

12:30 - AND I REMEMBER DISTINCTLY

12:32 - SAYING, "IT DOESN'T MATTER.

12:33 - YOU PICK.

12:35 - YOU KNOW, I KNOW YOU'LL PICK,"

12:36 - NOT THE RIGHT THING, "BUT I KNOW

12:38 - YOU'LL PICK SOMETHING GOOD."

12:39 - I HAD SUPREME CONFIDENCE IN MY

12:41 - FATHER, THAT I THOUGHT HE COULD

12:43 - DO ANYTHING, YOU KNOW?

12:45 - AND HIS DEATH WAS VERY HARD.

12:48 - LESS HARD FOR MY BROTHER, WHO

12:50 - WAS AWAY AT PRINCETON.

12:51 - IT WAS HIS FRESHMAN YEAR, AND I

12:53 - THINK HE WAS CAUGHT UP IN

12:54 - COLLEGE AND IMMERSED HIMSELF IN

12:56 - COLLEGE, AND HE HADN'T BEEN WITH

12:58 - MY DAD ON A DAILY BASIS.

12:59 - I WAS ALL THE WAY UP TO -- TO

13:02 - THE DAY HE DIED, AND IT WAS

13:05 - VERY, I MEAN, EXTREMELY

13:06 - TRAUMATIC FOR ME.

13:07 - WE HAD BREAKFAST TOGETHER.

13:09 - HE ALWAYS MADE BREAKFAST FOR US

13:11 - 'CAUSE, AGAIN, THAT WAS BEFORE

13:12 - THE COOK CAME IN.

13:14 - AND I LEFT TO GET ON THE SCHOOL

13:17 - BUS, AND HE WENT OUT TO HAIL A

13:19 - CAB...

13:21 - AND DIED OF A MASSIVE HEART

13:22 - ATTACK AS THE CAB WAS PULLING

13:24 - UP.

13:25 - AND IT'S AMAZING.

13:27 - I REMEMBER THEY CALLED ME AT

13:29 - SCHOOL...

13:31 - AROUND 10:00, 10:30 AND SAID,

13:35 - "CALL HOME.

13:38 - THERE'S...

13:40 - THERE'S A PROBLEM."

13:41 - AND I CALLED HOME, AND I GOT MY

13:43 - UNCLE SYDNEY, WHO WAS A GREAT

13:44 - GUY.

13:45 - AND I THOUGHT IT STRANGE THAT HE

13:46 - WAS IN MY HOUSE.

13:48 - AND HE SAID, "YOUR DAD IS SICK.

13:49 - YOU NEED TO COME HOME."

13:51 - AND I KNEW RIGHT AWAY THAT HE

13:53 - WAS DEAD.

13:54 - AND...

13:57 - I DIDN'T WANT TO FACE...

14:00 - THAT.

14:00 - SO I STAYED IN SCHOOL, I WENT TO

14:02 - BASKETBALL PRACTICE, AND THEN

14:04 - WHEN I CAME HOME, I GOT OFF THE

14:06 - SUBWAY.

14:07 - I TOOK THE SUBWAY HOME.

14:08 - I WENT TO THE CORNER...

14:13 - IT WASN'T A DRUGSTORE, LIKE

14:14 - NOVELTY STORE.

14:15 - HAD A SODA FOUNTAIN, AND I HAD

14:18 - AN ICE-CREAM SODA 'CAUSE I KNEW

14:21 - WHAT WAS WAITING FOR ME WHEN I

14:22 - CAME HOME, AND -- AND...

14:25 - THE WHOLE FAMILY WAS THERE, AND

14:27 - THEY TOLD ME THAT HE DIED, BUT I

14:28 - KNEW.

14:29 - I JUST KNEW.

14:31 - AND...

14:32 - THAT PRECEDED...

14:35 - I HAD...

14:36 - I WAS...

14:38 - 14, 15.

14:39 - I WAS A SOPHOMORE IN HIGH

14:41 - SCHOOL.

14:41 - I WAS YOUNG FOR MY GRADE.

14:44 - AND I ACTED UP IN SCHOOL THE

14:47 - REST OF THE YEAR, AND BY JUNE,

14:49 - THEY ASKED -- THEY DIDN'T KICK

14:50 - ME OUT, BUT THEY ASKED ME NOT TO

14:52 - RETURN.

14:53 - AND THAT WAS ALSO TRAUMATIC

14:54 - 'CAUSE THESE WERE MY FRIENDS,

14:56 - AND I'D GONE TO THAT SCHOOL

14:57 - SINCE THE 5th GRADE, AND HERE I

14:59 - WAS A SOPHOMORE IN HIGH SCHOOL.

15:01 - SO I WENT TO ANOTHER PRIVATE

15:03 - SCHOOL IN NEW YORK, AND I WAS

15:05 - DETERMINED TO GET BACK TO MY

15:08 - SCHOOL FOR MY SENIOR YEAR TO

15:09 - GRADUATE WITH MY FRIENDS, SO I

15:11 - REALLY BUCKLED DOWN, I GOT GREAT

15:13 - MARKS, AND, YOU KNOW, GREAT

15:16 - REVIEWS FROM THE TEACHERS, AND I

15:18 - GOT BACK INTO THE SCHOOL THAT

15:21 - HAD ASKED ME TO LEAVE.

15:23 - IT WAS A SCHOOL CALLED

15:24 - RIVERDALE -- RIVERDALE COUNTRY

15:25 - DAY SCHOOL -- AND I CAME BACK AS

15:27 - A SENIOR, AND I GRADUATED WITH

15:29 - MY CLASSMATES.

15:30 - AND THEN A FEW YEARS LATER -- I

15:32 - GUESS MORE THAN A FEW YEARS

15:34 - LATER -- I GRADUATED IN '61.

15:37 - AND I WAS GOVERNOR, SO IT HAD TO

15:39 - BE LIKE 2000 -- 40 YEARS LATER,

15:42 - THEY ASKED ME TO COME BACK AND

15:44 - BE THE SPEAKER AT THEIR 100th

15:45 - GRADUATING CLASS.

15:47 - AND I DIDN'T TELL THE KIDS THAT

15:48 - I HAD GOTTEN THROWN OUT.

15:50 - I THOUGHT THAT THAT WOULD COME

15:51 - WILL ILL GRACE, BUT I THOUGHT IT

15:53 - WAS SORT OF DELICIOUS IRONY THAT

15:55 - THEY HAD ASKED ME TO LEAVE AND

15:56 - THEN THEY ASKED ME TO COME BACK

15:58 - TO SPEAK AT THEIR 100th.

16:00 - >> WHAT'D YOU DO TO GET THROWN

16:02 - OUT?

16:02 - >> OH...

16:05 - DISRUPTIVE IN CLASS.

16:07 - I REMEMBER WE, THE STUDENTS,

16:09 - WAITED ON TABLES IN THE

16:10 - CAFETERIA, AND I THINK I

16:13 - SEMI-ACCIDENTALLY DUMPED A

16:15 - PLATTER OF TUNA FISH ON THIS

16:16 - TEACHER THAT I DIDN'T LIKE,

16:18 - THINGS LIKE THAT, BUT A SERIES

16:20 - OF THEM, ENOUGH THAT THEY

16:22 - DECIDED I WAS TOO MUCH OF A

16:23 - DISRUPTIVE FORCE, AND IN PRIVATE

16:25 - SCHOOL, YOU KNOW, THEY DON'T

16:26 - KEEP ANYBODY AROUND WHO'S

16:28 - SLIGHTLY DISRUPTIVE.

16:31 - >> TELL ME ABOUT YOUR MOM.

16:33 - >> WELL, MY MOM WAS A BEAUTIFUL,

16:35 - BEAUTIFUL, BEAUTIFUL WOMAN AND

16:38 - HAD AN INCREDIBLE...

16:41 - I'LL SHOW YOU SOME PICTURES OF

16:43 - MY MOM, BUT SHE WAS STUNNING,

16:44 - AND SHE HAD A VERY...

16:47 - HEIGHTENED FASHION SENSE, SO SHE

16:49 - BECAME A DESIGNER.

16:51 - HER -- HER SISTER, STELLA -- MY

16:54 - MOM'S NAME WAS EMMA -- STELLA

16:57 - [CHUCKLES] WAS THE DESIGNER

17:00 - FOR -- MY MOM'S FAMILY HAD A

17:02 - BUSINESS CALLED SLOAT SKIRTS --

17:04 - S-L-O-A-T.

17:05 - VERY FAMOUS.

17:06 - IT WAS PERHAPS THE PREMIER

17:07 - SPORTSWEAR MANUFACTURER IN

17:09 - AMERICA.

17:09 - MY AUNT STELLA, WHO WAS THE

17:11 - PRIMARY DESIGNER, USED TO

17:15 - PROVIDE SPORTSWEAR FOR

17:16 - JACKIE KENNEDY.

17:17 - SHE WON THE SPORTS ILLUSTRATED

17:18 - AWARD AS THE BEST SPORTSWEAR

17:20 - DESIGNER OF THE YEAR.

17:22 - STELLA WAS A FABULOUS DESIGNER.

17:24 - MY MOM WAS GOOD, NOT QUITE AS

17:26 - GOOD AS STELLA.

17:27 - SHE WAS SORT OF A SECONDARY

17:28 - DESIGNER FOR THE COMPANY, AND

17:30 - THEN SHE WENT OUT AND WORKED FOR

17:31 - OTHER COMPANIES.

17:32 - SO SHE WORKED A LOT.

17:34 - SHE WAS INCREDIBLY FASHIONABLE,

17:35 - ALWAYS DRESSED TO THE NINES.

17:39 - AND -- AND A VERY NICE WOMAN,

17:41 - AND AS...

17:43 - AFTER MY DAD DIED, OVER THE

17:45 - COURSE OF TIME, MY BROTHER AND I

17:46 - BECAME CLOSER TO HER.

17:48 - WHEN MY DAD WAS ALIVE, SHE WAS

17:49 - SORT OF SECONDARY, BUT WE BECAME

17:51 - CLOSER TO HER, AND SHE WAS A

17:52 - WOMAN OF GREAT SPIRIT AND -- AND

17:55 - GOOD SENSE OF HUMOR.

17:58 - AND SHE NEVER REMARRIED, AND SHE

18:00 - COULD'VE BECAUSE WHEN MY DAD

18:01 - DIED, SHE WAS 48 AND STILL VERY

18:04 - ATTRACTIVE, AND SHE JUST NEVER

18:06 - WANTED TO.

18:09 - BUT SHE WAS VERY FASTIDIOUS.

18:11 - I REMEMBER WE HAD A DOG WHEN I

18:13 - WAS YOUNG BY THE NAME OF

18:14 - MIDNIGHT.

18:15 - MIDNIGHT WAS A BLACK COCKER

18:17 - SPANIEL, AND MY MOTHER WAS VERY

18:19 - FASTIDIOUS ABOUT OUR HOME.

18:21 - YOU KNOW, YOU COULDN'T GET...

18:24 - DIRT ON THE COUCHES AND STUFF IN

18:26 - THE LIVING ROOM.

18:27 - IN FACT, THE KIDS -- WE WERE

18:29 - SORT OF...

18:31 - NOT ALLOWED TO GO INTO THE

18:32 - LIVING ROOM.

18:33 - AND A LOT OF THE TIMES, THE

18:34 - FURNITURE WAS COVERED WITH

18:35 - PLASTIC.

18:37 - AND ONE DAY, MIDNIGHT MUST'VE

18:39 - EATEN SOMETHING THAT DIDN'T

18:40 - AGREE WITH HIM, AND HE THREW UP

18:41 - ALL OVER THE LIVING ROOM.

18:43 - THE NEXT DAY, MIDNIGHT WAS SENT

18:44 - OUT TO LONG ISLAND -- TO A

18:46 - FAMILY IN LONG ISLAND.

18:48 - MIDNIGHT GOT THE HOOK, AND THAT

18:50 - WAS PRETTY TRAUMATIC FOR US.

18:52 - BUT, AGAIN, BECAUSE MY DAD DIED,

18:54 - I GOT TO KNOW MY MOTHER MUCH

18:56 - BETTER THAN HAD HE LIVED FOR A

18:58 - LONG TIME, AND BY THE TIME, MY

19:01 - MOM DIED -- MY MOM DIED WHEN SHE

19:02 - WAS 80...

19:04 - 89 -- BY THE TIME SHE DIED, BOTH

19:07 - MY BROTHER AND I HAD A GOOD

19:09 - RELATIONSHIP WITH MY MOM, AND

19:10 - JESSE GOT TO -- TO GROW UP AND

19:13 - SPEND TIME WITH HER AND -- MIDGE

19:16 - DID.

19:16 - IN FACT, WHEN MY MOM WAS -- THIS

19:17 - IS A GREAT STORY.

19:19 - MY MOM WAS SO MUCH INTO FASHION

19:23 - THAT THE FIRST TIME I EVER

19:24 - BROUGHT MIDGE HOME TO NEW YORK,

19:25 - WE HAD A GUEST ROOM, AND MIDGE

19:26 - STAYED IN THE GUEST ROOM.

19:27 - WE CAME IN, SAID HELLO TO MY

19:29 - MOTHER, TALKED TO MY MOTHER FOR

19:30 - A WHILE, AND THEN WE WENT OUT TO

19:32 - DO WHATEVER WE WERE GONNA DO IN

19:33 - NEW YORK.

19:34 - WE COME BACK IN.

19:35 - MIDGE GOES TO SLEEP IN THE GUEST

19:37 - ROOM.

19:37 - I GO IN TO SAY GOODNIGHT TO MY

19:39 - MOTHER, AND SHE SAID, "EDDIE" --

19:41 - SHE ALWAYS CALLED ME "EDDIE" UP

19:42 - TILL THE DAY THAT SHE DIED --

19:44 - SHE SAID, "EDDIE, SHE'S A NICE

19:45 - GIRL," AND I SAID, "I KNOW THAT,

19:46 - MOTHER."

19:47 - SHE SAID, "AND SHE'S A VERY

19:48 - PRETTY GIRL."

19:49 - I SAID, "I KNOW THAT, MOTHER."

19:50 - SHE SAID, "AND SHE HAS VERY GOOD

19:52 - FASHION SENSE," AND I SAID,

19:53 - "WELL, DID YOU LIKE THE DRESS

19:54 - SHE WAS WEARING?"

19:55 - SHE SAID, "THAT WAS NICE, BUT I

19:57 - WENT INTO THE CLOSET AND SAW THE

19:58 - LABELS, AND SHE HAD

20:00 - JOAN LESLEY," AND THEN SHE

20:01 - RIPPED OFF THE NAME OF A FEW

20:04 - PROMINENT DESIGNERS, AND I

20:06 - DIDN'T TELL MIDGE THAT STORY

20:08 - UNTIL AFTER WE WERE MARRIED, AND

20:09 - SHE WAS SOMEWHAT OUTRAGED BUT

20:11 - NOT REALLY 'CAUSE SHE HAD GOTTEN

20:13 - TO KNOW MY MOTHER AND THEY GOT

20:15 - ALONG GREAT.

20:17 - >> WHERE'D YOU LIVE?

20:18 - >> WE LIVED ON THE WEST SIDE OF

20:19 - MANHATTAN IN A VERY NICE

20:22 - APARTMENT BUILDING.

20:23 - IT WAS 90 RIVERSIDE DRIVE, 81st.

20:28 - THAT 90 WAS THE -- THE NUMBER,

20:31 - BUT IT WAS ON 81st AND

20:32 - RIVERSIDE DRIVE, NOT FAR FROM

20:34 - GRANT'S TOMB.

20:35 - IT WAS A WONDERFUL PLACE TO GROW

20:37 - UP BECAUSE RIVERSIDE PARK WAS

20:39 - RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET -- I

20:40 - MEAN, LITERALLY ACROSS THE

20:42 - STREET.

20:43 - AND THE MEMORIAL DAY PARADE USED

20:44 - TO COME UP RIVERSIDE DRIVE.

20:46 - DOESN'T ANYMORE BUT USED TO COME

20:47 - UP RIGHT UNDERNEATH OUR WINDOW.

20:49 - WE LIVED ON THE 11th FLOOR.

20:51 - WE HAD A BEAUTIFUL, PANORAMIC

20:52 - VIEW OF NEW JERSEY.

20:53 - I MEAN, WE GREW UP FAIRLY

20:54 - WELL-TO-DO.

20:57 - AND JUST WAS A GREAT...

21:00 - GREAT, GREAT PLACE TO LIVE.

21:03 - MY MOM LIVED THERE -- THEY HAD

21:05 - LIVED THERE -- WHEN I WAS BORN,

21:07 - THEY WERE AT 90 RIVERSIDE DRIVE,

21:10 - SO THAT WAS THE ONLY PLACE I

21:11 - KNEW TILL I WENT TO COLLEGE, AND

21:13 - THEN WITH MY DAD DEAD AND MY

21:15 - BROTHER AT PRINCETON AND ME AT

21:16 - PENN, MY MOM DECIDED THAT A BIG

21:19 - APARTMENT DIDN'T MAKE ANY SENSE

21:21 - FOR HER, AND SHE ALSO SAID, "THE

21:23 - WEST SIDE IS GOING DOWN.

21:25 - HELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S CHANGING."

21:27 - AND I LAUGHED BECAUSE THE PEOPLE

21:31 - WHO RENTED OUR APARTMENT AFTER

21:32 - WE LEFT WERE THE FAMOUS

21:35 - ACTOR/SINGER ELI WALLACH AND HIS

21:38 - WIFE, ANN JACKSON, WHO WAS A

21:39 - GREAT, GREAT ACTRESS.

21:42 - AND THEY LIVED THERE.

21:43 - THE BUILDING EVENTUALLY TURNED

21:45 - CONDOMINIUM, AND THEY BOUGHT THE

21:46 - APARTMENT.

21:48 - AND I'D NEVER MET ELI WALLACH,

21:49 - BUT THE YEAR THAT I WAS

21:51 - DEMOCRATIC CHAIRMAN IN 2000,

21:54 - ELI WALLACH PERFORMED AT ONE OF

21:55 - OUR FUND RAISERS.

21:57 - AND I WENT TO HIM BEFORE THE

21:59 - FUND RAISER AND SAID,

22:01 - "MR. WALLACH, I'D ED RENDELL.

22:02 - I'M THE CHAIRMAN OF THE PARTY.

22:04 - IT'S A PLEASURE TO MEET YOU --

22:06 - 11G."

22:08 - AND HE SAID, "HOW DID YOU KNOW?"

22:11 - I SAID, "WE WERE THE FAMILY THAT

22:12 - HAD THE APARTMENT BEFORE YOU

22:14 - GUYS DID -- 11G."

22:16 - I ALWAYS REMEMBER 11G.

22:17 - I DON'T KNOW WHY.

22:18 - I DON'T REMEMBER MY PHONE

22:19 - NUMBER.

22:20 - IT WAS TRAFALGAR 7 -- THAT'S ALL

22:22 - I KNOW.

22:23 - IN THOSE DAYS, PHONE NUMBERS, AS

22:25 - WAS TRUE IN PHILADELPHIA, HAD

22:27 - NAMES, BUT IT WAS TRAFALGAR 7

22:28 - SOMETHING, BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER

22:30 - THAT, BUT I WILL NEVER FORGET

22:31 - 11G.

22:32 - I CAN CLOSE MY EYES AND SEE THE

22:35 - INTERIOR OF THE BUILDING TODAY.

22:39 - I ALWAYS THOUGHT OF...

22:41 - I WOULD LOVE TO GO UP AND TAKE A

22:42 - LOOK AT 11G.

22:44 - I THINK ELI WALLACH'S STILL

22:46 - ALIVE.

22:46 - I'M PRETTY SURE HE IS.

22:49 - AND ANN JACKSON.

22:49 - THEY'RE PROBABLY STILL THERE,

22:51 - BUT I'VE NEVER HAD THE GUTS TO

22:52 - GO UP AND ASK TO SEE THE

22:54 - APARTMENT, BUT I CAN CLOSE MY

22:56 - EYES AND REMEMBER THE APARTMENT

22:57 - VERY WELL.

22:58 - >> DID YOU HAVE YOUR OWN ROOM OR

22:59 - YOU SHARE WITH YOUR BROTHER?

23:02 - >> I SHARED WITH MY BROTHER.

23:05 - AND I HAVE SOME VIVID MEMORIES.

23:06 - IN 1900...

23:09 - '51 WAS THE MIRACLE GIANTS.

23:12 - THEY WERE 13 1/2 GAMES BEHIND

23:14 - THE DODGERS ON AUGUST 1st, AND

23:17 - THEY MADE AN INCREDIBLE RUN, AND

23:19 - THEY TIED THE DODGERS AT THE END

23:20 - OF THE SEASON, AND THERE WAS A

23:22 - PLAYOFF.

23:22 - AND THE GIANTS WON THE FIRST

23:24 - GAME.

23:24 - THE DODGERS WON THE SECOND.

23:26 - THE THIRD GAME WAS AT THE

23:27 - POLO GROUNDS, AND MY FATHER

23:30 - BROUGHT ONE TICKET, AND HE WENT

23:32 - TO THE GAME, AND THE GIANTS FELL

23:34 - BEHIND 4-1, AND...

23:38 - AT THE END OF THE SEVENTH

23:39 - INNING, MY FATHER LEFT AND WENT

23:40 - TO WORK.

23:41 - HE THOUGHT THAT THEY WERE DONE

23:42 - 'CAUSE THE DODGERS HAD THIS...

23:45 - HAD A GREAT PITCHING STAFF.

23:47 - WELL, THAT WAS THE FAMOUS NINTH

23:49 - INNING WHERE THE GIANTS RALLIED

23:50 - AND SCORED FOUR RUNS TO WIN, AND

23:52 - BOBBY THOMPSON HIT THE SHOT

23:55 - HEARD 'ROUND THE WORLD, AND

23:56 - THERE WAS THE FAMOUS CALL BY THE

23:58 - GIANTS RADIO ANNOUNCER,

23:59 - RUSS HODGES.

24:01 - "THE GIANTS WIN THE PENNANT!

24:02 - THE GIANTS WIN THE PENNANT!

24:03 - GIANTS WIN THE PENNANT!"

24:04 - WE HAD TV BY THEN.

24:06 - OR DID WE HAVE TV?

24:08 - YEAH, I THINK WE HAD A LITTLE

24:10 - TV, AND MY BROTHER AND I WERE SO

24:11 - NERVOUS, WE WERE LISTENING TO

24:13 - THE GAME ON RADIO.

24:14 - WE COULDN'T BEAR TO WATCH IT ON

24:16 - TV.

24:17 - AND MY MOTHER WAS PLAYING -- SHE

24:19 - WAS HOME THAT DAY.

24:21 - I DON'T WHY SHE WASN'T AT WORK.

24:22 - SHE WAS PLAYING CANASTA.

24:24 - AND SHE WAS PLAYING CANASTA WITH

24:26 - HER GIRLFRIENDS, AND THEY HAD

24:28 - THESE SILLY PAJAMAS THAT THEY

24:29 - ALL WORE FOR THEIR CANASTA GAME,

24:31 - AND THIS WAS THE MIDDLE OF THE

24:33 - AFTERNOON.

24:34 - AND WHEN THOMPSON HIT THE HOME

24:36 - RUN, WE WANTED TO SEE HIM ROUND

24:38 - THE BASES, SO WE RAN STRAIGHT

24:40 - THROUGH THE -- THE ROOM WHERE MY

24:42 - MOTHER WAS.

24:43 - WE ALMOST KNOCKED THE TABLE OVER

24:45 - TO GET INTO THE DINING ROOM TO

24:46 - TURN ON THE TV IN TIME TO SEE

24:48 - THE -- BOBBY THOMPSON CIRCLE THE

24:50 - BASES.

24:51 - SO, YEAH.

24:53 - >> YOU WERE A GIANTS FAN, NOT A

24:55 - DODGERS FAN OR YANKEES FAN?

24:56 - >> NO, NO, WE WERE GIANTS FANS,

24:57 - AND, INTERESTINGLY, IF YOU WERE

24:59 - A GIANTS FAN IN BASEBALL, YOU

25:01 - HATED THE DODGERS, AND YOU HATED

25:03 - THE YANKEES.

25:04 - SO WHEN THE GIANTS AND DODGERS

25:06 - LEFT TO GO TO SAN FRANCISCO AND

25:08 - LOS ANGELES, WE HAD NO ONE TO

25:09 - ROOT FOR.

25:10 - THE METS DIDN'T COME IN FOR

25:11 - ANOTHER FIVE YEARS, AND BY THAT

25:12 - TIME, I WAS DOWN IN

25:13 - PHILADELPHIA.

25:16 - SO, I DECIDED TO ROOT FOR THE

25:17 - AMERICAN LEAGUE TEAM THAT HAD

25:19 - THE BEST CHANCE TO BEAT THE

25:21 - YANKEES, AND IT WAS THE

25:23 - CHICAGO WHITE SOX.

25:25 - THEY HAD...

25:27 - CHICO CARRASQUEL, NELLIE FOX,

25:29 - BILLY PIERCE.

25:31 - THEY HAD A WONDERFUL TEAM.

25:33 - THEY WERE CALLED THE "GO-GO

25:35 - SOX."

25:35 - THEY STOLE A LOT OF BASES.

25:36 - THEY DIDN'T HAVE A LOT OF POWER.

25:38 - SO, I DECIDED TO ROOT FOR THEM.

25:40 - FIRST YEAR I ROOTED FOR THEM,

25:41 - 1959, THEY WON THE PENNANT!

25:44 - THEY PLAYED THE DODGERS IN THE

25:46 - WORLD SERIES, LOST TO THE

25:47 - DODGERS, BUT THEY WON THE

25:48 - PENNANT.

25:49 - I THOUGHT, "BOY, THIS IS GREAT."

25:51 - THEY DIDN'T WIN ANOTHER PENNANT

25:53 - FOR 46 YEARS.

25:54 - >> [ LAUGHS ]

25:55 - >> AND THEN IN 2005, THEY WON

25:57 - THE PENNANT AND WENT ON TO SWEEP

25:59 - THE WORLD SERIES, BEATING

26:00 - HOUSTON FOUR GAMES TO NOTHING,

26:02 - AND, IRONICALLY, I HAD GOTTEN TO

26:04 - KNOW THE OWNER OF THE WHITE SOX,

26:06 - JERRY REINSDORF...

26:08 - WHO ACTUALLY GREW UP IN

26:10 - BROOKLYN.

26:10 - HE WAS A BROOKLYN DODGER FAN

26:12 - WHEN HE WAS A KID, WENT TO

26:13 - CHICAGO, INVESTED IN REAL

26:14 - ESTATE, MADE A LOT OF MONEY,

26:16 - BOUGHT THE WHITE SOX, AND IN

26:18 - 2000, WHEN I WAS DEMOCRATIC

26:19 - CHAIRMAN, I GOT TO KNOW HIM.

26:21 - HE WAS A SUPPORTER OF

26:23 - VICE-PRESIDENT GORE'S, AND WE'VE

26:25 - BECOME GOOD FRIENDS, AND TO THIS

26:26 - DAY, I WATCH, OF COURSE, THE

26:28 - PHILLIES, BUT I WATCH THE

26:29 - WHITE SOX IN THE AMERICAN

26:31 - LEAGUE.

26:31 - I HAVE MLB TICKETS, SO I CAN

26:33 - WATCH ALL THEIR GAMES, AND JERRY

26:35 - AND I WILL TEXT EACH OTHER FOUR

26:37 - OR FIVE TIMES DURING THE GAME.

26:39 - YOU KNOW, IT'S THE FUNNIEST

26:41 - THING, AND SOME OF HIS TEXTS ARE

26:43 - GREAT.

26:44 - THE WHITE SOX WERE LEADING THE

26:45 - LEAGUE FOR MOST OF THE LAST

26:47 - SEASON, AND THEN THE TIGERS

26:48 - CAUGHT THEM IN THE STRETCH, AND

26:50 - THE WHITE SOX HAD A BAD CLOSE,

26:51 - AND THEY WERE 4-11 IN THEIR LAST

26:53 - 15 GAMES, AND THERE WAS ONE GAME

26:55 - WHERE THE SOX WERE UP IN THIS

26:56 - STRETCH, AND THEY WERE BLOWING

26:58 - THE LEAD, AND I GOT A TEXT FROM

27:00 - JERRY, AND ALL IT SAID IS, "I

27:01 - CAN'T BREATHE."

27:02 - [ BOTH LAUGH ]

27:03 - I THOUGHT THAT SAID IT ALL.

27:04 - >> WHEN YOU WERE A KID FOLLOWING

27:05 - THE GIANTS, HOW DID YOU FOLLOW

27:06 - THEM?

27:07 - YOU LISTENED TO THE GAMES ON THE

27:08 - RADIO, READ THE PAPERS?

27:09 - >> WE LISTENED TO THE GAMES ON

27:10 - THE RADIO, READ THE PAPERS

27:11 - ASSIDUOUSLY.

27:12 - I KNEW THE BOX SCORE.

27:13 - OH, YEAH, I WAS BOX-SCORE GEEK

27:14 - EVEN BACK THEN, AND THEN WHEN

27:16 - THEY WERE IN, AS MUCH AS I SAID

27:18 - I WOULDN'T FOLLOW THEM WHEN THEY

27:20 - WERE IN SAN FRANCISCO, A

27:22 - NEW YORK STATION RE-CREATED THE

27:24 - GAMES, AND BY RE-CREATING, THEY

27:27 - DIDN'T HAVE AN ANNOUNCER OUT

27:28 - THERE, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE A

27:30 - TICKER, AND THE ANNOUNCER WOULD

27:32 - SAY, YOU KNOW, "AND

27:34 - WILLIE McCOVEY'S UP, AND HE HITS

27:36 - A LINE DRIVE DOWN THE," AND THEY

27:38 - WOULD HIT SOMETHING, IT WOULD BE

27:39 - THE SOUND OF A BAT HITTING THE

27:41 - BALL, BUT IT WAS CLEARLY A

27:42 - RE-CREATION, AND THEY'D HAVE

27:43 - PHONY FAN CHEERING.

27:45 - BUT WE LISTENED TO THAT FOR A

27:47 - WHILE BUT THEN EVENTUALLY JUST

27:48 - LOST ANY CONNECTION WITH THE

27:50 - BASEBALL GIANTS.

27:52 - >> DID YOU HAVE HATS AND -- AND

27:55 - PENNANTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT,

27:56 - SOUVENIRS, MEMORABILIA?

27:57 - >> OF THE GIANTS? SURE.

27:58 - >> STILL HAVE ANY OF IT?

27:59 - >> NO, LONG GONE.

28:01 - LONG GONE.

28:03 - I REMEMBER I HAD A FAVORITE

28:05 - GIANTS FOOTBALL PLAYER, AND I

28:07 - HAD FAVORITE BASEBALL PLAYERS,

28:09 - BUT NO MEMORABILIA.

28:12 - IT'S ALL GONE.

28:12 - >> WHO WERE YOUR FAVORITE

28:13 - PLAYERS?

28:14 - >> WELL, EDDIE PRICE WAS A

28:14 - FULLBACK FOR THE GIANTS WHO WAS

28:16 - GREAT.

28:17 - HE WAS TERRIFIC, AND I LOVED

28:18 - HIM.

28:20 - AND, OF COURSE, WILLIE MAYS WAS

28:23 - MY FAVORITE FOR THE BASEBALL

28:24 - GIANTS, AND WILLIE MAYS WAS A

28:26 - ROOKIE THAT FABULOUS YEAR IN

28:27 - 1951.

28:28 - THAT WAS HIS ROOKIE YEAR.

28:30 - >> YOU EVER GET TO MEET ANY OF

28:31 - THEM?

28:32 - >> NO, THE GIANTS OF THAT ERA --

28:33 - OH, I MET WILLIE MAYS WAY LATER.

28:35 - WHEN I WAS MAYOR, I THINK, I MET

28:37 - WILLIES MAYS, YEAH.

28:38 - HE WAS DOING SOME STUFF DOWN IN

28:39 - ATLANTIC CITY.

28:41 - I GOT TO MEET HIM BUT NOT WHEN

28:42 - THEY WERE CONTEMPORARIES.

28:44 - >> TELL ME ABOUT SCHOOL.

28:46 - YOU -- YOU WENT TO PRIVATE

28:47 - SCHOOL FROM 4th GRADE ON?

28:48 - >> YEAH, I WENT TO PUBLIC SCHOOL

28:50 - "K" THROUGH 4, PS-9, A COUPLE OF

28:51 - BLOCKS FROM WHERE I LIVED.

28:53 - >> YOU REMEMBER ANYTHING ABOUT

28:54 - THAT?

28:54 - >> YEAH, I REMEMBER MY 4th GRADE

28:56 - ENGLISH TEACHER WAS A...

28:58 - TOUGH S.O.B. BY THE NUMBER OF

29:00 - MR. MURPHY, AND HE WAS -- HE WAS

29:04 - BRUTAL ON US, BUT HE TAUGHT US,

29:06 - BOY, WE LEARNED GRAMMAR AND

29:08 - SPELLING.

29:09 - YOU KNOW?

29:11 - BECAUSE HE WAS SO TOUGH ON US,

29:12 - WE LEARNED UNBELIEVABLY WELL,

29:14 - BUT WE WERE SCARED.

29:15 - WE WERE SCARED.

29:16 - HE WOULD YELL AT US, AND WE WERE

29:18 - SCARED.

29:19 - >> DID YOU GET GOOD GRADES?

29:21 - >> I GOT DECENT GRADES.

29:24 - I NEVER WAS -- IN SCHOOL...

29:28 - I NEVER GOT -- MY GRADES WERE

29:30 - NEVER REFLECTIVE OF MY BOARD

29:32 - SCORES.

29:34 - AND THAT WAS TRUE THROUGH PENN.

29:36 - I REMEMBER WHEN I WAS GRADUATING

29:39 - MY SENIOR YEAR AT PENN, I WENT

29:41 - TO APPLY TO PENN LAW SCHOOL.

29:42 - I HAD AN INTERVIEW WITH A MAN BY

29:44 - THE NAME OF BILL SHANE, WHO WAS

29:45 - THE DEAN OF PENN LAW SCHOOL.

29:47 - THIS IS ALSO AN INTERESTING

29:49 - STORY.

29:50 - AND BILL SHANE WAS A FUNNY DEAN.

29:52 - HE WOULD HANG OUT WITH THE GUYS

29:53 - AT SMOKEY JOE'S, SO WE GOT TO

29:55 - KNOW HIM, BUT I WENT IN FOR MY

29:56 - INTERVIEW, AND HE SAID, "LOOK,

29:57 - I'M GONNA BE STRAIGHT WITH YOU.

29:59 - THERE'S GOOD NEWS AND BAD NEWS."

30:01 - I SAID, "WHAT'S THE GOOD NEWS?"

30:03 - HE SAID, "WELL, WE TAKE 10 PENN

30:06 - UNDERGRADS A YEAR IN OUR CLASS

30:08 - AT PENN LAW SCHOOL."

30:09 - THE CLASS HAS EXPANDED SINCE, SO

30:10 - I'M SURE THEY TAKE MORE THAN 10,

30:12 - BUT IN THOSE DAYS, THEY TOOK 10.

30:14 - HE SAID, "AND THE GOOD NEWS IS,

30:16 - YOU HAVE THE SECOND HIGHEST LOW

30:17 - BOARDS."

30:18 - I GOT A 710 OR 715 ON MY LAW

30:20 - BOARDS.

30:20 - I SAID, "OH, THAT'S GREAT,

30:22 - SECOND HIGHEST, SO I'M GONNA GET

30:24 - IN."

30:24 - HE SAID, "NO."

30:25 - HE SAID, "THE BAD NEWS IS, THERE

30:27 - ARE...

30:29 - I THINK 211 KIDS FROM PENN

30:33 - APPLIED TO PENN LAW SCHOOL."

30:35 - I HAD THE SECOND HIGHEST BOARD

30:36 - SCORES.

30:37 - I HAD LIKE THE 202nd HIGHEST

30:38 - CUMULATIVE AVERAGE.

30:40 - [ CHUCKLES ]

30:40 - SO I DIDN'T GET INTO PENN.

30:43 - SO, THE CLOSEST I DID TO

30:46 - PERFORMING AT THE LEVEL THAT MY

30:48 - BOARD SCORES SHOULD'VE

30:50 - INDICATED, I PERFORMED.

30:51 - I WENT TO VILLANOVA LAW SCHOOL,

30:52 - AND I DID WELL AT VILLANOVA LAW

30:54 - SCHOOL.

30:54 - >> WHEN YOU WERE LIVING IN AN

30:56 - APARTMENT AND YOU WERE A LITTLE

30:57 - KID, WERE THERE OTHER KIDS IN

30:58 - THE NEIGHBORHOOD, OTHER KIDS IN

31:00 - THE BUILDING YOU PLAYED WITH?

31:01 - >> SO, ONE PROBLEM WITH GROWING

31:03 - UP IN MANHATTAN AND LIVING IN AN

31:04 - APARTMENT BUILDING...

31:06 - THERE ARE NO STREETS FOR YOU TO

31:07 - RIDE BIKES WITH, YOU KNOW?

31:10 - AND IT'S INTERESTING.

31:12 - WHEN JESSE WAS BORN, WE LIVED IN

31:14 - WARDEN DRIVE IN EAST FALLS.

31:17 - AND BECAUSE OF THE NATURE OF

31:18 - WARDEN DRIVE, THE HOUSES WEREN'T

31:20 - CLOSE TO EACH OTHER.

31:21 - THE SIDEWALKS WEREN'T VERY...

31:24 - THERE WAS VERY LITTLE OF THAT,

31:26 - BUT, FORTUNATELY, JESSE GOT THAT

31:27 - DOWN AT THE SHORE WHERE

31:29 - EVERYTHING'S FLAT AT THE SHORE,

31:31 - AND WHEN WE -- WHEN JESSE WAS

31:33 - BORN AND WE HAD A HOUSE ON

31:35 - 50th STREET, AND THERE WERE...

31:38 - 10 KIDS ON THE BLOCK WHO WERE

31:40 - JESSE'S AGE OR ONE OR TWO YEARS

31:43 - CLOSE TO JESSE'S AGE, AND THOSE

31:45 - KIDS HAVE BECOME, IN SOME WAYS,

31:49 - LIFELONG FRIENDS, WHEREAS VERY

31:50 - FEW -- A FEW FROM THIS SCHOOL

31:53 - BECAME HIS LIFELONG FRIENDS BUT

31:54 - NOT AS MANY AS DOWN AT THE SHORE

31:56 - 'CAUSE WE DIDN'T HAVE -- AND I

31:57 - CERTAINLY DIDN'T HAVE THAT

31:59 - LIVING IN AN APARTMENT BUILDING.

32:00 - >> DID YOU PLAY SPORTS WHEN YOU

32:01 - WERE LITTLE.

32:03 - >> I PLAYED ALL -- BASKETBALL,

32:05 - BASEBALL, AND FOOTBALL, AND I

32:07 - WAS...

32:09 - I WAS -- I NEVER STARTED IN ANY

32:12 - SPORT.

32:12 - I WAS A PITIFUL BASEBALL PLAYER.

32:16 - THE ONLY THING I COULD DO AT

32:17 - BASEBALL WELL IS I TAUGHT MYSELF

32:18 - HOW TO BUNT, SO THAT BECAME A

32:20 - VALUABLE COMMODITY.

32:21 - >> THIS IS FOR SCHOOL TEAMS?

32:23 - >> YEAH, FOR MY HIGH-SCHOOL

32:24 - TEAMS.

32:26 - FOOTBALL -- I WAS A LINEMAN, BUT

32:28 - I WAS 165 AND NOT VERY FAST, AND

32:32 - THE ONLY THING I DID WELL THERE

32:34 - IS, WE HAD A COMPLICATED SYSTEM.

32:37 - WE PLAYED AN UNBALANCED LINE.

32:38 - I WENT TO A GREAT FOOTBALL

32:39 - SCHOOL.

32:40 - WE WON 55 STRAIGHT GAMES.

32:41 - I -- MY TEAM NEVER LOST A GAME.

32:44 - NOTHING TO DO WITH ME.

32:45 - WE HAD CALVIN HILL.

32:47 - THE ORIGINAL CALVIN HILL WENT ON

32:49 - TO STAR AT YALE AND THEN STAR IN

32:50 - THE DALLAS COWBOYS, SO WE NEVER

32:52 - LOST A GAME.

32:53 - CALVIN JUST DOMINATED.

32:55 - BUT WE HAD A COMPLICATED

32:56 - OFFENSIVE SCHEME.

32:57 - WE PLAYED AN UNBALANCED LINE,

32:59 - INSIDE TACKLE, OUTSIDE TACKLE,

33:00 - AND THE INSIDE TACKLE HAD TO

33:02 - LEARN A LOT OF COMPLICATED

33:03 - BLOCKING SCHEMES.

33:05 - I WAS SMART ENOUGH THAT I

33:06 - LEARNED THEM, SO I WAS A BACKUP

33:08 - AND WOULD OCCASIONALLY GET IN TO

33:10 - PLAY FOOTBALL.

33:11 - THE SPORT THAT I HAD THE MOST

33:13 - TALENT IN WAS BASKETBALL, BUT MY

33:14 - TALENT WAS LIMITED TO SHOOTING.

33:16 - I WAS A VERY GOOD SHOOTER, AND

33:18 - TO THIS DAY, I CAN GET ON A FOUL

33:20 - LINE AND PROBABLY MAKE -- IN

33:22 - FACT, I'LL TELL YOU A STORY --

33:23 - AND I CAN PROBABLY MAKE IN GYM

33:26 - CLASS, I COULD MAKE 7 OUT OF 10

33:28 - FOUL SHOTS PRETTY EASILY, EVEN

33:29 - RIGHT NOW.

33:30 - BUT I COULDN'T RUN, AND I

33:31 - COULDN'T JUMP, SO THE ONLY TIME

33:33 - I GOT TO PLAY IN THE VARSITY WAS

33:35 - IF THE OTHER TEAM WAS PLAYING

33:37 - THE ZONE.

33:38 - OCCASIONALLY, I'D GET IN, AND

33:40 - THE COACH WOULD SAY, "GET IN

33:41 - THERE, AND IF YOU HAVE AN OPEN

33:43 - SHOT, SHOOT."

33:45 - BUT I, AGAIN, DIDN'T PLAY ALL

33:46 - THAT MUCH.

33:48 - FOR MY 50th BIRTHDAY, MY WIFE --

33:51 - MY WIFE, MIDGE, AND I WOULD GO

33:53 - WITH FOUR OR FIVE COUPLES FROM

33:55 - OUR UNDERGRADUATE DAYS.

33:56 - WE'D GO TO ALL PENN BASKETBALL

33:58 - GAMES AT THE PALESTRA, AND WE'D

33:59 - GO TO ALMOST EVERY GAME.

34:01 - AND MY 50th BIRTHDAY FELL ON A

34:03 - GAME NIGHT.

34:05 - AND WE'RE SITTING THERE,

34:06 - WATCHING THE GAME, AND THEN I

34:07 - HEAR AN ANNOUNCEMENT RIGHT

34:08 - BEFORE THE HALF.

34:09 - "WILL MAYOR RENDELL PLEASE COME

34:11 - DOWN TO THE SCORERS' TABLE AT

34:12 - HALFTIME?"

34:14 - I THOUGHT, "MAYBE THEY WANT ME

34:16 - TO CUT A RIBBON OR DO

34:17 - SOMETHING," SO I WENT DOWN

34:19 - THERE, AND MIDGE HAD ARRANGED

34:21 - FOR ME TO SHOOT FOUL SHOTS AT

34:23 - HALFTIME.

34:24 - AND SHE HAD GOTTEN 10 OF MY

34:26 - FRIENDS TO PLEDGE $100 FOR EVERY

34:28 - SHOT THAT I MADE OUT OF 10.

34:30 - SO IF I HAD MADE ALL 10 -- I

34:32 - THINK THERE WERE 10 FRIENDS -- I

34:34 - WOULD'VE GOTTEN $1,000 FOR, I

34:35 - THINK IT WAS FOR PENN ATHLETICS,

34:37 - BUT THERE WERE 5,000 PEOPLE IN

34:39 - THE PALESTRA.

34:40 - I WAS IN A SUIT AND TIE.

34:42 - I TOOK OFF MY JACKET, BUT I

34:44 - STILL WAS IN DRESS SHOES, YOU

34:46 - KNOW, AND EVERYONE'S STARING AT

34:47 - ME.

34:48 - I MISSED THE FIRST THREE,

34:50 - INCLUDING ONE AIR BALL.

34:52 - NO, I THINK TWO AIR BALLS, AND

34:54 - AT THAT POINT, I WAS READY TO

34:55 - KILL MY WIFE, BUT SOMEHOW I

34:57 - FOUND IT WITHIN ME.

34:58 - I WAS A GOOD-ENOUGH SHOOTER THAT

35:00 - I RALLIED.

35:00 - I MADE FIVE OUT OF THE LAST

35:02 - SEVEN, AND I GOT AN APPRECIATIVE

35:04 - ROUND OF APPLAUSE FROM THE --

35:06 - FROM THE -- FROM THE CROWD.

35:09 - BUT IT WAS A SCARY MOMENT.

35:11 - I THINK I WAS AS FRIGHTENED

35:12 - THERE AS ANYTIME IN MY PUBLIC

35:14 - LIFE.

35:14 - SO, I HAVE TO FAST-FORWARD AND

35:16 - TELL YOU A STORY.

35:17 - WHEN DAVID COHEN LEFT THE

35:18 - MAYOR'S OFFICE...

35:20 - DAVID ALSO LOVED PENN AND, YOU

35:22 - KNOW, ET CETERA, AND IS NOW

35:23 - CHAIRMAN OF THE BOARD AT PENN AS

35:24 - YOU KNOW.

35:25 - SO, WE HAD A FAREWELL PARTY, AND

35:27 - EVERYONE WANTED TO COME TO

35:28 - DAVID'S FAREWELL PARTY.

35:30 - WE HAD HIS FAREWELL PARTY ON THE

35:31 - FLOOR OF THE PALESTRA.

35:33 - AND I HAD ARRANGED THE SAME TYPE

35:35 - OF SURPRISE FOR DAVID.

35:36 - HE WAS GONNA SHOOT 10 FOUL

35:38 - SHOTS.

35:39 - AND I THINK WE HAD ALL PITCHED

35:40 - IN MONEY.

35:41 - WE'RE GONNA GIVE MONEY TO

35:42 - CHARITY, AND DAVID IS A GOOD

35:45 - ATHLETE.

35:46 - I MEAN, YOU KNOW, PROBABLY -- WE

35:50 - NEVER DISCUSS WHETHER HE PLAYED

35:51 - IN HIGH SCHOOL AND COLLEGE, BUT

35:53 - HE HAS GOOD HAND-EYE

35:53 - COORDINATION.

35:54 - FOR EXAMPLE, HE WAS AN EXCELLENT

35:55 - HITTER IN SOFTBALL.

35:57 - JUST WOULD CRUSH THE BALL, AND,

35:58 - YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO HAVE GOOD

36:00 - HAND-EYE COORDINATION TO DO

36:01 - THAT.

36:02 - SO I ASSUMED DAVID WOULD DO

36:03 - REASONABLY WELL ON THE FOUL

36:05 - LINE.

36:05 - HE MISSED ALL 10.

36:07 - IT WAS THE MOST PAINFUL THING

36:08 - I'VE EVER WATCHED.

36:09 - I FELT HORRIBLE THAT I HAD

36:11 - SUBJECTED IT TO HIM 'CAUSE HIS

36:13 - KIDS WERE THERE, YOU KNOW, AND,

36:15 - YOU KNOW, KIDS -- KIDS ALWAYS

36:16 - THINK THEIR FATHER AND MOTHER

36:18 - WALK ON WATER, AND HERE [LAUGHS]

36:21 - >> [ CHUCKLES ]

36:22 - >> HE MISSED ALL 10.

36:24 - IT WAS HORRIBLE.

36:25 - I-I -- IT'S ONE OF THE GREAT

36:26 - REGRETS I HAVE IN MY LIFE THAT I

36:28 - FORCED DAVID TO DO THAT, BUT I

36:30 - JUST ASSUMED 'CAUSE HE WAS SUCH

36:32 - A GOOD HITTER IN SOFTBALL

36:34 - THAT -- AND IF YOU HEAR DAVID

36:35 - TELL IT, THEY WERE ALL PRETTY

36:37 - CLOSE, AND I DON'T HE SHOT ANY

36:39 - AIR BALLS, SO, BUT THAT WAS

36:42 - HORRIBLE.

36:43 - SO, I ENJOYED SPORTS.

36:46 - AND, YOU KNOW, LIKE EVERY LITTLE

36:48 - KID, WHEN I WAS 5 OR 6, I WANTED

36:49 - TO BE A PROFESSIONAL ATHLETE.

36:51 - WHEN I WAS ABOUT 10 OR 11, I

36:53 - REALIZED I WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH TO

36:54 - BE A PROFESSIONAL ATHLETE, THEN

36:56 - I WANTED TO BE A SPORTS

36:57 - ANNOUNCER.

36:59 - THEN I REALIZED MY VOICE SORT OF

37:01 - SUCKS, SO I COULDN'T BE A SPORTS

37:03 - ANNOUNCER, SO I DECIDED TO LOOK

37:04 - FOR SOMETHING ELSE.

37:06 - >> WERE YOU MUCH OF A READER?

37:08 - >> YEAH, I LIKED TO READ, BUT I

37:09 - WANTED TO READ WHAT I WANTED TO

37:11 - READ.

37:11 - YOU KNOW, I READ STUFF THAT I

37:13 - WAS INTERESTED IN A LOT MORE

37:15 - THAN -- I MEAN, I READ MY

37:16 - SCHOOLWORK, BUT I WAS AN AVID

37:19 - READER OF ADVENTURE STUFF.

37:21 - I WAS AN AVID OF BOOKS ABOUT

37:23 - SPORTS, YOU KNOW THINGS LIKE

37:25 - THAT.

37:25 - YEAH, I ENJOYED READING, AND TO

37:28 - THIS DAY, I MEAN, I FORGET -- I

37:30 - THINK I WAS IN COLLEGE.

37:31 - I READ "THE LORD OF THE RINGS"

37:34 - TRILOGY, AND, YOU KNOW, I LOVE

37:35 - TO READ.

37:36 - EVEN AS GOVERNOR AND MAYOR, ONE

37:40 - OF MY GREAT REGRETS AS MAYOR AND

37:41 - GOVERNOR IS, I HAVE SO MUCH

37:44 - WORK-RELATED MATERIAL TO READ

37:45 - THAT I REALLY STOPPED READING

37:47 - BOOKS 'CAUSE I JUST DIDN'T HAVE

37:49 - TIME, BUT I WAS DESPERATE TO

37:51 - READ "TEAM OF RIVALS," ONE,

37:53 - 'CAUSE DORIS KEARNS GOODWIN IS A

37:55 - FRIEND OF MINE, AND, TWO,

37:56 - BECAUSE IT WAS -- EVERYONE SAID

37:58 - IT WAS AN INCREDIBLE BOOK.

38:00 - "TEAM OF RIVALS" WAS ALMOST 800

38:02 - PAGES.

38:02 - TOOK EIGHT MONTHS AS GOVERNOR TO

38:04 - READ "TEAM OF RIVALS," BUT I

38:05 - READ IT, AND I THINK THAT WAS

38:07 - THE ONLY BOOK I READ WHILE I WAS

38:08 - GOVERNOR.

38:10 - >> YOU -- YOU SAID YOU WENT TO

38:11 - PRIVATE SCHOOL AFTER 4th GRADE?

38:12 - >> YEAH, WENT TO -- AFTER 4th

38:15 - GRADE, MY PARENTS SENT ME TO A

38:16 - SCHOOL CALLED

38:17 - RIVERDALE COUNTRY DAY SCHOOL,

38:19 - AND I WAS THERE 5th GRADE

38:20 - THROUGH 12th WITH THE EXCEPTION

38:22 - OF 11th GRADE, MY JUNIOR YEAR.

38:24 - I HAD BEEN KICKED OUT, AND I

38:25 - WENT TO A PRIVATE SCHOOL CALLED

38:27 - McBURNEY, AND THERE'S EVEN A

38:29 - STORY THERE.

38:30 - AT McBURNEY, I DID VERY, VERY

38:31 - WELL NOT ONLY SCHOLASTICALLY BUT

38:34 - SOCIALLY, AND THEY PUT ME UP FOR

38:37 - STUDENT GOVERNMENT PRESIDENT.

38:39 - AND I HAD APPLIED BACK TO

38:41 - RIVERDALE, WHICH I HADN'T TOLD

38:42 - ANYBODY EXCEPT FOUR OR FIVE OF

38:44 - MY CLOSEST FRIENDS AT McBURNEY,

38:46 - BUT IF I DIDN'T GET INTO

38:48 - RIVERDALE, I TOLD I MIGHT LIKE

38:49 - TO BE STUDENT GOVERNMENT

38:50 - PRESIDENT.

38:51 - WELL, BEFORE THE ACTUAL VOTING,

38:54 - I WAS NOTIFIED THAT I -- THEY

38:55 - WERE GONNA TAKE ME BACK AT

38:57 - RIVERDALE, SO I ASKED MY FOUR OR

38:59 - FIVE, SIX CLOSEST FRIENDS TO

39:00 - VOTE FOR THE OTHER GUY 'CAUSE I

39:02 - DIDN'T WANT TO EMBARRASS THE

39:04 - SCHOOL, HAVE THE GUY ELECTED

39:05 - STUDENT GOVERNMENT PRESIDENT

39:07 - LEAVE, AND I THINK I LOST BY

39:09 - THREE OR FOUR VOTES, SO THAT WAS

39:11 - THE ONLY ELECTION I'VE EVER

39:13 - TRIED TO RIG SO I COULD LOSE,

39:16 - AND I DID.

39:16 - >> WHO WERE SOME OF YOUR FRIENDS

39:18 - IN SCHOOL?

39:22 - >> AT RIVERDALE?

39:24 - OH, MY.

39:25 - IT'S INTERESTING.

39:26 - WELL, MY BEST FRIEND, I THINK,

39:29 - AT RIVERDALE WAS A GUY BY THE

39:31 - NAME OF STEVE ROSENAK, WHO I

39:32 - LOST TRACK OF.

39:33 - I KNOW HE BECAME A PSYCHIATRIST,

39:35 - BUT I LOST TRACK OF HIM.

39:36 - HE WAS -- HE WAS A GREAT GUY.

39:38 - I WAS FRIENDS WITH ANOTHER GUY

39:40 - BY THE NAME OF LARRY ROSENBLUTH

39:41 - THAT I SEE OCCASIONALLY, AND

39:42 - THEN I WAS FRIENDS -- ONE OF THE

39:44 - THINGS ABOUT SPORTS IS, YOU

39:45 - BECOME FRIENDS WITH YOUR

39:46 - TEAMMATES, AND WE HAD A GREAT

39:48 - QUARTERBACK BY THE NAME OF --

39:49 - AND BASKETBALL PLAYER BY THE

39:50 - NAME OF PETE SEIGERT.

39:51 - HE WAS TERRIFIC.

39:54 - PAUL GLAZURE.

39:56 - HE WAS A GREAT FOOTBALL PLAYER,

39:58 - AND WE BECAME FRIENDS, AND

40:00 - ANDY KAHN, PROBABLY OF MY

40:02 - RIVERDALE CLASSMATES, HE ALSO

40:04 - FOLLOWED ME TO PENN.

40:05 - WE WERE VERY CLOSE.

40:07 - RICHARD BING -- VERY CLOSE.

40:09 - AND, INTERESTINGLY, MY RIVERDALE

40:12 - CLASSMATES...

40:14 - DID BETTER FOR ME AS A CANDIDATE

40:17 - THAN MY PENN CLASSMATES DID.

40:20 - I DON'T KNOW WHY, BUT MY

40:21 - RIVERDALE CLASSMATES BANDED

40:22 - TOGETHER AND REALLY GAVE ME A

40:24 - LOT OF FINANCIAL SUPPORT.

40:25 - SOME OF THEM WERE VERY

40:26 - SUCCESSFUL, MOST OF THEM IN

40:28 - NEW YORK.

40:28 - GOT A LOT OF FINANCIAL SUPPORT

40:30 - FROM THEM.

40:31 - MY PENN CLASSMATES TO SOME

40:32 - DEGREE, BUT I REMEMBER WHEN I

40:33 - WAS RUNNING FOR DISTRICT

40:35 - ATTORNEY -- I TELL THIS STORY IN

40:36 - THE BOOK, TOO -- I SENT OUT A

40:39 - FUND-RAISING LETTER TO MOST

40:41 - OF -- NOT MY CLASSMATES.

40:42 - I HAD LIKE 1,100 IN MY

40:43 - GRADUATING CLASS AT PENN.

40:45 - SO, I WENT THROUGH THE LIST, AND

40:47 - I PICKED OUT MAYBE THE 100 THAT

40:48 - I KNEW THE BEST.

40:49 - AND I SENT OUT A LIST SAYING I

40:51 - WAS RUNNING FOR D.A. AGAINST THE

40:52 - MACHINE.

40:53 - I NEEDED HELP.

40:53 - CAN YOU SEND A CHECK NO MATTER

40:55 - HOW BIG OR SMALL?

40:56 - I REALLY EXCITED ABOUT ONE OF

40:59 - THE 100.

40:59 - IT WAS A WOMAN BY THE NAME OF

41:01 - HEDDA TOWLER, AND WE CALLED HER

41:03 - "PEACHES."

41:03 - THAT WAS HER NICKNAME.

41:05 - SHE WAS FROM TEXAS, AND SHE

41:07 - WAS -- RUMOR WAS, SHE WAS FROM

41:09 - OIL MONEY.

41:11 - AND I ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT, IN

41:12 - COLLEGE, THAT PEACHES HAD A

41:14 - CRUSH ON ME.

41:16 - AND PEACHES WAS ATTRACTIVE.

41:18 - I DON'T KNOW WHY I NEVER WENT

41:19 - OUT WITH HER, BUT WE NEVER DID,

41:20 - BUT I ALWAYS THOUGHT SHE HAD A

41:22 - CRUSH ON ME.

41:23 - SO I SENT A LETTER TO HER AS I

41:25 - DID ANOTHER 100 CLASSMATES.

41:28 - AND I THOUGHT SHE HAD OIL MONEY,

41:30 - SO SHE WAS LIKELY TO WRITE US A

41:31 - BIG CHECK, AND I KEPT AFTER MY

41:33 - STAFF.

41:34 - I SAID, "ENVELOPE COME IN FROM

41:36 - H. TOWLER?" ET CETERA.

41:38 - FINALLY ONE DAY, AN ENVELOPE

41:39 - CAME IN FROM H. TOWLER.

41:41 - SO, NORMALLY, THE STAFF WOULD

41:42 - OPEN IT UP AND TELL ME WHAT WAS

41:44 - IN IT LATER, BUT I TOOK THE

41:46 - ENVELOPE AWAY, I RIPPED OPEN THE

41:47 - ENVELOPE, AND I SAW THERE WAS A

41:49 - CHECK IN IT.

41:50 - I LOOKED AT THE CHECK, AND I

41:52 - THOUGHT IT SAID $10,000, WHICH

41:55 - WOULD'VE BEEN HUGE.

41:56 - MY FIRST ELECTION, WE RAISED

41:58 - $57,000.

42:00 - THE MACHINE SPENT HALF A

42:01 - MILLION, AND OF THE $57,000,

42:04 - $20,000 WERE LOANS THAT MIDGE

42:05 - AND I HAD TAKEN OUT, SO WE

42:07 - REALLY ONLY RAISED $37,000, SO

42:09 - $10,000...

42:10 - THEN I LOOKED AGAIN. IT WAS $10.

42:13 - SO I REALIZED THAT SHE DIDN'T

42:14 - HAVE THAT BIG A CRUSH ON ME

42:16 - AFTER ALL.

42:16 - >> [ CHUCKLES ]

42:18 - ANY TEACHERS STAND OUT IN YOUR

42:20 - MIND FROM RIVERDALE?

42:21 - >> OH, YEAH.

42:21 - WELL, FROM RIVERDALE, AGAIN,

42:24 - NONE STAND OUT AS MUCH AS

42:26 - MR. MURPHY, MY 4th GRADE ENGLISH

42:28 - TEACHER IN PUBLIC SCHOOL.

42:30 - I HAD GOOD TEACHERS BUT NONE

42:32 - THAT I WOULD REMEMBER

42:33 - DISTINCTLY.

42:35 - I REMEMBER MY FOOTBALL COACH,

42:37 - FRANK BERTINO -- WAS A GREAT

42:38 - FOOTBALL COACH.

42:40 - BECAUSE WE WON 55 GAMES IN A

42:42 - ROW, HE WAS SOUGHT AFTER.

42:43 - HE HAD GOTTEN OFFERS FROM

42:45 - MICHIGAN TO BE OFFENSIVE

42:47 - COORDINATOR, YALE HEAD COACH.

42:49 - HE TURNED THEM ALL DOWN.

42:50 - HE LIVED ON CAMPUS, AND HE WAS A

42:52 - BEAR OF A GUY AND A GREAT COACH

42:54 - AND A GREAT PERSON, AS WELL.

42:56 - I REMEMBER ONCE, MIDGE AND I

42:58 - WENT UP...

43:00 - I SHOWED MIDGE RIVERDALE.

43:01 - SHE HAD NEVER SEEN IT, AND JESSE

43:03 - WAS LIKE...

43:05 - MUST'VE BEEN LIKE 6, 7 MONTHS

43:07 - OLD, BUT WE TOOK JESSE WITH US.

43:10 - AND COACH BERTINO HAPPENED TO BE

43:12 - INSIDE THE GYM, AND I SAID

43:13 - HELLO.

43:14 - I INTRODUCED HIM TO MIDGE.

43:15 - WE TALKED, AND THEN WE SHOWED

43:18 - HIM JESSE, AND HE TOOK JESSE,

43:21 - AND HIS HANDS WERE LIKE THREE

43:22 - TIMES THE SIZE OF MINE,

43:23 - COACH BERTINO.

43:24 - HE STOOD JESSE UP, AND JESSE

43:26 - HADN'T STOOD UP YET.

43:28 - HE STOOD JESSE UP IN HIS HANDS,

43:30 - AND HIS HANDS WERE SO BIG AND SO

43:32 - STRONG, HE BALANCED JESSE

43:33 - UPRIGHT IN HIS HANDS.

43:35 - I'LL NEVER FORGET THAT, AND

43:37 - COACH BERTINO WAS THE ONE WHO I

43:40 - STAYED IN CONTACT WITH AS I WENT

43:41 - THROUGH LIFE AND WHO MADE THE

43:43 - MOST IMPRESSION UPON ME AS A

43:45 - PERSON.

43:45 - HE WAS A GREAT FOOTBALL COACH,

43:47 - BUT HE ALSO TAUGHT US STUFF

43:50 - ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DIGGING IN AND

43:52 - WHEN YOU THINK YOU COULDN'T DO

43:53 - SOMETHING, JUST TRYING HARDER,

43:54 - AND YOU COULD GET IT DONE, AND

43:56 - HE TAUGHT US ABOUT TEAMWORK, YOU

43:57 - KNOW, THINGS THAT WERE ESSENTIAL

43:59 - TO ME LATER ON IN LIFE, WHICH IS

44:01 - WHY I'M SUCH A BELIEVER THAT ALL

44:03 - KIDS SHOULD PARTICIPATE IN

44:04 - SPORTS, WHETHER THEY'RE GOOD AT

44:06 - IT OR NOT SO GOOD AT IT 'CAUSE

44:07 - YOU DO LEARN SOMETHING.

44:08 - I MEAN, YOU LEARN TEAMWORK.

44:10 - YOU LEARN THAT YOU'RE NOT ALONE

44:11 - AND YOU CAN'T BE FOR YOURSELF

44:13 - ALONE.

44:14 - AND HE WAS A GREAT INFLUENCE ON

44:16 - MY LIFE, AND THEN IN LAW SCHOOL,

44:19 - I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT I WANTED TO

44:20 - BE WHEN I WENT TO LAW SCHOOL.

44:22 - I WENT TO LAW SCHOOL SORT OF AS

44:23 - A HOLDING PATTERN.

44:25 - THE WAR WAS RAGING IN VIETNAM.

44:26 - I HAD DONE WELL ENOUGH ON THE

44:28 - WAR BOARDS THAT I WAS EXEMPT AS

44:31 - LONG AS I WENT TO SOME

44:33 - EDUCATION.

44:34 - I THOUGHT I MIGHT WANT TO BE A

44:36 - LAWYER, BUT I WASN'T SURE.

44:38 - SO I WENT TO LAW SCHOOL, AND...

44:41 - IN LITERALLY THE FIRST DAY, I

44:43 - WENT TO CRIMINAL LAW, AND THE

44:44 - PROFESSOR WAS A MAN BY THE NAME

44:46 - OF DONALD GIANNELLA.

44:49 - AND HE WAS A LITTLE GUY, BUT HE

44:51 - WAS INSPIRING.

44:52 - HE WAS ABSOLUTELY INSPIRING.

44:54 - HE AND ANOTHER, OUR

44:55 - CONSTITUTIONAL LAW PROFESSOR BY

44:57 - THE NAME OF DON DOWD, BOTH WERE

44:59 - INSPIRING TEACHERS, AND BETWEEN

45:01 - THE TWO OF THEM, AFTER FOUR OR

45:04 - FIVE, SIX WEEKS, I WAS CONVINCED

45:06 - I WANTED TO PRACTICE CRIMINAL

45:07 - LAW AND I WANTED TO BE A

45:08 - PROSECUTOR.

45:11 - AND, YOU KNOW, I WENT FROM LAW

45:13 - SCHOOL TO -- IN LAW SCHOOL, I

45:15 - INTERNED, SUMMER-INTERNED IN THE

45:16 - D.A.'s OFFICE FOR ARLEN SPECTER.

45:18 - I WENT OUT OF LAW SCHOOL, GOT A

45:20 - JOB AS AN ASSISTANT D.A., AND

45:24 - SEVEN YEARS AFTER I GRADUATED

45:25 - FROM LAW SCHOOL, I GOT ELECTED

45:27 - DISTRICT ATTORNEY.

45:28 - AND, UNFORTUNATELY,

45:31 - PROFESSOR GIANNELLA DIED OF

45:32 - LEUKEMIA, BUT I INVITED

45:36 - MRS. GIANNELLA, HIS WIFE, TO

45:37 - COME TO MY SWEARING IN AS

45:38 - DISTRICT ATTORNEY, AND I TOLD

45:40 - THE STORY HOW HE WAS THE ONE --

45:43 - HE WAS SO INSPIRING IN CLASS.

45:44 - HE MADE CRIMINAL LAW SO VIVID

45:46 - AND SO EXCITING THAT I KNEW

45:48 - WITHIN SIX WEEKS THAT I WANTED

45:49 - TO BE A LAWYER AND THAT I WANTED

45:51 - TO PRACTICE CRIMINAL LAW AND I

45:52 - WANTED TO BE A PROSECUTOR.

45:54 - AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S A SHAME,

45:55 - AGAIN, HE NEVER LIVED TO SEE ME

45:57 - GET ELECTED D.A.

45:58 - HE WOULD'VE GOTTEN A HUGE KICK

45:59 - OUT OF THAT, TOO.

46:01 - >> WANT TO ASK YOU ABOUT

46:02 - RIVERDALE JUST A LITTLE BIT

46:03 - MORE.

46:03 - HOW DID YOU GET TO SCHOOL EVERY

46:04 - DAY.

46:05 - >> WELL, WHEN I WAS YOUNGER,

46:06 - TOOK THE SCHOOL BUS.

46:07 - RIVERDALE GOT A LOT OF ITS KIDS

46:09 - FROM MANHATTAN.

46:09 - IT WAS A BOARDING SCHOOL, TOO.

46:11 - ABOUT 1/4 OF THE STUDENTS

46:12 - BOARDED.

46:14 - AND A LOT OF THEM WERE FOREIGN

46:15 - STUDENTS.

46:19 - BUT WE TOOK THE BUS EVERY DAY.

46:21 - I TOOK THE BUS LITERALLY UNTIL

46:23 - MY SENIOR YEAR WHEN I STARTED

46:25 - TAKING THE SUBWAY, BUT EVEN AS A

46:27 - SOPHOMORE AND A FRESHMAN, IF I

46:29 - STAYED LATE FOR FOOTBALL OR

46:31 - BASKETBALL PRACTICE, THE BUS

46:33 - WOULD'VE ALREADY GONE.

46:34 - SO I TOOK THE SUBWAY HOME, AND I

46:36 - LEARNED A LOT ABOUT THE NEW YORK

46:39 - SUBWAYS.

46:39 - SUBWAY RAN ALL THE WAY -- WE HAD

46:41 - TO TAKE A BUS TO GET TO THE

46:43 - SUBWAY BECAUSE THE SUBWAY ENDED

46:45 - AT 242nd STREET.

46:46 - RIVERDALE WAS ABOUT

46:47 - 251st STREET, AND THEN WE'D GET

46:50 - ON THE ELEVATED, AND THEN WE'D

46:51 - GO DOWN AND EVENTUALLY GO

46:53 - UNDERGROUND AND DROP YOU VERY

46:56 - CLOSE TO WHERE I LIVE.

46:58 - I REMEMBER ONE YEAR AS, I THINK,

47:01 - A FRESHMAN...

47:04 - I'D TAKE THE BUS, OR SOMEBODY

47:06 - DROPS ME.

47:07 - I THINK THE COACH DROPPED ME AT

47:09 - THE SUBWAY, AND I GOT OUT, AND

47:11 - I...

47:12 - COACH LEFT.

47:14 - AND I CHECKED, AND FOR SOME

47:15 - REASON, I DIDN'T HAVE ANY MONEY.

47:17 - AND THERE WERE NO CELLPHONES.

47:19 - I DIDN'T HAVE MONEY TO MAKE A

47:21 - PHONE CALL, AND I REMEMBER EVEN

47:24 - AS A FRESHMAN IN HIGH SCHOOL, I

47:27 - WAS STANDING THERE, AND I WAS

47:29 - FRUSTRATED, AND I STARTED TO

47:31 - CRY.

47:31 - I WAS 13 YEARS OLD, AND I

47:33 - STARTED TO CRY, AND THIS VERY

47:35 - NICE MAN CAME BY...

47:38 - AND SAID, "WHAT'S WRONG, SON?"

47:39 - AND I TOLD HIM.

47:41 - AND I JUST ASKED HIM FOR A DIME

47:42 - TO MAKE A PHONE CALL.

47:44 - HE SAID, "NO."

47:45 - HE SAID -- WHATEVER THE SUBWAY

47:46 - FARE WAS THEN, 50 CENTS OR

47:48 - WHATEVER, HE GAVE IT TO ME, AND

47:50 - I WENT HOME, AND I ALWAYS

47:51 - REMEMBERED THAT, SO I'VE ALWAYS

47:53 - BEEN INCLINED WHEN SOMEONE HITS

47:56 - ME UP -- AND SINCE I'VE BECAME

47:59 - RECOGNIZABLE, PEOPLE HIT ME UP

48:00 - ALL THE TIME FOR MONEY.

48:02 - LIKE, A GUY HIT ME UP AT THE

48:04 - 30th STREET STATION IN

48:05 - PHILADELPHIA.

48:07 - HE SAID, "I'M TRYING TO GET HOME

48:09 - TO SEE MY MOM, AND I CAME UP

48:12 - HERE, AND EVEN THE JERSEY

48:14 - TRANSIT IS $42.

48:16 - I DON'T HAVE ANYWHERE NEAR THAT.

48:18 - CAN YOU HELP ME OUT?"

48:19 - AND I KNEW THERE WAS A CHANCE

48:21 - THAT HE WAS JUST...

48:23 - B.S.-ING AND HE WAS GONNA TAKE

48:25 - THE MONEY FOR DRUGS OR SOMETHING

48:26 - OR WHATEVER, BUT JUST IN CASE HE

48:29 - WAS TELLING ME THE TRUTH, I GAVE

48:30 - HIM $10, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE I

48:32 - REMEMBERED, AND I ALWAYS

48:33 - REMEMBER THAT MAN -- ALWAYS

48:35 - REMEMBER.

48:35 - I NEVER KNEW HIS NAME OR

48:36 - ANYTHING, BUT I ALWAYS

48:37 - REMEMBERED HIM.

48:37 - >> WHEN YOU WERE A KID, DID YOU

48:39 - EXPLORE THE CITY MUCH WITH

48:40 - FRIENDS, LIKE, JUST GO OUT AND

48:41 - TRAVEL AROUND?

48:41 - >> OH, YEAH.

48:43 - YOU KNOW, WE WERE GREAT

48:44 - EXPLORERS AND, AGAIN, GOT TO USE

48:46 - THE SUBWAY, AND THE NEW YORK

48:48 - SUBWAY, JUST LIKE THE

48:49 - PHILADELPHIA SUBWAY, SO GOOD IN

48:51 - TERMS OF MOVING YOU AROUND.

48:53 - IT WAS EASY TO EXPLORE, AND, YOU

48:55 - KNOW, WE WENT OUT TO

48:56 - ATLANTIC BEACH, AND I GOT TO

48:58 - KNOW WESTCHESTER.

49:00 - OF COURSE, RIVERDALE WAS NEAR

49:02 - FORDHAM.

49:02 - IT WAS NEAR WHERE COLUMBIA

49:04 - PLAYED ITS FOOTBALL GAMES.

49:06 - I REMEMBER SPENDING SOME TIME UP

49:08 - ON THE COLUMBIA CAMPUS.

49:09 - NO, WE WENT EVERYWHERE --

49:10 - EVERYWHERE.

49:10 - IT'S THE NATURE OF BEING A

49:12 - NEW YORKER.

49:12 - WE DIDN'T HAVE A CAR.

49:15 - OCCASIONALLY, WHEN WE WOULD GO

49:17 - OUT TO THE BEACH, WE'D GET LIFTS

49:19 - BY OTHER FAMILIES, OR

49:20 - OCCASIONALLY MY FATHER WOULD

49:21 - RENT A CAR, BUT WE NEVER HAD A

49:23 - CAR.

49:23 - HE NEVER HAD A CAR.

49:24 - MOTHER NEVER HAD A CAR.

49:25 - WE NEVER HAD A CAR.

49:26 - SO I NEVER LEARNED TO DRIVE.

49:28 - I NEVER LEARNED TO DRIVE, AND I

49:30 - WENT TO COLLEGE, AND BY THAT

49:31 - TIME, OUR DAD HAD DIED, MY

49:33 - MOTHER'S FAMILY WAS PAYING FOR

49:34 - MY TUITION, BUT I HAD LESS

49:36 - SPENDING MONEY THAN MY ROOMMATE,

49:37 - WHO WAS A SCHOLARSHIP BASKETBALL

49:39 - PLAYER, SO I COULDN'T AFFORD A

49:41 - CAR.

49:41 - I NEVER HAD A CAR IN COLLEGE, SO

49:42 - I NEVER LEARNED TO DRIVE.

49:44 - WHEN I WAS AN ASSISTANT D.A., I

49:46 - LIVED CLOSE ENOUGH TO WALK, SO I

49:48 - NEVER HAD ANY REASON TO BUY A

49:50 - CAR.

49:50 - PLUS, THE SALARY THAT ASSISTANT

49:52 - D.A.s MADE, I COULDN'T AFFORD A

49:53 - CAR.

49:54 - I GOT MARRIED, AND MIDGE HAD A

49:57 - CAR, AND SHE SAID, "THIS IS

49:58 - RIDICULOUS."

49:59 - SHE SAID, "I'M NOT DRIVING YOU

50:01 - AROUND FOR THE REST OF YOUR

50:02 - LIFE.

50:03 - YOU'RE LEARNING HOW TO DRIVE,"

50:04 - SO I THINK I WAS 27 YEARS OF AGE

50:07 - WHEN I TOOK DRIVING LESSONS, AND

50:08 - I REMEMBER MY INSTRUCTOR'S NAME,

50:10 - NICK CARFAGNO, AND I THINK I

50:13 - MUST'VE CAUSED NICK AN EARLY

50:15 - DEMISE 'CAUSE I WAS A TERRIBLE

50:17 - STUDENT, AND I'VE NEVER BEEN

50:19 - ANYWHERE.

50:20 - I'M A LUCKY DRIVER IN THE SENSE

50:22 - THAT I HAD NEVER HAD AN

50:23 - ACCIDENT, BUT I WAS A PRETTY

50:24 - LOUSY DRIVER.

50:27 - AND, OF COURSE, IT'S BEEN...

50:32 - BEEN 20 YEARS, 21 YEARS SINCE I

50:34 - REALLY DROVE A CAR.

50:36 - AS MAYOR, THE DETAIL WOULD LEAVE

50:39 - ME DOWN AT THE SHORE ON FRIDAY

50:41 - AND COME BACK AND GET ME ON

50:42 - SUNDAY, AND I WOULD OCCASIONALLY

50:44 - DRIVE A CAR TO GO FROM MY HOUSE

50:49 - TO THE WAWA TO PICK SOMETHING

50:51 - UP.

50:53 - BUT THAT WAS LIKE SEVEN BLOCKS.

50:55 - I HAVEN'T DRIVEN ON A HIGHWAY OR

50:56 - ANYTHING IN 20 YEARS, AND THEN

50:58 - WHEN I BECAME GOVERNOR, STATE

50:59 - POLICE WERE NEVER LEAVING.

51:01 - THAT WAS -- THEY JUST -- IT WAS

51:02 - IN THEIR PROTOCOL, SO IF I EVER

51:04 - NEEDED TO BE TAKEN ANYWHERE,

51:06 - THEY DROVE ME.

51:07 - SO I HAVEN'T DRIVEN A CAR IN 20

51:10 - YEARS, AND WHEN I STOPPED BEING

51:12 - GOVERNOR, I SWORE THAT I WAS

51:14 - GONNA GET BACK TO DRIVING A CAR.

51:16 - AND I SWORE THAT I WAS GONNA GO

51:18 - TO PENN CHARTER.

51:18 - WE LIVE IN EAST FALLS.

51:21 - AND I STILL LIVE IN EAST FALLS.

51:22 - AND PENN CHARTER'S RIGHT AROUND

51:24 - THE BLOCK, AND I WAS GONNA...

51:27 - START DRIVING, PARTICULARLY IN

51:29 - THE SUMMER WHEN PENN CHARTER'S

51:30 - CLOSED.

51:31 - THEY KEEP THE GROUNDS OPEN, AND

51:32 - I WAS GONNA DRIVE AROUND THE

51:34 - PARKING LOTS AND AROUND THE

51:35 - DRIVEWAYS, ET CETERA.

51:37 - I HAVEN'T DONE IT YET THE FIRST

51:38 - TWO SUMMERS, BUT I'M SORT OF

51:41 - INCLINED TO DO IT, AND I ALMOST

51:43 - THINK JESSE SHOULD GO WITH ME

51:45 - TO, YOU KNOW, IN CASE I HAVE ANY

51:47 - START-UP PROBLEMS 'CAUSE I

51:48 - REMEMBER -- I SHOULDN'T HAVE

51:49 - DONE THIS -- BUT WHEN JESSE WAS

51:51 - LIKE...

51:53 - 10 OR 9 OR 10 OR 11, I REMEMBER

51:56 - TAKING HIM INTO PENN CHARTER.

51:59 - I WAS DRIVING, AND I WOULD PUT

52:01 - HIM ON MY LAP AND LET HIM STEER.

52:04 - I WOULD DO THE GAS AND THE

52:06 - BRAKES, AND HE WOULD STEER, AND

52:08 - HE WAS ACTUALLY PRETTY GOOD, SO

52:10 - HE SHOULD PROBABLY TEACH ME NOW.

52:12 - >> WHAT WERE YOU LIKE TO BE

52:14 - AROUND AS A KID?

52:15 - >> I WAS A HAPPY-GO-LUCKY KID.

52:19 - YOU KNOW, LOVED SPORTS, LOVED

52:21 - ADVENTURE, AND I WAS ALWAYS THE

52:23 - SORT OF A RINGLEADER OF THE CREW

52:25 - THAT I HUNG AROUND WITH, AND

52:27 - SOMETIMES THAT WAS FOR GOOD,

52:28 - SOMETIMES NOT FOR SO MUCH GOOD,

52:31 - BUT...

52:32 - AND I WAS A TRUE INDOMITABLE

52:35 - FREE SPIRIT.

52:36 - WE HAD A SOFTBALL TEAM.

52:38 - MY FRIENDS AND I OVER THE

52:40 - SUMMER, AND THE CITY WOULD HAVE

52:41 - OPEN COMPETITION.

52:42 - ANY TEAM COULD ENTER IT.

52:44 - WE ENTERED ONE YEAR, AND I

52:47 - REMEMBER RIGHT BEFORE THE FIRST

52:49 - GAME OF THE TOURNAMENT, ABOUT 10

52:51 - DAYS BEFORE OR LESS, I WAS TOLD

52:54 - I HAD TO HAVE A HERNIA

52:55 - OPERATION.

52:56 - SO, I HAD A HERNIA OPERATION,

52:58 - AND THE GAME WAS LIKE FIVE DAYS

53:00 - AFTER THE OPERATION.

53:01 - I SAID TO THE DOCTOR, "IS THERE

53:02 - ANY WAY I CAN PLAY?"

53:03 - HE SAID, "NO," BUT IN THOSE

53:06 - DAYS, THEY KEPT YOU OVERNIGHT.

53:08 - I CAME HOME THE SECOND DAY.

53:10 - BY THE FIFTH DAY, I DIDN'T FEEL

53:11 - SO BAD, SO I PLAYED.

53:13 - I COULDN'T PROBABLY RIPPED MY

53:14 - STITCHES OPEN, BUT I DIDN'T.

53:17 - BUT, YOU KNOW, I WAS ALWAYS

53:18 - PRETTY MUCH OF A FREE SPIRIT.

53:21 - >> TELL ME ABOUT YOUR

53:22 - GRANDPARENTS.

53:23 - >> DON'T REMEMBER MUCH ABOUT MY

53:24 - GRANDPARENTS.

53:25 - MY PATERNAL GRANDPARENTS...

53:30 - ONE WAS DEAD WHEN I WAS BORN,

53:33 - AND THE OTHER DIED LIKE WHEN I

53:34 - WAS AN INFANT, 1 OR 2.

53:37 - BUT THEY LIVED INTO THEIR LATE

53:38 - 80s, EARLY 90s.

53:40 - MY MATERNAL GRANDPARENTS I

53:41 - REMEMBER MORE...

53:46 - BUT -- BECAUSE THEY WERE ALIVE

53:49 - WHEN I WAS BORN, AND THEY WERE

53:51 - ALIVE FOR A WHILE.

53:53 - THEY BOTH DIED IN THEIR LATE

53:55 - 80s, EARLY 90s, AS WELL.

53:57 - AND I REMEMBER WE WOULD ASSEMBLE

53:59 - THE FAMILY EVERY FRIDAY NIGHT,

54:02 - AND...

54:05 - THEY HAD...

54:07 - MY GRANDPARENTS ON MY MOTHER'S

54:09 - SIDE HAD SEVEN...

54:12 - SIBLINGS, SO WHEN THE FAMILY

54:14 - GATHERED, IT WAS A BIG

54:15 - GATHERING.

54:15 - YOU KNOW, WE'D HAVE 20, 21

54:17 - PEOPLE FOR FRIDAY NIGHT DINNER,

54:19 - AND I REMEMBER MY GRANDFATHER

54:23 - WAS SORT OF OLD BY THE TIME I

54:24 - GOT TO KNOW HIM AND SOMEWHAT

54:26 - GRUFF.

54:28 - SO I DIDN'T REALLY GET TO KNOW

54:29 - HIM WELL.

54:30 - I GOT TO KNOW GRANDMA SLOAT A

54:31 - LITTLE BETTER.

54:32 - SHE LIVED FOR A FEW YEARS AFTER

54:35 - HER HUSBAND DIED, MY GRANDFATHER

54:36 - DIED.

54:37 - AND I REMEMBER -- THE THING THAT

54:39 - I REMEMBER DISTINCTLY ABOUT HER

54:41 - IS, ON FRIDAY NIGHTS, SHE WOULD

54:42 - SIT THERE, AND SHE WAS IN A

54:44 - WHEELCHAIR BY THEN, BUT SHE

54:45 - WOULD SIT IN THE WHEELCHAIR, AND

54:47 - ALL THE TIME SHE WAS SITTING

54:49 - THERE, HER RIGHT LEG WAS MOVING

54:51 - UP AND DOWN.

54:52 - AND...

54:54 - SHORTLY THEREAFTER, MY RIGHT LEG

54:57 - STARTED MOVING UP AND DOWN.

54:59 - ALL THROUGH...

55:01 - CHILDHOOD, ALL THROUGH COLLEGE,

55:03 - ALL THROUGH LAW SCHOOL, ALL

55:04 - THROUGH MY TIME AS AN ASSISTANT

55:06 - D.A.

55:07 - FINALLY, I GOT ELECTED MAYOR,

55:09 - AND I THINK THAT I WORKED SO

55:12 - HARD AS MAYOR AND AS GOVERNOR

55:14 - THAT THE EXCESS ENERGY THAT THIS

55:15 - WOULD BURN OFF, I DIDN'T HAVE IT

55:17 - ANYMORE, SO I STOPPED DOING IT,

55:18 - BUT I REMEMBER THAT FROM

55:20 - GRANDMA SLOAT, BUT I DIDN'T GET

55:21 - TO KNOW ANY OF THEM REAL WELL.

55:22 - >> THEY WERE ALL IMMIGRANTS?

55:24 - >> OH, YEAH.

55:25 - IN FACT, MY MOTHER TOLD US

55:28 - THAT -- TOLD MY BROTHER AND I

55:30 - THAT SHE WAS BORN IN THE U.S.,

55:32 - AND SHE TOLD US HER AGE, AND,

55:33 - ACCORDING TO HER, SHE WOULD'VE

55:34 - BEEN 86 WHEN SHE DIED.

55:37 - BUT MY BROTHER WENT BACK TO MY

55:41 - MOM'S APARTMENT AFTER I HAD TO

55:42 - GO BACK TO PHILADELPHIA.

55:44 - MY BROTHER CLEANED OUT STUFF,

55:46 - AND HE FOUND A BIRTH CERTIFICATE

55:48 - FROM -- FROM RUSSIA.

55:51 - >> YOUR MOM?

55:51 - >> YEAH, AND MY MOTHER'S NAME

55:53 - WAS EMMA SLOAT -- S-L-O-A-T --

55:56 - RENDELL, AND ON THE BIRTH

55:58 - CERTIFICATE, IT, OF COURSE,

55:59 - DIDN'T HAVE RENDELL.

56:01 - SHE MARRIED MY FATHER OVER HERE.

56:04 - BUT HER NAME WAS EMIA, WHICH IS

56:06 - CYRILLIC FOR EMMA --

56:08 - EMIA SLUTSKY -- S-L-U-T-S-K-Y.

56:12 - AND JESSE, WHO ALWAYS CALLED MY

56:13 - MOTHER -- MY GRANDMA -- MY

56:15 - MOTHER "EMMA," JESSE -- WHEN

56:18 - JESSE HEARD THAT, HE SHOOK HIS

56:19 - HEAD AND SAID -- JESSE WAS ABOUT

56:21 - 12 WHEN EMMA DIED.

56:24 - NO, I'M GONNA TAKE IT BACK.

56:25 - HE WAS LIKE 15 WHEN EMMA DIED.

56:27 - HE SAID, "EMMA WOULD'VE HAD A

56:28 - TOUGH TIME GOING THROUGH HIGH

56:29 - SCHOOL IN AMERICA WITH THAT

56:30 - NAME.

56:31 - IT'S A GOOD THING THEY CHANGED

56:32 - IT."

56:33 - EMIA SLUTSKY.

56:34 - SO, SHE WAS -- MY DAD WAS BORN

56:37 - HERE, BUT ALL FOUR SETS -- ALL

56:40 - FOUR OF MY GRANDPARENTS WERE

56:41 - BORN IN RUSSIA.

56:43 - >> DID YOU FOLLOW THE NEWS WHEN

56:45 - YOU WERE GROWING UP?

56:46 - >> YEAH, I WAS VERY INTERESTED

56:47 - IN POLITICS, AGAIN, 'CAUSE OF MY

56:49 - DAD.

56:49 - I REMEMBER WHEN I WAS AT

56:50 - RIVERDALE IN A LOWER SCHOOL, I

56:52 - COULD NAME ALL 100 SENATORS.

56:56 - >> WHAT POSSESSED YOU TO DO

56:57 - THAT?

56:58 - >> INTEREST IN POLITICS.

57:01 - YEAH, YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE NAMING

57:03 - THE GIANTS BASEBALL TEAM WHEN I

57:05 - WAS 5 YEARS OLD, YOU KNOW?

57:07 - I WAS JUST INTERESTED IN IT.

57:08 - >> DID YOU TALK OVER ISSUES WITH

57:09 - YOUR DAD?

57:12 - >> YEAH, I MEAN, HE TOLD ME WHY

57:14 - THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY WAS SO GOOD

57:16 - FOR ORDINARY PEOPLE.

57:18 - YOU KNOW, HE EXPLAINED THAT

57:19 - STUFF TO ME BUT, YOU KNOW, NOT

57:20 - IN MINUTE DETAIL AND NOT -- WE

57:23 - DIDN'T GET INTO THE WEEDS, BUT

57:24 - HE TOLD ME BROAD SORT OF VALUES

57:27 - AND IMPRESSIONS THAT HE HAD

57:28 - ABOUT POLITICS.

57:30 - >> DID YOU GET AT ALL INVOLVED

57:31 - IN THE 1960 PRESIDENTIAL

57:33 - ELECTION?

57:34 - YOU WERE IN HIGH SCHOOL.

57:35 - >> YOU KNOW, LIKE ALL YOUNG

57:37 - KIDS, I WAS FOR JFK.

57:38 - IF I HAD A VOTE, I WOULD'VE

57:39 - VOTED FOR HIM, BUT, NO, I DIDN'T

57:41 - GET ELECT-- I DIDN'T GET

57:42 - INVOLVED.

57:42 - >> DID YOU EVER GET IN TROUBLE

57:44 - AS A KID?

57:44 - >> OTHER THAN -- OTHER THAN

57:46 - SCHOOL, NO.

57:47 - NO TROUBLE WITH THE LAW OR

57:48 - ANYTHING, NO, NO.

57:49 - >> DID YOU HAVE A TEMPER?

57:53 - >> YEAH, I GUESS I HAD A TEMPER

57:55 - AS A KID, PROBABLY MORE SO AS A

57:58 - YOUNG ADULT.

58:00 - I REMEMBER WHEN I RAN FOR

58:01 - DISTRICT ATTORNEY, THERE WAS A

58:03 - BIG STORY ABOUT MY TEMPER IN A

58:06 - PHILADELPHIA MAGAZINE, BUT

58:08 - JUDGE JIM McDERMOTT, WHO, BY

58:10 - THEN, WAS ON THE SUPREME COURT,

58:12 - WHO HAD GOTTEN TO KNOW ME AS AN

58:14 - ASSISTANT D.A., HE SAID

58:16 - SOMETHING THAT I CATEGORICALLY

58:18 - BELIEVE IT.

58:19 - HE SAID, "YOU SHOW ME WITHOUT A

58:20 - TEMPER, AND I'LL SHOW YOU

58:22 - SOMEONE WHO DOESN'T CARE ABOUT

58:24 - ANYTHING."

58:26 - IT'S TRUE. IF YOU CARE ABOUT...

58:29 - LIKE, IF I EVER FOUND OUT THAT

58:32 - ONE OF MY ASSISTANT D.A.s...

58:36 - TREATED A CITIZEN WITH

58:38 - DISRESPECT, I WOULD GO THROUGH

58:40 - THE ROOF BECAUSE EVERYONE I

58:43 - HIRED, I WOULD HAVE AN HOUR,

58:46 - MAYBE A TWO-HOUR SESSION,

58:48 - TELLING THEM THE BROAD VALUES OF

58:49 - THE OFFICE, THE GUIDELINES THAT

58:51 - I WANTED THEM TO FOLLOW, ET

58:52 - CETERA.

58:53 - ONE OF THE THINGS I TOLD THEM

58:54 - IS, EVERY WITNESS, EVERY VICTIM,

58:56 - I WANT YOU TO TREAT THEM AS IF

58:57 - THEY'RE YOUR OWN MOTHER.

58:59 - AND TO ME, THAT WAS ENORMOUSLY

59:01 - IMPORTANT 'CAUSE I REMEMBER ONCE

59:04 - A FRIEND OF MINE, WHEN I WAS AN

59:06 - ASSISTANT D.A., SAID TO ME, "HOW

59:08 - CAN YOU HAVE THAT JOB WHERE ALL

59:09 - YOU DO IS PUT MINORITIES AND

59:11 - POOR PEOPLE IN JAIL?"

59:13 - I SAID, "TOM, YOU DON'T

59:15 - UNDERSTAND.

59:17 - THE VICTIMS ARE MINORITY AND

59:19 - POOR PEOPLE.

59:20 - THEY'VE NEVER HAD ANYBODY IN

59:21 - THEIR LIFE STAND UP AND SPEAK

59:23 - FOR THEM AND REPRESENT THEM AND

59:25 - BE THEIR CHAMPION.

59:26 - I DO THAT EVERY DAY, SOMETIMES

59:29 - 15, 20 TIMES A DAY.

59:31 - I SPEAK FOR THEM.

59:32 - I REPRESENT THE STATE, BUT I

59:33 - ALSO REPRESENT THEIR INTERESTS,

59:35 - AND THEY'VE NEVER HAD ANYONE

59:36 - LOOK AFTER THEM," AND IT'S A

59:38 - WONDERFUL FEELING.

59:38 - IT'S NOT A BAD FEELING THAT

59:40 - YOU'RE PUTTING POOR PEOPLE IN

59:41 - JAIL.

59:42 - YOU BELIEVE THAT YOU'RE

59:43 - PROTECTING POOR PEOPLE.

59:44 - >> WHEN YOU WERE GROWING UP AND

59:45 - YOU WENT TO A PRIVATE SCHOOL IN

59:47 - NEW YORK CITY, WERE ALL THE KIDS

59:49 - THERE WELL-TO-DO?

59:50 - DID YOU HAVE ANY EXPOSURE TO

59:52 - LESS-WELL-OFF PEOPLE.

59:55 - >> IN RIVERDALE, THERE WERE A

59:57 - FEW SCHOLARSHIP KIDS, BUT EVEN

59:58 - 597 THEY WERE, BY OUR STANDARDS,

01:00 - 01.464 MIDDLE-CLASS.

01:00 - 02.699 MOST OF THE KIDS WERE

01:00 - 03.866 UPPER-MIDDLE-CLASS.

01:00 - 05.468 MOST OF THE FOREIGN STUDENTS

01:00 - 07.136 WERE WEALTHY OR THEY WERE SONS

01:00 - 08.004 OF DIPLOMATS.

01:00 - 09.973 SO, NO, THERE WEREN'T ANY

01:00 - 11.274 DIRT-POOR KIDS.

01:00 - 13.676 BUT AGAIN, I GOT TO KNOW KIDS IN

01:00 - 16.012 THE SUMMERTIME, IN THE SOFTBALL

01:00 - 18.181 LEAGUES AND STUFF LIKE THAT.

01:00 - 21.484 SO I HAD, YOU KNOW, SIGNIFICANT

01:00 - 24.320 EXPOSURE TO PEOPLE THAT DIDN'T

01:00 - 25.888 COME FROM SUCCESSFUL FAMILIES.

01:00 - 27.056 >> WHAT DO YOU REMEMBER ABOUT

01:00 - 30.026 YOUR SENIOR YEAR OF HIGH SCHOOL?

01:00 - 31.628 >> JUST HOW MUCH FUN IT WAS TO

01:00 - 33.196 GET BACK WITH MY FRIENDS, YOU

01:00 - 33.663 KNOW?

01:00 - 35.231 NOBODY THOUGHT I COULD DO IT,

01:00 - 36.933 BUT I DID IT.

01:00 - 38.668 YOU KNOW, HAVING A GOOD TIME.

01:00 - 40.203 AND I REMEMBER, AGAIN, MOSTLY

01:00 - 45.174 THE SPORTS THAN ANYTHING ELSE.

01:00 - 47.276 >> AND WHEN DID YOU DECIDE YOU

01:00 - 50.046 WANTED TO GO TO PENN?

01:00 - 55.485 >> PRETTY MUCH LATE FALL OF MY

01:00 - 56.653 SENIOR YEAR.

01:00 - 58.087 >> HOW MANY COLLEGES WERE ON

01:00 - 58.721 YOUR LIST?

01:00 - 59.389 >> THREE.

01:00 - 01.190 PRINCETON I APPLIED TO 'CAUSE MY

01:01 - 02.825 BROTHER WENT THERE, AND I GOT

01:01 - 03.660 TURNED DOWN.

01:01 - 05.061 THOSE WERE IN THE DAYS WHEN

01:01 - 06.663 PRINCETON WAS DECIDEDLY BETTER,

01:01 - 07.930 ACADEMICALLY, THAN PENN.

01:01 - 09.999 AND PENN AND WILLIAMS -- NO, NO,

01:01 - 11.167 PENN AND WESLEYAN --

01:01 - 12.635 CONNECTICUT, WESLEYAN, AND

01:01 - 14.070 TRINITY UP IN CONNECTICUT.

01:01 - 15.538 AND I GOT IN TO THOSE THREE.

01:01 - 16.706 I GOT TURNED DOWN FROM

01:01 - 17.373 PRINCETON.

01:01 - 19.676 AND I DECIDED I WANTED TO GO TO

01:01 - 21.811 PENN BECAUSE RIVERDALE, EVEN

01:01 - 24.180 THOUGH IT WAS TECHNICALLY IN THE

01:01 - 26.416 BRONX, WAS IN A BEAUTIFUL SORT

01:01 - 27.884 OF RUSTIC SETTING.

01:01 - 29.886 AND TRINITY WAS IN HARTFORD --

01:01 - 30.853 NOT SO MUCH.

01:01 - 32.722 BUT WESLEYAN WAS IN A RUSTIC

01:01 - 34.824 SETTING, AND I WANTED TO GO TO A

01:01 - 36.292 BIG CITY FOR COLLEGE.

01:01 - 39.662 SO I DECIDED TO COME TO PENN,

01:01 - 43.433 AND THAT'S HOW IT STARTED.

01:01 - 45.735 I'D NEVER BEEN IN PHILADELPHIA

01:01 - 48.071 UNTIL THE FIRST DAY OF FRESHMAN

01:01 - 50.039 ORIENTATION WEEK.

01:01 - 51.407 >> WHEN YOU WERE A KID, DID YOU

01:01 - 52.075 TRAVEL MUCH?

01:01 - 52.975 >> NO, NOT MUCH.

01:01 - 54.510 I MEAN, WE TRAVELED ALL AROUND

01:01 - 56.079 THE NEW YORK METROPOLITAN AREA,

01:01 - 57.280 BUT DIDN'T TRAVEL MUCH.

01:01 - 58.881 MY FOLKS WENT TO FLORIDA, BUT WE

01:01 - 02.552 STAYED BEHIND.

01:02 - 04.353 I'M TRYING TO THINK IF I WAS --

01:02 - 06.222 RIVERDALE WOULD SEND THE FIFTH

01:02 - 07.890 GRADE TO WILLIAMSBURG ON A

01:02 - 09.425 TRAIN, AND WE WOULD STAY

01:02 - 10.927 OVERNIGHT TWO NIGHTS IN

01:02 - 11.894 WILLIAMSBURG.

01:02 - 13.596 THAT WAS PROBABLY AS FAR AS WE

01:02 - 14.263 TRAVELED.

01:02 - 15.798 I'M TRYING TO THINK WHEN MY

01:02 - 17.767 FIRST PLANE RIDE WAS.

01:02 - 24.540 I DON'T RECALL, BUT IT WASN'T AS

01:02 - 25.675 A YOUNG PERSON.

01:02 - 27.543 THAT'S FOR SURE.

01:02 - 31.614 AFTER MY DAD DIED, MY MOTHER,

01:02 - 33.549 YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY TOOK OVER,

01:02 - 35.518 AND SHE HAD CERTAIN THINGS THAT

01:02 - 36.886 SHE WANTED US TO DO.

01:02 - 38.287 AND SHE WANTED MY BROTHER AND I

01:02 - 39.355 TO LEARN HOW TO DANCE.

01:02 - 41.124 SO SHE SENT MY BROTHER TO DANCE

01:02 - 42.825 SCHOOL AND THEN, A YEAR LATER,

01:02 - 44.260 SENT ME TO DANCE SCHOOL.

01:02 - 45.795 AND I REMEMBER VIOLA WOLFE

01:02 - 46.763 DANCING SCHOOL.

01:02 - 49.632 I REMEMBER THAT CLEAR AS A BELL.

01:02 - 53.669 AND I WENT THERE BY SUBWAY AND

01:02 - 55.171 BUS.

01:02 - 56.639 SO, THEN IT OCCURRED TO ME,

01:02 - 57.974 AFTER GOING TO THE FIRST

01:02 - 59.675 CLASS -- AND I HATED IT 'CAUSE I

01:02 - 01.210 WASN'T MUCH INTO GIRLS AND I

01:03 - 02.545 SURE AS HECK WASN'T INTO

01:03 - 03.146 DANCING.

01:03 - 05.348 STILL NOT TODAY.

01:03 - 07.316 BUT I REMEMBER THINKING, "THIS

01:03 - 08.284 IS A BREEZE.

01:03 - 09.919 MY MOTHER DOESN'T KNOW."

01:03 - 13.756 SO, I WOULD GO PLAY BASEBALL OR

01:03 - 16.759 PLAY SOME SPORT, AND I'D HAVE

01:03 - 18.427 SOME BEAT-UP CLOTHES THAT I

01:03 - 20.296 WOULD STORE AT A FRIEND'S HOUSE

01:03 - 21.931 AND THEN GET BACK INTO MY GOOD

01:03 - 23.166 CLOTHES AND COME HOME.

01:03 - 25.701 AND I CUT LIKE FOUR WEEKS IN A

01:03 - 27.637 ROW OF DANCING SCHOOL.

01:03 - 30.506 BUT FINALLY THE SCHOOL CALLED MY

01:03 - 33.009 MOTHER, AND THE JIG WAS UP.

01:03 - 34.877 OH, BUT I HATED IT. I HATED IT.

01:03 - 36.746 AND TO THIS DAY, I'M A TERRIBLE

01:03 - 37.380 DANCER.

01:03 - 39.515 IN FACT, MIDGE WOULD TELL YOU

01:03 - 41.651 THAT WHENEVER WE'RE FORCED TO

01:03 - 43.019 DANCE, SHE LEADS.

01:03 - 44.654 >> [ CHUCKLES ]

01:03 - 46.522 DID YOU PLAY A LOT OF STREET

01:03 - 48.024 BASEBALL OR FOOTBALL?

01:03 - 49.559 >> OH, YEAH, WE PLAYED

01:03 - 51.260 HALF-BALL, WHICH IS A BIG

01:03 - 53.262 NEW YORK CITY -- WELL, PHILLY,

01:03 - 53.763 TOO.

01:03 - 55.765 WE PLAYED HALF-BALL.

01:03 - 58.334 HALF-BALL WAS FOR CITY KIDS WHAT

01:03 - 00.703 WIFFLE BALL IS FOR MOST OTHER

01:04 - 01.404 KIDS.

01:04 - 02.972 WE PLAYED HALF-BALL.

01:04 - 04.674 AND WE PLAYED SOFTBALL.

01:04 - 06.909 I REMEMBER WE USED TO PLAY DOWN

01:04 - 08.311 IN RIVERSIDE PARK.

01:04 - 10.146 THE INFIELD WAS CONCRETE.

01:04 - 12.815 IT WAS AWFUL. IT WAS AWFUL.

01:04 - 14.650 I MEAN, YOU BETTER NOT SLIDE.

01:04 - 15.618 IT WAS AWFUL.

01:04 - 17.553 THE OUTFIELD WAS GRASS, BUT THE

01:04 - 18.955 INFIELD WAS CONCRETE.

01:04 - 20.723 AND ALSO, IF YOU PLAYED THIRD

01:04 - 22.491 BASE, YOU'RE TAKING YOUR LIFE

01:04 - 24.760 INTO YOUR OWN HANDS, EVEN WITH

01:04 - 25.428 SOFTBALL.

01:04 - 26.863 IT WAS SOMETHING.

01:04 - 29.098 AND I REMEMBER THE BASKETBALL

01:04 - 31.400 COURTS, THE OUTDOOR BASKETBALL

01:04 - 33.035 COURTS WE PLAYED ON.

01:04 - 34.737 TO THIS DAY, I CAN REMEMBER SOME

01:04 - 35.371 OF THOSE.

01:04 - 37.273 IT'S AMAZING HOW YOU HAVE

01:04 - 39.375 MEMORIES, HOW CERTAIN THINGS

01:04 - 40.343 STAND OUT.

01:04 - 42.345 WHEN THE EAGLES FOOTBALL GAME

01:04 - 44.547 WAS CANCELED, THE BIG -- BECAUSE

01:04 - 46.382 OF THE SNOW THAT LED TO MY

01:04 - 48.251 COMMENT THAT WE'VE BECOME A

01:04 - 50.386 NATION OF WUSSIES, WHICH LED TO

01:04 - 53.389 THE BOOK, I WROTE THE NEXT

01:04 - 56.492 DAY -- THE WASHINGTON TIMES

01:04 - 59.862 ASKED ME TO WRITE AN OP-ED

01:04 - 01.063 PIECE, WHICH THEY PUT ON THE

01:05 - 01.631 FRONT PAGE.

01:05 - 02.598 I COULDN'T BELIEVE IT.

01:05 - 06.502 BUT I WROTE ABOUT -- THE MOST

01:05 - 08.638 VIVID FOOTBALL MEMORY I HAD FROM

01:05 - 10.473 MY YOUTH WAS BECAUSE OF BAD

01:05 - 11.207 WEATHER.

01:05 - 13.042 AND MY THEORY WAS THAT THOSE

01:05 - 15.011 BAD-WEATHER GAMES ARE MEMORABLE

01:05 - 16.012 FOR THE FANS.

01:05 - 17.780 YOU KNOW, THEY STICK OUT IN

01:05 - 19.949 YOUR -- AND IT WAS GIANTS VERSUS

01:05 - 21.450 THE CLEVELAND BROWNS.

01:05 - 23.452 THEY WERE THE HATED RIVALS IN

01:05 - 25.388 THE NATIONAL FOOTBALL LEAGUE

01:05 - 26.656 EASTERN DIVISION.

01:05 - 28.391 AN THE BROWNS HAD JIM BROWN, THE

01:05 - 30.126 GREAT RUNNER, AND THE GIANTS HAD

01:05 - 31.827 SAM HUFF, THE GREAT LINEBACKER.

01:05 - 33.863 AND THEY WOULD HAVE JUST EPIC

01:05 - 39.869 BATTLES, LIKE ACHILLES AND

01:05 - 41.270 HECTOR, YOU KNOW, JUST

01:05 - 43.372 INCREDIBLE BATTLES.

01:05 - 45.174 AND WE WENT INTO THE LAST GAME

01:05 - 46.976 OF THE SEASON AT HOME TRAILING

01:05 - 48.411 THE BROWNS BY ONE GAME.

01:05 - 50.212 AND WE NEEDED TO WIN THE GAME.

01:05 - 52.081 IF IT WAS A TIE OR IF THE BROWNS

01:05 - 53.582 WON, WE WERE ELIMINATED.

01:05 - 55.418 IF WE TIED, WE WOULD FORCE A

01:05 - 56.118 PLAYOFF.

01:05 - 58.587 AND IT STARTED SNOWING ABOUT AN

01:05 - 00.423 HOUR BEFORE GAME TIME.

01:06 - 02.058 AND BY THE TIME THE GAME

01:06 - 04.126 STARTED, IT WAS COMING DOWN REAL

01:06 - 06.228 HARD, AND THE WIND WAS -- IT WAS

01:06 - 07.730 LIKE A SNOWSTORM AND A

01:06 - 08.698 NORTHEASTER.

01:06 - 10.099 THE WIND WAS BRUTAL.

01:06 - 12.134 AND THE GIANTS WERE 2 POINTS

01:06 - 16.839 DOWN, WITH TWO MINUTES TO GO.

01:06 - 18.975 AND SOMEHOW THEY MANAGED TO PUT

01:06 - 21.010 TOGETHER A DRIVE, AND THEY GOT

01:06 - 23.079 TO THE BROWNS' 43-YARD LINE AS

01:06 - 24.613 TIME WAS RUNNING OUT.

01:06 - 26.215 AND SO THE ONLY THING THEY COULD

01:06 - 27.450 DO WAS TRY A FIELD GOAL.

01:06 - 28.918 AND WE WERE IN THE STANDS AND

01:06 - 30.419 THOUGHT, "WHAT CHANCE IS THERE

01:06 - 31.921 THAT A 50-YARD FIELD GOAL WILL

01:06 - 33.155 BE GOOD IN THOSE WEATHER

01:06 - 34.523 CONDITIONS, WITH THE WIND?"

01:06 - 36.392 AND THE WIND WAS SWIRLING, AND

01:06 - 38.294 THE SNOW -- WE COULD HARDLY SEE

01:06 - 39.095 THE FIELD.

01:06 - 41.030 PAT SUMMERALL, WHO LATER BECAME

01:06 - 42.732 A GREAT ANNOUNCER, WAS THE

01:06 - 44.066 GIANTS' PLACEKICKER.

01:06 - 45.634 AND HE WAS AN OLD-FASHIONED,

01:06 - 47.169 STRAIGHT-AHEAD PLACEKICKER.

01:06 - 49.038 AND HE HAD A GOOD LEG, BUT 50

01:06 - 50.840 YARDS -- AND IT WAS 50 YARDS

01:06 - 52.475 'CAUSE IN THOSE DAYS, THE

01:06 - 54.477 GOALPOSTS WERE ON THE GOAL LINE.

01:06 - 55.845 THEY WEREN'T 10 YARDS BACK.

01:06 - 57.179 THEY WERE ON THE GOAL LINE.

01:06 - 58.748 SO, IF YOU WERE KICKING FROM THE

01:06 - 59.782 50, IT WAS 50 YARDS.

01:06 - 01.150 TODAY IT WOULD BE 60 YARDS.

01:07 - 03.953 SO, IT WAS 50 YARDS AND THEY

01:07 - 06.122 LINE UP AND SUMMERALL KICKS THE

01:07 - 06.989 BALL.

01:07 - 08.324 AND I REMEMBER IT WAS DARK.

01:07 - 09.759 IT WAS LATE AFTERNOON, AND IT

01:07 - 10.359 WAS DARK.

01:07 - 12.294 AND I CAN CLOSE MY EYES RIGHT

01:07 - 14.030 NOW -- I SAID THIS IN THE

01:07 - 14.764 ARTICLE.

01:07 - 16.866 I SAID I COULD CLOSE MY EYES AND

01:07 - 18.768 STILL SEE THE BALL TRAVELING

01:07 - 20.770 THROUGH THE SNOW, UNBELIEVABLE

01:07 - 22.538 TRIP THROUGH THE SNOW, AND

01:07 - 23.906 SOMEHOW HE MADE IT.

01:07 - 24.673 GIANTS WON.

01:07 - 26.409 THEY WENT ON TO WIN THE PLAYOFF

01:07 - 28.010 GAME, AND THEY WENT ON TO THE

01:07 - 29.678 WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP AGAINST THE

01:07 - 31.080 COLTS, THAT FAMOUS GAME.

01:07 - 32.681 AND I SAID WHAT MADE THAT GAME

01:07 - 34.250 MEMORABLE WAS NOT ONLY THAT IT

01:07 - 35.818 WAS AN IMPORTANT GAME FOR THE

01:07 - 37.353 GIANTS TO WIN, BUT BECAUSE IT

01:07 - 38.988 HAD BEEN A BLIZZARD ALL DAY AND

01:07 - 40.623 'CAUSE HE KICKED THE FIELD GOAL

01:07 - 41.924 UNDER THE MOST DIFFICULT

01:07 - 42.658 CONDITIONS.

01:07 - 44.460 THE ONLY FIELD GOAL I EVER

01:07 - 46.595 REMEMBER BEING CLOSE TO THAT WAS

01:07 - 48.497 WHEN ADAM VINATIERI, FOR THE

01:07 - 50.599 PATRIOTS, KICKED THE FIELD GOAL

01:07 - 52.735 TO WIN THE TUCK BOWL, THE FAMOUS

01:07 - 54.170 TUCK BOWL WHERE THE QUARTERBACK

01:07 - 55.504 FUMBLED AND THERE WAS A RULE

01:07 - 56.372 ABOUT TUCKING IT.

01:07 - 58.040 AND HE DID IT IN A BLIZZARD,

01:07 - 59.341 TOO, TO WIN THE GAME.

01:07 - 01.110 BUT AGAIN, I CAN CLOSE MY EYES

01:08 - 02.611 AND SEE THE BALL FLOATING

01:08 - 03.679 THROUGH THE AIR.

01:08 - 05.714 AND, YOU KNOW, IT HAPPENED, AND

01:08 - 07.783 THE BALL -- IT WAS LIKE THE BALL

01:08 - 09.485 WAS GOING IN SLOW MOTION.

01:08 - 11.120 IT WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

01:08 - 12.755 AND I SAID THAT WAS A GREAT

01:08 - 13.389 MEMORY.

01:08 - 14.857 I WAS A 14-YEAR-OLD KID.

01:08 - 16.659 I SAID, "AND THE NFL ROBBED US

01:08 - 18.360 OF THE CHANCE AND THE EAGLES

01:08 - 19.929 ROBBED US OF THE CHANCE OF

01:08 - 21.630 HAVING SIMILAR MEMORIES THAT

01:08 - 22.298 SUNDAY."

01:08 - 24.266 AND IT'S INTERESTING.

01:08 - 28.003 SINCE THAT SUNDAY -- WE WERE

01:08 - 29.171 HEADED TO THE PLAYOFFS, AND WE

01:08 - 30.139 STILL MADE THE PLAYOFFS.

01:08 - 32.074 MINNESOTA BEAT US TWO DAYS

01:08 - 34.210 LATER, ON A TUESDAY, WHEN THE

01:08 - 35.511 GAME WAS PLAYED.

01:08 - 36.879 BUT SINCE THAT CANCELLATION OF

01:08 - 38.314 THAT GAME, THE EAGLES HAVE NEVER

01:08 - 40.883 HAD A WINNING RECORD.

01:08 - 42.618 THE CURSE OF WUSSIFICATION.

01:08 - 43.819 >> [ LAUGHS ]

01:08 - 45.654 DO YOU REMEMBER, AS A PLAYER

01:08 - 47.656 WHEN YOU WERE IN SCHOOL, HAVING

01:08 - 49.191 ANY TRIUMPHANT MOMENTS?

01:08 - 50.759 >> I LOVED PLAYING IN THE RAIN

01:08 - 52.194 BECAUSE THE FIELD WOULD GET

01:08 - 53.729 MUDDY AND IT WAS SOFT AND YOU

01:08 - 55.264 SLOSHED AROUND, BUT -- WE HAD

01:08 - 56.799 TRIUMPHANT MOMENTS AS A TEAM,

01:08 - 59.835 BUT I CAN'T REMEMBER TOO MANY

01:08 - 03.205 TRIUMPHANT MOMENTS FOR ME.

01:09 - 04.773 OH, YEAH.

01:09 - 06.408 WE WERE IN A HOLIDAY TOURNAMENT

01:09 - 07.309 MY SENIOR YEAR.

01:09 - 07.910 [ CHUCKLES ]

01:09 - 09.211 WE WERE IN A HOLIDAY TOURNAMENT,

01:09 - 10.379 AND WE WERE THE CLASS OF THE

01:09 - 10.946 TOURNAMENT.

01:09 - 12.581 WE PLAYED THREE GAMES --

01:09 - 14.350 QUARTERFINALS, SEMIFINALS,

01:09 - 15.017 FINALS.

01:09 - 16.051 >> WHAT SPORT WAS THIS?

01:09 - 16.752 >> BASKETBALL.

01:09 - 19.088 AND WE WON THEM ALL, AND WE WON

01:09 - 21.490 THEM EASY, WHICH MEANT -- WE HAD

01:09 - 23.292 13 PLAYERS ON THE TEAM.

01:09 - 24.793 EIGHT PLAYED WHEN THERE WAS

01:09 - 26.262 SERIOUS -- THE GAME WAS IN

01:09 - 26.795 DOUBT.

01:09 - 28.430 THEN THERE WERE THE FIVE OF US

01:09 - 29.198 WHO DIDN'T.

01:09 - 30.332 I WAS THE ONLY EXCEPTION.

01:09 - 31.734 OCCASIONALLY AGAINST THE ZONE, I

01:09 - 32.434 WOULD GET IN.

01:09 - 34.203 BUT IN THESE THREE GAMES, WE

01:09 - 36.172 WERE SO FAR AHEAD THAT THE FIVE

01:09 - 37.139 OF US PLAYED.

01:09 - 39.475 AND IN THE THREE GAMES, I TOOK

01:09 - 41.677 SEVEN SHOTS, AND I MADE THEM

01:09 - 42.278 ALL.

01:09 - 44.813 SO, I AM -- AND I REMEMBER THE

01:09 - 47.049 PROGRAM FROM THAT YEAR HAD

01:09 - 49.451 TOURNAMENT RECORDS, AND, YOU

01:09 - 50.753 KNOW, THE HIGHEST PERCENTAGE FOR

01:09 - 51.453 THE TOURNAMENT.

01:09 - 55.591 AND I AM STILL IN THAT -- IF

01:09 - 56.992 THAT TOURNAMENT IS STILL GOING

01:09 - 58.460 ON -- I DON'T REMEMBER THE NAME

01:09 - 59.929 OF IT -- I'M STILL SOMEWHERE IN

01:09 - 01.297 THE RECORD BOOK 'CAUSE I SHOT

01:10 - 01.730 1,000.

01:10 - 03.199 AND IT WASN'T LIKE I SHOT TWO

01:10 - 03.666 SHOTS.

01:10 - 05.234 I SHOT SEVEN IN THE THREE GAMES.

01:10 - 07.369 THAT WAS PROBABLY MY GREATEST

01:10 - 09.371 MOMENT OF ATHLETIC TRIUMPH.

01:10 - 10.306 >> WERE YOU CLOSE TO YOUR

01:10 - 11.407 BROTHER, OR DID YOU KIND OF RUN

01:10 - 12.441 IN SEPARATE CIRCLES 'CAUSE OF

01:10 - 13.209 YOUR AGE DIFFERENCE?

01:10 - 15.144 >> THE AGE DIFFERENCE WAS SUCH

01:10 - 17.179 THAT WE RAN IN SEPARATE CIRCLES.

01:10 - 18.647 AND MY BROTHER WAS THE

01:10 - 20.349 TRADITIONAL OLDER BROTHER.

01:10 - 21.951 HE WOULD BEAT THE LIVING

01:10 - 23.319 DAYLIGHTS OUT OF ME.

01:10 - 25.221 WHEN HE WAS 12 OR 13 OR SO, MY

01:10 - 27.256 PARENTS WOULD OCCASIONALLY LEAVE

01:10 - 28.290 HIM IN CHARGE.

01:10 - 29.825 WHEN HE WAS IN CHARGE, HE WOULD

01:10 - 30.993 CHARGE ME FOR WATCHING

01:10 - 32.528 TELEVISION, AND I HAD TO PAY A

01:10 - 34.063 NICKEL FOR WATCHING TELEVISION.

01:10 - 35.831 IF I WANTED A SANDWICH, HE WOULD

01:10 - 36.899 CHARGE ME A DIME.

01:10 - 37.900 HE WAS BRUTAL.

01:10 - 39.702 WE'VE GOTTEN TO BE MUCH CLOSER

01:10 - 43.939 FRIENDS NOW, BUT -- AND THEN HE

01:10 - 47.009 AND HIS FRIEND JOHN ZUCKER -- WE

01:10 - 49.912 GREW UP DURING THE KOREAN WAR.

01:10 - 52.281 AND I WAS LIKE 8 OR 9, AND THEY

01:10 - 53.949 WERE 12 OR WHATEVER.

01:10 - 55.684 AND WE WOULD PLAY THIS GAME

01:10 - 57.720 WHERE JOHN ZUCKER AND MY BROTHER

01:10 - 59.588 WOULD GET ON THE BED ON THEIR

01:10 - 01.457 KNEES, AND THEY WERE THE U.S.

01:11 - 02.157 MARINES.

01:11 - 04.159 AND I WOULD BE ON THE FLOOR, AND

01:11 - 05.861 I WAS THE KOREAN ARMY, THE

01:11 - 07.129 NORTH KOREAN ARMY.

01:11 - 08.697 AND I HAD TO STORM THE BED.

01:11 - 10.499 IT WAS ONE 9-YEAR-OLD TRYING TO

01:11 - 11.967 STORM THE BED AGAINST TWO

01:11 - 13.736 12-YEAR-OLDS, SO I GOT THE CRAP

01:11 - 15.471 BEAT OUT OF ME ALL THE TIME BY

01:11 - 17.039 JOHN ZUCKER AND MY BROTHER,

01:11 - 17.640 ROBERT.

01:11 - 19.575 SO, WE WEREN'T ALL THAT CLOSE,

01:11 - 21.377 AND THEN -- ROBERT LIVES IN

01:11 - 22.044 DALLAS.

01:11 - 23.946 BUT OVER THE LAST DECADE OR SO,

01:11 - 25.848 WE'VE BECOME MUCH CLOSER, WHICH

01:11 - 27.750 IS ONE OF THE NICE THINGS ABOUT

01:11 - 28.284 LIFE.

01:11 - 30.019 YOU KNOW, IT GOES IN CYCLES.

01:11 - 32.021 >> DID YOU GET AN ALLOWANCE?

01:11 - 34.189 >> OH, YEAH, WHICH IS WHY I HAD

01:11 - 36.425 TO PAY TRIBUTE TO MY BROTHER FOR

01:11 - 38.694 WATCHING TV OR FOR A SANDWICH OR

01:11 - 39.528 WHATEVER.

01:11 - 40.529 >> AND YOU TALKED AT THE

01:11 - 41.764 BEGINNING ABOUT THE NURSE, THE

01:11 - 42.331 IRISH WOMAN.

01:11 - 43.499 HOW LONG DID SHE WORK FOR --

01:11 - 44.767 >> BELIEVE IT OR NOT, TILL I WAS

01:11 - 46.201 10.

01:11 - 48.203 TILL I WAS 10.

01:11 - 50.306 YEAH. SHE WAS GREAT.

01:11 - 51.573 GREAT DISPOSITION.

01:11 - 53.442 I MEAN, ONE OF THE REASONS I

01:11 - 55.277 THINK I'M BASICALLY A HAPPY,

01:11 - 57.279 OPTIMISTIC PERSON WAS 'CAUSE OF

01:11 - 59.515 MAY.

01:11 - 01.016 YEAH.

01:12 - 02.217 >> YOU REMEMBER -- YOU TALKED

01:12 - 03.419 ABOUT FAMILY GATHERINGS, ABOUT

01:12 - 04.320 THE BIG FAMILY DEAL.

01:12 - 05.621 WHAT KIND OF OCCASIONS WOULD YOU

01:12 - 06.255 GET TOGETHER?

01:12 - 07.256 WHAT WOULD THEY BE LIKE?

01:12 - 09.024 >> EVERY FRIDAY NIGHT, WE'D ALL

01:12 - 10.559 GET TOGETHER, EVERY FRIDAY

01:12 - 11.093 NIGHT.

01:12 - 12.561 AND AFTER MY GRANDMA AND

01:12 - 14.229 GRANDFATHER DIED, THE FAMILY

01:12 - 15.998 WOULD GET TOGETHER, BUT IT WAS

01:12 - 17.800 NOT AT THEIR APARTMENT ANYMORE.

01:12 - 19.335 WE'D GO OUT TO DINNER AT A PLACE

01:12 - 20.302 CALLED LONGCHAMPS.

01:12 - 22.004 AND THAT TRADITION SORT OF HELD

01:12 - 23.405 FOR THE LONGEST TIME, THE

01:12 - 24.239 LONGEST TIME.

01:12 - 25.941 >> YOU HAD A LOT OF COUSINS YOU

01:12 - 26.742 PLAYED WITH?

01:12 - 28.010 >> OH, YEAH.

01:12 - 30.679 AND I STILL SEE MY -- I SEE TWO

01:12 - 31.847 OF MY COUSINS A LOT --

01:12 - 33.215 STEVE SHARFSTEIN, WHO IS A

01:12 - 34.450 PSYCHIATRIST, PROMINENT

01:12 - 35.951 PSYCHIATRIST, WHO WAS HEAD OF

01:12 - 37.219 THE AMERICAN PSYCHIATRIC

01:12 - 37.953 ASSOCIATION.

01:12 - 40.089 IN FACT, HE TOLD A STORY.

01:12 - 41.924 I DID A BOOK SIGNING.

01:12 - 47.062 HE RUNS A WONDERFUL PLACE WHERE

01:12 - 48.630 THEY TREAT PEOPLE WITH MENTAL

01:12 - 50.299 CHALLENGES CALLED SHEPPARD PRATT

01:12 - 51.133 IN BALTIMORE.

01:12 - 53.035 HE'S THE PSYCHIATRIST IN CHARGE.

01:12 - 54.236 HE'S THE PRESIDENT.

01:12 - 55.938 HE HAD A BOOK SIGNING FOR ME

01:12 - 57.673 THERE, AND WHEN HE INTRODUCED

01:12 - 01.944 ME, HE TOLD A NUMBER OF STORIES

01:13 - 04.546 ABOUT BOTH OF US.

01:13 - 06.782 AND HE SAID WHEN HE RAN FOR THE

01:13 - 08.684 PRESIDENCY OF THE AMERICAN

01:13 - 10.953 PSYCHIATRIC ASSOCIATION, HE LOST

01:13 - 12.988 BY LIKE 8 VOTES OUT OF 2,000

01:13 - 13.622 CAST.

01:13 - 15.023 AND HE SAID THAT I WAS

01:13 - 16.792 RESPONSIBLE FOR CONVINCING HIM

01:13 - 18.694 TO TRY AGAIN, JUST AS I LOST TWO

01:13 - 20.496 ELECTIONS BEFORE I GOT ELECTED

01:13 - 22.464 MAYOR.

01:13 - 25.100 AND IT WAS TRUE.

01:13 - 26.502 SO, I SEE STEVEN A LOT.

01:13 - 28.103 HOWARD SHARFSTEIN, MY OTHER

01:13 - 29.972 COUSIN, IS A LAWYER IN NEW YORK,

01:13 - 31.840 SO I SEE HIM OFTEN WHEN WE GO TO

01:13 - 32.541 NEW YORK.

01:13 - 35.677 YEAH, THEY'RE GOOD PEOPLE.

01:13 - 37.346 THEY'RE ABOUT -- I HAVE A VERY

01:13 - 39.148 SMALL REMAINING FAMILY.

01:13 - 41.283 IT'S THOSE TWO COUSINS, MY

01:13 - 43.819 BROTHER AND HIS WIFE AND HIS TWO

01:13 - 44.853 DAUGHTERS.

01:13 - 46.221 THAT'S IT, BASICALLY.

01:13 - 48.090 WE'RE VERY SMALL ON THE RENDELL

01:13 - 48.624 SIDE.

01:13 - 50.492 AND MIDGE'S FAMILY IS SMALL.

01:13 - 52.494 IT WAS JUST HER AND HER SISTER.

01:13 - 54.296 FORTUNATELY, HER SISTER HAD

01:13 - 56.131 THREE BOYS AND WE HAD JESSE.

01:13 - 57.833 THERE'S NOT A GIRL IN THE

01:13 - 59.902 FAMILY, BUT THE NICE THING ABOUT

01:13 - 01.870 MARRIAGE IS THAT MIDGE HAD NEVER

01:14 - 03.839 HAD A GIRL, AND I ALWAYS THOUGHT

01:14 - 05.841 SHE WOULD HAVE GOT A KICK OUT OF

01:14 - 07.709 GOING SHOPPING WITH A GIRL AND

01:14 - 08.877 THINGS LIKE THAT.

01:14 - 10.746 WELL, WHEN JESSE MARRIED BEKA,

01:14 - 11.814 SHE GOT A GIRL.

01:14 - 13.682 SHE GOT AN OLDER DAUGHTER, BUT

01:14 - 15.517 BEKA'S BEEN LIKE A DAUGHTER TO

01:14 - 16.952 HER -- AND TO ME, TOO.

01:14 - 18.487 AND IT'S BEEN REAL NICE.

01:14 - 20.656 >> ANY FAMILY TRADITIONS YOU HAD

01:14 - 22.357 PASSED DOWN FROM THE OLD

01:14 - 23.125 COUNTRY?

01:14 - 25.260 >> NOT FROM THE OLD COUNTRY, NO,

01:14 - 27.162 EXCEPT FRIDAY NIGHT DINNERS.

01:14 - 29.298 YOU KNOW, FOR JEWS, FRIDAY NIGHT

01:14 - 31.333 IS, YOU KNOW, THE BEGINNING OF

01:14 - 34.937 THE HOLY DAY.

01:14 - 36.672 ONE TRADITION STEVEN MENTIONED

01:14 - 38.407 WHEN HE INTRODUCED ME IS -- WE

01:14 - 40.142 USED TO GO OUT TO THEIR HOUSE.

01:14 - 41.577 THE SHARFSTEINS LIVED IN

01:14 - 43.011 GREAT NECK, LONG ISLAND.

01:14 - 44.746 WE USED TO GO OVER THEIR HOUSE

01:14 - 46.582 EVERY THANKSGIVING, AND WE WOULD

01:14 - 48.317 PLAY THIS TOUCH-FOOTBALL GAME,

01:14 - 50.152 WHICH WE CALLED THE TURKEY BOWL.

01:14 - 52.454 AND IT WAS STEVEN AND I VERSUS

01:14 - 54.223 MY BROTHER AND HOWARD.

01:14 - 55.224 HOWARD'S THE YOUNGEST.

01:14 - 56.391 MY BROTHER WAS THE OLDEST.

01:14 - 57.793 STEVEN AND I WERE IN THE MIDDLE.

01:14 - 59.528 SO, THAT WAS ABOUT OUR ONLY

01:14 - 00.729 FAMILY TRADITION.

01:15 - 02.598 AND OF COURSE FRIDAY NIGHTS,

01:15 - 04.366 WHEN WE WOULD GATHER AT MY

01:15 - 06.401 GRANDPARENTS' HOUSE -- IN THOSE

01:15 - 08.036 DAYS, FRIDAY NIGHTS WERE

01:15 - 09.972 DOMINATED BY THE FRIDAY-NIGHT

01:15 - 10.639 FIGHTS.

01:15 - 12.174 AND YOU WOULD OFTEN HAVE EVEN

01:15 - 13.675 TITLE FIGHTS ON FRIDAY NIGHT

01:15 - 15.143 'CAUSE THERE WAS NO PAY TV.

01:15 - 16.678 YOU DIDN'T GO TO A THEATER TO

01:15 - 17.312 WATCH IT.

01:15 - 18.780 YOU DIDN'T WATCH IT ON HBO.

01:15 - 21.016 IT WAS ON LIVE, COMMERCIAL

01:15 - 22.150 TELEVISION.

01:15 - 23.485 SO -- AND EVEN WHEN THERE WERE

01:15 - 24.786 NO CHAMPIONSHIP FIGHTS, THERE

01:15 - 25.787 WOULD BE GOOD FIGHTS.

01:15 - 27.623 SO, WE HAD AN UNCLE BY THE NAME

01:15 - 29.291 OF IRVING, AND UNCLE IRVING

01:15 - 31.126 WOULD ALWAYS HAVE THIS -- EVERY

01:15 - 32.928 FRIDAY NIGHT, HE'D COME IN AND

01:15 - 34.830 SAY -- SOMEONE WOULD SAY, "WHO'S

01:15 - 35.998 FIGHTING TONIGHT?"

01:15 - 38.133 AND UNCLE IRVING WOULD SAY, "THE

01:15 - 38.901 FAMILY."

01:15 - 40.936 AND THAT WAS UNDOUBTEDLY TRUE.

01:15 - 42.671 WE ALWAYS -- THESE BIG DINNERS

01:15 - 44.206 WITH 18, 20 PEOPLE ALWAYS

01:15 - 45.807 ERUPTED INTO ARGUMENTS OVER

01:15 - 47.543 POLITICS, OVER BUSINESS, OVER,

01:15 - 48.744 YOU KNOW, WHATEVER.

01:15 - 50.445 I MEAN, AND WE KIDS WERE SORT OF

01:15 - 51.179 BYSTANDERS.

01:15 - 53.181 >> WHEN YOUR DAD DIED, WAS THERE

01:15 - 55.183 A MALE ROLE MODEL WHO YOU LOOKED

01:15 - 57.686 TO?

01:15 - 59.054 >> NO.

01:15 - 03.859 AND THE INTERESTING THING IS...

01:16 - 07.529 YOU ALWAYS SAY TO YOURSELF OR

01:16 - 09.331 SAY ABOUT OTHER PEOPLE, "WELL,

01:16 - 10.999 WAS THERE ANY GOOD THAT CAME

01:16 - 12.234 FROM MY DAD DYING?"

01:16 - 15.170 WELL, HARDLY ANY, I MEAN, WHEN I

01:16 - 16.805 THINK OF ALL THAT I MISSED AND

01:16 - 18.373 THAT HE MISSED FROM HIS EARLY

01:16 - 18.941 DEMISE.

01:16 - 20.776 BUT THE ONLY GOOD THAT CAME FROM

01:16 - 23.912 IT IS I WAS BASICALLY -- WHEN I

01:16 - 25.380 WENT AWAY TO PENN A YEAR AND A

01:16 - 26.882 HALF LATER, I WAS BASICALLY ON

01:16 - 27.382 MY OWN.

01:16 - 29.184 AGAIN, MY MOM WASN'T CLOSE TO

01:16 - 29.618 US.

01:16 - 31.486 SHE BECAME CLOSER AS THE YEARS

01:16 - 33.422 WENT ON, BUT I WAS BASICALLY ON

01:16 - 34.056 MY OWN.

01:16 - 35.824 MY BROTHER WAS FAR AWAY, YOU

01:16 - 37.793 KNOW, AND I LEARNED TO BE FAIRLY

01:16 - 38.927 SELF-SUFFICIENT.

01:16 - 40.562 I LEARNED TO FEND FOR MYSELF.

01:16 - 42.230 I LEARNED TO FIGHT FOR THINGS

01:16 - 42.798 MYSELF.

01:16 - 44.299 IT'S WHY I THINK I HAD THE

01:16 - 45.901 COURAGE TO RUN FOR D.A. AT A

01:16 - 47.636 TIME WHEN NOBODY THOUGHT YOU

01:16 - 49.104 COULD BEAT THE MACHINE.

01:16 - 50.772 I RAN AGAINST THE INCUMBENT

01:16 - 52.708 DEMOCRATIC D.A. AT THE HEIGHT OF

01:16 - 55.110 THE POWER OF THE RIZZO MACHINE.

01:16 - 56.645 PEOPLE THOUGHT I WAS CRAZY.

01:16 - 58.347 IT'S WHY I DECIDED I WANTED TO

01:16 - 00.148 RUN FOR GOVERNOR OF PENNSYLVANIA

01:17 - 01.750 EVEN THOUGH PEOPLE SAID, "NO

01:17 - 03.318 PHILADELPHIAN WILL EVER GET

01:17 - 04.853 ELECTED GOVERNOR 'CAUSE THE

01:17 - 06.421 STATE HATES PHILADELPHIA SO

01:17 - 06.989 BADLY."

01:17 - 09.691 AND I THINK BEING ALONE FROM THE

01:17 - 12.227 TIME I WAS 14 UNTIL 27, WHEN I

01:17 - 14.630 GOT MARRIED, I THINK MADE ME

01:17 - 16.465 FAIRLY RESILIENT AND

01:17 - 19.001 SELF-SUFFICIENT, AND I LEARNED

01:17 - 24.039 TO -- TO, YOU KNOW, RIDE WITH

01:17 - 26.308 THE PUNCHES AND NOT GET TOO HIGH

01:17 - 28.877 AND NOT GET TOO LOW.

01:17 - 30.212 YOU KNOW, I REMEMBER THERE WERE

01:17 - 31.480 A LOT OF TIMES I ATE DINNER BY

01:17 - 34.583 MYSELF.

01:17 - 35.884 BUT I THINK THAT ALL JUST --

01:17 - 37.786 IT MADE ME STRONGER.

01:17 - 39.087 >> DID YOU DECIDE EARLY ON THAT

01:17 - 40.022 YOU WERE A DEMOCRAT?

01:17 - 41.323 WAS THERE ANY DOUBT ABOUT THAT?

01:17 - 42.691 >> OH, NO, FROM THE TIME I WAS 8

01:17 - 45.727 YEARS OLD, THERE WAS NO DOUBT.

01:17 - 47.396 NO DOUBT, ALTHOUGH, HAD I FOUND

01:17 - 48.897 PROBLEMS WITH THE DEMOCRATIC

01:17 - 50.399 PARTY, I DON'T THINK I WOULD

01:17 - 51.800 HAVE NECESSARILY STAYED A

01:17 - 52.434 DEMOCRAT.

01:17 - 54.269 AND THERE ARE SOME PROBLEMS WITH

01:17 - 55.904 THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, BUT ON

01:17 - 57.539 BALANCE, I THINK WHAT MY DAD

01:17 - 58.540 SAID WAS RIGHT.

01:17 - 00.742 I BELIEVE WITH ALL MY HEART IT'S

01:18 - 02.878 THE BEST VEHICLE TO PROTECT THE

01:18 - 04.946 MOST VULNERABLE IN OUR SOCIETY

01:18 - 07.149 AND THE WORKING MEN AND WOMEN OF

01:18 - 08.150 OUR SOCIETY.

01:18 - 09.885 AND AGAIN, THAT'S NOT TO SAY

01:18 - 11.286 THERE AREN'T SOME FINE

01:18 - 12.187 REPUBLICANS.

01:18 - 14.022 THERE WERE MANY IN MY LIFETIME

01:18 - 15.657 AND MANY THAT HELPED ME IN

01:18 - 16.491 HARRISBURG.

01:18 - 17.959 BUT BY AND LARGE, I THINK THE

01:18 - 19.528 VALUES OF THE TWO PARTIES -- THE

01:18 - 20.996 DEMOCRATIC PARTY IS MUCH MORE

01:18 - 22.330 LIKELY TO LOOK OUT FOR THE

01:18 - 23.799 LITTLE GUY AND THE VULNERABLE

01:18 - 27.235 PEOPLE THAN THE REPUBLICANS.

01:18 - 28.837 >> WHAT DID YOU DO IN THE SUMMER

01:18 - 30.439 BETWEEN HIGH SCHOOL AND WHEN YOU

01:18 - 31.540 WENT OFF TO COLLEGE?

01:18 - 33.809 >> I WORKED IN -- MY MOTHER'S

01:18 - 35.977 FAMILY -- A VERY SUCCESSFUL

01:18 - 38.180 SPORTSWEAR BUSINESS, WOMEN'S

01:18 - 40.749 SPORTSWEAR.

01:18 - 43.018 AND OF COURSE THEY WERE ON 7th

01:18 - 44.553 AVENUE IN NEW YORK.

01:18 - 46.922 SO, I WORKED IN THE FACTORY, AND

01:18 - 49.257 I DID THAT FOR THE FOUR SUMMERS

01:18 - 51.560 THAT I WAS IN COLLEGE, AS WELL,

01:18 - 53.762 AFTER MY FRESHMAN, SOPHOMORE,

01:18 - 55.630 JUNIOR, AND SENIOR YEAR.

01:18 - 56.965 SO, FOR FIVE YEARS, I WORKED IN

01:18 - 58.266 THE FACTORY, AND I GOT TO KNOW

01:18 - 59.401 THE BUSINESS PRETTY WELL.

01:18 - 01.036 I WORKED IN THE SHIPPING

01:19 - 01.937 DEPARTMENT.

01:19 - 03.472 I WORKED IN THE SORTING

01:19 - 04.940 DEPARTMENT, PACKAGING

01:19 - 06.608 DEPARTMENT, ALL DIFFERENT

01:19 - 07.309 THINGS.

01:19 - 09.377 EVEN TO THIS DAY, I CAN TELL YOU

01:19 - 11.446 A LOT ABOUT COLORS THAT MOST MEN

01:19 - 12.781 HAVE NO CLUE ABOUT.

01:19 - 14.049 I KNOW WHAT FUCHSIA IS.

01:19 - 17.652 I KNOW WHAT MAGENTA IS.

01:19 - 19.621 AND I REALLY HAVE A FAIRLY GOOD

01:19 - 21.656 EYE FOR WOMEN'S CLOTHING BECAUSE

01:19 - 23.391 I WORKED THERE FOR SO LONG.

01:19 - 25.660 AND THEY WERE REALLY -- THE

01:19 - 28.196 CLASS OF WOMEN'S SPORTSWEAR WAS

01:19 - 30.832 SLOAT SKIRTS, STARTED BY MY

01:19 - 33.602 MATERNAL GRANDPARENTS, AND BY

01:19 - 38.240 THE TIME I GOT THERE -- MY MOM

01:19 - 39.641 WORKED THERE A LITTLE BIT AFTER

01:19 - 40.942 MY DAD DIED, BUT THE THREE

01:19 - 42.477 PRINCIPLES WERE MY AUNT STELLA,

01:19 - 43.712 MY UNCLE HERBERT, AND MY

01:19 - 44.479 UNCLE ARCHIE.

01:19 - 45.781 AND IT WAS FUNNY.

01:19 - 49.217 ARCHIE WAS REALLY THE C.E.O.

01:19 - 50.685 HERBERT WAS IN CHARGE OF

01:19 - 52.587 SELLING, AND HE WENT ON THE ROAD

01:19 - 53.155 A LOT.

01:19 - 55.290 AND HE WAS A GREAT SALESMAN, A

01:19 - 57.559 GOOD-LOOKING GUY WHO HAD A GREAT

01:19 - 58.593 GIFT OF GAB.

01:19 - 00.362 AND STELLA WAS A DESIGNER, AND A

01:20 - 01.496 BRILLIANT DESIGNER.

01:20 - 03.098 IN FACT, ONE YEAR SHE WON THE

01:20 - 04.800 SPORTS ILLUSTRATED "SPORTSWEAR

01:20 - 06.368 DESIGNER OF THE YEAR" AWARD.

01:20 - 10.038 SO, IT WAS A VERY GOOD, ROBUST

01:20 - 11.473 BUSINESS, AND I LEARNED A LOT

01:20 - 12.941 ABOUT BUSINESS AND A LOT ABOUT

01:20 - 13.809 WOMEN'S CLOTHES.

01:20 - 15.076 >> AND WERE MOST OF THE PEOPLE

01:20 - 16.411 YOU WORKED WITH FAMILY MEMBERS?

01:20 - 16.945 >> NO.

01:20 - 18.547 OCCASIONALLY, THE PRINCIPALS

01:20 - 20.315 WOULD WALK THROUGH THE FACTORY,

01:20 - 21.883 BUT I WORKED WITH THE UNION

01:20 - 23.952 GUYS.

01:20 - 27.889 I WORKED WITH -- IN THOSE DAYS,

01:20 - 29.724 IT WAS ALL THE ILGWU, THE

01:20 - 31.793 INTERNATIONAL LADIES' GARMENT

01:20 - 32.994 WORKERS' UNION.

01:20 - 34.162 AND I WORKED WITH THEM.

01:20 - 35.730 I WORKED WITH THE SHOP STEWARDS.

01:20 - 37.766 AND I LEARNED SOME LESSONS FROM

01:20 - 38.800 WORKING THERE.

01:20 - 40.836 THE UNIONIZED WORKERS FELL INTO

01:20 - 42.671 TWO CATEGORIES -- THE HOURLY

01:20 - 44.706 WORKERS AND WHAT WAS CALLED THE

01:20 - 46.842 PEACE WORKERS.

01:20 - 49.311 THE HOURLY WORKERS WERE GOOD.

01:20 - 51.279 I MEAN, THEY DID A GOOD JOB, BUT

01:20 - 53.081 THEY'D OCCASIONALLY COME IN A

01:20 - 53.982 LITTLE LATE.

01:20 - 55.784 THEY'D GO TO THE BATHROOM AND

01:20 - 57.752 HANG OUT THERE FOR A LITTLE BIT.

01:20 - 59.287 THEY'D TAKE SMOKE BREAKS.

01:20 - 01.223 THEY MIGHT LEAVE A LITTLE EARLY.

01:21 - 03.024 THEIR ATTENDANCE WAS GOOD, BUT

01:21 - 04.826 OCCASIONALLY THEY WOULD TAKE A

01:21 - 06.528 THREE-DAY WEEKEND WHEN THERE

01:21 - 08.196 WASN'T A THREE-DAY WEEKEND.

01:21 - 10.265 THEY'RE THE HOURLY WORKERS, AND

01:21 - 12.234 BY AND LARGE, THEY DID A GOOD

01:21 - 12.767 JOB.

01:21 - 14.803 THE PEACE WORKERS WERE MOSTLY,

01:21 - 16.638 BY THE TIME I WORKED THERE,

01:21 - 18.306 OLDER EASTERN EUROPEANS.

01:21 - 20.242 IN FACT, MANY OF THEM HARDLY

01:21 - 21.910 SPOKE A LICK OF ENGLISH.

01:21 - 23.345 AND THEY WERE AMAZING.

01:21 - 25.013 THEY WOULD GET IN AT 7:00.

01:21 - 26.648 THEY WOULD LEAVE AT 4:00 OR

01:21 - 27.883 4:30.

01:21 - 28.917 THEY WOULDN'T GO TO THE

01:21 - 30.051 BATHROOM.

01:21 - 31.953 THEY WOULD EAT LUNCH 10 MINUTES

01:21 - 33.622 AT THEIR MACHINE, AND THEY

01:21 - 35.590 WORKED AND WORKED AND WORKED, NO

01:21 - 37.192 SMOKE BREAKS, NO BATHROOM

01:21 - 39.160 BREAKS, NO ANYTHING, 'CAUSE THEY

01:21 - 40.595 GOT PAID BY THE PIECE.

01:21 - 42.530 IF THEY SEWED ONE SKIRT, THEY

01:21 - 43.832 GOT PAID FOR THAT.

01:21 - 45.767 IF THEY SEWED 40 SKIRTS, THEY

01:21 - 47.068 GOT PAID FOR THAT.

01:21 - 48.670 IF THEY SEWED 80 SKIRTS, THEY

01:21 - 49.738 GOT PAID FOR THAT.

01:21 - 51.439 AND IT WAS UNBELIEVABLE, THE

01:21 - 53.341 DIFFERENCE IN THE COMMITMENT AND

01:21 - 55.076 THE LEVEL OF PRODUCTIVITY OF

01:21 - 56.878 PEOPLE WHO HAD AN INCENTIVE TO

01:21 - 58.747 WHAT THEY DID, WHO WERE PAID BY

01:21 - 00.482 OUTPUT, AS OPPOSED TO PAID BY

01:22 - 01.216 THE HOUR.

01:22 - 02.784 SO, I LEARNED THAT LESSON, AND I

01:22 - 04.352 APPLIED SOME OF THAT STUFF WHEN

01:22 - 05.820 I BECAME MAYOR AND GOVERNOR TO

01:22 - 07.289 SOME OF THE WORK-RULE CHANGES

01:22 - 10.725 THAT WE BROUGHT ABOUT.

01:22 - 13.495 AND I ALSO LEARNED A LITTLE BIT

01:22 - 15.196 ABOUT MANAGEMENT.

01:22 - 17.065 IT WAS INTERESTING.

01:22 - 22.237 MY UNCLE ARCHIE HAD A TERRIBLE

01:22 - 24.205 TEMPER, AND TWO OR THREE TIMES A

01:22 - 26.007 MONTH, HE WOULD HIT THE ROOF.

01:22 - 27.742 AND HE WOULD SHOUT SO MUCH THAT

01:22 - 29.444 YOU COULD HEAR THE WALLS -- YOU

01:22 - 30.645 COULD FEEL THE WALLS

01:22 - 32.714 REVERBERATE.

01:22 - 34.749 BUT FIVE MINUTES AFTER HE BLEW

01:22 - 36.718 HIS TOP, HE WAS FINE, AND THE

01:22 - 38.820 WORKERS REALLY LIKED HIM 'CAUSE

01:22 - 40.922 HE TOOK AN INTEREST IN THEM, HE

01:22 - 42.891 GOT TO KNOW THEM, GOT TO KNOW

01:22 - 44.392 ABOUT THEIR FAMILIES.

01:22 - 46.594 SO, THEY FORGAVE HIM THE

01:22 - 49.264 OUTBURSTS OF TEMPER BECAUSE HE

01:22 - 50.632 REALLY CARED.

01:22 - 52.400 UNCLE HERBERT -- WHEN HE WAS IN

01:22 - 54.202 THE FACTORY, HE WOULD NEVER LOSE

01:22 - 55.971 HIS TEMPER, BUT HE NEVER GOT TO

01:22 - 57.772 KNOW ANYBODY, HE SORT OF FELT HE

01:22 - 59.107 WAS ABOVE THE WORKERS.

01:22 - 00.308 SO, THEY DIDN'T LIKE

01:23 - 02.010 UNCLE HERBERT NEARLY AS MUCH AS

01:23 - 03.378 THEY LIKED UNCLE ARCHIE.

01:23 - 06.581 AND THAT WAS A LESSON FOR ME,

01:23 - 07.816 AS WELL.

01:23 - 10.085 AND, YOU KNOW, AT VARIOUS STAGES

01:23 - 12.354 IN MY CAREER, I'VE HAD A TEMPER.

01:23 - 14.422 WHEN I LOSE MY TEMPER, I NEVER

01:23 - 16.558 LOSE IT AT ANYONE SPECIFICALLY.

01:23 - 18.727 I JUST LOSE IT AT THINGS GETTING

01:23 - 20.762 SCREWED UP, AND I TRY TO MAKE

01:23 - 22.364 AMENDS AND HAVE A GOOD

01:23 - 24.532 RELATIONSHIP WITH ALL THE PEOPLE

01:23 - 26.501 I'VE LED AS D.A., MAYOR, AND

01:23 - 28.503 GOVERNOR, AND I THINK I HAVE.

01:23 - 29.771 >> WHEN YOU WERE WORKING IN THE

01:23 - 30.805 FACTORY, WERE YOU A UNION

01:23 - 31.239 MEMBER?

01:23 - 32.774 >> YEAH, I HAD TO GET A UNION

01:23 - 33.975 CARD AND PAY DUES AND

01:23 - 34.709 EVERYTHING.

01:23 - 35.710 YEAH, IT WAS FUN.

01:23 - 38.179 >> WAS THAT YOUR FIRST EXPOSURE

01:23 - 40.348 TO WORKING-CLASS PEOPLE, TO

01:23 - 41.316 BLUE-COLLAR PEOPLE?

01:23 - 42.650 'CAUSE YOU WENT TO A PRIVATE

01:23 - 43.118 SCHOOL.

01:23 - 44.319 >> WELL, I WENT TO PUBLIC SCHOOL

01:23 - 47.055 THROUGH THE FIFTH GRADE.

01:23 - 48.156 NOT SO MUCH.

01:23 - 50.425 I MEAN, I WOULD GET TO KNOW THE

01:23 - 52.494 BUS DRIVERS FROM SCHOOL AND

01:23 - 54.729 STUFF, AND I RODE THE SUBWAY A

01:23 - 55.296 LOT.

01:23 - 57.332 BUT THAT WAS MY FIRST EXPOSURE

01:23 - 59.334 TO WORKING PEOPLE ON THE JOB,

01:23 - 01.503 CLEARLY, OTHER THAN BEING SERVED

01:24 - 03.238 AT A RESTAURANT OR A SODA

01:24 - 04.539 FOUNTAIN.

01:24 - 08.243 I WAS VERY CLOSE TO THE OLDER

01:24 - 11.446 JEWISH COUPLE WHO RAN THAT SODA

01:24 - 12.680 SHOP THAT I TOLD YOU ABOUT

01:24 - 13.748 EARLIER, WHERE I WENT.

01:24 - 15.717 SO, I GOT TO KNOW -- YOU KNOW, I

01:24 - 17.719 WAS A PRETTY GREGARIOUS KID JUST

01:24 - 19.454 LIKE I'M A PRETTY GREGARIOUS

01:24 - 20.055 ADULT.

01:24 - 21.756 SO, I GOT TO KNOW PEOPLE PRETTY

01:24 - 22.357 EASILY.

01:24 - 24.059 BUT THAT WAS MY FIRST PROLONGED

01:24 - 25.727 EXPOSURE TO PEOPLE ON THE JOB.

01:24 - 27.495 I ALSO LEARNED ABOUT SOCIAL

01:24 - 28.263 SECURITY.

01:24 - 30.298 AND IT WAS SOMETHING -- I ALWAYS

01:24 - 32.233 WONDERED WHY WE HAD THIS SILLY

01:24 - 32.801 RULE.

01:24 - 36.838 AND THE CUTTERS IN OUR PLACE --

01:24 - 38.573 THEY WERE THE SKILLED CRAFTSMEN.

01:24 - 40.241 THEY WERE STILL UNION, BUT THEY

01:24 - 41.810 WERE THE ONES -- IT'S NOW ALL

01:24 - 43.344 DONE BY COMPUTER, OF COURSE.

01:24 - 46.081 YOU WOULD LAY OUT A BOLT OF

01:24 - 48.349 GREEN IRISH LINEN.

01:24 - 53.988 AND YOU'D LAY OUT 60 FOLDS, 60

01:24 - 55.457 STRIPS OF IRISH LINEN.

01:24 - 58.259 AND THE PATTERN WOULD GO OVER

01:24 - 01.062 THE 60 PIECES OF IRISH LINEN.

01:25 - 03.598 AND THE CUTTER, USING LITERALLY

01:25 - 06.234 WHAT LOOKED LIKE A SAW, WOULD GO

01:25 - 08.703 IN AND OUT, TRACING THE SKETCH

01:25 - 10.839 THAT WAS LAID OUT ON TOP.

01:25 - 12.073 AND IF THE CUTTER MADE THE

01:25 - 13.541 SLIGHTEST MISTAKE, IT WOULD RUIN

01:25 - 14.209 THE GARMENT.

01:25 - 15.910 SO, THEY WERE VERY SKILLED AT

01:25 - 16.878 WHAT THEY DID.

01:25 - 18.480 IT WAS HIGH-STRESSFUL WORK.

01:25 - 20.281 AND THEY GOT PAID WELL.

01:25 - 22.250 THEY WERE THE HIGHEST-PAID

01:25 - 23.985 PEOPLE IN THE FACTORY.

01:25 - 26.354 AGAIN, THE CUTTERS WERE MOSTLY

01:25 - 28.556 EASTERN EUROPEAN, ET CETERA.

01:25 - 31.493 THEY WERE OLDER JEWISH MEN,

01:25 - 33.428 ROMANIAN, YOU NAME IT.

01:25 - 35.296 SO, THEY WOULD DO THE CUTTING,

01:25 - 37.198 AND IT WAS SUCH A DIFFICULT JOB

01:25 - 39.033 THAT THEY WERE HAVING TROUBLE

01:25 - 40.869 FINDING YOUNGER PEOPLE TO TAKE

01:25 - 42.637 IT, EVEN THOUGH IT PAID VERY

01:25 - 43.171 WELL.

01:25 - 45.540 SO, WHAT THEY WOULD DO IS, WHEN

01:25 - 47.675 A CUTTER WOULD RETIRE, THEY

01:25 - 49.844 WOULD ASK THE CUTTER TO COME

01:25 - 51.779 BACK AND WORK PART TIME.

01:25 - 55.650 AND I REMEMBER THAT FOUR OR FIVE

01:25 - 57.785 WEEKS AFTER I HAD BEEN THERE IN

01:25 - 59.921 JULY, ONE OF THE CUTTERS WOULD,

01:25 - 02.056 AT 11:17, STOP WORKING, PACK UP

01:26 - 04.259 HIS CLOTHES FROM HIS LOCKER, SAY

01:26 - 06.327 GOODBYE TO EVERYBODY, AND SAY,

01:26 - 08.296 "SEE YOU NEXT YEAR," BECAUSE HE

01:26 - 10.031 HAD REACHED THE ALLOWABLE INCOME

01:26 - 11.466 THAT YOU COULD EARN UNDER

01:26 - 12.433 SOCIAL SECURITY.

01:26 - 14.135 THERE WAS A CAP, IF YOU WERE ON

01:26 - 15.837 SOCIAL SECURITY, OF WHAT INCOME

01:26 - 16.771 YOU COULD EARN.

01:26 - 18.039 NOW THAT CAP DOESN'T EXIST

01:26 - 18.573 ANYMORE.

01:26 - 19.407 MAYBE IT SHOULD.

01:26 - 20.308 I MEAN, YOU KNOW?

01:26 - 21.876 BUT IT WAS AMAZING.

01:26 - 23.578 CUTTERS WOULD LEAVE AT 11:17 IN

01:26 - 26.814 THE MORNING, 3:32 IN THE

01:26 - 27.649 AFTERNOON.

01:26 - 29.250 THEY HAD IT FIGURED DOWN TO THE

01:26 - 30.752 PENNY OF HOW MUCH THEY COULD

01:26 - 31.953 EARN WITHOUT VIOLATING

01:26 - 32.887 SOCIAL SECURITY.

01:26 - 34.322 >> DID YOU EVER THINK --

01:26 - 36.157 ENTERTAIN THOUGHTS OF GOING INTO

01:26 - 37.926 THE FAMILY BUSINESS, OR DID THE

01:26 - 39.527 FAMILY EVER KIND OF HOPE YOU

01:26 - 40.962 WOULD GO INTO THE FAMILY

01:26 - 41.663 BUSINESS?

01:26 - 42.497 >> I THINK YEAH.

01:26 - 44.866 I THINK UNCLE ARCHIE,

01:26 - 48.036 UNCLE HERBERT, AND AUNT STELLA

01:26 - 49.671 PROBABLY DID.

01:26 - 51.773 OF ALL MY GENERATION, ONLY ONE

01:26 - 53.975 OF US WENT INTO THE BUSINESS --

01:26 - 55.710 MY COUSIN JERRY, WHO WAS

01:26 - 59.847 REALLY -- JERRY'S PROBABLY ABOUT

01:26 - 02.350 17, 16, 17 YEARS OLDER THAN ME.

01:27 - 04.419 HIS MOTHER WAS THE OLDEST OF THE

01:27 - 05.153 SISTERS.

01:27 - 07.789 THERE WERE TWO BOYS AND SEVEN

01:27 - 09.824 SISTERS -- NINE KIDS.

01:27 - 11.659 MY MOTHER WAS THE YOUNGEST, SO

01:27 - 13.328 THERE WAS A BIG GAP BETWEEN

01:27 - 14.229 JERRY AND I.

01:27 - 16.164 BUT MY BROTHER DIDN'T. I DIDN'T.

01:27 - 17.899 NONE OF THE OTHER COUSINS WENT

01:27 - 19.400 INTO THE BUSINESS, AND SO

01:27 - 20.969 EVENTUALLY THEY LIQUIDATED

01:27 - 22.503 BECAUSE THEY ALL WANTED TO

01:27 - 23.104 RETIRE.

01:27 - 24.539 THEY HAD MADE ENOUGH MONEY.

01:27 - 26.507 SADLY, HAD ANY OF THE KIDS GONE

01:27 - 28.309 INTO THE BUSINESS OTHER THAN

01:27 - 30.278 JERRY, THEY WOULD HAVE KEPT THE

01:27 - 31.379 BUSINESS ALIVE.

01:27 - 33.014 AND THEY ALSO DIDN'T WANT TO

01:27 - 34.349 WORK FOR ANYBODY ELSE.

01:27 - 36.184 THEY COULD HAVE SOLD THE NAME TO

01:27 - 38.019 A BIG -- TO A REVLON, LET'S SAY,

01:27 - 39.654 BUT REVLON WOULD HAVE -- AND

01:27 - 40.888 MADE A LOT OF MONEY.

01:27 - 42.257 REVLON WOULD HAVE REQUIRED THAT

01:27 - 43.591 THEY STAY ON FOR FIVE YEARS TO

01:27 - 44.759 RUN THE BUSINESS, AND THEY

01:27 - 45.827 DIDN'T WANT TO DO THAT.

01:27 - 47.428 WHEN THEY DECIDED TO QUIT, THEY

01:27 - 48.329 WANTED TO QUIT.

01:27 - 50.732 SO, NO, I NEVER THOUGHT ABOUT

01:27 - 53.468 IT.

01:27 - 55.270 I DIDN'T MIND MY TIME AT THE

01:27 - 57.205 BUSINESS AT ALL, AND I ENJOYED

01:27 - 00.842 THE REPARTEE, BUT I JUST DIDN'T

01:28 - 02.877 THINK THAT I WANTED TO MAKE

01:28 - 05.213 WOMAN'S SPORTSWEAR AND HAVE THAT

01:28 - 07.448 BE THE SOLE GOAL AND AIM OF MY

01:28 - 09.550 LIFE, EVEN THOUGH I NOW LOOK

01:28 - 11.719 BACK, AND THE SLOATS EMPLOYED

01:28 - 13.988 SEVERAL HUNDRED PEOPLE AND GAVE

01:28 - 16.024 THEM SOLID LIVINGS AND GOOD

01:28 - 16.958 BENEFITS.

01:28 - 18.726 AND THERE'S A TREMENDOUS SOCIAL,

01:28 - 20.295 SOCIETAL VALUE TO THAT, TOO.

01:28 - 21.496 I'VE LEARNED THAT LATER.

01:28 - 22.930 BUT AT THAT POINT, THAT ISN'T

01:28 - 23.965 WHAT I WANTED TO DO.

01:28 - 25.300 >> THAT WAS DURING YOUR COLLEGE

01:28 - 26.200 YEARS, THE SUMMERS?

01:28 - 26.768 >> YEAH.

01:28 - 28.403 AFTER HIGH SCHOOL, THE YEAR THAT

01:28 - 29.937 I GRADUATED FROM HIGH SCHOOL,

01:28 - 31.439 AND THE SUMMERS AFTER MY FOUR

01:28 - 32.273 COLLEGE YEARS.

01:28 - 34.075 >> DID YOU FORM ANY OPINIONS OF

01:28 - 35.810 UNIONS AT THE TIME THAT STAYED

01:28 - 37.645 WITH YOU, OR WAS IT JUST KIND OF

01:28 - 38.846 A FIRST IMPRESSION?

01:28 - 40.014 >> WELL, OF COURSE, MY

01:28 - 41.582 UNCLE ARCHIE HATED THE UNION --

01:28 - 42.483 AND AUNT STELLA.

01:28 - 43.518 THEY HATED THE UNION.

01:28 - 45.019 BUT I ACTUALLY THOUGHT THE UNION

01:28 - 46.387 DID A PRETTY GOOD JOB FOR THE

01:28 - 47.555 WORKERS, AND IF I WAS ON

01:28 - 48.990 ANYBODY'S SIDE, IF THERE WAS A

01:28 - 50.425 CONTROVERSY, IT WAS USUALLY THE

01:28 - 52.093 WORKERS.

01:28 - 53.194 >> NOW, YOU WENT TO PENN --

01:28 - 55.463 >> AND THE ILG, REMEMBER, WAS A

01:28 - 56.464 GOOD UNION.

01:28 - 58.700 IT WASN'T A UNION THAT TRASHED

01:28 - 00.401 ANYTHING OR ENGAGED IN

01:29 - 01.336 VANDALISM.

01:29 - 03.338 AND THEY BARGAINED WELL, BUT

01:29 - 05.373 THEY ALSO UNDERSTOOD THAT, IF

01:29 - 07.375 THE BUSINESSES DID WELL, THE

01:29 - 09.010 WORKERS WOULD DO WELL.

01:29 - 10.378 THEY WERE SMART ENOUGH TO

01:29 - 11.346 UNDERSTAND THAT.

01:29 - 13.047 AND IF YOU REMEMBER, THE ILG HAD

01:29 - 15.650 LEGENDARY LEADERS, JUST

01:29 - 18.219 TREMENDOUSLY WONDERFUL PEOPLE.

01:29 - 20.388 AND IRONICALLY, THE GREAT IRONY

01:29 - 22.623 IS THE FIRST UNION TO ENDORSE ME

01:29 - 24.559 WHEN I RAN FOR D.A. WAS THE

01:29 - 27.161 ILGWU, A TERRIFIC GUY BY THE

01:29 - 28.930 NAME OF IRV SOLOMON, WHO LATER

01:29 - 30.798 WENT TO BE THE SECOND IN COMMAND

01:29 - 32.166 OF THE NATIONAL UNION.

01:29 - 33.501 >> DID YOU USE THAT IN THE

01:29 - 35.069 CAMPAIGN, THAT YOU WERE ONCE AN

01:29 - 35.870 ILGWU MEMBER?

01:29 - 37.171 >> ABSOLUTELY. OF COURSE.

01:29 - 38.373 >> DID YOUR CO-WORKERS THERE

01:29 - 39.474 TREAT YOU ANY DIFFERENTLY

01:29 - 40.775 BECAUSE YOU WERE THE NEPHEW OF

01:29 - 42.043 THE OWNER OR 'CAUSE YOU WERE A

01:29 - 42.677 COLLEGE KID?

01:29 - 44.445 >> WELL, A LITTLE BIT OF BOTH,

01:29 - 46.214 BUT I THINK -- THAT WAS AT THE

01:29 - 48.082 BEGINNING, BUT BY THE END OF THE

01:29 - 49.784 SUMMER, THEY WERE TREATING ME

01:29 - 51.486 LIKE ALMOST, YOU KNOW, ONE OF

01:29 - 53.154 THE GROUP 'CAUSE THEY KNEW I

01:29 - 54.589 WAS -- YOU KNOW, I WASN'T STUCK

01:29 - 54.922 UP.

01:29 - 56.290 I DIDN'T THINK ANYTHING I DID

01:29 - 56.958 WAS SPECIAL.

01:29 - 59.394 IN FACT, THE ONLY THING THAT

01:29 - 02.063 INDICATED I WAS THE RELATIVE OF

01:30 - 04.532 THE OWNERS WAS, MOST DAYS, I

01:30 - 07.135 WOULD GO TO LUNCH WITH MY AUNT

01:30 - 09.871 AND TWO UNCLES AT AN EATING CLUB

01:30 - 12.607 WHICH WAS CALLED, IF I REMEMBER,

01:30 - 15.843 1417 CLUB OR -- IT WAS THE NAME

01:30 - 17.578 OF THE ADDRESS OF A BUILDING

01:30 - 18.379 NEXT DOOR.

01:30 - 20.314 AND IT WAS HYSTERICAL.

01:30 - 22.550 IT WAS LIKE RIGHT OUT OF A

01:30 - 24.652 STAND-UP COMEDY ROUTINE.

01:30 - 26.521 WE WOULD WALK IN, AND I WOULD

01:30 - 28.256 WALK IN WITH MY UNCLES, AND

01:30 - 30.224 THEY'D STOP AT THE FIRST TABLE,

01:30 - 31.859 AND THEY'D SAY -- IRV WAS

01:30 - 33.828 THERE -- "IRV, HOW'S BUSINESS?"

01:30 - 35.463 "AH, BUSINESS IS TERRIBLE.

01:30 - 36.998 WE'RE ONE STEP AWAY FROM

01:30 - 37.899 BANKRUPTCY."

01:30 - 39.767 AND THEY'D GO TO THE NEXT TABLE,

01:30 - 41.402 AND THEY'D SAY, "HERB, HOW'S

01:30 - 42.170 BUSINESS?"

01:30 - 44.539 "OY, WE'RE GOING BROKE."

01:30 - 46.240 EVERY TABLE WE STOPPED AT,

01:30 - 47.708 BUSINESS WAS TERRIBLE.

01:30 - 50.044 THEN I WOULD LEAVE AT 5:45, AND

01:30 - 52.380 ALL THESE GUYS WHO AT LUNCHTIME

01:30 - 54.782 SAID THEIR BUSINESS WAS TERRIBLE

01:30 - 56.350 WERE GETTING INTO THESE STRETCH

01:30 - 57.885 LIMOUSINES, CADILLAC LIMOUSINES

01:30 - 59.487 WITH A CHAUFFEUR AND EVERYTHING.

01:30 - 00.855 DIDN'T MAKE ANY SENSE.

01:31 - 02.657 BUT I LEARNED THAT IT'S HARD TO

01:31 - 04.525 GET A BUSINESSPERSON -- AT LEAST

01:31 - 06.227 IN THE GARMENT INDUSTRY -- TO

01:31 - 07.895 SAY BUSINESS IS GOOD, ALMOST

01:31 - 08.696 IMPOSSIBLE.

01:31 - 10.431 >> NOW, DO YOU REMEMBER THE LAST

01:31 - 12.133 DAYS THAT YOU WERE IN NEW YORK,

01:31 - 13.568 BEFORE YOU HAD GONE OFF TO

01:31 - 15.203 COLLEGE, I MEAN, LIKE BREAKING

01:31 - 16.604 UP THE GANG OF FRIENDS OR

01:31 - 17.738 ANYTHING LIKE THAT?

01:31 - 19.373 DID ANY OF YOUR FRIENDS GO OFF

01:31 - 20.208 TO PENN ALSO?

01:31 - 20.842 >> YEAH.

01:31 - 22.577 ACTUALLY, I WAS VERY FORTUNATE.

01:31 - 24.245 TWO OF MY HIGH SCHOOL FRIENDS

01:31 - 25.513 WENT WITH ME TO PENN.

01:31 - 27.081 ONE WAS MY ROOMMATE, WHO WAS A

01:31 - 28.616 GUY BY THE NAME OF RICH BING,

01:31 - 31.986 WHO I STILL SEE TO THIS DAY, AND

01:31 - 33.788 ANOTHER FELLA BY THE NAME OF

01:31 - 35.256 ANDY KAHN, WHO WENT TO

01:31 - 36.057 RIVERDALE.

01:31 - 38.025 HE WAS MY ROOMMATE AT PENN, BUT

01:31 - 39.727 WE WERE FRIENDS, AND ANDY,

01:31 - 41.562 PROBABLY AS MUCH AS ANY OF MY

01:31 - 42.964 RIVERDALE CLASSMATES,

01:31 - 44.832 SPEARHEADED MY EFFORTS TO GET

01:31 - 46.400 ELECTED D.A., MAYOR, AND

01:31 - 47.168 GOVERNOR.

01:31 - 49.103 HE ALWAYS GOT THE RIVERDALE CREW

01:31 - 50.972 TOGETHER TO DO FUNDRAISERS FOR

01:31 - 52.707 ME, AND I GOT TO KNOW ANDY'S

01:31 - 54.342 KIDS AND HIS WIFE OVER THE

01:31 - 54.909 YEARS.

01:31 - 56.777 AND SO I WAS VERY LUCKY.

01:31 - 59.480 THEY WENT WITH ME.

01:31 - 00.915 BUT AGAIN, I NEVER HAD ANY

01:32 - 02.450 TROUBLE MAKING FRIENDS, SO I

01:32 - 04.085 WASN'T WORRIED ABOUT THAT, BUT

01:32 - 05.453 IT WAS STILL NICE TO HAVE

01:32 - 06.487 SOMEONE YOU KNEW.

01:32 - 07.955 >> WHY DID YOU PICK PENN?

01:32 - 09.724 >> WELL, 'CAUSE I DIDN'T GET IN

01:32 - 10.625 TO PRINCETON.

01:32 - 12.426 I APPLIED TO PRINCETON AND PENN.

01:32 - 14.161 AND IN THOSE DAYS, THERE WAS A

01:32 - 14.595 GAP.

01:32 - 17.231 HARVARD, YALE, AND PRINCETON

01:32 - 20.034 WERE HERE AND THEN MAYBE BROWN

01:32 - 22.904 AND COLUMBIA WERE HERE AND THEN

01:32 - 24.138 PENN, DARTMOUTH, AND CORNELL

01:32 - 25.406 WERE THERE IN THE IVY LEAGUE.

01:32 - 27.108 SO, I HAD DECENT MARKS AND

01:32 - 29.176 PRETTY GOOD BOARDS, BUT NOT GOOD

01:32 - 30.945 ENOUGH TO GET INTO HARVARD,

01:32 - 32.280 YALE, OR PRINCETON.

01:32 - 33.514 MY BROTHER WENT TO PRINCETON,

01:32 - 34.615 WHICH IS WHY I APPLIED TO

01:32 - 35.149 PRINCETON.

01:32 - 36.284 I GOT TURNED DOWN.

01:32 - 37.685 I GOT ACCEPTED TO PENN.

01:32 - 38.986 THINGS HAVE CHANGED.

01:32 - 40.721 NOW I THINK THE BIG THREE HAS

01:32 - 42.490 PROBABLY BEEN JOINED BY PENN.

01:32 - 43.991 THOSE ARE THE FOUR BEST.

01:32 - 45.459 AND THEN I THINK YOU HAVE BROWN

01:32 - 46.928 AND COLUMBIA AND DARTMOUTH AND

01:32 - 47.862 CORNELL FOLLOWING.

01:32 - 50.498 BUT PENN NOW IS ON A LEVEL THAT

01:32 - 52.166 OFTEN BEATS SOME OF THE BIG

01:32 - 53.067 THREE IN THE

01:32 - 54.669 U.S. NEWS & WORLD REPORT

01:32 - 55.336 RANKING.

01:32 - 57.838 BUT IN THOSE DAYS, PENN WAS --

01:32 - 00.508 PRINCETON KIDS CONSIDERED PENN A

01:33 - 02.777 SAFETY SCHOOL.

01:33 - 04.712 NO MORE.

01:33 - 06.547 >> WHAT WAS YOUR MAJOR?

01:33 - 08.716 >> POLITICAL SCIENCE.

01:33 - 11.519 >> DID YOU HAVE A GOAL IN MIND?

01:33 - 12.453 >> NO.

01:33 - 14.722 I WAS A TYPICAL 17-YEAR-OLD KID.

01:33 - 16.924 I HAD NO GOAL IN MIND, AND WHEN

01:33 - 18.859 I STARTED MY SENIOR YEAR, I

01:33 - 21.128 DIDN'T KNOW WHAT I WANTED TO DO.

01:33 - 23.197 I APPLIED TO BUSINESS SCHOOL.

01:33 - 24.966 I APPLIED TO LAW SCHOOL.

01:33 - 26.567 I JUST DIDN'T KNOW WHAT I --

01:33 - 28.169 I KNEW I WASN'T READY FOR THE

01:33 - 29.937 WORKING WORLD, AND I DIDN'T WANT

01:33 - 31.672 TO NECESSARILY FIGHT IN VIETNAM.

01:33 - 34.208 SO I APPLIED FOR BOTH LAW SCHOOL

01:33 - 35.910 AND BUSINESS SCHOOL.

01:33 - 37.645 AS AN UNDERGRADUATE, DID YOU

01:33 - 42.316 GOOF OFF A LOT?

01:33 - 43.784 >> I GUESS THE ONLY QUESTION

01:33 - 45.152 WOULD BE THE TERM "A LOT."

01:33 - 46.053 I DID GOOF OFF.

01:33 - 47.688 I DIDN'T STUDY AS HARD AS I

01:33 - 49.624 SHOULD HAVE.

01:33 - 51.058 I DID WELL IN THE COURSES I

01:33 - 51.559 LIKED.

01:33 - 53.027 I DIDN'T DO VERY WELL IN THE

01:33 - 54.228 COURSES I DIDN'T LIKE.

01:33 - 58.099 I WAS ON PROBATION ONE SEMESTER.

01:33 - 02.436 AND -- BUT, ON BALANCE, I THINK

01:34 - 05.373 I GRADUATED WITH 2.6 GRADE

01:34 - 07.041 POINT, YOU KNOW, NOT TERRIBLE.

01:34 - 08.409 I WAS NEVER IN DANGER OF

01:34 - 09.977 FLUNKING OUT EXCEPT THAT ONE

01:34 - 10.645 SEMESTER.

01:34 - 13.047 BUT I JUST DIDN'T DO ANYWHERE

01:34 - 15.383 NEAR WHAT I COULD HAVE DONE.

01:34 - 17.251 BUT AS IT TURNED OUT, IT TURNED

01:34 - 19.153 OUT TERRIFICALLY BECAUSE I WENT

01:34 - 20.655 TO VILLANOVA LAW SCHOOL.

01:34 - 25.726 I STILL STAYED IN THE AREA.

01:34 - 27.194 I DIDN'T REALLY KNOW THAT I

01:34 - 28.829 WANTED TO BE A LAWYER THE DAY I

01:34 - 30.364 ENTERED VILLANOVA LAW SCHOOL.

01:34 - 31.999 AND THE SECOND DAY I WAS THERE,

01:34 - 34.368 I HAD MY FIRST CLASS IN CRIMINAL

01:34 - 35.336 LAW.

01:34 - 36.804 AND WE HAD A GREAT, GREAT, GREAT

01:34 - 37.872 TEACHER BY THE NAME OF

01:34 - 40.274 DONALD GIANNELLA.

01:34 - 44.178 AND HE WAS SPECTACULAR.

01:34 - 45.980 AND THE CLASS WAS SO MUCH BETTER

01:34 - 47.248 THAN THE OTHER CLASS.

01:34 - 48.182 IT CAME ALIVE.

01:34 - 49.350 IT WAS INTERESTING.

01:34 - 50.384 IT WAS EXCITING.

01:34 - 52.253 AND OF COURSE CRIMINAL LAW DEALS

01:34 - 54.021 WITH THINGS THAT ARE A PART OF

01:34 - 55.656 ORDINARY LIFE, NOT ABSTRACT

01:34 - 57.124 PARTS OF THE TAX CODE OR

01:34 - 58.959 CORPORATE LAW OR SOMETHING LIKE

01:34 - 59.460 THAT.

01:34 - 00.895 IT DEALT IN UNDERSTANDABLE

01:35 - 02.296 THINGS, AND IT WAS PRETTY

01:35 - 02.963 EXCITING.

01:35 - 04.799 AND AFTER ABOUT FOUR WEEKS, I

01:35 - 06.600 DECIDED I WANTED TO PRACTICE

01:35 - 08.502 CRIMINAL LAW AND I DIDN'T WANT

01:35 - 10.004 TO REPRESENT CRIMINALS.

01:35 - 11.338 I WANTED TO GO TO THE D.A.'s

01:35 - 11.806 OFFICE.

01:35 - 16.944 AND DONALD GIANNELLA REALLY PUT

01:35 - 18.679 ME ON TRACK FOR WHAT I WANTED TO

01:35 - 19.080 DO.

01:35 - 20.715 I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT I WANTED TO

01:35 - 22.349 DO WHEN I WENT TO LAW SCHOOL,

01:35 - 23.984 AND HE INSPIRED ME TO BECOME A

01:35 - 24.985 CRIMINAL LAWYER.

01:35 - 27.354 AND I HAD A GREAT CONSTITUTIONAL

01:35 - 29.657 LAW PROFESSOR THE NEXT SEMESTER

01:35 - 31.525 BY THE NAME OF DON DOWD.

01:35 - 33.427 CON LAW AND CRIMINAL LAW ARE

01:35 - 34.829 VERY MUCH THE SAME.

01:35 - 36.664 SO, I WAS TRYING TO GET A SUMMER

01:35 - 38.365 JOB, BUT IN THOSE DAYS, IT WAS

01:35 - 40.101 IMPOSSIBLE TO GET A SUMMER JOB

01:35 - 41.535 AS A FIRST-YEAR STUDENT.

01:35 - 44.872 SO, I WAS PRETTY MUCH

01:35 - 46.273 DESPAIRFUL, AND I WAS THINKING

01:35 - 47.742 OF GOING BACK AND WORKING IN THE

01:35 - 50.077 FACTORY WHEN A FRIEND OF MINE BY

01:35 - 51.979 THE NAME OF ART BELLIS --

01:35 - 54.181 OH, BY THE WAY, I DIDN'T TELL

01:35 - 56.117 YOU THE BILL SHANE STORY.

01:35 - 58.586 LATER ON, AS GOVERNOR, I GOT AN

01:35 - 01.122 APPLICATION FROM BILL SHANE, WHO

01:36 - 03.491 HAD BEEN ON THE PUBLIC UTILITY

01:36 - 04.592 COMMISSION.

01:36 - 06.861 HE WANTED TO GO BACK ON.

01:36 - 08.295 SO, I SHOULD HAVE TURNED HIM

01:36 - 09.663 DOWN JUST LIKE HE TURNED ME

01:36 - 10.698 DOWN, BUT I DIDN'T.

01:36 - 12.199 I ACCEPTED HIM, AND BILL DID A

01:36 - 14.001 VERY FINE JOB ON THE P.U.C. FOR

01:36 - 15.836 ME.

01:36 - 18.472 BUT WHAT REMINDED ME OF IT IS,

01:36 - 20.808 I'M IN THE HALLWAY IN LATE

01:36 - 23.077 APRIL, AND I RUN IN TO A GUY BY

01:36 - 24.845 THE NAME OF ART BELLIS.

01:36 - 26.013 AND HIS FATHER WAS A CITY

01:36 - 27.381 COUNCILMAN HERE IN PHILADELPHIA

01:36 - 29.850 BY THE NAME OF ISADORE BELLIS.

01:36 - 35.055 AND ART SAID, "WHAT ARE YOU

01:36 - 35.723 DOING THIS SUMMER?"

01:36 - 37.124 I SAID, "I COULDN'T GET A JOB.

01:36 - 38.492 I'M GONNA PROBABLY GO BACK AND

01:36 - 39.760 WORK IN MY FOLKS' FACTORY."

01:36 - 41.462 HE SAID, "WELL, I WAS GONNA WORK

01:36 - 42.830 IN THE D.A.'s OFFICE AS A

01:36 - 44.231 VOLUNTEER IN THEIR SUMMER

01:36 - 45.566 PROGRAM, BUT I'M GETTING

01:36 - 46.934 MARRIED, AND MY FOLKS ARE

01:36 - 48.135 SENDING US TO EUROPE.

01:36 - 49.503 WOULD YOU LIKE TO DO IT?"

01:36 - 50.571 HE SAID, "I KNOW YOU'RE

01:36 - 51.839 INTERESTED IN CRIMINAL LAW."

01:36 - 53.007 AND I SAID, "I'D LOVE TO."

01:36 - 56.477 SO, FIRST I CALL MY AUNT STELLA

01:36 - 57.945 'CAUSE THEY WERE BASICALLY

01:36 - 59.380 PAYING FOR MY EDUCATION AT

01:36 - 00.848 VILLANOVA AND GAVE ME WHAT

01:37 - 02.383 LITTLE SPENDING MONEY I HAD.

01:37 - 04.285 AND I SAID, "IS IT ALL RIGHT IF

01:37 - 05.252 I WORK THERE?

01:37 - 06.921 I WON'T MAKE ANY MONEY, SO

01:37 - 08.722 YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO CONTINUE

01:37 - 10.624 SUBSIDIZING ME, BUT IT'S A GOOD

01:37 - 11.592 OPPORTUNITY."

01:37 - 13.093 AND MY AUNT STELLA, TO HER

01:37 - 14.728 CREDIT, ABSOLUTELY RECOGNIZED

01:37 - 16.430 THAT HERE WAS SOMETHING THAT I

01:37 - 18.165 HAD A REAL INTEREST IN, AND SHE

01:37 - 19.834 COULD TELL THAT I DID, SO SHE

01:37 - 20.501 SAID YES.

01:37 - 22.570 SO, I WENT DOWN TO THE D.A.'s

01:37 - 24.638 OFFICE TO MEET ARLEN SPECTER.

01:37 - 26.607 THEY SET UP AN APPOINTMENT.

01:37 - 28.776 I GOT DOWN THERE AT ABOUT 3:00,

01:37 - 30.811 AND I SAW HER ARLEN AT ABOUT

01:37 - 32.079 QUARTER TO 7:00.

01:37 - 33.781 HE MADE ME WAIT ALMOST FOUR

01:37 - 34.381 HOURS.

01:37 - 35.850 BUT THEN I TALKED TO HIM AND I

01:37 - 37.384 HIT IT OFF WITH HIM AND THEN HE

01:37 - 38.886 OFFERED ME THE JOB, SUCH AS IT

01:37 - 39.253 WAS.

01:37 - 40.588 DIDN'T PAY ANYTHING.

01:37 - 42.523 AND I WORKED THE WHOLE SUMMER

01:37 - 43.290 FOR FREE.

01:37 - 44.558 I DID A GOOD JOB.

01:37 - 46.627 SO, THE NEXT YEAR, I APPLIED FOR

01:37 - 48.395 THEIR PAID SUMMER PROGRAM.

01:37 - 51.665 I WAS HIRED AT $1.25 AN HOUR.

01:37 - 53.767 AND AT $1.25 AN HOUR, I MADE 60

01:37 - 54.969 BUCKS A WEEK.

01:37 - 56.403 >> WHAT YEAR WAS THAT?

01:37 - 57.771 >> I THINK I MADE 80 BUCKS A

01:37 - 59.240 WEEK 'CAUSE I WORKED 60 HOURS.

01:37 - 01.775 THAT WOULD HAVE BEEN -- THE

01:38 - 04.578 FIRST YEAR WOULD HAVE BEEN THE

01:38 - 06.080 SUMMER OF '66.

01:38 - 06.947 >> '66.

01:38 - 08.549 >> SUMMER OF '66.

01:38 - 10.384 THEN THE FIRST YEAR I GOT PAID

01:38 - 11.819 WAS THE SUMMER OF '67.

01:38 - 15.256 AND THEN I GOT A FULL-TIME JOB,

01:38 - 18.525 WHICH I STARTED IN THE SPRING

01:38 - 21.595 OF -- OR THE SUMMER OF '68,

01:38 - 24.265 AFTER I PASSED THE BAR.

01:38 - 26.834 BUT ONE OF THE GREAT IRONIES --

01:38 - 28.569 ART BELLIS' FATHER,

01:38 - 31.071 ISADORE BELLIS, GOT IN TROUBLE

01:38 - 33.240 AND WAS PROSECUTED BY THE

01:38 - 35.943 SPECIAL PROSECUTOR'S OFFICE.

01:38 - 40.948 AND THE APPELLATE COURT THREW

01:38 - 41.782 THE CASE OUT.

01:38 - 43.217 BY THAT TIME, THE SPECIAL

01:38 - 44.818 PROSECUTOR'S OFFICE WAS GONE.

01:38 - 45.886 THE CASES HAD ALL BEEN

01:38 - 47.121 TRANSFERRED TO THE D.A.'s

01:38 - 47.588 OFFICE.

01:38 - 49.423 I HAD BEEN THE NEWLY ELECTED

01:38 - 51.392 D.A. AT THAT TIME AND I HAD TO

01:38 - 53.227 MAKE THE DECISION WHETHER TO

01:38 - 55.262 APPEAL OR NOT AND WE DID APPEAL

01:38 - 57.331 AND THE SENTENCE WAS REINSTATED.

01:38 - 58.966 I FELT SORT OF BAD ABOUT IT,

01:38 - 00.734 BUT, I MEAN, THE LAW WAS PRETTY

01:39 - 01.268 CLEAR.

01:39 - 04.271 SO, BILL SHANE AND ARTHUR AND

01:39 - 07.574 ISADORE BELLIS SORT OF HAD A LOT

01:39 - 10.844 TO DO WITH DETERMINING MY FUTURE

01:39 - 13.781 AND THEN CAME BACK AND I HAD

01:39 - 16.917 CONTACT WITH HIM IN LATER LIFE.

01:39 - 17.985 >> I WANT TO GET YOU TO TALK

01:39 - 19.053 ABOUT PENN A LITTLE BIT MORE.

01:39 - 20.821 WHEN YOU ARRIVED IN TOWN, IT WAS

01:39 - 22.489 YOUR FIRST TIME YOU LIVED AWAY

01:39 - 23.190 FROM HOME?

01:39 - 25.426 >> YEAH, SURE, OTHER THAN I WENT

01:39 - 27.728 TO CAMP DURING THE SUMMER.

01:39 - 29.296 >> HOW IS IT ADJUSTING TO PHILLY

01:39 - 30.664 AFTER BEING A NEW YORK KID?

01:39 - 31.865 >> PRETTY EASY.

01:39 - 33.901 AND IT'S INTERESTING -- IN THOSE

01:39 - 35.836 DAYS, THE PENN KIDS DIDN'T USE

01:39 - 37.738 PHILADELPHIA NEARLY AS WELL AS

01:39 - 39.173 THE PENN KIDS DO NOW.

01:39 - 40.874 WE BASICALLY STAYED ON CAMPUS.

01:39 - 42.710 THE ONLY TIME WE WENT OFF CAMPUS

01:39 - 44.178 WAS -- THERE USED TO BE A

01:39 - 47.915 HOT SHOPPES IN PHILADELPHIA, OUT

01:39 - 50.184 SOMEWHERE AROUND THE CITY LINE.

01:39 - 51.518 AND HOT SHOPPES IN THOSE DAYS

01:39 - 52.720 WAS LIKE THE McDONALD'S OF

01:39 - 53.153 TODAY.

01:39 - 54.455 AND IT WAS NEW, AND EVERYONE

01:39 - 55.723 LOVED THE HAMBURGERS AND THE

01:39 - 56.156 FRIES.

01:39 - 57.791 SO, WE WOULD OCCASIONALLY GO OUT

01:39 - 59.360 THERE TO HOT SHOPPES, BUT THAT

01:39 - 00.327 WAS BASICALLY IT.

01:40 - 02.262 I MEAN, WE STAYED PRETTY MUCH ON

01:40 - 02.896 CAMPUS.

01:40 - 04.732 AND IT WAS AN URBAN CAMPUS, NO

01:40 - 06.600 DOUBT, BUT IF YOU KNOW THE PENN

01:40 - 08.235 AREA, BY THAT TIME, IT HAD

01:40 - 10.004 BECOME FAIRLY SELF-CONTAINED.

01:40 - 11.271 >> WHERE'D YOU LIVE?

01:40 - 13.107 >> I LIVED MY FIRST YEAR IN THE

01:40 - 15.009 DORMS, FRESHMAN DORMS, MY SECOND

01:40 - 16.910 AND THIRD YEAR, IN MY FRATERNITY

01:40 - 18.746 HOUSE, WHICH WAS PI LAMBDA PHI,

01:40 - 20.347 AND MY FOURTH YEAR IN AN

01:40 - 22.216 APARTMENT WITH MY ROOMMATE, A

01:40 - 23.484 GUY BY THE NAME OF

01:40 - 25.386 PETE FANTINE, REALLY GOOD GUY,

01:40 - 26.954 WENT TO BALDWIN HIGH IN

01:40 - 27.821 PITTSBURGH.

01:40 - 29.556 AND I LATER GOT TO SPEAK AT

01:40 - 30.557 BALDWIN HIGH.

01:40 - 32.393 AND OTHER THAN PETE, MY BEST

01:40 - 34.361 FRIEND WAS A GUY BY THE NAME OF

01:40 - 35.362 FREDDY GREEN.

01:40 - 37.164 PETE WAS A BASKETBALL PLAYER,

01:40 - 38.432 SCHOLARSHIP PLAYER.

01:40 - 40.100 FRED GREEN WAS A BASKETBALL

01:40 - 41.902 PLAYER AT PENN, A SCHOLARSHIP

01:40 - 42.536 PLAYER.

01:40 - 44.438 HE WENT TO HICKORY HIGH SCHOOL

01:40 - 46.373 IN HERMITAGE, WHICH IS RIGHT IN

01:40 - 47.941 THAT SHARON/MERCER AREA.

01:40 - 49.910 AND WHEN FRED WAS A SENIOR,

01:40 - 51.745 HICKORY HAD WON THE STATE

01:40 - 52.846 CHAMPIONSHIP.

01:40 - 54.782 SO, WHEN I WAS PUSHING FOR MY

01:40 - 56.917 EDUCATION BUDGET, THE STAFF, NOT

01:40 - 58.919 KNOWING, ARRANGED FOR ME TO GO

01:40 - 00.854 TO HICKORY HIGH SCHOOL, AND I

01:41 - 02.923 GOT TO SEE A PICTURE OF FRED ON

01:41 - 03.724 THE WALL.

01:41 - 05.759 AND ONE OF HIS TEAMMATES WAS A

01:41 - 07.528 TEACHER THERE.

01:41 - 09.863 AGAIN, MY PAST KEPT COMING UP

01:41 - 12.399 AND -- NOT BITING ME, BUT I KEPT

01:41 - 14.201 RUNNING INTO MY PAST.

01:41 - 15.536 >> WHY DID YOU JOIN A

01:41 - 16.336 FRATERNITY?

01:41 - 18.272 >> 'CAUSE IN THOSE DAYS AT PENN,

01:41 - 19.973 YOU COULD ONLY LIVE IN THE DORMS

01:41 - 21.075 YOUR FRESHMAN YEAR.

01:41 - 22.709 THERE WERE NO UPPER-CLASS DORMS

01:41 - 23.577 IN THOSE DAYS.

01:41 - 24.978 SO, IT WAS EITHER AN APARTMENT

01:41 - 27.214 OR A FRATERNITY, AND, YOU KNOW,

01:41 - 30.551 MOST OF -- I'D SAY 60% OF THE

01:41 - 32.352 STUDENTS JOINED FRATERNITIES.

01:41 - 34.388 >> DID IT HAVE ACTIVITIES OR

01:41 - 35.522 JUST PARTIES?

01:41 - 37.324 >> JUST BASICALLY PARTIES.

01:41 - 38.992 IN THOSE DAYS, WE WEREN'T NEARLY

01:41 - 40.461 AS SOCIALLY CONSCIOUS AS THE

01:41 - 41.728 PENN KIDS ARE NOW.

01:41 - 43.864 >> DO YOU REMEMBER ANY TEACHERS

01:41 - 46.433 YOU HAD AT PENN WHO YOU LIKED?

01:41 - 48.602 >> YEAH, I HAD A

01:41 - 49.937 PROFESSOR RIASANOVSKY, WHO WAS

01:41 - 51.305 RUSSIAN HISTORY, WHO WAS JUST A

01:41 - 52.039 GREAT TEACHER.

01:41 - 54.007 MADE RUSSIAN HISTORY COME ALIVE.

01:41 - 57.444 HE WAS AWESOME.

01:41 - 59.813 HE WAS ABOUT THE ONE I REMEMBER

01:41 - 00.881 MOST.

01:42 - 02.349 >> WERE THERE -- WAS PENN HARD

01:42 - 03.750 FOR YOU, COMPARED TO THE HIGH

01:42 - 05.285 SCHOOL YOU WENT TO, OR WAS IT AN

01:42 - 06.153 OKAY TRANSITION?

01:42 - 07.888 >> I MEAN, IT WAS -- IT WASN'T

01:42 - 09.756 EASY, BUT IT WASN'T PARTICULARLY

01:42 - 10.290 HARD.

01:42 - 14.061 AGAIN, IT WASN'T THE PENN OF

01:42 - 14.962 MODERN DAY.

01:42 - 17.698 WHEN JESSE WENT TO PENN -- AND

01:42 - 23.437 JESSE ENTERED IN 1997 --

01:42 - 24.872 NO. 1998.

01:42 - 26.473 JESSE ENTERED IN '98.

01:42 - 28.509 AFTER ABOUT TWO MONTHS, MIDGE

01:42 - 30.410 AND I ASKED HIM HOW HE WAS

01:42 - 32.146 FINDING IT ACADEMICALLY.

01:42 - 33.147 HE SAID, "IT'S HARD."

01:42 - 34.414 HE SAID, "AT PENN CHARTER,"

01:42 - 35.582 WHERE HE HAD GONE TO HIGH

01:42 - 36.984 SCHOOL -- AND PENN CHARTER IS A

01:42 - 38.285 VERY FINE SCHOOL -- HE SAID,

01:42 - 39.620 "THERE ARE ALWAYS HALF OF THE

01:42 - 40.921 KIDS WHO ARE AT THE BOTTOM OF

01:42 - 41.522 THE CURVE.

01:42 - 42.823 YOU CAN ALWAYS COUNT ON THEM

01:42 - 44.024 BEING AT THE BOTTOM OF THE

01:42 - 44.491 CURVE."

01:42 - 46.693 HE SAID, "AT PENN, THERE IS NO

01:42 - 48.295 BOTTOM OF THE CURVE.

01:42 - 53.167 EVERY TEST, YOU'RE UP AGAINST

01:42 - 54.935 EVERYONE WHO'S AS GOOD A STUDENT

01:42 - 56.870 AND AS BRIGHT AS YOU ARE."

01:42 - 58.071 >> YOU FLUNK ANYTHING?

01:42 - 59.039 >> DID I FLUNK ANYTHING?

01:42 - 00.140 THE YEAR I WAS ON PROBATION,

01:43 - 01.208 YEAH, I FLUNKED A COUPLE OF

01:43 - 03.944 COURSES, BUT NOT ENOUGH THAT I

01:43 - 05.445 COULDN'T MAKE THEM UP IN THE

01:43 - 06.880 REGULAR COURSE OF TIME SO I

01:43 - 07.915 GRADUATED ON TIME.

01:43 - 09.349 >> YOU WERE INVOLVED IN STUDENT

01:43 - 10.017 GOVERNMENT?

01:43 - 11.285 >> YEAH, I WAS THE -- I GOT

01:43 - 12.486 ELECTED VICE PRESIDENT OF

01:43 - 13.987 STUDENT GOVERNMENT AND THEN LOST

01:43 - 15.422 IN MY ELECTION FOR PRESIDENT OF

01:43 - 16.557 THE STUDENT GOVERNMENT.

01:43 - 18.225 >> WHAT DOES STUDENT GOVERNMENT

01:43 - 18.592 DO?

01:43 - 20.060 >> IN THOSE DAYS, NOT MUCH,

01:43 - 21.361 NOT MUCH.

01:43 - 23.697 IT HAD SOME INTERACTION WITH THE

01:43 - 24.965 ADMINISTRATION.

01:43 - 27.334 IT TALKED ABOUT SOME ISSUES LIKE

01:43 - 29.670 PARKING ISSUES ON CAMPUS, ISSUES

01:43 - 33.440 LIKE...

01:43 - 37.811 WE TRIED TO GET THE SCHOOL TO

01:43 - 39.746 TAKE OUT OF OUR TUITION TO GET

01:43 - 41.748 US A CARD THAT GOT US IN TO ALL

01:43 - 43.717 ATHLETIC EVENTS FOR FREE AND SO

01:43 - 45.219 WE DIDN'T HAVE TO PAY.

01:43 - 47.287 I MEAN, THINGS LIKE THAT.

01:43 - 48.956 IN THOSE DAYS, IT WASN'T

01:43 - 51.024 INVOLVED IN MACRO ISSUES HAVING

01:43 - 52.759 TO DO WITH WORLD PEACE OR

01:43 - 54.127 ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

01:43 - 55.329 IT WAS PRETTY MUNDANE STUFF.

01:43 - 56.463 >> DID YOU CAMPAIGN FOR IT?

01:43 - 57.898 >> OH, SURE.

01:43 - 58.765 >> YOUR FIRST TASTE OF

01:43 - 00.467 CAMPAIGNING?

01:44 - 01.802 >> I HAD BEEN IN STUDENT

01:44 - 03.337 GOVERNMENT IN HIGH SCHOOL, AS

01:44 - 03.804 WELL.

01:44 - 06.673 BUT, YEAH, THERE WERE POLITICAL

01:44 - 08.041 PARTIES, BELIEVE IT OR NOT.

01:44 - 09.676 THERE WAS ONE PARTY THAT WAS

01:44 - 11.411 BASICALLY THE FRATERNITY PARTY

01:44 - 13.213 AND ONE PARTY THAT WAS BASICALLY

01:44 - 14.715 THE INDEPENDENT PARTY FOR

01:44 - 15.983 NON-FRATERNITY-GOERS.

01:44 - 17.851 SO, I LEARNED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT

01:44 - 19.486 PARTIES, AND WE LEARNED, YOU

01:44 - 21.788 KNOW, THE VOTER TURNOUT.

01:44 - 23.924 SO, AT THE FRATERNITIES -- WHEN

01:44 - 25.425 YOU VOTED IN A STUDENT

01:44 - 27.394 GOVERNMENT ELECTION, YOUR CARD

01:44 - 28.328 GOT PUNCHED.

01:44 - 29.796 YOU HAD A STUDENT I.D. CARD.

01:44 - 30.664 IT GOT PUNCHED.

01:44 - 32.766 SO, THE PARTY ENFORCED A RULE

01:44 - 35.002 THAT NOBODY COULD EAT DINNER AT

01:44 - 37.170 ANY OF THE FRATERNITIES UNLESS

01:44 - 39.172 THEIR CARD WAS PUNCHED -- A

01:44 - 41.241 LITTLE BIT LIKE THE

01:44 - 43.577 OBAMA FOR AMERICA TEAM.

01:44 - 45.178 >> NOW, WERE YOU ABLE TO ADOPTED

01:44 - 46.747 THE PHILADELPHIA SPORTS TEAMS TO

01:44 - 47.648 BE FANS OF OR --

01:44 - 49.316 >> NO, NOT IN THOSE DAYS.

01:44 - 51.752 THE ONLY -- I REMAINED A GIANTS

01:44 - 53.353 FAN IN FOOTBALL.

01:44 - 54.821 THE ONLY TEAM THAT I SORT OF

01:44 - 00.794 ADOPTED WAS THE PHILLIES BECAUSE

01:45 - 02.429 THE METS HAD JUST STARTED IN

01:45 - 03.697 NEW YORK AND I HAD NO

01:45 - 05.265 RELATIONSHIP WITH THE METS.

01:45 - 06.933 AND THEY STARTED AFTER I WAS

01:45 - 08.502 DOWN IN PHILADELPHIA, SO I

01:45 - 10.337 NEVER -- TO THIS DAY, I HAVE NO

01:45 - 11.638 FEELING FOR THE METS.

01:45 - 13.440 WHATEVER FEELING I HAVE IS FOR

01:45 - 15.008 THE SAN FRANCISCO GIANTS.

01:45 - 17.344 AND WHAT MADE ME A PHILLIES FAN

01:45 - 19.680 WAS SEEING THE ABSOLUTE TORTURE

01:45 - 21.948 THAT THIS CITY WENT THROUGH IN

01:45 - 24.718 '64, WHEN, AS YOU KNOW, WITH 10

01:45 - 26.520 GAMES TO GO, THE PHILLIES

01:45 - 28.522 WERE -- WITH 12 GAMES TO GO,

01:45 - 30.557 THEY WERE UP 6 1/2 GAMES OVER

01:45 - 32.459 THE CARDINALS AND THE REDS, WHAT

01:45 - 34.361 WAS A LEAD THAT COULDN'T

01:45 - 35.896 POSSIBLY BE BLOWN.

01:45 - 37.531 AND THEN THE PHILLIES LOST 10 IN

01:45 - 38.031 A ROW.

01:45 - 41.768 AND WE GOT TO SEE HOW THE CITY

01:45 - 43.136 DIED A LITTLE BIT.

01:45 - 45.339 THE "P" LADIES -- THE LADIES WHO

01:45 - 47.341 CLEANED UP OUR ROOMS -- THEY

01:45 - 48.408 TOOK IT HARD.

01:45 - 49.910 THE PEOPLE WHO WORKED IN THE

01:45 - 51.545 RESTAURANTS, STUFF LIKE THAT --

01:45 - 52.779 THEY TOOK IT HARD.

01:45 - 53.880 THE BUILDINGS AND GROUND

01:45 - 55.148 PEOPLE -- THEY TOOK IT HARD.

01:45 - 57.017 AND YOU COULD SEE THE CITY DIE A

01:45 - 58.251 LITTLE BIT EACH DAY.

01:45 - 00.787 AND, YOU KNOW, IT WAS SO BIZARRE

01:46 - 03.123 AND THE CITY WAS SO EMOTIONAL

01:46 - 05.859 THAT I SORT OF HAD A -- SORT OF

01:46 - 08.495 FELL IN LOVE WITH THE BASEBALL

01:46 - 12.132 TEAM AND SORT OF BECAME A

01:46 - 13.967 PHILLIES FAN EVER SINCE.

01:46 - 14.801 AND INTERESTINGLY,

01:46 - 16.036 DAVE MONTGOMERY, THE PRESIDENT

01:46 - 19.606 OF THE PHILLIES -- I AM PROBABLY

01:46 - 21.041 DIRECTLY RESPONSIBLE FOR HIM

01:46 - 22.409 BEING THE PRESIDENT OF THE

01:46 - 23.009 PHILLIES.

01:46 - 26.980 WHEN WE WERE -- I WAS FINISHING

01:46 - 28.782 MY SECOND YEAR OF LAW SCHOOL,

01:46 - 30.384 DAVID WAS FINISHING UP AT

01:46 - 31.051 WHARTON.

01:46 - 32.753 IN THOSE DAYS, YOU COULD GO

01:46 - 34.654 DIRECTLY FROM PENN UNDERGRAD TO

01:46 - 36.189 WHARTON BUSINESS SCHOOL.

01:46 - 37.958 AND DAVID HAD HIS MBA.

01:46 - 40.127 AND HE HAD A JOB OFFER FROM THE

01:46 - 42.362 THE CONTAINER CAN CORPORATION OF

01:46 - 44.464 AMERICA, CCA, IN PHILADELPHIA.

01:46 - 46.166 AND HE WAS GONNA GO WORK FOR A

01:46 - 47.934 CORPORATION THAT MADE CANS, THE

01:46 - 49.603 CANS THAT YOU BOTTLE SODA IN,

01:46 - 52.038 PEPSI, 7UP, WHATEVER.

01:46 - 54.107 AND I SAID, "DAVID," I SAID,

01:46 - 55.075 "YOU CAN'T DO THAT."

01:46 - 56.810 I SAID, "YOU OUGHT TO TRY TO

01:46 - 58.478 MAKE YOUR LIVING IN SPORTS.

01:46 - 59.613 YOU LOVE SPORTS."

01:46 - 01.982 I SAID, "I KNOW --" AND BY THEN,

01:47 - 03.517 I HAD GOTTEN TO KNOW

01:47 - 05.619 IRV KOSLOFF, THE OWNER OF THE

01:47 - 07.053 76ers AT THE TIME.

01:47 - 08.288 AND I SAID, "LET ME CALL

01:47 - 09.890 IRV KOSLOFF AND SEE IF I CAN GET

01:47 - 11.391 YOU AN INTERVIEW TO SEE IF YOU

01:47 - 12.292 CAN GO TO WORK."

01:47 - 13.360 AND DAVID GOT AN INTERVIEW

01:47 - 14.394 WITH A GUY BY THE NAME OF

01:47 - 16.430 DON DeJARDIN.

01:47 - 18.198 AND HE WENT, AND DON DeJARDIN --

01:47 - 19.833 THEY HAD A GOOD INTERVIEW, BUT

01:47 - 21.501 DON DeJARDIN SAID, "LOOK, I'LL

01:47 - 23.170 KEEP YOUR NAME ON FILE, BUT WE

01:47 - 24.771 HAVE NO POSITIONS RIGHT NOW."

01:47 - 26.640 SO, THAT STARTED DAVID THINKING,

01:47 - 28.108 AND HE HAD KNOWN FROM THE

01:47 - 29.876 LITTLE QUAKERS -- HE HAD KNOWN

01:47 - 31.845 SOMEONE WHO KNEW ROBIN ROBERTS.

01:47 - 33.680 SO, HE CONTACTED ROBIN ROBERTS.

01:47 - 35.449 ROBIN ROBERTS PUT HIM TOGETHER

01:47 - 37.317 WITH BILL GILES, WHO WAS THE NEW

01:47 - 38.685 OWNER OF THE PHILLIES.

01:47 - 40.353 AND BILL GILES AND DAVID HIT

01:47 - 40.987 IT OFF.

01:47 - 42.689 THEY BECAME LIFELONG FRIENDS.

01:47 - 44.324 AND BILL GILES HIRED DAVID.

01:47 - 46.393 BUT HAD I NOT PUT THE BUG IN HIS

01:47 - 48.295 EAR AND SENT HIM TO INTERVIEW

01:47 - 50.363 WITH THE 76ers, HE'D PROBABLY BE

01:47 - 51.598 THE C.E.O. OF THE

01:47 - 53.667 CONTAINER CORPORATION OF AMERICA

01:47 - 55.235 NOW INSTEAD OF THE PRINCIPAL

01:47 - 56.536 OWNER OF THE PHILLIES.

01:47 - 57.671 >> DID YOU USED TO GO TO GAMES

01:47 - 58.605 AT CONNIE MACK STADIUM?

01:47 - 59.773 >> OH, YEAH, WE ALL WOULD GO TO

01:47 - 00.740 THE CONNIE MACK STADIUM.

01:48 - 02.409 IN FACT, ONE OF THE GREAT

01:48 - 04.411 STORIES OF -- I'LL TELL YOU TWO

01:48 - 06.246 QUICK OTHER DAVID MONTGOMERY

01:48 - 07.881 STORIES.

01:48 - 10.884 DAVID WAS KNOWN IN THOSE DAYS AS

01:48 - 12.853 A PRODIGIOUS EATER.

01:48 - 14.221 NOT THAT HE WAS HEAVY.

01:48 - 15.655 HE WASN'T HEAVY AT ALL.

01:48 - 16.990 BUT HE COULD EAT A LOT.

01:48 - 19.059 SO, HE BET US -- THIS IS REALLY

01:48 - 20.160 GONNA DATE ME.

01:48 - 22.696 HE BET US THAT HE COULD EAT $5

01:48 - 25.499 OF FOOD DURING THE GAME, DURING

01:48 - 27.667 A SINGLE PHILLIES GAME.

01:48 - 28.969 NOW, AGAIN, THAT REALLY DATES

01:48 - 29.302 US.

01:48 - 30.570 WHAT'S A HOT DOG THESE DAYS?

01:48 - 33.673 A HOT DOG IS $4 THESE DAYS?

01:48 - 35.275 NO BEER, NO SODA ALLOWED.

01:48 - 37.010 SO, HE HAD TO JUST EAT FOOD.

01:48 - 38.445 AND IN THOSE DAYS, THE

01:48 - 40.380 BIG-TICKET ITEM -- I THINK A HOT

01:48 - 42.082 DOG WAS 35 OR 40 CENTS, ICE

01:48 - 44.017 CREAM WAS 25 CENTS, PEANUTS WERE

01:48 - 45.352 25 CENTS, ET CETERA.

01:48 - 46.753 SO, WE ALL BET.

01:48 - 49.289 DAVID WAS SO OVERCONFIDENT THAT

01:48 - 51.691 HE ATE DINNER AT HIS PARENTS'

01:48 - 54.027 HOUSE, AND HE HAD ROAST PORK

01:48 - 56.396 WITH FILLING.

01:48 - 57.597 BUT HE STILL THOUGHT, "$5?

01:48 - 58.632 I CAN DO THIS EASILY."

01:48 - 00.433 AND HE, OUT OF THE GUN, FIRST

01:49 - 02.269 THREE INNINGS, HE WAS AT LIKE

01:49 - 03.904 $2.80.

01:49 - 07.007 THEN THE NEXT THREE INNINGS, HE

01:49 - 08.542 SLOWED DOWN AND MAYBE GOT

01:49 - 09.342 ANOTHER $1.

01:49 - 12.546 HE WAS AT $3.80 GOING INTO THE

01:49 - 14.014 TOP OF THE 9th.

01:49 - 16.182 AND THE ONLY WAY HE COULD BEAT

01:49 - 18.451 US -- HE BOUGHT THREE DIXIE CUPS

01:49 - 19.553 OF ICE CREAM.

01:49 - 21.855 I THINK THEY WERE 30 CENTS EACH,

01:49 - 24.024 AND THAT WOULD HAVE PUT HIM AT

01:49 - 24.691 $5.05.

01:49 - 26.393 BUT HE NEVER FINISHED THEM.

01:49 - 28.295 MIDWAY THROUGH THE SECOND DIXIE

01:49 - 30.063 CUP, HE WOUND UP LYING ON THE

01:49 - 31.798 GROUND, UNDERNEATH THE SEAT,

01:49 - 32.499 MOANING.

01:49 - 34.467 AND WE HAD TO LITERALLY CARRY

01:49 - 36.937 HIM TO THE CAR TO TAKE HIM HOME.

01:49 - 40.607 SO, WE WON THE BET, AND HE LOST.

01:49 - 44.110 BUT THEN, TO GO FULL CIRCLE,

01:49 - 46.246 DAVID WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR ME

01:49 - 48.348 MEETING MIDGE AND EVENTUALLY

01:49 - 49.649 MARRYING MIDGE.

01:49 - 51.585 HE BROUGHT MIDGE TO A PARTY THAT

01:49 - 53.119 I THREW AT MY APARTMENT.

01:49 - 55.655 AND MIDGE AND I HIT IT OFF.

01:49 - 58.058 I CALLED DAVID THE NEXT MORNING.

01:49 - 00.160 I SAID, "HOW SERIOUS ARE YOU

01:50 - 01.528 WITH THIS GIRL?"

01:50 - 02.896 HE SAID, "NOT VERY."

01:50 - 04.297 I WAS GOING OUT WITH A GIRL BY

01:50 - 05.398 THE NAME OF KATHY KEIL.

01:50 - 06.866 HE SAID, "BUT I WOULD LIKE TO GO

01:50 - 07.901 OUT WITH KATHY KEIL."

01:50 - 09.836 SO, WE SWITCHED, AND I SAID,

01:50 - 11.805 "GOOD LUCK WITH KATHY KEIL."

01:50 - 13.540 I CALLED MIDGE THE NEXT DAY AND

01:50 - 15.275 TOLD HER THAT DAVID HAD SAID IT

01:50 - 16.977 WAS ALL RIGHT, AND THE REST IS

01:50 - 18.011 HISTORY.

01:50 - 19.446 >> SO, IT WAS OKAY WITH THE

01:50 - 20.747 LADIES THAT THEY TRADED?

01:50 - 22.248 >> WELL, IT OKAY WITH MIDGE.

01:50 - 23.917 I DON'T THINK DAVID GOT VERY FAR

01:50 - 25.418 WITH KATHY KEIL, BUT HE NEVER

01:50 - 26.019 TOLD ME.

01:50 - 27.520 AND SHE NEVER TOLD ME.

01:50 - 30.056 >> DID YOU GO TO ANY EAGLE

01:50 - 30.890 GAMES?

01:50 - 32.292 >> NO, AND THE INTERESTING PART

01:50 - 33.593 IS, I DIDN'T GO TO ANY EAGLES

01:50 - 37.364 GAMES, AND YET MY FIRST

01:50 - 40.000 EXPERIENCE WITH THE EAGLES WAS

01:50 - 42.168 MY FIRST SUNDAY AT PENN.

01:50 - 44.871 IT WAS LIKE SEPTEMBER 8th OR 7th

01:50 - 46.506 OR WHATEVER.

01:50 - 48.174 AND I'D GONE OUT DRINKING THE

01:50 - 50.710 NIGHT BEFORE.

01:50 - 52.912 AND I WAS SOUND ASLEEP.

01:50 - 56.483 AND MY DORM WAS AT LITERALLY THE

01:50 - 59.486 BACK END, 34th AND SPRUCE.

01:50 - 00.920 I WAS IN THE BACK END OF THE

01:51 - 01.388 DORMS.

01:51 - 02.956 34th AND SPRUCE.

01:51 - 05.058 AND AT ABOUT 12:20 -- I HAD

01:51 - 07.227 GOTTEN IN AROUND 2:00 IN THE

01:51 - 09.596 MORNING, SO I WAS STILL ASLEEP.

01:51 - 11.698 AT ABOUT 12:20, I THOUGHT THERE

01:51 - 13.033 WAS AN EARTHQUAKE.

01:51 - 15.001 MY ENTIRE ROOM SHOOK.

01:51 - 17.404 THE NOISE WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

01:51 - 19.172 IT WAS THE EAGLES COMING OUT

01:51 - 20.974 ONTO FIELD AT FRANKLIN FIELD,

01:51 - 22.909 WHICH WAS LITERALLY A BLOCK AND

01:51 - 24.644 A HALF AWAY, AND THERE WERE

01:51 - 26.546 68,000 PEOPLE IN FRANKLIN FIELD

01:51 - 27.414 GOING NUTS.

01:51 - 29.683 AND, YOU KNOW, SO WE KNOW THAT

01:51 - 32.018 ON SUNDAYS, YOU CLEARED OUT AND

01:51 - 34.087 YOU WENT TO A BUILDING OR A

01:51 - 36.356 FRIEND'S HOUSE OR WHATEVER WAY

01:51 - 38.591 OUT ON THE WESTERN END OF THE

01:51 - 39.359 CAMPUS.

01:51 - 41.161 AND THAT WAS MY FIRST EXPOSURE

01:51 - 42.996 TO THE EAGLES, BUT I NEVER WENT

01:51 - 44.864 TO AN EAGLES GAME WHEN I WAS AN

01:51 - 45.832 UNDERGRAD, NO.

01:51 - 47.300 >> DID YOU GO TO PENN GAMES?

01:51 - 48.835 >> OH, YEAH, I WENT TO PRETTY

01:51 - 50.370 MUCH EVERY FOOTBALL AND EVERY

01:51 - 51.304 BASKETBALL GAME.

01:51 - 52.706 >> FOR SOMEONE WHO HAS NEVER

01:51 - 54.174 BEEN TO THE PALESTRA, CAN YOU

01:51 - 54.908 DESCRIBE IT?

01:51 - 58.645 >> WELL, I CAN'T DESCRIBE IT

01:51 - 01.681 TODAY BECAUSE YOU CAN'T GO TO

01:52 - 05.118 THE PALESTRA TODAY AND GET THE

01:52 - 07.420 FEELING OF WHAT IT WAS LIKE IN

01:52 - 11.357 THE '60s, '70s, EVEN THE '80s.

01:52 - 12.792 MAYBE OCCASIONALLY IF THERE'S A

01:52 - 14.194 VILLANOVA/SAINT JOE GAME THAT

01:52 - 15.428 THEY PLAY IN THE PALESTRA.

01:52 - 17.297 WHAT MAKES THE PALESTRA SPECIAL

01:52 - 18.832 IS TWO THINGS -- ONE, ITS

01:52 - 20.066 CONFIGURATION.

01:52 - 22.902 THE SEATS ARE LITERALLY THREE

01:52 - 25.238 FEET FROM THE SIDELINE.

01:52 - 28.441 AND ALL 9,000 SEATS ARE ON TOP

01:52 - 29.809 OF THE COURT.

01:52 - 31.377 IT'S AN OLD BUILDING, SO THE

01:52 - 33.079 SOUND REVERBERATES LIKE NOTHING

01:52 - 34.147 YOU'VE EVER HEARD.

01:52 - 36.316 AND IN THE TYPICAL BIG 5 GAME OR

01:52 - 38.485 A PENN/PRINCETON GAME, SELL-OUT,

01:52 - 39.886 YOU'D HAVE HALF THE CROWD

01:52 - 41.488 ROOTING FOR PENN AND HALF THE

01:52 - 43.022 CROWD ROOTING FOR SAINT JOE,

01:52 - 44.324 HALF THE CROWD ROOTING FOR

01:52 - 45.792 TEMPLE, HALF THE CROWD ROOTING

01:52 - 46.559 FOR LA SALLE.

01:52 - 48.261 AND THE NOISE WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

01:52 - 49.929 AND IN THOSE DAYS, MOST OF THE

01:52 - 51.397 GAMES WERE DOUBLE HEADERS.

01:52 - 54.267 SO, YOU'D HAVE PENN PLAYING

01:52 - 57.237 PRINCETON AND MAYBE LA SALLE

01:52 - 58.538 PLAYING TEMPLE.

01:52 - 59.939 AND THE NOISE WOULD BE

01:52 - 00.840 UNBELIEVABLE.

01:53 - 02.609 IT WAS LIKE NOTHING I'VE EVER

01:53 - 03.109 SEEN.

01:53 - 05.745 THERE'S REALLY NO ARENA THAT WAS

01:53 - 08.248 SHARED BY MAJOR COLLEGE TEAMS,

01:53 - 10.316 OTHER THAN THE PALESTRA.

01:53 - 12.786 AND YOU VIRTUALLY NEVER GOT --

01:53 - 15.388 WHEN UCLA PLAYED, YOU KNOW, EVEN

01:53 - 17.690 USC, THEY WOULD GIVE USC 500

01:53 - 20.193 TICKETS OUT OF 12,000.

01:53 - 22.395 BUT WHEN PENN PLAYED SAINT JOE,

01:53 - 23.997 IT WAS USUALLY 50-50.

01:53 - 25.331 AND IT WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

01:53 - 27.066 AND THERE WILL NEVER BE ANYTHING

01:53 - 27.667 LIKE IT.

01:53 - 29.135 IT'S ALSO A GREAT PLACE FOR

01:53 - 30.170 POLITICAL RALLIES.

01:53 - 31.805 AND INTERESTINGLY, I SAW

01:53 - 33.840 BOBBY KENNEDY AND GENE McCARTHY

01:53 - 35.675 SPEAK AT THE PALESTRA IN '68

01:53 - 37.477 WHEN I WAS A THIRD-YEAR LAW

01:53 - 38.211 STUDENT.

01:53 - 40.613 AND THAT GAVE ME THE IDEA, OF

01:53 - 43.149 COURSE, TO HAVE HILLARY CLINTON

01:53 - 45.652 IN THE PALESTRA FOR THE MONDAY

01:53 - 48.254 BEFORE THE PENNSYLVANIA PRIMARY.

01:53 - 49.722 ON TUESDAY, FOR OUR CLOSING

01:53 - 51.257 RALLY, WE HAD HILLARY IN THE

01:53 - 53.927 PALESTRA.

01:53 - 56.563 AND WE JUST HAD ANOTHER RALLY

01:53 - 59.032 THE MONDAY NIGHT BEFORE THE

01:53 - 01.100 PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION.

01:54 - 02.936 PRESIDENT OBAMA WASN'T IN TOWN,

01:54 - 04.804 BUT BILL CLINTON WAS IN TOWN FOR

01:54 - 06.639 OBAMA, AND WE HAD THAT RALLY IN

01:54 - 08.474 THE PALESTRA, AS WELL, AND THEY

01:54 - 10.376 WERE BOTH SOLD OUT, 3,000, 4,000

01:54 - 12.011 PEOPLE OUTSIDE LISTENING ON

01:54 - 12.912 LOUDSPEAKERS.

01:54 - 14.547 INCREDIBLE, AND, AGAIN, THE

01:54 - 15.882 NOISE WAS INCREDIBLE.

01:54 - 16.816 >> DID YOU PAY ATTENTION TO

01:54 - 17.717 POLITICS WHILE YOU WERE IN

01:54 - 18.117 COLLEGE?

01:54 - 18.985 >> OH, SURE, I ALWAYS WAS

01:54 - 19.819 INTERESTED IN POLITICS.

01:54 - 22.989 >> 'CAUSE THAT WAS THE JFK AND

01:54 - 24.257 JOHNSON YEARS.

01:54 - 26.059 >> MM-HMM.

01:54 - 27.594 IN FACT, YOU KNOW, THE ANSWER TO

01:54 - 28.962 THE QUESTION "WHERE WERE YOU

01:54 - 29.929 WHEN YOU --" IN OUR

01:54 - 31.331 GENERATION -- "WHERE WERE YOU

01:54 - 32.332 WHEN YOU HEARD THAT

01:54 - 33.867 PRESIDENT KENNEDY WAS SHOT -- WE

01:54 - 35.301 WERE EATING A LATE LUNCH IN MY

01:54 - 35.969 FRATERNITY.

01:54 - 37.670 AND THE COOK, SAM -- I'LL NEVER

01:54 - 38.204 FORGET.

01:54 - 39.939 I FORGET SAM'S LAST NAME, BUT HE

01:54 - 40.940 WAS A GREAT GUY.

01:54 - 43.042 SAM COMES RUNNING OUT OF THE

01:54 - 45.211 KITCHEN, YOU KNOW, AND HE WAS

01:54 - 47.080 HYSTERICAL, AND HE SAID,

01:54 - 48.982 "PRESIDENT KENNEDY'S BEEN SHOT."

01:54 - 51.050 SO, WE ALL RAN TO THE ONE TV

01:54 - 53.319 THAT WE HAD IN THE LIVING ROOM,

01:54 - 55.388 AND WE ESSENTIALLY STAYED IN

01:54 - 57.323 FRONT OF THAT TV UNTIL THE

01:54 - 00.727 PRESIDENT WAS BURIED ON MONDAY.

01:55 - 01.995 >> WERE THERE VIETNAM WAR

01:55 - 03.396 PROTESTS DURING YOUR COLLEGE

01:55 - 03.863 YEARS?

01:55 - 05.231 >> YEAH, THERE WERE SOME ON

01:55 - 05.732 CAMPUS.

01:55 - 06.699 >> YOU EVER GET INVOLVED IN

01:55 - 07.867 THEM?

01:55 - 08.401 >> NO.

01:55 - 10.036 I THOUGHT THE WAR WAS IDIOTIC,

01:55 - 11.604 BUT I DIDN'T GET INVOLVED IN

01:55 - 12.071 THEM.

01:55 - 13.473 >> DID YOU GET INVOLVED IN CITY

01:55 - 14.941 POLITICS AT ALL OR PAY ATTENTION

01:55 - 15.808 TO CITY POLITICS?

01:55 - 20.346 >> NO, NOT MUCH. NOT MUCH.

01:55 - 23.349 >> SO, YOU GRADUATED FROM PENN.

01:55 - 24.284 >> AND WENT TO VILLANOVA LAW

01:55 - 24.617 SCHOOL.

01:55 - 28.321 >> '68, AND DID YOU MOVE TO

01:55 - 29.455 VILLANOVA AT THE TIME?

01:55 - 31.057 >> NO, 'CAUSE ALL MY FRIENDS

01:55 - 32.325 WERE AT WHARTON GRAD.

01:55 - 33.826 I WANTED TO STAY DOWNTOWN.

01:55 - 36.262 SO, I GOT A LITTLE PLACE AT 2047

01:55 - 38.464 WALNUT STREET, WHICH IS NOW A

01:55 - 40.833 STORE SELLING -- I FORGET WHAT.

01:55 - 43.136 BUT -- AND IT WAS A FIRST-FLOOR

01:55 - 44.971 APARTMENT, AND IT WAS AN

01:55 - 46.005 EFFICIENCY.

01:55 - 48.641 IT HAD NO SINK.

01:55 - 50.176 IT HAD A STOVE, BUT FOR SOME

01:55 - 51.911 REASON, THEY DIDN'T HAVE A SINK.