00:06 - OH YEAH, ALL PERSONS HAVING

00:08 - BUSINESS BEFORE THE

00:08 - COMMONWEALTH COURT OF

00:09 - PENNSYLVANIA TO DRAW NEAR AND

00:11 - GIVE THEIR ATTENTION FOR THE

00:12 - COURT IS NOW CITY.

00:14 - THAT SAID THE COMMONWEALTH,

00:15 - THIS HONORABLE COURT.

00:17 - PRESIDENT JACQUES P HAVE A

00:18 - BROAD SIDE. WE SEE EVERYONE.

00:26 - THANK YOU GOOD MORNING WELCOME

00:28 - TO THE COMMONWEALTH COURT'S ON

00:29 - BOX SESSION FOR OCTOBER

00:31 - 2021.

00:32 - FOR THOSE OF YOU WHO ARE NEW

00:34 - TO THE COURT WE HAVE ALLOCATED

00:36 - APPROXIMATELY 30 MINUTES.

00:38 - HER CASE THAT WORKS OUT TO

00:39 - APPROXIMATELY 15 MINUTES PER

00:40 - SIDE. I REALLY APPROXIMATELY

00:42 - BUT FROM WHERE I'M FROM MATT IS

00:43 - A LITTLE HARD FOR US. IF YOU

00:46 - ARE THE PETITIONER OR THE

00:47 - APPELLANT ANY WISHED RESERVE

00:49 - SOME OF YOUR TIME PLEASE DO SO

00:50 - AT THE BEGINNING OF THE

00:51 - ARGUMENT. WE DO HAVE SOME

00:53 - FAIRLY COMPLEX CASES BEING

00:55 - ARGUED TODAY. SO UNLESS YOUR

00:57 - CASE HAS BEEN A LOT OF

00:58 - ADDITIONAL TIME PLEASE DO YOUR

01:00 - BEST TO STICK TO THE TIME THAT

01:01 - IS GIVEN. THE JUDGES THAT I'M

01:03 - SITTING WITH TODAY HAVE ALL

01:06 - READ THE BRIEFS READ THE RECORD

01:07 - ANY ANY OPINIONS BELOW SO ARE

01:10 - VERY PREPARED FOR THE ARGUMENTS

01:12 - TODAY. SO I SUGGEST TO YOU

01:14 - THAT'S BEEN A LOT OF TIME

01:15 - ON BACKGROUND. BUT REALLY GET

01:17 - INTO THE NUMBER THE ISSUES THAT

01:18 - ARE HERE FOR ARGUMENT AND WITH

01:19 - THAT THE FIRST CASE THAT WE

01:21 - HAVE IS NUMBER 27.

01:23 - ISAAC VASQUEZ'S SANTIAGO VERSUS

01:25 - COMMONWEALTH, THE PENNSYLVANIA

01:26 - DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION.

01:29 - IN THIS CASE APPELLANT THE

01:30 - DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

01:32 - BUREAU OF DRIVER LICENSING

01:33 - SUSPENDED THE OPERATING

01:34 - PRIVILEGE OF THE APP ALI ISAAC

01:36 - VASQUEZ SANTIAGO PURSUANT TO

01:38 - PENNSYLVANIA'S IMPLIED CONSENT

01:39 - LAW AFTER THE UP HELLY

01:41 - REPORTEDLY REFUSED TO SUBMIT TO

01:43 - CHEMICAL TESTING.

01:44 - IT'S INTO HIS ARREST FOR

01:45 - DRIVING UNDER THE INFLUENCE IN

01:46 - VIOLATION OF THE VEHICLE CODE

01:48 - PELLEY TESTIFIED IN THE TRIAL

01:50 - COURT THROUGH AN INTERPRETER

01:52 - THAT HE DOES NOT SPEAK ENGLISH

01:53 - AND DOES NOT REMEMBER BEING

01:54 - ASKED TO UNDERGO CHEMICAL

01:55 - TESTING. WE'RE ARRESTING

01:57 - OFFICER TESTIFIED THAT HE USING

01:58 - ONLY ENGLISH WAR IN THE APPLE

02:00 - II OF THE CONSEQUENCES OF THE

02:01 - REFUSAL. TRIAL COURT FOUND THAT

02:03 - I REALLY COULD NOT HAVE MADE A

02:05 - KNOWING AND CONSCIOUS REFUSAL

02:06 - BECAUSE HE DID NOT UNDERSTAND

02:08 - ENGLISH AND IT REVERSED THE

02:10 - SUSPENSION. BEFORE THIS COURT

02:12 - THE APPELLATE THE DEPARTMENT

02:13 - TRANSPORTATION SITES ARE

02:15 - DECISION AND VICK

02:17 - FIRST DEPARTMENT TRANSPORTATION

02:18 - WHERE WE EXPLAIN THAT AN

02:19 - OFFICER'S ONLY DUTY IS TO

02:20 - INFORM MOTORISTS OF IMPLIED

02:22 - CONSENT WARNING NOT TO ENSURE

02:24 - THAT THE MOTORS UNDERSTANDS THE

02:25 - WARNING. THAT'S A PALIN ARGUES

02:27 - THAT THE TRIAL COURT ERRED AS A

02:28 - MATTER OF LAW WHEN IT RELIED

02:30 - SOLELY ON THE PELLYS LACK OF

02:31 - ENGLISH COMPREHENSION TO

02:33 - CONCLUDE THE VALLEY COULD NOT

02:35 - HAVE MADE A KNOWING AND

02:36 - CONSCIOUS REFUSAL. FURTHERMORE

02:38 - THE APPELLANT TRANS DEPARTMENT

02:39 - TRANSPORTATION CONTENDS THE

02:41 - TRIAL COURT'S FINDINGS THAT UP

02:42 - ALI WAS INCAPABLE OF MAKING A

02:43 - KNOWING AND CONSCIOUS DECISION

02:45 - BECAUSE HE DID NOT UNDERSTAND

02:46 - ENGLISH, NOT SUPPORTED BY

02:48 - SUBSTANTIAL EVIDENCE. FINALLY

02:50 - THE APPELLANT CONTENDS THAT THE

02:51 - UP HELLY FAILED TO PROVE

02:53 - THAT EXCESS CONSUMPTION OF

02:54 - ALCOHOL DID NOT CAUSE OR

02:55 - CONTRIBUTE TO HIS INABILITY TO

02:57 - UNDERSTAND WHAT THE OFFICER

02:58 - SAID TO HIM

02:59 - IN ENGLISH. THE APPELLATE FIRST

03:01 - ASSERTS THAT THE DEPARTMENT

03:03 - WAIVED ALL ISSUES ON APPEAL BY

03:04 - FILING A DEFECTIVE CONCISE

03:06 - STATEMENT OF ERRORS

03:07 - ON THE MERITS IT ALLIE

03:09 - EMPHASIZES TESTIMONY BY THE

03:10 - OFFICER THAT THERE WAS A

03:11 - LANGUAGE BARRIER CITES SEVERAL

03:13 - CASES THIS COURT DECIDED BEFORE

03:15 - MARTIN NOWAK

03:16 - THAT UNDERMINE DEPARTMENTS

03:17 - RELIANCE THEREON AND SUPPORT

03:19 - THE TRIAL

03:19 - COURT'S DECISION AS AN

03:21 - ALTERNATIVE GROUND FOR FROM THE

03:22 - TRIAL COURT.

03:23 - KELLY ARGUES THAT THE IMPLIED

03:24 - CONSENT LAW VIOLATES THE UNITED

03:26 - STATES AND PENNSYLVANIA

03:27 - CONSTITUTIONS SO WITH THAT

03:29 - WE'LL HEAR FROM THE DEPARTMENT.

03:34 - GOOD MORNING PRESIDENT GEORGE

03:35 - ROBSON AND JUDGES OF THE

03:36 - COMMONWEALTH COURT OF

03:37 - PENNSYLVANIA.

03:39 - MAY IT PLEASE THE COURT MY

03:40 - PARENTS AND THAT WORKS THE

03:42 - GOVERNOR'S OFFICE OF GENERAL

03:43 - COUNSEL REPRESENTING THE

03:45 - COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA.

03:46 - DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION,

03:48 - YOU'RE A

03:48 - DRIVER LICENSING AND YOUR HONOR

03:51 - WOULD LIKE TO RESERVE A COUPLE

03:52 - OF MINUTES FOR REBUTTAL IF

03:53 - NECESSARY TO.

04:00 - THE DEPARTMENT HAS A

04:01 - 4 PART BURDEN OF PROOF AND ONE

04:03 - OF THOSE IMPLIED CONSENT CASES

04:05 - AND THE TRIAL COURT DID FIND

04:07 - THAT THE DEPARTMENT MET ITS

04:09 - BURDEN OF

04:11 - IT IN FACT THE COURT SAID IN

04:12 - ITS OPINION IN THE INSTANT

04:14 - MATTER PETITIONER DOES NOT

04:16 - DISPUTE THE PENNDOT HAS MET ITS

04:18 - INITIAL BURDEN OF PROOF BASED

04:20 - UPON THE FACTS PRESENTED.

04:22 - NEVERTHELESS THE PROPER COURT

04:24 - SUSTAIN THE FIELD

04:26 - BECAUSE THE COURT FOUND THAT

04:27 - OFFICER O'CONNOR THE ARRESTING

04:28 - OFFICER, I WANT TO QUOTE THIS

04:30 - FROM THE OPINION.

04:31 - QUOTE WAS ABSOLUTELY UNCERTAIN

04:34 - AS TO WHETHER PETITIONER

04:36 - UNDERSTOOD THE CONSEQUENCES.

04:38 - THIS REFUSAL TO SUBMIT TO A

04:40 - BLOOD TEST. NAMELY THAT ITS

04:42 - LICENSE WOULD BE SUSPENDED FOR

04:44 - A PERIOD OF

04:44 - ONE YEAR. THIS ISN'T THE TRIAL

04:46 - COURT OPINION THAT PAGE 5.

04:49 - THE WORDS

04:50 - ABSOLUTELY UNCERTAIN ARE

04:52 - UNDERSCORED AND IN BOLD AND THE

04:55 - WORD CONSEQUENCES

04:57 - IS UNDERSCORED INVOLVED AND

04:58 - ALSO IN THAT ALEX.

05:01 - OFFICER CONNOR HAD NO

05:02 - OBLIGATION WHATSOEVER TO ENSURE

05:05 - THAT MISTER VASQUEZ'S SANTIAGO

05:08 - UNDERSTOOD THE CONSEQUENCES.

05:10 - THIS COURT HAS SAID SO ON A

05:12 - NUMBER OF CASES AND WE CITED IN

05:13 - OUR BRIEF. THE SCOTT CASE WHICH

05:17 - THE PENNSYLVANIA SUPREME

05:18 - COURT CASE. WHY ARE PRONOUNCED

05:21 - MARK AND MARK OF THE WORK.

05:23 - PARKING MCKENNA. CONSEQUENTLY

05:26 - THE TRIAL COURT OR DOES MATTER

05:28 - OF LAW IN SUSTAINING

05:30 - THE APPEAL BASED UPON THE

05:32 - OFFICERS AND ABILITY TO JUST

05:35 - WITHOUT ANY DOUBT IN

05:36 - MY MIND. A LICENSEE HERE

05:39 - UNDERSTOOD THE CONSEQUENCES OF

05:41 - THE REFUSAL.

05:43 - ASIDE FROM THAT AND THIS IS WHY

05:45 - WE ALSO ARGUE THAT THE JUDGES

05:48 - OTHER FINDINGS ARE NOT

05:49 - SUPPORTED BY SUBSTANTIAL

05:51 - EVIDENCE. THE

05:52 - COURT WENT TO SUCH EXTREMES

05:55 - WITH ITS VIEW THAT ALSO CONNER

05:58 - HAD TO PROVE MISTER

06:01 - VASQUEZ'S SANTIAGO UNDERSTOOD

06:03 - THE CONSEQUENCES OF OF THE WAR

06:06 - THE WARNINGS THAT

06:08 - THE COURT IGNORE ALL THE OTHER

06:10 - EVIDENCE WHICH THE COURT WE DID

06:12 - FIND TO BE CREDIBLE AND

06:14 - CREDIBLE TESTIMONY OF OFFICER

06:15 - O'CONNOR I WOULD IN PARTICULAR

06:18 - LIKE THAT JUST REFERRED TO

06:19 - THE TRANSCRIPT. AND THIS

06:22 - IS ON PAGE 23 OF THE

06:25 - REPRODUCE RECORD. TESTIMONY

06:27 - NUMBER 10. ALSO RICK HONOR

06:29 - CREDIBLY TESTIFIED THAT.

06:31 - I READ HIM THE DEAL 26 WOULDN'T

06:34 - FIRED. I ASKED HIM, YOU

06:36 - UNDERSTAND WHAT I READ TO YOU.

06:38 - HE SAID YES. I SAID DO YOU WANT

06:41 - TO TAKE THE TEST. HE

06:42 - SAID NO AND I EXPLAINED TO HIM

06:44 - IS A TEST OF BLOOD DO YOU

06:46 - UNDERSTAND, AND HE WAS SAYING.

06:48 - YES, I UNDERSTAND DO YOU WANT

06:51 - TO TAKE THE TEST NO. SO I TOOK

06:53 - THAT AS A REFUSAL. WE

06:55 - RESPECTFULLY SUBMIT THAT IF

06:57 - THIS TESTIMONY WHICH THAT COURT

06:59 - FOUND CREDIBLE

07:01 - IS ACCEPTED FOR THE BURDEN THAT

07:05 - THE DEPARTMENT HAS TO PROVE.

07:06 - I KNEW THAT.

07:08 - MR. BEST QUEST, SAN DIEGO WAS

07:11 - PROBABLY MORE AND HAVE THE

07:12 - OPPORTUNITY TO SUBMIT TO THE

07:14 - TEST

07:14 - AND DIDN'T THAT THE REFUSAL AND

07:17 - THAT IS AS FAR AS THE

07:18 - DEPARTMENT HAD TO GO.

07:22 - AND SORRY

07:22 - TO INTERRUPT.

07:24 - DISNEY ALSO

07:25 - TRUE THAT.

07:26 - HAND SIGNALS NEEDED TO BE

07:28 - USED IN ORDER TO COMMUNICATE

07:29 - YESTER ARE IN FACT THE.

07:31 - THE RECORD IS REPLETE WITH

07:33 - TESTIMONY FROM THE OFFICER

07:35 - THAT.

07:37 - SPEAKING TO PLACE AND SEE AND

07:40 - ALSO USING HAND SIGNALS.

07:42 - HE WAS ABLE TO CONVEY MOST OF

07:44 - THEM WE WILL CAN SEE NOT

07:46 - EVERYTHING BUT MOST OF THEM

07:47 - WHAT HE WAS TRYING EXPLAIN TO

07:50 - MISTER VASQUEZ'S AND YOU'VE GOT

07:51 - TO KEEP IN MIND TOO, MR.

07:53 - S QUEST SANTIAGO ACKNOWLEDGE

07:56 - THAT HE WAS INTOXICATED WHICH

07:57 - IS ONE OF THE POINTS FOR TRYING

07:59 - TO MAKE SOMEONE WHO

08:00 - IS INTOXICATED

08:02 - WHO IS MAKING A KNOWING

08:03 - UNCONSCIOUS REFUSAL DEFENSE.

08:06 - WE USUALLY HAVE TO PROVE THAT

08:08 - THE ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION, EXCESS

08:10 - ALCOHOL CONSUMPTION. DID NOT

08:12 - AFFECT A PERSON'S ABILITY TO

08:14 - MAKE THAT KNOWING UNCONSCIOUS

08:15 - FOR REVIEW, SO SO HE

08:17 - HADN'T ADMITTED THAT.

08:22 - IT IN YOUR TERMS WAS A

08:24 - NEED CREATED WOULD YOU APPROACH

08:26 - THIS DIFFERENTLY.

08:29 - NO YOUR HONOR THAT

08:30 - OUR POSITION. AND THAT SHOT IS

08:33 - A GUY PRONOUNCED MARTIN OVER

08:35 - THAT THIS PART SITTING ON BOND.

08:38 - SHOULD OVERRULE ANY CASES THAT

08:40 - SAY THE LICENSEE WHO.

08:42 - SAYS I DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE

08:44 - CONSEQUENCES BECAUSE I DON'T

08:46 - UNDERSTAND ENGLISH AS A MATTER

08:49 - OF LAW.

08:51 - AVOID ONE OF THE SUSPENSIONS

08:53 - AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS

08:54 - BECAUSE IT.

08:58 - THE CASES INVOLVING KNOWING

09:00 - UNCONSCIOUS, USUALLY ARE

09:01 - RELATIVELY FEW USUALLY IT'S A I

09:04 - GOT BANGED UP IN THE ACCIDENT.

09:08 - THE PENNSYLVANIA SUPREME COURT

09:10 - THE BARBER CONCERT WITH

09:11 - COMPETENT MEDICAL EVIDENCE.

09:13 - YES YOU CAN AVOID THE

09:14 - SUSPENSION. SOMEONE WHO SAYS I

09:16 - DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH SHOULD NOT

09:18 - BE ALLOWED TO STAY

09:20 - BOTH THE CIVIL CONSEQUENCES OF

09:22 - REFUSAL. MISTER EDWARDS MISSED

09:23 - THIS WAS SOMETHING MORE THAN

09:24 - SOMEONE SAYING I DON'T SPEAK

09:26 - ENGLISH.

09:27 - THE OFFICER HERE TRIED TO GET

09:29 - AN INTERPRETER. CORRECT, YES

09:32 - AND HE WAS UNABLE TO GET AN

09:34 - INTERPRETER WITH INTER DIDN'T

09:35 - COME SOON AND IS NOT CORRECT.

09:38 - THAT'S CORRECT TO YOU

09:39 - SO DOESN'T THAT HAVE AN IMPACT

09:40 - HERE I MEAN IF THE OFFICER

09:41 - THOUGHT I NEED TO GET

09:42 - AN INTERPRETER DOES THAT GO TO

09:44 - THE OFFICER ALMOST CONCEDING

09:46 - THAT HE DOES NOT

09:47 - UNDERSTAND ENGLISH.

09:48 - WELL HE AS OFFICER CONNOR

09:50 - TESTIFY WITH BOTH HAWKING TO

09:54 - MISTER VASQUEZ'S SANTIAGO AND

09:55 - USING

09:56 - HAND SIGNALS. HE WAS ABLE TO

09:58 - CONVEY A CASE OF THE TALKING

09:59 - SIDE BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT NEEDS

10:00 - AN INTERPRETER SO IT'S JUST

10:02 - DANCING AS WELL AS ITS IT'S

10:04 - ALSO THE TALKING RUN AGAIN

10:05 - THAT'S WHY HE COULD BE SPEAKING

10:07 - GERMAN OR HE COULD BE SPEAKING.

10:11 - HOW YOU CONVEYING TO THE GUYS

10:14 - CONCEDES THE OFFICER CONCEDES

10:16 - HE DOES NOT UNDERSTAND ENGLISH

10:18 - I NEED

10:18 - AN INTERPRETER BUT I WANT TO

10:20 - SPEAK IN TOUCH WITH YOU JUST

10:21 - TALK LOUDER.

10:23 - THE ONLY REQUIREMENT IN

10:24 - RESPONSE THAT ARE ONGOING

10:25 - REQUIREMENT.

10:27 - IS FOR THE OFFICER TO READ

10:28 - THE WARNINGS THIS COURT HAS

10:30 - SAID IN A NUMBER OF CASES IN

10:31 - THE SUPREME PRETTY RELAXED.

10:36 - BECAUSE THAT WAS LIKE IN ERIE

10:38 - AND WENT.

10:39 - PROBABLY BECAUSE

10:40 - NOBODY HAS YET TO UNDERSTAND

10:42 - WHY NO ONE HAS YOUR ON THAT I'M

10:44 - AWARE OF THE COUNCIL THIS IS

10:45 - THIS IS WHY I THINK THIS CASE

10:47 - IS HERE BEFORE US WHICH IS TO

10:49 - TRY TO FIGURE OUT.

10:52 - VICK IF THAT'S CORRECT WHERE

10:54 - THE LINE IS IF THE GENTLEMAN

10:56 - WAS RUSSIAN AND THERE WAS

10:59 - NO COMMUNICATION AND THE SAME

11:01 - PROBABLE CAUSE FOR THE OFFICER

11:03 - TO PULL OVER AND TO GET THE

11:05 - BLOOD. A BLOOD TEST

11:07 - ONCE AND ONCE THEY DO THEY

11:10 - BRING THEM IN.

11:11 - AND THERE WAS NO COMMUNICATION

11:13 - BETWEEN THE INDIVIDUAL AND THAT

11:15 - THE OFFICER,

11:16 - WHAT DOES MORE TO NOVICK SAY

11:18 - ABOUT

11:19 - THAT SCENARIO BECAUSE I THINK

11:20 - WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT

11:21 - WHERE THE LINE IS ON ENOUGH OF

11:25 - IMPLIED CONSENT.

11:26 - YOUR HONOR OUR POSITION IS

11:28 - VERY SIMPLE ONCE

11:29 - THE WARNINGS ARE READ IN WHICH

11:31 - THE LICENSEE THAT IS ALL THE

11:33 - IMPLIED CONSENT REQUIRED SO

11:35 - EVEN IF

11:35 - THE PERSON.

11:37 - ONE OF THE INTERPRETER AND

11:39 - HAD I MEAN I UNDERSTAND THE

11:41 - FACTS OF THIS CASE WHICH IS A

11:43 - LITTLE DIFFERENT BECAUSE

11:43 - THERE'S SOME GRAY ON THE LEVEL

11:46 - OF PROFICIENCY OF ENGLISH.

11:48 - BUT LET'S SAY THERE'S NO LEVEL

11:50 - OF GREY ON PROFICIENCY AND THAT

11:52 - THE INDIVIDUAL

11:54 - JUST SIMPLY DOES NOT UNDERSTAND

11:55 - ENGLISH AND THERE'S NO

11:56 - TESTIMONY OTHERWISE UNDER WEEK,

11:59 - YOUR INTERPRETATION IS AS LONG

12:02 - AS THE OFFICER READS.

12:04 - THE DEAL 26 OR 2 I THINK THAT'S

12:07 - RIGHT THAT THEN HE OR SHE CAN

12:10 - MOVE FORWARD UNDER BUT THEY DID

12:13 - NOT CONSENT TO THE BOARD.

12:15 - THAT'S RIGHT.

12:16 - TO MAYBE EXPAND A LITTLE

12:17 - ON THAT TO SUPPORT HIS SAID IN

12:20 - THE DETAINED CASE WHICH WAS

12:22 - CITED

12:22 - NEVER BRIEFED THAT KNOWING

12:25 - UNCONSCIOUS EXCEPTION TO THE

12:27 - REQUIREMENTS SHOULD BE STRICTLY

12:29 - CONSTRUED THIS IS A CASE OF

12:31 - CALLS ARE STRICTLY

12:32 - THIS GROWING. IF SOMEONE WHO

12:34 - DOES NOT SPEAK ENGLISH WELL, OR

12:37 - UNDERSTAND ENGLISH WELL IS

12:39 - ALLOWED TO DRINK AND DRIVE

12:41 - WITHOUT WORRYING ABOUT THE

12:42 - CONSEQUENCES OF BEING ARRESTED

12:44 - BECAUSE I DON'T HAVE TO TAKE

12:46 - THE BLOOD TEST I DON'T HAVE TO

12:47 - TAKE THE BREATH TEST. I

12:49 - DON'T UNDERSTAND YOU CAN

12:51 - SUSPEND MY LICENSE OWNED BY THE

12:52 - WAY YOU CAN'T CONVICT ME OF ANY

12:54 - OF THE 6 PROVISIONS OF THE

12:56 - DUI LAW THAT REQUIRE CHEMICAL

12:59 - TEST RESULTS THAT IS SOMETHING

13:01 - THE COMMONWEALTH CANNOT LIVE

13:03 - WITH. THAT'S WHY WE'RE SAYING

13:05 - THAT SHOULD BE A.

13:07 - ROY BLACK AND WHITE ONCE THE

13:10 - OFFICER HAS READ THE WARNINGS.

13:12 - ALL OF THE FIREMAN'S OF

13:13 - IMPLIED CONSENT.

13:14 - WAS THE PRACTICAL EFFECT OF

13:16 - THE OFFICER ASKING FOR

13:18 - TRANSLATOR. I MEAN IS THAT THE

13:20 - TYPICAL STANDARD OF HOW THEY

13:22 - RESPONDED THERE UNCERTAIN

13:24 - WHETHER SOMEONE SPEAKS ENGLISH

13:26 - IS NOT HAVE TO I STARTED GOING

13:28 - TO THE TRUCK MANY DO.

13:32 - OFFICERS DON'T REQUESTING

13:35 - CHEMICAL TESTING BECAUSE THEY

13:37 - WANT TO NOT TO SUSPEND HIM.

13:39 - THEY WANTED TO TAKE A BREATH

13:40 - TEST OR TAKE A

13:41 - BLOOD TEST AND HE'S GOT AN

13:43 - INTERPRETER TO DO IT FIND THAT

13:45 - WITH SO IT'S KIND LIKE A SAFETY

13:47 - NET IT IS YOU'RE TAKING A DISH

13:49 - OR ON THAT IS NOT A MANDATE.

13:51 - NO IT'S NOT REQUIRED

13:52 - AT ALL. HOW IS THE SHIRT, I

13:54 - MEAN THEY'RE TRYING TO GET THE

13:56 - BLOOD TEST BREATH TEST RESULTS.

13:58 - THEY'RE NOT TRYING TO GET

13:59 - PENNDOT INVOLVED

13:59 - IN SUSPENSION.

14:01 - DO WE NEED TO LOOK THE

14:02 - SURROUNDING TOTALITY OF THE

14:04 - CIRCUMSTANCES AND IT IS

14:05 - INTERESTING THAT EVEN WHEN THE

14:07 - POLICE OFFICER WENT BACK TO

14:08 - HIS CAR THAT THE LICENSEE FELL

14:11 - ASLEEP AT THE WHEEL. HE WAS

14:12 - REALLY DOCTOR ON THAT.

14:14 - THAT'S THAT'S ME SO I

14:16 - CONSTRUE HAVING

14:17 - MANY MANY YEARS AGO WHEN YOU'RE

14:19 - YOUNGER DAYS ON OCCASION FALLEN

14:21 - ASLEEP IN

14:21 - MY CAR.

14:24 - BELIEVE IS I'M SURE

14:27 - THE STATUE WITH PATIENTS AS I'M

14:30 - SURE YOU'RE ON THAT WAS THAT

14:31 - WHEN I WAS A JUNIOR OFFICER IN

14:32 - THE COAST GUARD MANY YEARS AGO

14:34 - YOU MIGHT WANT TO GO WITH HOPE

14:35 - HYPOTHETICALLY YOU KNOW THAT'S

14:38 - SO SHOULD WE BE LOOKING AT

14:40 - THE TOTALITY OF CIRCUMSTANCES

14:41 - IN ANY RESPECT OR DO WE JUST

14:44 - STICK ON THE LIVE THE MERE FACT

14:46 - THAT THE OFFICER ONLY HAS TO

14:47 - INFORM. THAT'S THAT'S OUR

14:49 - POSITION YOUR OWN WHAT.

14:50 - ONCE THE WARNINGS HAVE BEEN

14:52 - PROVIDED AND RED TO

14:54 - THE LICENSEE ANYTHING WHICH

14:56 - THERE'S NO REQUIREMENT FOR ANY

14:57 - OTHER LANGUAGE.

14:59 - THE DEPARTMENT HAS MET ITS

15:00 - BURDEN FOR PURPOSES OF THE

15:02 - SUSPENSION AND AGAIN.

15:04 - SO MISTER EVER SAW ME ASK YOU

15:05 - THIS HYPOTHETICALLY IF LICENSE

15:07 - HE WAS DEATH. WE NEED TO DO IS

15:09 - READ THE.

15:11 - WARNINGS AND THAT THAT WILL

15:12 - SUFFICE KNOW IF YOU CAN HEAR

15:14 - WE'VE HAD THOSE CASES YOU CAN

15:16 - USUALLY IN THOSE CASES YOU ARE

15:18 - THE OFFICER WILL ATTEMPT TO

15:21 - WRITE OUT. QUESTIONS EXPLAIN

15:24 - THINGS AND HAVING TO GO BACK

15:25 - AND

15:25 - FORTH IN AS THOSE CASE TO SEE

15:27 - RECOGNIZES A LANGUAGE BARRIER

15:29 - MAKE ACCOMMODATIONS. AT THAT'S

15:31 - WHAT THE INTERPRETERS ALL ABOUT

15:33 - OUR POSITION IS THE WIN.

15:35 - PUSH COMES TO SHOVE IF IT

15:37 - DOES NOT POSSIBLE FOR THE

15:39 - PERSON OR THE PERSON REFUSES

15:41 - FOR PURPOSES OF IMPOSING,

15:43 - ESPECIALLY BETTER BURDEN OF

15:44 - PROOF IS GOING TO WANT TO READ

15:46 - SO HERE.

15:47 - THE OFFICER TRIED TO BRIDGE

15:49 - THAT LANGUAGE BARRIER BY

15:51 - SPEAKING KNOWING THAT

15:53 - THE WE'RE STRONG SUSPICION

15:55 - SUSPECTING THE LICENSE HE DID

15:57 - NOT UNDERSTAND ENGLISH THEN

15:58 - ENGAGED IN A SERIES OF HAND

16:00 - SIGNALS. YOU KNOW WHAT THOSE

16:01 - HAND SIGNALS WORK. JUST TRYING

16:04 - TO AVOID THIS MORNING. IT IS

16:07 - FOR THE FOR THE OF BLOOD TEST

16:09 - AND THINGS LIKE THAT TOGETHER

16:10 - WITH EXPLAINING IT TO HIM AGAIN

16:12 - WE DON'T KNOW. THAT'S ON

16:14 - THE RECORD. YES THAT'S ON THE

16:15 - RECORD THE DESCRIPTION OF THE

16:18 - HAND SIGNALS. IT WILL TALK

16:19 - ABOUT THE HAND SIGNALS USING

16:21 - HAND SIGNALS. I THINK ONE OF

16:22 - THEM WAS THE MENTION A POINT IN

16:24 - THE DR. 6, 2, AND

16:26 - THAT'S ENOUGH.

16:26 - WELL, NO IT WAS ENOUGH IS

16:28 - READING THE WARNING READING

16:29 - WARNINGS IN ENGLISH, YES, YOUR

16:30 - ON OKAY COUNCIL WE DO HAVE A

16:32 - LINE OF CASES THAT FOCUS ON THE

16:35 - CREDIBILITY DETERMINATIONS OF

16:37 - THE TRIAL COURT.

16:39 - AS IN THIS CASE, EVEN THOUGH

16:40 - THE TRIAL COURT WENT THROUGH

16:42 - TESTIMONY AS YOU NOTED, AND THE

16:44 - OFFICER TESTIFIED. THE TRIAL

16:47 - COURT CONCLUDED.

16:50 - THAT THE CLAIMANT DID NOT THE

16:51 - PETITIONER DID NOT UNDERSTAND

16:54 - ENGLISH, WHAT DO WE DO WITH THE

16:56 - CREDIBILITY FINDING BECAUSE OUR

16:58 - ISN'T THAT ONE OF THE THINGS

16:59 - THAT WE LOOK AT WHEN WE TALK

17:01 - ABOUT.

17:02 - YOU KNOW LOOKING AT THE

17:03 - SURROUNDING CIRCUMSTANCES IN

17:05 - OTHER WORDS YOU NOT PRESUMED

17:06 - NOT TO UNDERSTAND

17:08 - BECAUSE YOU HAVE YOU SPEAK

17:10 - LITTLE OR NO ENGLISH.

17:12 - BUT IN A NUMBER OF

17:14 - CASES WHEN IT WAS CLEARLY

17:16 - ESTABLISHED THEY COULDN'T

17:17 - UNDERSTAND ANYTHING AT ALL IN

17:19 - THE TRIAL COURT FOUND SUCH.

17:22 - WELL THAT GETS BACK TO WHY

17:24 - THE BURDEN SHOULD BE ON AND I'M

17:26 - GETTING VERY WHAT I WANT TO I I

17:30 - FOUND THAT OUT THE HARD WAY

17:31 - YOU'RE

17:33 - THAT IS WHY IN A SITUATION LIKE

17:35 - THIS WHERE

17:36 - THE LICENSEE AND MISS HE

17:39 - WAS INTOXICATED HE SHOULD HAVE

17:41 - A BURDEN TO

17:41 - PROVE THAT HIS INABILITY TO

17:44 - UNDERSTANDING THIS WAS NOT

17:46 - CAUSED IT

17:46 - ALL BY THE EXCESS ALCOHOL

17:49 - CONSUMPTION, YOU'RE ASKING US

17:50 - TO MAKE DIFFERENT FINDINGS THAT

17:52 - THE TRIAL COURT THAT I THINK

17:53 - WERE BASED ON

17:54 - CREDIBILITY DETERMINATIONS.

17:56 - NO YOUR HONOR, THE WE CAN SEE

18:00 - THAT. HE WAS

18:02 - SO DRUNK THAT HE

18:03 - DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT WE DON'T

18:05 - KNOW WAS WHETHER OR NOT

18:07 - HIS INABILITY TO UNDERSTAND

18:09 - WHAT'S CAUSED

18:10 - IT ALL. IN PART BY THIS BEING

18:13 - IN TALKS AGAIN WE DON'T HAVE

18:14 - THAT IN THE COUNCIL YOU KEEP

18:15 - SAYING THAT BUT I DON'T THINK

18:17 - THAT'S

18:17 - YOUR ARGUMENT.

18:18 - YOUR ARGUMENT IS THAT AS LONG

18:20 - AS THE OFFICER READS BEFORE.

18:23 - IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER WHAT

18:24 - THE STATE OF MIND OF THE

18:26 - INDIVIDUAL IS AND THE OFFICER

18:28 - CAN CHECK THE BOX ON THE MARKET

18:30 - NOVICK AND THAT'S ALL WE SHOULD

18:33 - LOOK TO THAT'S RIGHT EXACTLY

18:35 - WRONG. SO UNION SIGNALS THAT

18:38 - THE OFTEN ALL TOO OFTEN ON

18:41 - AGAIN CONVERSATIONS.

18:45 - DON'T MATTER THEY DO

18:46 - NOT DROWN.

18:46 - BUT AGAIN, BUT AGAIN KEEP IN

18:49 - MIND. THESE OFFICERS ARE DOING

18:51 - THE ABSOLUTE BEST THEY CAN TO

18:53 - CONVEY THE REQUIREMENTS TO THE

18:54 - PEOPLE WERE ARRESTED

18:55 - FOR DUI AND THAT THEY SHOULD

18:57 - NOT THAT'S NOT BE HELD AGAINST

18:59 - HOW DO WE RESOLVE MORE TO MAKE

19:01 - MARTIN INDYK ANY.

19:03 - AND I'M JUST POINTING AND

19:04 - MARTIN OF EQUITY.

19:05 - THE COURT DID SAY THAT THE

19:06 - ACTUAL REFUSAL IN THE CASE WAS

19:08 - PREDICATED ON THE FACT THAT

19:10 - THEY TOOK 3 TO

19:11 - ATTEMPTS TO REGISTER BREATH

19:14 - SAMPLE BUT FAILED AND THEN IT

19:15 - WAS DEEMED TO BE A REFUSAL.

19:18 - THEN THE COURT WENT ON TO SAY,

19:19 - BUT WE STILL HOLD

19:21 - WE ARE WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE

19:23 - THIS COURT SITTING ON BAR

19:25 - OVERRULE A CASE THAT SAYS AND

19:27 - SITUATION WHERE A LICENSEE

19:29 - MAINTAINS I DIDN'T UNDERSTAND

19:31 - THE CONSEQUENCES. EVEN THOUGH

19:34 - THE WARNINGS ARE READ TO ME

19:36 - THAT IS A SUFFICIENT BASIS

19:38 - REALLY REALLY NUMB FROM THE

19:40 - OBLIGATION TO SUBMIT TO

19:41 - CHEMICAL TESTING SO YOU'RE

19:43 - SAYING BY VIRTUE OF THE FACT

19:44 - THAT SOMEONE HAS THE PRIVILEGE

19:45 - TO DRIVE THAT WE SHOULD TO TAKE

19:47 - AWAY

19:50 - FACTOR THAT CONSIDERS WHETHER

19:51 - OR NOT THEY KNOWING SKEWS ME

19:53 - KNOWINGLY AND CONSCIOUSLY MADE

19:55 - THE DECISION TREE OF THE YEAR

19:56 - STRONG CONSISTENT WITH WITH THE

19:58 - COURT'S OWN DESCRIPTION AND THE

20:01 - RECENT THAT A NEW SYSTEM WHICH

20:03 - IS SITED BEEN AND WE STARTED

20:04 - OUT THOUGH THIS ARGUMENT TODAY

20:05 - BY SAYING THAT EVEN IF THAT IS

20:07 - THE THE STANDARD THAT YOU

20:08 - BELIEVE IN THIS CASE THAT THERE

20:10 - IS A DISREGARD OF EVIDENCE THAT

20:11 - SHOWED THAT IT WAS KNOWING.

20:14 - THANK YOU COUNCIL. YOU HAVE

20:15 - YOUR 2 MINUTES. THANK YOU ARE.

20:25 - JOHN STALEY THE BANKS LAW

20:26 - GROUP FREE SACK BASKET OF

20:27 - SANTIAGO.

20:29 - I JUST WANT TO START BY

20:30 - POINTING OUT THAT THROUGH

20:31 - TODAY'S ARGUMENT DEPARTMENTS IN

20:33 - THE BRIEFS IN THE ART OF THE

20:34 - TRIAL COURT DEPARTMENT HAS YET

20:35 - TO ACKNOWLEDGE THE EXISTENCE OF

20:36 - COME

20:37 - WILL BE COMMONWEALTH THE IS

20:39 - DIRECTLY ON POINT OF THE FACTS

20:40 - FOR THIS CASE AND HOLDING THAT

20:42 - WHEN IT'S SHOWN IN

20:44 - THE RECORD THAT THE LICENSEE

20:46 - DID NOT SPEAK ENGLISH AND THE

20:48 - WARNINGS ARE ONLY READ TO HIM

20:49 - IN ENGLISH YOU MUST RESCIND THE

20:50 - LICENSE BECAUSE HE WAS NOT

20:51 - GIVEN THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE A

20:53 - KNOWING AND CONSCIOUS REFUSAL.

20:56 - THE DEPARTMENT RELIES

20:57 - ON MORE SNOW THAT AND CLAIMS

20:59 - MARTINO THAT OVERRULE THIS LINE

21:00 - OF CASES AND CLAIMS

21:01 - ARE STRAIGHT. BRIGHT LINE RULE

21:03 - AS LONG AS THE OFFICER READS

21:04 - THE WARNINGS

21:05 - THAT'S ENOUGH. MARK KNOW THAT

21:07 - DID NOT HOLD THIS AND IN FACT

21:09 - THAT ACTUALLY ACKNOWLEDGE THE

21:10 - EXISTENCE OF THE AND SAID THAT

21:11 - WAS

21:12 - A CASE IN WHICH A LANGUAGE

21:13 - BARRIER CAN BE GROUNDS FOR

21:15 - SENDING US ESPECIALLY SO WHAT

21:16 - WE SAW WITH THE POLICE OF A

21:18 - SORRY WHAT'S A POLICE OFFICER,

21:20 - YOU IN THE FIELD.

21:22 - TO DO THEY HAVE THE FORM FROM

21:24 - PENNDOT THAT IS AN ENGLISH,

21:27 - WHAT IS SO THEY COME ACROSS

21:29 - SOMEONE SUSPECTED DUI THEY DO

21:33 - ONE REASON THE FORM AND THE

21:35 - PERSON THEY READ THE FORM OF

21:37 - THE PERSON SAYS.

21:40 - AND OUR STANDARDS

21:41 - SOMEHOW COMMUNICATES WHAT THEY

21:42 - DON'T SPEAK WHATEVER WHAT'S THE

21:44 - OFFICER SUPPOSED TO DO AT THAT

21:45 - POINT.

21:46 - WELL THE OFFICER CAN GET A

21:47 - WARRANT, YOUR HONOR TO GET THE

21:49 - OTHER INJURY BLOOD HE'S

21:50 - SEEKING.

21:52 - ASKING THIS COURT TO IMPOSE ANY

21:54 - NEW DUTY ON THE OFFICER WIDEST

21:56 - WELL YOU ARE IN THE SENSE THAT.

21:58 - IF IF THE PERSON

22:00 - IF THE PERSON WHO UNDERSTANDS

22:02 - THE ENGLISH WRITTEN MORNING.

22:04 - THE OFFICER DOESN'T NEED TO GET

22:05 - A WARRANT.

22:07 - BUT YOU'RE BASICALLY SAYING

22:08 - THAT THE OFFICER WOULD NEED TO

22:09 - GET A WARRANT IF THE PERSON

22:11 - SAYS I DON'T SPEAK ENGLISH.

22:13 - ONLY HE WANTS THE BLOOD

22:14 - EVIDENCE YOUR HONOR

22:16 - BECAUSE EVEN IF THERE'S REFUSAL

22:17 - TO DOES UNDERSTANDING HOW IS

22:18 - THAT EQUAL HOW IS THAT TREATING

22:20 - PEOPLE EQUALLY.

22:22 - WHEN ENGLISH SPEAKING PERSON

22:23 - DOESN'T MAKE YOU KNOW CAN CAN

22:25 - YOU DOESN'T NEED A WARRANT, BUT

22:28 - THE 90 WE SPEAK IN PERSON GETS

22:29 - THE PROTECTION OF THE 4TH

22:30 - AMENDMENT OR WHAT BOTH PEOPLE

22:32 - GET THE PROTECTION OF THE 4TH

22:33 - AMENDMENT IF THEY REFUSE THE

22:35 - EAGLE HAVE LOCACION IS THAT AN

22:36 - ENGLISH SPEAKING PERSON GETS

22:37 - THE OPTION OF KNOWING THAT HIS

22:39 - LICENSE WILL BE SUSPENDED IF WE

22:40 - DON'T THEY ALL KNOW, BUT IT

22:41 - DIDN'T WIN WHEN THEY WHEN THEY

22:42 - WENT THROUGH THE PROCESS OF

22:43 - GETTING A DRIVER'S LICENSE AND

22:44 - THEY ALL KNOW THAT THE IMPLIED

22:46 - CONSENT LAW EXISTED IN THAT THE

22:47 - FAILURE TO DO SO WAS I MEAN I

22:49 - I'M ASSUMING IF YOU'VE GOT THE

22:50 - LICENSE YOU DID THE TRAINING TO

22:52 - GET THE

22:52 - LICENSE WHICH REQUIRED YOU TO

22:54 - UNDERSTAND THAT IF YOU DO GET

22:56 - PULLED OVER AND ASKED FOR

22:57 - SAMPLE, THE IMPLIED CONSENT LAW

22:58 - KICKS IN YOU DO GET TRAINING

23:00 - YOUR HONOR AND WE DO ASSUME

23:02 - THAT EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS THE

23:03 - LAW BUT YOU DON'T HAVE TO GET A

23:04 - PERFECT SCORE ON THAT TEST.

23:06 - AND ALSO IN APPLICATION IF WE

23:08 - REALLY ASSUMED EVERYBODY

23:09 - UNDERSTOOD THE CONSEQUENCES OF

23:10 - REFUSAL WE WILL BE READING THE

23:12 - MORNING THAT ALL WE JUST ASSUME

23:13 - THEY KNOW THEM ASKING FOR BLOOD

23:14 - COUNTS OF THE CITY COME DOWN TO

23:16 - THE TRIAL COURT'S

23:16 - DETERMINATION. I MEAN IN THIS

23:18 - CASE THAT RECORD SENT A LOT

23:20 - OF THINGS.

23:21 - IF YOU READ THROUGH THE

23:21 - OPINION YOU ALMOST GO WELL THE

23:23 - COUNT THE COURT IS GOING TO

23:24 - FIND THAT

23:25 - HE UNDERSTOOD AND THEN KNOWING

23:27 - CONSCIOUS. A REFUSAL AND THEN

23:30 - ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU GET TO THE

23:31 - END OF THE OPINION AND IT'S

23:32 - LIKE WELL I FIND THAT HE DID

23:34 - NOT UNDERSTAND SO YOU KNOW IF

23:37 - IF YOU WOULD YOU COULD YOU EVEN

23:39 - BE HERE IF THE TRIAL COURT.

23:42 - HAD SAID

23:44 - HE DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT WOULD

23:45 - BE THE BASIS OF YOUR CHALLENGE

23:47 - THEN WILL THE BASIS OF THAT

23:49 - WOULD BE THE FACTUAL CHALLENGE

23:50 - THE OFFICER IN DESCRIBING HIS

23:51 - OWN INTERACTIONS DID SAY THEY

23:53 - WERE LARGELY LIMITED.

23:54 - 2 HAND GESTURES AND

23:56 - COMMUNICATIONS AND THAT HE

23:57 - EXPLAINED TO THE

23:58 - MISTER VASQUEZ'S THAT HE WAS

23:59 - ASKING FOR A BLOOD DRAW YOU

24:00 - WOULD BE ARGUING CREDIBILITY

24:02 - DETERMINATION THAT'S WHAT YOU

24:04 - WOULD COME AND ARGUE WITH IT

24:06 - IF THE TRIAL COURT HAD RULED

24:07 - THE OTHER WAY KNOW I I'D BE

24:09 - ARGUING THAT THE TRIAL COURT'S

24:10 - DETERMINATION IF YOU WANT THE

24:11 - OTHER WAY OVERLOOK THE FACT

24:12 - THAT THE OFFICER ACKNOWLEDGED

24:14 - HIS TESTIMONY THAT HE USE NO

24:16 - COMMUNICATIONS THROUGH HAND

24:17 - GESTURES AT ALL TO EXPLAIN THE

24:18 - CONSEQUENCES OF THE REFUSAL TO

24:20 - ACKNOWLEDGE THAT ON THE RECORD

24:21 - BUT DID THE POLICE OFFICER SAY

24:22 - HE WAS ALSO UNCERTAIN AS TO

24:24 - WHETHER OR NOT HE DID SO

24:26 - THERE IS NOTHING CLEAR OF THAT

24:28 - HE ABSOLUTELY WAS CERTAIN THAT

24:30 - THE INDIVIDUAL DID NOT SPEAK

24:31 - ENGLISH.

24:34 - HE SAID HE WAS CLEAR HE DID

24:35 - NOT SPEAK ENGLISH FROM THE

24:36 - VERY BEGINNING, HE SAID HE

24:37 - RECOGNIZED THAT THERE WAS A

24:39 - LANGUAGE BARRIER HE ASKED FOR

24:40 - AN INTERPRETER AND COMMUNICATED

24:41 - THROUGH HAND GESTURES THEY

24:43 - COULDN'T DO THE FIELD SOBRIETY

24:44 - TEST BECAUSE THE LANGUAGE

24:45 - BARRIER BUT HE WAS ABLE TO ASK

24:47 - HIM THROUGH HAND GESTURES OF

24:48 - WHAT HE HAD TO DRINK HOW MANY

24:49 - HE HAD TO DRINK AND TO TRY TO

24:50 - EXPLAIN TO HIM

24:52 - THAT HE WAS ASKING FOR A BLOOD

24:53 - TEST, BUT THE HAND GESTURE STOP

24:55 - THERE. AND WHEN HE READ OVER

24:56 - THE CONSEQUENCES IN THE DEAL 26

24:58 - FORM BE USED TO NOTHING TO AID

25:00 - HIM IN THAT.

25:01 - LET ME TURN MY CONCERN MY

25:02 - CONCERN IS HOW DO WE APPLY THIS

25:05 - GOING FORWARD BECAUSE THEN I

25:06 - FEEL LIKE WE'RE GOING TO BE

25:07 - OPEN UP. PANDORA'S BOX OF EVERY

25:10 - TIME SOMEONE GETS PULLED OVER

25:13 - AND THEN THEY JUST START

25:15 - MOTIONING THAT THEY DON'T

25:16 - UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON HOW

25:18 - ARE WE EVER GOING TO DO WITH

25:20 - THE PURPOSE OF THE LAW WHICH IS

25:22 - TO ENSURE THAT WE DON'T

25:24 - HAVE PEOPLE DRINKING AND

25:25 - DRIVING.

25:26 - WELL YOUR HONOR I'D ARGUE

25:27 - THAT THE COURTS ALREADY BEEN

25:28 - DOING THIS COMPEAN DEPARTMENT

25:30 - VE GARTNER THAT IN ABOUT THESE

25:34 - ARE THE ANSWER

25:36 - IT'S ALREADY BEEN DONE YOU LOOK

25:37 - AT THE RECORD LOOK AT THE FACTS

25:38 - MAY IS THEIR DETERMINATION

25:40 - COULD HE SPEAK ENGLISH. IF THE

25:42 - ANSWER IS YES, HE WAS COULD

25:43 - SPEAK ENGLISH. THEN THE LICENSE

25:45 - STANCE. IT'S NOT YOU RESCIND

25:47 - THE LICENSE THE COURTS ALREADY

25:48 - BEEN DOING THIS

25:49 - AND I HAVE FAITH IN OUR TRIAL

25:50 - COURTS TO MAKE EVIDENCE JURY

25:51 - FINDINGS OF FACT AND

25:52 - DETERMINE THAT. BUT IF THAT'S

25:54 - IF THAT'S THE TRUE

25:55 - CONSIDERATION. THE COURT THAT

25:57 - DOVETAILS INTO MY SECOND ARE

25:58 - GOING UP.

25:59 - FIND STATUTE UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

26:01 - WE DON'T HAVE TO MAKE ANY

26:02 - FACTUAL FINDINGS AT ALL OF MY

26:04 - CONCERN IS AND I AGREE WITH

26:06 - WHAT WAS STATED BY OPPOSING

26:07 - COUNSEL THAT.

26:08 - NO THE TRIAL COURT SAID THAT

26:10 - THE OFFICER WAS ABSOLUTELY

26:12 - UNCERTAIN. AS THE WEATHER.

26:15 - SO YOU HE WASN'T THE OFFICER

26:16 - HIMSELF WASN'T SURE WHETHER HE

26:18 - DID OR DIDN'T SPEAK ENGLISH.

26:20 - AND THAT'S WHAT CONCERNS ME IS

26:22 - LIKE WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT THE

26:23 - FACTS OF EVERY CASE. ALRIGHT

26:26 - IS IT A GENERAL RULE OF LAW.

26:30 - YOU'RE DRIVING

26:31 - YOU UNDERSTAND THE CONSEQUENCES

26:32 - BY HAVING VIRTUE OF HAVING A

26:34 - LICENSE WHICH IS A PRIVILEGE.

26:36 - I BELIEVE THE PRIOR CASES FROM

26:38 - THIS COURT SAY THAT YOU LOOK AT

26:40 - EVERY CASE IN WHICH THE CLAIM

26:41 - IS MADE

26:41 - AND DETERMINE.

26:43 - DID THE PERSON SPEAK ENGLISH

26:45 - WELL ENOUGH TO UNDERSTAND THE

26:46 - WARNINGS THAT'S WHAT THE CASE

26:47 - LAW HOLDS. THERE IS NO CONFLICT

26:50 - BETWEEN HE AND MARTIN O LET'S

26:52 - TALK ABOUT SCOTT. THAT'S A

26:53 - SUPREME COURT CASE RIGHT.

26:55 - YES AND THAT WAS CITED IN

26:57 - MARTIN BACK.

27:00 - THE PURPOSE OF SAYING THAT ONCE

27:02 - THEY HAVE INFORM THE MOTORIST

27:04 - AND OFFICERS AND 4 MOTORS OF

27:06 - IMPLIED CONSENT WRITING

27:07 - WARNINGS.

27:08 - THEY HAVE DONE ALL ALL THEY

27:10 - HAVE TO DO TO SATISFY

27:11 - THEIR OBLIGATIONS AND THAT IS

27:14 - THE LANGUAGE FROM FROM SCOTT

27:16 - THAT'S A SUPREME COURT WE'RE

27:17 - NOT TALKING ABOUT OUR CASES AND

27:20 - IT SAYS YOU KNOW THAT.

27:22 - ONCE THE OFFICER

27:23 - PROVIDES O'CONNELL WARNINGS

27:24 - ASIDE ABOUT THE MIRANDA TESTING

27:26 - THAT THE OFFICER HAS TO ADVISE

27:28 - THE MOTORIST

27:30 - REGARDING CHEMICAL SOBRIETY

27:32 - TESTING IS DONE EVERYTHING

27:33 - POSSIBLE TO ASSIST THE MOTORS

27:35 - IN MAKING INFORMED DECISION AND

27:38 - THAT'S

27:38 - WAS VIEWED AS AN ADDITIONAL

27:40 - BURDEN ON LAW ENFORCEMENT AND

27:42 - THAT WAS TO ENSURE MOTORS IS

27:43 - MAKING A KNOWLEDGEABLE AND

27:45 - INFORMED DECISION

27:47 - THAT'S BALANCED AGAINST THE

27:49 - OBVIOUS TO SUBMIT TO ENSURE

27:52 - THEY'RE FULLY AWARE OF THEIR

27:53 - RIGHTS

27:54 - ADVISING THEM YOU'RE ASKING US

27:57 - OR TO TO TO ENTER SOME KIND OF

27:59 - IGNORED OPINION THAT HIS

28:01 - CONTRACT TO SCOTT.

28:04 - I'M NOT AND I'M NOT ASKING

28:05 - FOR ANY ADDITIONAL BIRD TO BE

28:06 - PLACED ON THE OFFICER I THINK

28:08 - WE'RE CONFLATING WHAT THE

28:09 - OFFICERS BURDEN IS IN THE FIELD

28:10 - AND WHAT THE DEPARTMENT IS

28:11 - AFTER THE FACT IN UPHOLDING THE

28:13 - SUSPENSION. THE OFFICER HERE

28:15 - DID MORE THAN HE HAD TO NO

28:17 - ONE'S ARGUING. THE OFFICER WAS

28:18 - DERELICT IN HIS DUTIES, WE'RE

28:19 - ONLY SAYING THAT UNDER

28:21 - AN APPLICATION. DRIVERS POST BE

28:23 - GIVEN A CHOICE OF THE SCENE YOU

28:24 - WANT TO SUSPENSION YOU WANT TO

28:25 - SUBMIT

28:26 - TO BLOOD. THIS INDIVIDUAL IS

28:27 - NOT GIVEN THAT CHOICE THINK I

28:28 - THINK THE ONLY THING YOU CAN

28:29 - ASK US A LOOK AT IN LIGHT

28:31 - OF SCOTT IS THE FACT THAT THERE

28:34 - ARE KIDS THERE'S A LINE OF

28:35 - CASES THAT DOES LOOK AT WHETHER

28:37 - THERE WAS.

28:39 - AND A LANGUAGE BARRIER SUCH

28:40 - THAT THEY COULD NOT UNDERSTAND

28:42 - ANYTHING. THAT WAS READ TO

28:44 - THEM.

28:46 - AND THAT'S REALLY I ASKED US TO

28:48 - DO IN LIGHT OF SCOTT BECAUSE

28:49 - THAT'S AND THAT'S A CREDIBILITY

28:52 - DETERMINATIONS OF I ASK YOU

28:53 - WHAT WOULD YOU BE DOING IN

28:54 - FRONT OF A SIEVE. IF

28:56 - THAT RECORD HAD SAID HE

28:58 - COULDN'T HE COULDN'T UNDERSTAND

28:59 - AND AGAIN I I WOULD.

29:00 - POINT BACK AT THAT POINT I

29:01 - WOULD BE ARGUING THAT THE TRIAL

29:03 - COURT DID NOT GIVE WAY TO THE

29:05 - OFFICER'S TESTIMONY THAT WHEN

29:06 - HE READ THE WARNINGS OF THE

29:07 - CONSEQUENCES. HE DID NOT MEET

29:09 - WITH ANY OF THE OTHER

29:10 - DISCUSSIONS HE DID THROUGH THE

29:11 - REST OF THE TRIAL COURT'S FREE

29:13 - TO GIVE WAY TO WHATEVER THE

29:14 - TRIAL COURT WANTS TO GIVE WAY

29:16 - I AGAIN I THINK THAT KIND OF

29:18 - GOING BACK TO WHAT THIS IS ALL

29:20 - ABOUT IT'S ALL ABOUT PUBLIC

29:21 - SAFETY. IT'S ALL ABOUT HAVING

29:24 - THIS TOOL AVAILABLE TO GET.

29:27 - THE THE

29:27 - CHEMICAL TESTING TO DETERMINE

29:30 - WHETHER SOMEONE IS DUI OR NOT

29:31 - AND GETTING THESE PEOPLE WHO

29:33 - HAVE THE PRIVILEGE OF A LICENSE

29:34 - TO COOPERATE WITH THAT EFFORT

29:35 - AND THEN HAVING A CIVIL

29:36 - CONSEQUENCES IF

29:37 - THEY DON'T. IT SOUNDS TO ME

29:39 - LIKE WHAT YOU WERE WHAT YOU

29:41 - WHAT YOU ARE PROPOSING WHICH I

29:42 - THINK WAS A CONCERN IN SOME OF

29:44 - THE CASES IS

29:46 - THAT SAFETY PURPOSE IT

29:48 - OVERRIDING PUBLIC

29:48 - SAFETY PURPOSE. PRETTY MUCH

29:51 - GOES AWAY WHENEVER YOU'RE

29:52 - DEALING WITH SOMEONE WHO

29:53 - DOESN'T SPEAK ENGLISH OR

29:54 - PROFESSES NOT TO

29:54 - SPEAK ENGLISH. YOU KNOW IT'S

29:57 - IT'S PRETTY SLAM WITH WITH AN

29:59 - ENGLISH SPEAKING DRIVER, BUT

30:00 - WITH AN AWNING ALLEGEDLY NON

30:02 - ENGLISH SPEAKING DRIVER.

30:04 - THAT THE POLICE OFFICER CAN'T

30:05 - DO ANYTHING IN THE FIELD TOO 2.

30:09 - OTHER THAN GET

30:10 - A WARRANT. WHICH IS THE WHOLE

30:12 - POINT OF THE IMPLIED

30:13 - CONSENT LAW. IS IS YOU KNOW

30:17 - YOU'RE YOU'RE SETTING UP 2

30:18 - CLASSES OF SITUATIONS THAT

30:19 - DON'T SEEM TO FULFILL THE

30:20 - PURPOSE OF THE STATUTE.

30:23 - AND IT TOOK THE WORDS OUT OF

30:24 - MY MOUTH WITH THE.

30:26 - GET THE WARRANT ARGUMENT YOU'RE

30:27 - ON BUT THE PURPOSE OF THE

30:29 - IMPLIED CONSENT LAW AGAIN WAS

30:30 - THAT AT THE POINT OF DRAWING

30:32 - BLOOD TO GIVE THE LICENSEE A

30:34 - CHOICE TAKE THE SUSPENSION.

30:36 - WE'RE GIVING BLOOD

30:37 - AND WHY ADOPTING THE PLANE.

30:39 - THE PLANE LICENSES PRESUME TO

30:41 - KNOW THE LAW. AT THE TIME OF

30:43 - THE PULL OVER AND

30:45 - YOU'RE SAYING YOU'RE SAYING

30:46 - THAT YOUR YOUR CLIENT DIDN'T

30:48 - EVEN KNOW THAT THE OFFICER WAS

30:49 - ASKING HIM.

30:51 - TO CHEMICAL TESTING AT ALL NO

30:54 - BUT BASED ON THE

30:54 - TESTIMONY PRESENTED. THE

30:56 - OFFICER WAS ABLE TO CONVEY TO

30:57 - HIM THROUGH HAND GESTURES OF

30:59 - DRAWING BLOOD.

31:00 - THAT HE WAS ASKING FOR BLOOD

31:02 - DRAW THAT HE DID NOT UNDERSTAND

31:03 - THE CONSEQUENCES OF THE OFFICER

31:04 - MADE NO BONES ABOUT IT HE DID

31:06 - NOT USE ANY AUGMENT ADDITIONAL

31:08 - TOOLS TO TRY TO TELL HIM WELL

31:10 - THAT WOULD KIND OF BE I MEAN

31:11 - IT'S NOT.

31:13 - I GUESS YOU COULD USE PICTURE

31:14 - MARY OR OR OR SOMETHING BUT I'M

31:16 - NOT SURE HOW YOU SAY AND YOUR

31:18 - LICENSE WILL BE SUSPENDED.

31:21 - AND HAND GESTURES I GUESS I'M

31:22 - I'M TRYING TO GET TO THE POINT

31:23 - WHERE IF YOUR IF YOUR CLIENT

31:25 - KNEW AT LEAST KNEW THAT THE

31:27 - POLICE OFFICER WAS ASKING FOR A

31:29 - BLOOD DRAW

31:30 - WHEN HE AS AN EDUCATED

31:32 - DRIVER WHO WAS DRIVING THE

31:33 - ROADS OF PENNSYLVANIA WHERE

31:35 - ENGLISH IS ALL OVER THE PLACE

31:37 - IN TERMS OF SIGNS AND

31:38 - DIRECTIONS AND WHERE HE TOOK

31:39 - THE TEST. NO OH

31:41 - MY GOSH. YOU KNOW HE'S ASKING

31:44 - ME FOR THIS THING WHERE I COULD

31:46 - END UP LOSING MY LICENSE AND I

31:47 - DON'T

31:47 - SAY YES.

31:48 - WHAT THE LAW DOES PRESUME,

31:50 - EVERYONE KNOWS THE LAW BUT IN

31:52 - APPLICATION THAT'S NOT

31:53 - THE TRUTH. AND IN THE VEHICLE

31:55 - CODE THERE'S NO ACTUAL

31:56 - REQUIREMENT THAT A DRIVER, NO

31:57 - ENGLISH.

31:59 - THAT ADDED TO GET A LICENSE

32:01 - TO DRIVE IN THIS IN

32:02 - THIS AUTHOR WROTE WHICH HE HAS

32:05 - TO KNOW THE RULES OF THE ROAD

32:07 - DOES HAVE TO KNOW THE RULES ARE

32:08 - ON THE VEHICLE CODE CHAPTER 15

32:10 - ONLY REQUIRE THAT HE

32:11 - UNDERSTANDS THE SIGNAGE NOT

32:12 - THAT HE READ ENGLISH WHILE HE'S

32:13 - DRIVING.

32:14 - WELL, THE MORE REASON AGAINST

32:15 - THE OFFICER TO GIVE HAND

32:16 - SIGNALS.

32:18 - THE ONLY PLACE IN THE VEHICLE

32:19 - COVERT ENGLISH IS REQUIRED IS

32:21 - ON THE SKILLS TEST OF THE CDL

32:22 - EXAM, NOWHERE ELSE IN THE

32:24 - VEHICLE CODE IS ENGLISH

32:25 - REQUIRED. SO THE PRIOR

32:26 - HYPOTHETICAL THERE'S NOTHING

32:27 - THAT REQUIRES THE OFFICER TO

32:29 - EVEN READ SO ARE YOU SAYING

32:30 - YOUR CLIENT WAS UNAWARE OF THE

32:31 - PENNSYLVANIA IMPLIED CONSENT

32:32 - LAW. I'M SAYING HE WAS UNAWARE

32:34 - OF THE FACT THAT HIS LICENSE

32:35 - WILL BE SUSPENDED IF YOU'RE DID

32:36 - NOT SUBMIT TO TESTING WHICH IS

32:38 - IN THE IMPLIED CONSENT LAW,

32:39 - YES. SO HIS YOU'RE SAYING YOUR

32:41 - CLIENT WAS IGNORANT OF THE LAW,

32:42 - YES.

32:44 - BUT THE LAW SAYS THAT SHE HAS

32:45 - DOESN'T THAT CUT AGAINST THE

32:47 - PRESUMPTION THAT PEOPLE KNOW

32:49 - WHAT THE LAW IS AND THAT'S A

32:50 - GENERAL PRESUMPTION BUT 1547

32:52 - THE IMPLIED

32:53 - CONSENT STATUE MANDATES THEY

32:55 - GET THOSE WARNINGS AGAIN AND

32:56 - MAKE THAT DECISION ON THE SCENE

32:58 - 1547 A SPECIFIC EXEMPTION THAT

33:00 - SAYS WE DON'T IMPLY THAT EVERY

33:01 - TIME.

33:02 - WE'RE GOING TO GIVE YOU THESE

33:03 - WARNINGS AGAIN AND THEN YOU'RE

33:04 - GOING TO MAKE A KNOWING

33:05 - DECISION BUT THAT'S ALL IT

33:06 - SAYS.

33:07 - IT SHALL BE THE DUTY OF THE

33:08 - POLICE OFFICER TO INFORM THE

33:10 - PERSON THAT THE PERSONS

33:11 - OPERATING PRIVILEGE PRIVILEGE

33:12 - WILL BE SUSPENDED UPON REFUSAL

33:14 - TO SUBMIT TO CHEMICAL TESTING

33:16 - SO IT SAYS IT DOESN'T SAY TO

33:17 - MAKE SURE THEY KNOW AND

33:19 - UNDERSTAND KNOW THAT CAME FROM

33:20 - CASE, VARIOUS CASE LOOK AT THE

33:22 - CASE LAW FIRMS, VARIOUS COURTS,

33:24 - INCLUDING DEPARTMENT THE

33:26 - DEPARTMENT THE GARTNER

33:27 - STATE THAT THEY GET THAT OPTION

33:29 - WHEN IT SPREAD OF THEM IN A

33:30 - LANGUAGE THEY DON'T UNDERSTAND

33:32 - THEY DIDN'T GET THAT OPTION AND

33:33 - THE SUSPENSION MUST BE COUNCIL

33:35 - IS IT YOUR

33:35 - POSITION THAT.

33:36 - WE SHOULD IMPOSE UPON POLICE

33:39 - OFFICERS A REQUIREMENT TO

33:41 - ENSURE THAT THE DRIVER

33:43 - UNDERSTANDS ENGLISH.

33:45 - NO I'M ASKING THE COURT TO

33:46 - IMPOSE STIFF. THEY'RE

33:48 - NOT SATISFIED WITH

33:50 - THE REFUSAL TO BECAUSE IT IS

33:51 - CASE THEY'RE JUST SATISFIED

33:53 - WITH THE REFUSAL AND THEY TAKE

33:55 - THE SUSPENSION RIGHT OFF IF

33:56 - THEY WANT THE EVIDENCE

33:57 - WE HAVE CASES ALL THE TIME THAT

34:00 - THE WHOLE ISSUE IS WHETHER OR

34:01 - NOT THEY THEY FULLY UNDERSTOOD.

34:03 - BUT FOR

34:03 - DIFFERENT REASONS, YES FOR

34:05 - DIFFERENT REASONS FOR MEDICAL

34:06 - REASONS FOR PSYCHOLOGICAL

34:07 - REASONS AND IN THOSE CASES.

34:09 - THERE IS A BURDEN OF PROOF

34:10 - FROM THIS FROM THIS COURT

34:11 - PUTTING THAT YOU HAVE TO

34:12 - ESTABLISH THAT INTOXICATION IS

34:14 - NOT A FACTOR THERE.

34:16 - COSBY GARTNER SPECIFICALLY

34:18 - EXEMPTS THAT FROM LANGUAGE

34:19 - CASES.

34:21 - THEY SAID THAT THEY'RE TOTALLY

34:22 - ANTITHETICAL FROM EACH OTHER WE

34:23 - DO NOT PUT THAT BURDEN ON

34:25 - LANGUAGE CASES GOING BACK TO

34:26 - JUST FOR JACK'S QUESTION WHAT

34:28 - DO WE DO REGARDING INFORMING

34:30 - OFFICERS.

34:31 - OF WHAT APPEARS TO BE AN

34:33 - ADDITIONAL RESPONSIBILITY THAT

34:35 - YOU WOULD LIKE THIS COURT TO

34:36 - IMPOSE.

34:38 - TO BE FRANK WITH THE COURT WHEN

34:39 - THE OFFICE IN THE FIELD, I

34:40 - BELIEVE THE OFFICERS CONCERNED

34:41 - WITH COLLECTING EVIDENCE NOT

34:43 - WITHSTANDING A CIVIL SUSPENSION

34:44 - GOING FORWARD.

34:46 - THE OFFICERS DOING ALL THESE

34:47 - THINGS THAT

34:48 - 1547 BECOME WEALTHY MYERS, A

34:50 - TOOL FOR THE OFFICER TO GAIN

34:51 - EVIDENCE IF THE OFFICERS

34:52 - UNHAPPY WITH THE OUTCOME IN THE

34:53 - EVIDENCE HE OBTAINED

34:55 - HIS GOAL IS TO GET AN

34:56 - ADDITIONAL SUSPENSION HIS GOAL

34:57 - IS TO GET EVIDENCE IF YOU WANT

34:59 - TO CONTINUE FOR TO GET OUT THAT

35:00 - HE CAN GET

35:00 - A WARM.

35:01 - WELL, THE GOAL OF THE IMPLIED

35:02 - CONSENT LAWS TO MAKE IT EASY

35:04 - FOR THE POLICE NOT EASY

35:05 - ACCESSIBLE FOR THE POLICE

35:06 - OFFICERS ON THE SCENE FACED

35:08 - WITH A SITUATION WHERE TIME IS

35:09 - OF THE ESSENCE TO GET THAT

35:10 - EVIDENCE AND THAT'S THAT THAT'S

35:12 - THE QUID PRO QUO BETWEEN

35:13 - GETTING

35:13 - THE LICENSE AND THEN GETTING

35:16 - PULLED OVER THE IMPLIED CONSENT

35:17 - LAW.

35:19 - AND ALL THOSE INTERACTIONS

35:21 - HAVE WERE WRITTEN LONG BEFORE

35:23 - BIRCHFIELD CHANGE THE ENTIRE

35:25 - SCAPE THE LAW WITH REGARD TO

35:26 - BLUNT THAT WAS FOR CRIMINAL.

35:28 - A CONVICTION ARE TALKING

35:29 - ABOUT A LICENSE SUSPENSION

35:31 - HERE.

35:32 - WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE YOU'RE

35:34 - BEING FORCED TO GIVE THE BLOOD.

35:36 - THEY CAN'T DO THAT BUT DRUGS

35:37 - THEY REFUSE WITH THE LORD THAT

35:40 - KIM.

35:42 - BUT AGAIN YOU WANT TO

35:43 - DO THAT IN HIS LICENSE

35:44 - SUSPENSION CASE AND FORCE THEM

35:46 - TO HAVE TO HAVE A BLOOD DRAW.

35:48 - I'M NOT I'M NOT FOLLOWING THAT

35:50 - BECAUSE I THINK YOU'RE TRYING

35:51 - TO SAY THEY SHOULDN'T HAVE TO

35:53 - WHAT YOU'RE SAYING BRINGING A

35:54 - WARRANT LIKE YOU WOULD IN A

35:55 - CRIMINAL.

35:56 - MATTER. THIS ISN'T A CREW

35:59 - MATTER IT'S A LICENSE

36:00 - SUSPENSION AND DRIVING IS A

36:01 - PRIVILEGE SO DIFFERENT

36:02 - STANDARDS HAVE BEEN APPLIED AND

36:04 - THAT'S WHY.

36:05 - WITH THAT HERE I'M AN

36:07 - ARTFULLY WORD THIS BUT MY

36:09 - ARTIST IN THE FIELD.

36:11 - THE OFFICERS WORRIED WITH THE

36:12 - CRIMINAL EVIDENCE, GATHERING.

36:15 - I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THIS

36:16 - IMPLIED CONSENT LAW IS THE

36:17 - TOOL. IT IS HELPFUL TO THE

36:19 - OFFICERS TO

36:20 - GATHER THAT.

36:21 - YES AND IF WE IF WE SIDE

36:25 - WITH YOU WE'RE MAKING. WE'RE

36:27 - DIMINISHING THE AVAILABILITY OF

36:29 - THAT TOOL.

36:30 - WELL IN THIS CASE AND IN

36:31 - LANGUAGE CASES THE LANGUAGE

36:33 - THEY'RE DIMINISHES THE

36:34 - AVAILABILITY OF THE TOOL.

36:36 - IF HE DOESN'T GET READ THE

36:37 - WARNINGS IN A WAY HE

36:38 - UNDERSTANDS IT THEN IT'S NOT A

36:39 - TOOL OF ALL USING A BALL TEAM

36:41 - HAMMER DRIVE-IN AND NOW.

36:43 - WELL AGAIN, I MEAN LOOK I

36:44 - UNDERSTAND I THINK IT'S A

36:46 - COMPLICATED CASE THAT THE ISSUE

36:48 - IS THE ISSUE IS YOUR CLIENT'S

36:49 - RIGHTS CERTAINLY, BUT THE ISSUE

36:51 - IS WHAT IS THE U.S. THE PURPOSE

36:52 - OF THE IMPLIED CONSENT LAW AND

36:54 - THE BURDEN ON OFFICERS IF

36:56 - THE OFFICERS NOT ONLY HAVE THE

36:58 - OBLIGATION TO READ THE WARNING

36:59 - THAT THEY'RE GIVEN

37:00 - BUT TO ALSO SOMEHOW DETERMINE

37:02 - WHAT THE LANGUAGES OF THE

37:03 - PERSON WHO'S THAT THAT THAT THE

37:05 - SPEAK AND THEN GET THE WARNINGS

37:07 - IN THE LANGUAGE THAT THE PERSON

37:08 - THAT THEY SPEAK OR FIND AN

37:09 - INTERPRETER

37:09 - ALL WHILE PRESUMABLY THE BLOOD

37:12 - IT CAN BE ANY ALCOHOL THE

37:13 - SYSTEM IS CONTINUING TO WORK

37:14 - ITS WAY OUT OF THE SYSTEM YOUR

37:16 - ANSWER TO THAT IS GET A

37:17 - WARRANT.

37:19 - MY ANSWER THAT IS GET A

37:20 - WARRANT AND ALSO ARGUE THAT I'M

37:22 - NOT WE'RE NOT ASKING THAT YOU

37:23 - TAKE THE

37:24 - TOOL WAY THE TOOLS THEY'RE

37:26 - STILL UTILIZE WE'RE ONLY ASKING

37:27 - THAT IN UNIQUE CIRCUMSTANCES

37:29 - WHERE THE FACTUALLY

37:30 - INEFFECTUAL. WHAT

37:33 - TO STOP THE

37:34 - DEPARTMENT CAN SWING THE HAMMER

37:35 - AFTER THE FACT WHEN WE'RE

37:37 - MONTHS AFTER THE FACT ALL OF

37:39 - THE FACTS OF UNSETTLED THE TOOL

37:40 - WAS THERE FOR THE OFFICER TO

37:42 - USE THAT WAS INEFFECTUAL

37:43 - BECAUSE OF A LANGUAGE BARRIER

37:44 - DON'T LET THE DEPARTMENT HIT

37:46 - THEM WITH A HAMMER AFTER THE

37:46 - FACT WHEN THAT WAS IN EFFECT

37:48 - CAN. THANK YOU COUNCIL.

37:53 - NOTHING FURTHER

37:53 - YOUR HONOR. THANK YOU. MISTER

37:55 - EDWARDS WILL TAKE IT UNDER

37:56 - ADVISEMENT.

38:03 - WELL YOU'RE NOT GOING ANYWHERE.

38:07 - HIS NEW SWITCHING

38:11 - I LEARNED MY LESSON, SHE'S

38:14 - A STICKLER NEXT CASE

38:16 - IS NUMBER HENRY ROLE FERGUSON

38:19 - VERSUS COMMONWEALTH, THE

38:20 - PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT

38:21 - OF TRANSPORTATION.

38:22 - THIS MATTER INVOLVES THE

38:23 - APPEAL OF HENRI EARL FERGUSON

38:25 - FROM THE JANUARY 212021 TO

38:27 - ORDER THE COURT OF COMMON PLEAS

38:28 - OF

38:29 - CUMBERLAND COUNTY DIVERSIONS

38:31 - APPEAL IN FROM THE DEPARTMENT

38:32 - OF TRANSPORTATION BUREAU OF

38:33 - DRIVER LICENSING ONE YEAR

38:35 - SUSPENSION. FERGUSON'S

38:36 - OPERATING PRIVILEGES. FERGUSON

38:38 - PLED GUILTY TO DUI ON JULY

38:41 - 142020. BECAUSE FERGUSON HAVE

38:43 - PREVIOUSLY ACCEPTED ACCELERATED

38:45 - REHABILITATIVE DISPOSITION

38:46 - COMMONLY REFERRED TO AS A R D

38:48 - AND SATISFACTION OF THE DUI

38:50 - CHARGE IN

38:51 - 2012, WHICH THE DEPARTMENT OF

38:52 - TRANSPORTATION CONSIDERED A

38:54 - PRIOR OFFENSE UNDER THE

38:55 - VEHICLE CODE. THE DEPARTMENT OF

38:57 - TRANSPORTATION NOTIFY FERGUSON

38:59 - THAT IS OPERATING PRIVILEGE

39:00 - WOULD BE SUSPENDED FOR

39:01 - ONE YEAR. IF NOT FOR THE PRIOR

39:03 - OFFENSE. FERGUSON WOULD NOT

39:05 - HAVE BEEN SUBJECT TO A

39:05 - SUSPENSION OF HIS OPERATING

39:07 - PRIVILEGE. FERGUSON APPEAL TO

39:08 - THE COMMON PLEAS COURT SEEKING

39:10 - TO EXTEND

39:11 - THE SUPERIOR COURT'S HOLDING IN

39:12 - COMMONWEALTH CHURCH VERSUS

39:14 - CHURCH CAN 2 THE ENHANCED CIVIL

39:16 - PENALTY OF A LICENSE SUSPENSION

39:17 - FOR SECOND OFFENDERS UNDER

39:19 - SECTION FOR THE VEHICLE CODE

39:21 - AND CHECK IN THE SUPERIOR COURT

39:22 - DECLARED SECTION 38 O 6 OF THE

39:25 - VEHICLE CODE TO BE

39:26 - UNCONSTITUTIONAL. AND SO FAR AS

39:28 - THE DEFIANT ACCEPTANCE INTO A

39:29 - ARE D HAS A PRIOR OFFENSE

39:31 - FOR PURPOSES OF IMPOSING

39:33 - ENHANCED CRIMINAL PENALTIES.

39:35 - THE COMMON PLEAS COURT REJECTED

39:36 - SUCH AN EXTENSION OF CHURCH CAN

39:38 - IN THIS CASE AND FROM THE ONE

39:39 - YEAR SUSPENSION OF FERGUSON'S

39:41 - OPERATING PRIVILEGES WE POSED

39:43 - BY

39:43 - THE DEPARTMENT, ONE APPEAL

39:44 - FERGUSON PRESENTS AN ISSUE OF

39:46 - FIRST IMPRESSION TO THIS COURT

39:47 - QUESTIONING WHETHER

39:48 - CONSISTENT WITH THE HOLDING OF

39:50 - A SUPERIOR COURT JUDGE CAN THE

39:51 - SUBSTANTIVE AND PROCEDURAL DUE

39:53 - PROCESS RIGHTS OF PENNSYLVANIA

39:54 - MOTORISTS ARE VIOLATED WHEN THE

39:56 - DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION

39:57 - CONSIDERS AN EARLIER

39:58 - DUI CHARGE WHICH WAS DISMISSED

40:01 - FOLLOWING THE SUCCESSFUL

40:02 - COMPLETION OF AN E R D PROGRAM

40:04 - HAS A

40:04 - PRIOR OFFENSE, JUSTIFYING THE

40:07 - SUSPENSION OF A MOTORIST

40:09 - OPERATING PRIVILEGES. THANK YOU

40:11 - YOUR HONOR.

40:12 - THAT'S A CONCISE STATEMENT OF

40:14 - THE FACTS.

40:24 - SORRY

40:25 - COUNCIL SEAT. PRESIDENT JUDGE

40:27 - JERRY LAI SAID ON BEHALF OF

40:28 - GENERAL FERGUSON.

40:31 - I WOULD LIKE TO RESERVE MAYBE 2

40:32 - MINUTES OF TIME AT THE END IF

40:34 - IT'S NEEDED ON MY PART TO REBUT

40:36 - ANYTHING THAT.

40:37 - COMMONWEALTH MIGHT WANT TO

40:38 - PENNDOT MIGHT WANT TO PUT

40:39 - FORWARD. COVERED.

40:41 - YOU'RE YOU'RE INTIMATELY

40:42 - FAMILIAR WITH THIS CASE, I'VE

40:45 - BEEN DOING CRIMINAL FOR

40:47 - MY WHOLE PROFESSIONAL A LITTLE

40:49 - BIT OF A DUCK OUT OF WATER HERE

40:51 - IN THE COMMONWEALTH COURT.

40:53 - PEOPLE DEFER TO YOUR EXPERTISE.

40:55 - I DON'T WANT TO SOUND TOO MUCH

40:57 - LEVITY HERE.

40:59 - BUT I HAVE SEEN

41:01 - THE DUI LAW OVER MY CAREER

41:04 - EVOLVE AND IT'S GOTTEN TO A

41:06 - GOOD PLACE IT'S GETTING BETTER

41:08 - AND BETTER IT'S STILL NOT THE

41:09 - BEST SOLUTION FOR SOMEBODY THAT

41:11 - HAS AN IMPAIRMENT VERSUS

41:13 - SOMEBODY THAT COULD BE INJURED

41:14 - SERIOUSLY ON THE ROAD BUT WE

41:16 - HAVE GOING FROM

41:17 - NO PUNISHMENT HARSH PUNISHMENT

41:20 - TO REHABILITATION WE'VE DONE A

41:22 - LOT OF THINGS.

41:23 - THE COURTS. THE DEFENSE BAR.

41:27 - THE PROSECUTORS AND WITH THAT

41:29 - WHERE WE ARE RIGHT NOW IS I

41:31 - THINK WE'RE AT ANOTHER ONE OF

41:32 - THOSE POINTS AND THE ONLY ISSUE

41:34 - THAT I HAVE IN THIS WHOLE CASE

41:36 - IS.

41:38 - I DON'T ALLOW ME TO THAT DRESS

41:39 - BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW

41:41 - HOW MUCH PRACTICE YOU'VE HAD

41:43 - BEEN IN THIS IN THE CRIMINAL

41:45 - DEFENDANT ARENA. BUT WHEN A

41:46 - CLIENT COMES TO ME AND HE'S

41:48 - CHARGED WITH DUI IT'S HIS

41:51 - FIRST OFFENSE OR HER FIRST

41:52 - OFFENSE REGARDLESS OF WHATEVER

41:54 - WALK OF LIFE REGARDLESS WHETHER

41:56 - IN GLACIER LANGUAGE THEY SPEAK

41:58 - THEY ARE PRESENTED WITH AN

42:00 - OPTION USUALLY BY THE COURT AND

42:02 - THAT'S IF YOU DON'T

42:03 - CHALLENGE THIS. IF YOU PROMISE

42:06 - TO DO CERTAIN REHABILITATED

42:08 - THINGS LIKE GET COUNSELING AND

42:10 - DO COMMUNITY SERVICE. WE WILL

42:12 - INMATE YOU TO THE AIR

42:14 - D PROGRAM AND AT THE END OF

42:16 - THAT PROGRAM IF YOU

42:17 - SUCCESSIVELY COMPLETED. YOU

42:19 - DON'T HAVE TO PLEAD GUILTY TO

42:21 - ANYTHING YOU DON'T HAVE TO

42:22 - ADMIT TO ANY FACTS BUT WE WILL

42:25 - DISMISS THIS CHARGE AGAINST YOU

42:27 - AND IT CAN'T AND THERE WILL BE

42:29 - AS IF IT

42:30 - NEVER HAPPENED.

42:31 - BUT DOESN'T IT ALWAYS STILL

42:32 - EXIST EVEN THOUGH YOU RD

42:35 - DOESN'T IT ALWAYS

42:36 - STILL EXIST. IT SECRET LITTLE

42:39 - PLACE YOUR HONOR AND THAT IS IN

42:41 - PENN DOT HAS A FORM.

42:43 - THAT WE'LL GET TO THAT IN A

42:44 - MINUTE BUT IF YOU SUCCESSFULLY

42:46 - COMPLETED A R D WE

42:48 - HAVE TO YOU'RE 12 MONTHS IN

42:49 - YOUR COMMUNITY SERVICE AND

42:50 - COUNSELING YOUR CLASSES.

42:52 - THE JUDGE OF THE COMMON PLEAS

42:54 - COURT WILL ISSUE AN ORDER.

42:56 - IF YOU PETITION HIM TO EXPUNGE

42:58 - THE RECORD

42:59 - AND THAT REALLY MEANS THAT IT

43:01 - GOES AWAY SO THERE'S NO

43:02 - CONVICTION. THERE IS NO

43:04 - CONVICTION AND THERE IS AN

43:06 - OFFENSE.

43:07 - THERE WAS AN

43:09 - THERE WAS SEE THIS IS WHERE WE

43:11 - GET INTO A JOB AND THERE'S A

43:12 - VIOLATION THERE'S AN OFFENSE.

43:13 - THERE'S NO COMMISSION AND THIS

43:15 - IS VERY TROUBLING FOR ME

43:16 - BECAUSE IN PAGE 10 OF PENNDOT

43:19 - STREET BRIEF AND YOU HAVE TO

43:21 - UNDERSTAND IF I COULD DIRECT

43:23 - YOUR ATTENTION OF GETTING OFF

43:24 - OF I 10 GENTLE FOUGHT DISORDER

43:25 - THAT I GET OFF AND ON MIKE.

43:29 - BUT BACK R D KIND COMES

43:31 - TO ME AND I SAY

43:33 - OR DOES A GOOD GOOD ANSWER TO

43:35 - YOU, I'M A JUDGE ON A DOCTOR,

43:36 - I'M A LAWYER, I'M A JUST A

43:38 - REGULAR LABOR YOU TAKE A ARE D

43:41 - YOU'RE GOING TO GET THROUGH

43:41 - THIS AND ULTIMATELY ON THE

43:43 - RECORD. SO THAT'S A GOOD THING

43:45 - FOR YOUR CAREER

43:45 - YOUR PROFESSION OR WHATEVER,

43:47 - BUT ON THE OTHER 2 DIFFERENT

43:48 - SCENARIOS HERE ONE IS OF HAVING

43:50 - NO RECORD.

43:52 - BUT WE NEVER TAKE AWAY THE

43:53 - FACT THAT THE CLIENT

43:55 - UNDERSTANDS THAT HE OR SHE

43:57 - COMMITTED.

43:59 - ILLEGAL EVENTS OR NONE OF THEM

44:01 - THAT WE UNDERSTAND ONLY ONE

44:03 - THING AND THAT'S WHAT

44:05 - I THINK PANDA GETS A LITTLE BIT

44:06 - FAST WITH THEY PUT IN THEIR

44:08 - BRIEF THAT HE WAS

44:10 - ADMITTED TO A R D FOR A

44:12 - VIOLATION OF THE DUI STATUE.

44:16 - HE WAS NOT ADMITTED

44:18 - TO THE AIR THE PROGRAM

44:19 - INITIALLY FOR

44:20 - A VIOLATION. HE WAS ADMITTED

44:22 - FOR A JOB BEING CHARGED WITH

44:24 - THAT AND ALL WE'RE ASKING IS

44:27 - PLEASE IF WE'RE GOING TO USE

44:29 - THIS AS A RESET OF THIS TYPE

44:30 - OF STATUE. I TELL MY CLIENTS

44:33 - BACK TO THE COURT SAID WELL

44:35 - THERE WILL BE A RECORD AT PENN

44:36 - DOT AND THEY WILL KNOW

44:38 - FROM FROM THE DL FORM THAT

44:40 - PENNDOT ROAD PENNDOT GAVE TO

44:42 - THE CLERKS AND IT'S ON

44:43 - IF YOU LOOK AT IT ON THE

44:44 - REPRODUCE RECORD SET REPRODUCE

44:46 - RECORD PAGE

44:47 - 76 PENNDOT FILLS OUT HAS THE

44:50 - CLERK OF COURTS FILL OUT THIS

44:51 - ONE FORM THAT DOESN'T EVER GO

44:53 - AWAY AND THAT GETS SAID THE

44:54 - PENNDOT PENNDOT HAD THIS

44:56 - FOREMAN, MISTER FERGUSON LIKE

44:57 - IT HAS ON ALL OF US WHO WOULD

44:59 - BE CHARGED THROUGH EVERY DAY.

45:00 - AND NOW PENNDOT IS USING THIS

45:02 - FORM AND THIS FORM ONLY TO SAY

45:05 - MISTER FERGUSON,

45:07 - YOU HAVE A PRIOR OFFENSE.

45:10 - AND ALL I'M ASKING YOU TO

45:11 - CONSIDER IS PERHAPS THAT THAT'S

45:13 - A VIOLATION OF

45:16 - DUE PROCESS, LET ME ASK YOU A

45:17 - QUESTION BECAUSE THIS YOUR

45:18 - HONOR.

45:19 - THEN YOU RITUALLY THAT

45:21 - THE THE COURT GIVES THE IN THE

45:24 - LICENSEE AN OPTION YOU CAN

45:26 - EITHER PLEAD TO THE CHARGE.

45:29 - WE DO AND YOU CAN SEE DIVIDE IT

45:31 - CAN BE FOUND GUILTY. WE'RE NOT

45:33 - GOING TO BITE OR NOT GUILTY

45:35 - OR YOU CAN GO OR DO THAT'S

45:37 - CORRECT OR SO BECAUSE THE

45:39 - CLIENT UNDERSTANDS THAT THERE

45:40 - ARE 2 OPTIONS, YES, DOESN'T THE

45:43 - CLIENT

45:43 - ALSO UNDERSTAND THAT BY TAKING

45:46 - A ARE D THAT HE COULD HAVE BEEN

45:48 - FOUND GUILTY.

45:49 - BUT IT DOESN'T TAKE AWAY THE

45:50 - FACT IT COULD HAVE BEEN FOUND

45:51 - IN THAT ISN'T WHAT I DOT RIGHT,

45:53 - BUT I DON'T MEAN TO INTERRUPT

45:54 - IP ADDRESS.

45:57 - THERE'S

45:58 - STILL THAT

45:59 - VIOLATION ALLEGED VIOLATION OUT

46:02 - THERE AND YOU'RE ON OR YOU'RE

46:03 - USING A PROPER WORD. THANK YOU.

46:06 - I DON'T MEAN TO SOUND THAT WAY

46:08 - BUT YOU'RE USING THE WORD

46:09 - ALLEGED.

46:10 - AND THAT'S ONLY THING WE KNOW

46:11 - BECAUSE A LOT

46:12 - OF TIMES IT CAN KIND OF COME TO

46:14 - ME THEY'RE DRIVING UP ABOVE WAS

46:16 - A LITTLE BIT BILL THEY'VE HAD

46:18 - WAS LET ME ASK YOU ONE STEP

46:19 - FURTHER BECAUSE A LOT OF TIMES

46:20 - DON'T THE CLIENTS ARE ALREADY

46:22 - KNOW WHAT THERE.

46:23 - LET'S LEVEL BUT ALCOHOL LEVEL

46:25 - IS IN THEIR BLOOD WHEN WHEN

46:27 - THEY MAKE WE'RE ALWAYS

46:29 - WHAT THEY DIDN'T REPORT THEY

46:30 - REFUSED DIRECT YEAH, NO THEY

46:32 - KNOW WHERE THAT SO IT'S I MEAN

46:33 - THEY HAVE A LOT OF INFORMATION

46:35 - THAT EITHER THEY DIDN'T CONSENT

46:37 - OR THERE ARE AWARE THAT MAY

46:40 - BE THERE IDAHO LEVEL WAS ABOVE

46:43 - WHERE IT NEEDED TO BE SO

46:44 - THEY HAD SOME INFORMATION IN

46:47 - ORDER TO MAKE AN INFORMED

46:49 - DECISION ABOUT WHICH WAY

46:50 - TO GO YOU'RE YOU'RE YOU'RE

46:52 - GETTING ME THE GOOD QUESTIONS

46:54 - AND I THANK YOU FOR THAT, BUT I

46:55 - WILL TELL YOU THAT IN 99.94,

46:59 - 100% OF THE TIME.

47:00 - THEY ARE GUILTY THEY DRANK

47:02 - TOO MUCH AND THEY SHOULDN'T

47:04 - HAVE BEEN DRIVING THAT CAR

47:05 - BECAUSE ENDANGERED ALL OF US,

47:07 - BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS WE'RE

47:08 - STILL IN THE UNITED STATES OF

47:09 - AMERICA AND THEY HAVE TO PROVE

47:12 - EACH AND EVERY ELEMENT OF THAT

47:13 - WHEN A CLIENT COMES TO ME YOUR

47:15 - HONOR AND I LOOK AT THIS CASE.

47:17 - AND IT'S RIGHT ON THE LEGAL

47:18 - LIMIT FOR HE'S UP IN THE

47:20 - NORTHERN END OF THE COUNTY AND

47:22 - HE'S ON A WINDY ROAD AND HE

47:23 - CROSSED THE LINE A LITTLE BIT I

47:25 - TELL A CLIENT YOU KNOW THIS IS

47:27 - MAYBE A TRIBAL CASE, BUT IF YOU

47:29 - TRY IT AND YOU LOSE IT'S GOING

47:31 - TO BE ON YOUR

47:32 - FOR LIFE. SO YOU KNOW IT'S A

47:34 - CLOSE CALL. BUT YOU BETTER TAKE

47:36 - A ARE D BECAUSE IT'S A SAFER

47:37 - WAY OUT AND

47:39 - THAT WAY HE DOESN'T ADMIT HE'S

47:41 - NOT CONVICTED AND HE GETS A

47:43 - FREE SORT OF A FREE PASS EXCEPT

47:45 - SO FOR NOW WHEN YOU GO BACK TO

47:47 - RESET OF

47:48 - IF WE YOU KNOW WHAT OR DO

47:51 - THAT OFFENSE NUMBER A KURD.

47:54 - YOU KNOW IF YOU STILL NEED

47:56 - TO MAKE THE LICENSEE

47:57 - RESPONSIBLE THAT THAT'S

47:59 - SOMETHING ELSE THAT HAPPENED AT

48:01 - ONE POINT AND THEY MADE A

48:03 - DECISION AND BASED ON YOUR.

48:05 - HI PERCENTILE.

48:07 - THAT MAYBE WE'RE TAKING WE'RE

48:09 - TAKING AWAY. THE RECIPIENT THE

48:11 - CITIZEN BY NOT COUNTING TO THE

48:13 - FIRE FOR HOW ABOUT THIS THAT.

48:16 - THERE WAS A PRIOR AIR D.

48:20 - THE FORM

48:21 - FROM 8 YEARS AGO IS IN PENNDOT

48:24 - POSSESSION PENNDOT SENSE

48:26 - ME OR MY CLIENT A LETTER AND

48:28 - SAYS BECAUSE WE'RE IS A

48:30 - SECOND OFFENSE WE'RE GOING TO

48:32 - TAKE YOUR LICENSE OR YOU'RE

48:33 - GOING TO BE SUBJECTED TO THE

48:35 - PROVISIONS OF THE RESET OF THIS

48:37 - TYPE OF STATUTE IN THERE.

48:38 - AND MY CLIENT THAT AT THAT

48:40 - POINT SAYS WAIT A MINUTE GARY.

48:42 - YOU KNOW WHAT

48:44 - I WANT TO TELL YOU THAT I

48:46 - WAS INNOCENT THAT NIGHT AND I

48:48 - JUST TOOK THIS BECAUSE IT WAS

48:49 - SAFE FOR MY PROFESSION AND MY

48:51 - CAREER I WANT PENNDOT TO PROVE

48:54 - WE'RE AT LEAST OFFER SOME

48:55 - EVIDENCE AT A HEARING THAT.

48:58 - I WAS I COMMITTED A VIOLATION

49:01 - NOT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE BEYOND A

49:03 - REASONABLE DOUBT AND THEY DO

49:05 - THESE HEARINGS ALL THE TIME FOR

49:07 - REFUSAL CASES THEY DO THESE

49:09 - HEARINGS WHERE THE OFFICER

49:10 - ASKED TO COME IN AND I THINK HE

49:11 - UNDERSTOOD ENGLISH AND IN

49:12 - UNDERSTANDING THAT THEY HAVE TO

49:13 - HAVE HEARINGS THAT PENNDOT

49:15 - SOMETIMES TO DEFEND THEIR

49:17 - DECISION TO SUSPEND AND ALL I'M

49:19 - SAYING IS SUBSTANTIAL

49:21 - DUE PROCESS WOULD BE

49:23 - THE BEST WAY TO HANDLE

49:25 - THIS THIS.

49:26 - THIS PROBLEM IS NOT WITH THE

49:28 - LET'S I WANT TO I WANT TO TRY

49:30 - TO UNDERSTAND WHAT I UNDERSTAND

49:31 - THE PROBLEM IS BECAUSE IF YOU

49:33 - GO BACK TO BASICALLY WE'RE

49:34 - TALKING ABOUT IS A STATUTE.

49:35 - WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A STATUTE

49:36 - THAT DEFINES A PRIOR OFFENSE

49:38 - HAS ACTUALLY INCLUDING R D.

49:42 - NOW MAYBE NOT

49:45 - DEFENDANTS IN A DUI CASE HAVE

49:47 - THE PRIVILEGE OF YOUR

49:48 - REPRESENTATION AND YOUR

49:49 - EXPERTISE IN

49:50 - THE AREA.

49:51 - I'M A LEGEND IN MY OWN MIND

49:53 - TO I KNOW IT

49:56 - THE IF THE IF WE KNOW THAT THE

49:58 - PRIOR OFFENSES DEFINED TO

50:00 - INCLUDE A ARE D AND WE'RE

50:02 - TALKING ABOUT A CIVIL

50:02 - CONSEQUENCES, NOT THE CRIMINAL

50:04 - CONSEQUENCES.

50:06 - WHY ISN'T A SIMPLE ENOUGH TO

50:07 - SAY TO YOUR CLIENT WORK FROM

50:10 - THE CIVIL SIDE.

50:12 - IF YOU DO A R D. YOU SURE

50:15 - YOU'RE NOT GOING TO GET YOUR

50:16 - CRIMINAL RECORD. BUT

50:18 - UNDER THE STATUTE IT'S GOING TO

50:19 - BE CONSIDERED A PRIOR OFFENSE

50:20 - THAT ON DUI AGAIN WHAT'S THE

50:22 - PROBLEM WITH THAT I DIDN'T HAVE

50:24 - A PROBLEM WITH

50:25 - THAT ENTAILED.

50:26 - CHANGE CAN AND LETTERS 1000

50:28 - OF THAT LAWYER DOWN IN

50:29 - PHILADELPHIA WHO WROTE THAT

50:31 - ROAD DEBRIS FOR THEM. AND LIKE

50:33 - ME AND SAID YOU KNOW GARY

50:34 - WEIGHT THE RECEIPT OF A

50:35 - STATUTE. THERE'S A LITTLE BIT

50:37 - OF A. HERE AND THAT'S LIKE

50:39 - WORK PUNISHING THAT A ARE D

50:41 - PERCENT BECAUSE THEY ELECTED

50:44 - TO TAKE A ARE DEALING WITH OUT

50:46 - HAVING US OUT SORRY, BUT

50:49 - THEY'RE NOT BEING

50:50 - PUNISHED. IN THE CRIMINAL PER

50:54 - PERIOD OF INCARCERATION OR.

50:58 - IT'S A.

50:59 - PROTECTIVE MEASURES SAFETY

51:00 - MEASURE THE LEGISLATURE

51:02 - DETERMINED THAT YES YOU CAN

51:04 - HAVE A ARE D BUT IF YOU DO IT

51:07 - AGAIN.

51:09 - THAT COUNTS AS A PRIOR OFFENSE

51:10 - AND

51:10 - ALLOWS US.

51:11 - TO APPLY THAT TO SUSPEND YOUR

51:13 - LICENSE

51:14 - A PRIVILEGE.

51:15 - YES, I'M NOT A RIGHT, BUT

51:17 - IT'S ALSO UNDERGO KNOW LAST

51:19 - YEAR I THINK YOU'RE COURT HAS

51:20 - RULED THAT ITS PENAL IN NATURE

51:22 - IS A SUSPENSION IS BASICALLY A

51:23 - PENAL IN NATURE, IT'S US CIVIL

51:25 - STATUTE AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT

51:27 - THEY HAVE TO PROVE

51:29 - THAT YOU COMMITTED THAT DUI

51:31 - BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT

51:32 - THEY WOULD JUST HAVE TO USE THE

51:34 - CIVIL PENALTY LIKE THEY DO IN

51:35 - THE REFUSAL HEARING SAYING LOOK

51:37 - MISTER FERGUSON HERE IS THE

51:39 - OFFICER HE SO YOU'RE DRIVING

51:41 - THAT HIS OPINION YOU ARE DRUG

51:43 - YOUR BE AC WAS 0.17 TO GET OUT

51:45 - OF HERE WE GO BACK TO THE

51:46 - STATUTE HOW DO WE GET AROUND TO

51:47 - ANSWER, I'M SORRY TO ANSWER

51:49 - YOUR QUESTION YOUR HONOR, YES.

51:51 - I'M SORRY.

51:53 - BACK TO THE STATUE HOW DO WE

51:54 - GET AROUND THE LANGUAGE IN THE

51:55 - STATUTE THAT DOES CONSIDER AND

51:57 - THEY ARE DUE TO

51:58 - PRIOR OFFENSE.

51:59 - IT SAYS IT'S AN

52:01 - OFFENSE SHALL BE CONSIDERED AND

52:03 - THE THE WAY YOU GET AROUND THAT

52:05 - OR THE WAY YOU DEAL WITH THAT

52:06 - TO MAKE IT NOT UNCONSTITUTIONAL

52:08 - IS YOU DON'T DO ANYTHING TO IT

52:11 - EXCEPT WHEN SOMEBODY SAYS WAIT.

52:13 - I AM NOT GETTING SUBSTANTIAL TO

52:15 - DUE PROCESS BECAUSE I WANT TO

52:17 - HEARING HERE AT THE PENN DOT ON

52:20 - THIS SUSPENSION ISSUE BECAUSE

52:21 - MY DECISION TO AN AREA OR D AT

52:24 - THE TIME WAS BECAUSE I DIDN'T

52:26 - WANT TO LOSE MY LICENSE

52:28 - I DID I WASN'T GUILTY. BUT I I

52:31 - SAYING THE FACT THOSE ARE ALL

52:33 - GOOD RE, I THE DECREE WITH ANY

52:34 - OF THE REASONS TO ENTER THE

52:35 - AREA LOT OF PEOPLE GOING TO AIR

52:37 - THE FOR DIFFERENT REASONS AND

52:38 - ALL CAN SEE THAT THERE ARE

52:38 - PEOPLE THAT BELIEVE.

52:40 - I PROBABLY COULD FIGHT THIS

52:41 - THING BUT I DON'T WANT TO RISK

52:43 - IT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT I

52:44 - THINK WE ALL PROBABLY EXCEPT

52:45 - THAT YES THE ISSUE

52:47 - THOUGH IS IN THE CRIMINAL

52:49 - ENHANCED CRIMINAL SIDE MAKING

52:50 - IT ENHANCED CRIMINAL PENALTY TO

52:52 - HAS A PRIOR OFFENSE TO KICK A

52:54 - PENALTY. FROM AN E R D WHERE

52:56 - THERE WAS NO ADJUDICATION OF

52:58 - GUILT YOU'RE SURE IS DIFFERENT

53:00 - THAN SORT OF

53:01 - A CIVIL TO DO WITH REGARD TO

53:05 - DRIVING PRIVILEGES AND SAYING

53:07 - OKAY IF YOU TAKE A RD SURE

53:09 - YOU'RE GOING TO AVOID ALL THIS

53:10 - CRIMINAL STUFF BUT REALIZE THE

53:12 - CONSEQUENCES YOU TAKING A ARE D

53:13 - IS THEY ARE GOING PENN DOT IS

53:16 - GOING TO TREAT IT AS A PRIOR

53:17 - OFFENSE AND HOW IS THAT

53:18 - UNCONSTITUTIONAL. I DON'T THINK

53:20 - THAT THAT IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL I

53:22 - THINK WHAT'S UNCONSTITUTIONAL

53:24 - IS WHEN PENNDOT SEND YOU A

53:25 - LETTER SAYING.

53:27 - YOU'RE GOING TO GET A 12

53:28 - MONTH SUSPENSION WHEN THE TRIAL

53:30 - COURT JUDGE SAID THIS WAS THE

53:32 - FIRST OFFENSE FOR YOU AND THERE

53:33 - SHOULD BE NO SUSPENSION AT THAT

53:35 - POINT IN TIME

53:36 - I HAVE PROBLEM BECAUSE ALL I'M

53:38 - SAYING IS THEY'RE RELYING ON

53:40 - ONE FORM THAT WAS FILLED OUT

53:42 - WITHOUT MY CLIENT'S KNOWLEDGE

53:43 - OR AWARENESS OR EXECUTION THAT

53:45 - WAS REPORTED AND IT'S A PENNDOT

53:47 - 4 MEN ALL I'M SAYING IS ASK

53:49 - PENNDOT TO BRING FORWARD

53:51 - PROVE SOME PROVE TO A 2 TO A

53:55 - 51% CIVIL BIRD NOT BEYOND A

53:57 - REASONABLE DOUBT THAT MY CLIENT

53:59 - WAS WAS.

54:02 - DID THE VIOLENT AND THAT'S NOT

54:03 - SOMETHING TO PROCESS YOUR ORGAN

54:04 - PROCEDURAL DUE THAT'S UP FIRST

54:07 - IT'S BOTH BECAUSE THE SUBSTANCE

54:08 - WOULD BE THEY HAVE TO COME

54:09 - FORWARD WITH EVIDENCE AND THE

54:11 - PROCEDURE WOULD BE PENNDOT

54:13 - BEFORE THEY

54:14 - UNILATERALLY SAY YOUR LICENSE

54:16 - IS SUSPENDED EVEN THOUGH IT'S

54:18 - NOT REALLY A CONVICTION.

54:20 - IF YOU'RE INNOCENT YOU SHOULD

54:21 - BE ALLOWED TO PUT THAT.

54:23 - WHAT ARE THEY DOING THIS

54:25 - COUNSELOR AND I'M CONFUSED WITH

54:27 - YOUR TIMELINE OK WHEN DO YOU

54:28 - THINK THIS OBLIGATION SHOULD

54:30 - OCCUR WHEN PENNDOT GETS NOTICE

54:32 - OF THE NEW VIOLATION.

54:34 - EVEN IF YOU GET NO SUSPENSION

54:36 - FROM THE TRIAL COURT JUDGE LIKE

54:37 - MISTER FERGUSON DID THEY

54:39 - PENNDOT GETS THIS FORM

54:40 - SUBMITTED TO THEM.

54:41 - THE PENDANT BUT IT'S 9 YEARS

54:44 - LATER I WAS GOING TO SAY, BUT

54:45 - WHAT WHAT ABOUT THE FIRST

54:46 - OFFENSE.

54:47 - THE FIRST OFFENSE YOU GET A

54:48 - SUSPENSION FOR IF IT HERE WELL,

54:50 - I UNDERSTAND THAT WAS 8 YEARS

54:52 - AGO I GET IT BUT WHAT IS YOUR

54:54 - RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE SECOND

54:55 - OFFENSE IN YOUR SCENARIO IN THE

54:57 - FIRST OFFENSE, THE FIRST SENSE

54:59 - IS AS JUDGE KOBE COULD SAY WAS

55:00 - 7 AND A HALF

55:01 - YEARS AGO. YES, YOU'RE WHAT

55:03 - OBLIGATION DO YOU THINK PENNDOT

55:05 - HAS BEEN IN IN THE

55:07 - SECOND OFFENSE. YES,

55:09 - IF PENNDOT WANTS TO BECAUSE

55:12 - OF CHURCH CAN MENU PLEAD GUILTY

55:14 - NOWADAYS LIKE MISTER FERGUSON

55:16 - DID IN 2020 AND IT'S A FIRST

55:18 - OFFENSE AND THEN PENNDOT SEND

55:20 - YOU A LETTER OF NOTICE OF

55:21 - SUSPENSION.

55:22 - AND THEY SAY WE'RE GOING TO

55:24 - SPEND IT BECAUSE WE DON'T

55:26 - REALLY.

55:27 - WE'RE CIVIL WE DON'T DO

55:29 - CRIMINAL RIGHT AND WE'RE GOING

55:30 - TO TREAT THIS IS THE SECOND

55:31 - OFFENSE AT THAT POINT IN TIME I

55:33 - THINK YOU SHOULD BE ABLE TO

55:34 - FILE A NOTICE OF APPEAL.

55:36 - NONE

55:38 - SO YOU WHAT YOU WANT TO HAVE A

55:39 - TRIAL ON THE ALRIGHT WHAT I'M

55:41 - TRYING TO GET TO WRITE THOSE I

55:42 - ONLY WANT TO LICENSE SUSPENSION

55:44 - HEARING I WANT TO I WANT TO

55:46 - HEARING BEFORE BRING IN

55:47 - EVIDENCE OF CONVICTION OR A OR

55:49 - D NUMBER ONE,

55:50 - NO THEY BROUGHT IN EVIDENCE OF

55:52 - AN A OR A DAY THAT'S

55:53 - NOT DISPUTED. SO WHAT WAS THE

55:55 - BERT THE CARDINAL HAVE THE

55:57 - DEPARTMENT HAVE THE BURDEN TO

55:59 - ESTABLISH.

56:00 - THE YOUR CLIENT WAS DRIVING

56:01 - IMPAIRED THE FIRST GO AROUND

56:02 - IS THAT WE'RE SEEKING WHAT I'M

56:03 - SAYING IS I WOULD LIKE TO SEE

56:05 - BECAUSE OF DUE PROCESS

56:06 - CONSIDERATIONS EVEN IN THE

56:08 - CIVIL ARENA.

56:09 - THAT WHEN THEY GIVE YOU

56:10 - NOTICE THAT THEY'RE SUSPENDING

56:12 - YOUR LICENSE BECAUSE THEY'RE

56:13 - CONSIDERING A SECOND OFFENSE.

56:15 - AND A RECIDIVIST CONCEPT YOU

56:17 - COULD YOU HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY

56:18 - TO SAY NO.

56:21 - 9 OUT OF

56:22 - 10 OF THE PEOPLE RISE, I WAS SO

56:23 - DRAWN I KNOW THAT THEY CAN

56:26 - PROVE THAT.

56:26 - WHAT ABOUT THE PERSON THAT

56:28 - WAS INNOCENT THE ISSUE THE

56:29 - ISSUE I THINK THE JUDGES ARE

56:30 - RAISING WE'RE GOING WAY OVER

56:32 - THE TIME IS IS IS WHAT WOULD

56:34 - THAT HEARING. LOOK LIKE THAT

56:37 - WHERE IT WAS SO PENNDOT COMES

56:38 - IN YOU TAKE

56:39 - AN APPEAL. ARGUABLY A LICENSE

56:41 - SUSPENSIONS, HIS LIFE AND I WAS

56:43 - DOING MY SUSPENSION THEY WOULD

56:44 - GO FIRST THEY WOULD HAVE THE

56:45 - BURDEN. THEY SHOW YOUR MOST

56:48 - RECENT DUI AND THEN THEY SHOW

56:50 - RD DOES THAT SHIFT THE

56:52 - BURDEN THEN TO THE DEFENDANT TO

56:55 - PROVE THAT I ONLY PLAID A ARE D

56:58 - BECAUSE I WANTED TO AVOID

56:59 - SOMETHING I ACTUALLY WASN'T

57:01 - WRONG KIND OF HAS THAT WORK TO

57:02 - THINK THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE

57:03 - ASKING. BUT I THINK YOU'RE

57:04 - ASKING THEM TO GO IN AND DO

57:06 - LIKE THEY WOULD HAVE DONE IN

57:07 - THE

57:07 - FIRST PLACE.

57:09 - RD AND HOLD A HEARING ON THE

57:12 - CHARGE THE FIRST CHARGE WHAT

57:14 - YOU'RE ASKING I'M ASKING ME

57:15 - THAT THEY WOULD HAVE TO BRING

57:16 - FORWARD

57:17 - THE OFFICER OR SOME EVIDENCE

57:20 - THAT THAT PERSON WAS DRIVING

57:22 - AND WAS SICK. HE OFFICERS

57:24 - APPEASING MY YOUR CLIENT BY

57:25 - YOUR CLIENT TAKING A ARE D IT

57:27 - PREVENTED THE COMMONWEALTH FROM

57:29 - PROVING THAT AT THE FIRST TIME,

57:31 - NO

57:32 - PENNDOT KNOWS THIS IS A PROBLEM

57:34 - PENNDOT HAS FIX THIS PROBLEM

57:36 - BECAUSE WHAT THEY'VE DONE

57:37 - NOW IS THEY HAVE THROUGH THE

57:40 - DISTRICT COURT AND DISTRICT

57:41 - ATTORNEYS ASSOCIATION AND THE

57:43 - BUREAU TRAFFIC SAFETY OF

57:44 - PENN DOT. NOW WHEN YOU ENTER

57:46 - A OUR DEPOTS CHIPPED IN USE,

57:49 - I'M BASICALLY A CONFESSION OF

57:50 - JUDGMENT SAYING I KNOW

57:53 - THAT I AM GUILTY OF THIS DO YOU

57:55 - WHY AND YOU SIGN THAT JUDGMENT

57:57 - NOWADAYS AND THEY KEEP THAT

57:59 - DOCUMENT AND THIS AVOIDS IN THE

58:01 - FUTURE. HAVING TO HAVE

58:04 - THIS HEARING. AT

58:06 - THE SUSPENSION HEARING THE

58:08 - APPEAL LEVEL OF COMMON PLEAS

58:10 - ALL I'M ASKING FOR IS TO

58:11 - PROCESS HERE THAT

58:13 - IF I ENTERED A RD AND THEY'RE

58:14 - GOING TO USE THAT AS A RESET OF

58:16 - AGAINST ME GIVE ME A HEARING

58:17 - AND HAVE THE OFFICER COME IN

58:19 - AND

58:19 - AT LEAST AT THE ROOMING THEY

58:21 - KEPT ALL THE RECORDS FROM 7

58:23 - YEARS AGO THE CAPE AND THEY'RE

58:24 - GONE SO HOW ARE THEY CAN PROVE

58:26 - IT.

58:27 - WELL WITH THE NEW BECAUSE POST

58:31 - CHURCH CAN FORM THEY HAVE AN

58:32 - ADMISSION THAT THEY MAKE

58:34 - EVERYBODY SIGN NOWADAYS GOING

58:36 - FORWARD AND THERE HE GETS A

58:37 - PASS, I'M SORRY YOUR GUY GETS A

58:39 - PASTOR. NO MY GUY GETS

58:41 - CONVICTED IF THE OFFICER COMES

58:43 - FORWARD AND SAYS I STOPPED AND

58:45 - THEY DON'T HAVE THE EVIDENCE

58:46 - IT'S A DEFAULT THAT THEN IT'S

58:48 - BECAUSE OF DUE PROCESS I THINK

58:50 - WE SHOULD GET SOME

58:51 - SOME MINOR PROTECTION IN THOSE

58:53 - FEW CASES THAT ARE OCCURRING IN

58:55 - THIS WINDOW, I KNOW IT'S NOT

58:57 - HOW A DOUBLE AS

58:58 - A CONCEPT BUT I THINK THAT THE

58:59 - CONSTITUTION ALLOWS US TO OUR

59:01 - DAY IN COURT RATHER THAN JUST

59:03 - AN ARBITRARY SAYING

59:05 - YOU'RE YOU COMMITTED AN OFFENSE

59:07 - LOVE YOU YOU DIDN'T GET YOUR

59:10 - DAY IN COURT THAT'S WHY YOU'RE

59:11 - HERE HAD HE HAD HIS OPPORTUNITY

59:13 - FOR HIS DAY IN COURT IN THE

59:14 - CRIMINAL CASE AND HE TOOK A ARE

59:15 - D SO THE SO LET'S WE'RE WAY

59:17 - OVER YOUR TIME, I'M SORRY LET'S

59:19 - HEAR FROM LET'S HEAR FROM

59:20 - MISTER EDWARDS, THANK YOU FOR

59:21 - YOUR TIME THAT.

59:30 - I'M GOING TO SUE MISTER

59:31 - EDWARDS DISAGREES WITH

59:32 - VIRTUALLY EVERYTHING THAT YOU

59:33 - SAID.

59:36 - EXCEPT FOR CHECKS CAN HILL

59:37 - AGREE THAT YOUR SKIN IS OUT

59:38 - THERE. YES, YOU ARE GOING TO

59:40 - SAY I NOT SHORT BREAK FOR HIM.

59:43 - HOWEVER FIRST WITH REGARD TO

59:47 - ARE THE FORM.

59:50 - THAT ISSUE WAS NEVER BROUGHT

59:51 - UP IN THIS YEAR.

59:52 - IT'S WAIVED OUR OUR EVIDENCE

59:54 - OUR EXHIBIT CQC ONE THAT HAD

59:56 - THAT FORM AND IT CAME IN

59:58 - WITHOUT ANY OBJECTION

59:59 - 369 WHATSOEVER SO THERE'S NO

01:00 - 01.830 ARGUMENT ABOUT THIS FOR

01:00 - 03.899 ANOTHER THING TO KEEP IN MIND

01:00 - 05.479 AS RESULT OF A SUPERIOR COURT

01:00 - 06.900 CASE CALLED COMMONWEALTH THE

01:00 - 10.119 FROM 2001 WHICH IS NOT IN

01:00 - 11.309 THE RECORD. I I'M JUST

01:00 - 14.329 ANSWERING THIS. WHICH I

01:00 - 15.829 HAD TO ON OR OF

01:00 - 17.869 LOSING IN SUPERIOR COURT WHICH

01:00 - 19.109 WAS THE FIRST AND ONLY TIME

01:00 - 20.480 I'VE BEEN IN SUPERIOR COURT.

01:00 - 23.419 THE GENERAL SOME WAY AMENDED

01:00 - 25.549 SECTION 1534 OF THE VEHICLE

01:00 - 26.859 CODE WHICH NOW

01:00 - 29.359 REQUIRES FOR PENNDOT TO KEEP A

01:00 - 30.789 RECORD AND THEY ARE THE FOR 10

01:00 - 32.759 YEARS. SO THE FORM THAT

01:00 - 33.760 SUBMITTED.

01:00 - 36.459 ENDS UP IN THE RECORD AS IT DID

01:00 - 37.909 HERE TO SHOW THAT THERE WAS AS

01:00 - 39.959 PRAIRIE OR DO SO THIS WHOLE

01:00 - 41.059 ARGUMENT ABOUT THE

01:00 - 42.060 FORM OF.

01:00 - 43.859 I LOOK GOOD HAPPENS AFTER 10

01:00 - 44.720 YEARS BECAUSE YOU KNOW THERE

01:00 - 46.169 THERE'S THE FLIP SIDE THAT I'M

01:00 - 48.410 CONCERNED ABOUT WHICH IS YOU

01:00 - 51.449 MOST INDIVIDUALS ARE NOT

01:00 - 52.450 FAMILIAR WITH THE LAW.

01:00 - 55.329 AND ESPECIALLY EVEN HOW OR

01:00 - 57.199 DEFORM GETS PUT AWAY IN A

01:00 - 59.199 SECRET VOTE FOR FOR 10 YEARS

01:00 - 59.640 AND THEN.

01:00 - 01.239 WHAT HAPPENS TO THAT SECRET

01:01 - 03.799 FORM AFTER 10 YEARS. BUT WHEN

01:01 - 06.130 THEY DO EXCEPT RD

01:01 - 07.919 THEY REALLY DO IN THEIR MIND

01:01 - 09.779 BELIEVE THAT EVERYTHING IS

01:01 - 10.780 GOING AWAY.

01:01 - 12.489 I MEAN THAT THAT'S THE LOGICAL

01:01 - 13.879 CONSEQUENCE THAT I KNOW MY NEXT

01:01 - 14.680 QUESTION IS GOING TO BE YOU

01:01 - 15.939 KNOW IT'S IN THE STATUTE AND WE

01:01 - 17.379 GOT IT. YOU KNOW HERE

01:01 - 19.489 TO THAT BUT HOW DO YOU

01:01 - 21.439 RESPOND TO WHAT PEOPLE REALLY

01:01 - 23.549 THINK WHEN THEY ACCEPT RD

01:01 - 24.869 BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THE TRIAL

01:01 - 26.809 JUDGE IS TELLING THEM. OH BY

01:01 - 28.269 THE WAY THIS REALLY IS

01:01 - 30.639 AN OFFENSE. SO IT WOULD YOU

01:01 - 32.699 DRINK AND DRIVE AGAIN THAT

01:01 - 34.159 YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A BIGGER

01:01 - 34.860 PROBLEM.

01:01 - 35.889 WE'RE HERE ON EARTH THE

01:01 - 37.559 REPRESENTED BY COMPETENT

01:01 - 39.669 COUNSEL AT THE TIME THAT THE

01:01 - 41.089 COUNCIL IS DISCUSSING WITH THE

01:01 - 44.039 CLIENT. OPTIONS THE GUILTY PLEA

01:01 - 45.739 NOT GUILTY. THEY CAN TAKE IT

01:01 - 48.199 TO TRIAL. EXCEPT THEY ARE ASKED

01:01 - 49.499 FOR A OR DO THEY HAVE TO ASK

01:01 - 51.689 FOR AIR THE. ONE OF THE

01:01 - 54.309 CONSEQUENCES IS IF YOU ARE

01:01 - 56.179 ACCEPTED IN THE AIR TO BE IN

01:01 - 58.449 ACCORDANCE WITH THE CURRENT LAW

01:01 - 00.119 AND THE COMMONWEALTH. IF YOU

01:02 - 02.319 HAVE A SUBSEQUENT DUI

01:02 - 03.839 CONVICTION WITHIN 10 YEARS OF

01:02 - 06.569 THAT DATE ARE A VIOLATION FOR

01:02 - 07.610 WHICH ARE CONVICTED.

01:02 - 10.019 THERE IS GOING TO BE A ONE YEAR

01:02 - 11.479 SUSPENSION IT'S IMPOSED UNDER

01:02 - 13.379 THE VEHICLE CODE SO AFTER 10

01:02 - 15.620 YEARS IT IS IT MUCH THOUGHT

01:02 - 16.860 IT'S GONE.

01:02 - 18.729 IT THEN IT WOULD NOT COME

01:02 - 20.739 BACK TO BE USED AS A PRIOR

01:02 - 22.499 EVENTS KNOW YOU'RE ON THE WATER

01:02 - 24.309 IT TO ITS CONSISTENT

01:02 - 26.069 WITH IT. IT GETS A LITTLE

01:02 - 28.439 COMPLICATED BECAUSE THE BUREAU

01:02 - 30.339 OF DRIVER LICENSING ARM AND TO

01:02 - 32.689 EXPEND EXPUNGE IS THAT ON THE

01:02 - 34.839 10 YEAR ANNIVERSARY OF THE

01:02 - 36.960 ACCEPTANCE OR VERDI IT'S GONE.

01:02 - 39.329 OCCASIONALLY THERE WILL BE A

01:02 - 41.739 SUBSEQUENT CONVICTION FOR AN

01:02 - 43.219 OFFENSE THAT IS MORE THAN

01:02 - 45.229 10 YEARS LATER WHERE THE AIR

01:02 - 46.799 THE WOULD BE THE PRIOR OFFENSE

01:02 - 48.140 THAT LEADS TO A CONVICTION.

01:02 - 50.989 AND THEN SOMEHOW OR OTHER THEY

01:02 - 52.699 HAVE TO RESURRECT THE FACT THAT

01:02 - 53.500 THERE WAS A

01:02 - 56.709 ARE D THE EXISTED MORE THAN

01:02 - 59.339 10 YEARS AGO. THEY HAVE A WAY

01:02 - 00.340 OF DOING THAT BUT

01:03 - 02.419 MOST PEOPLE IF THEY'RE SMART

01:03 - 03.310 ENOUGH AND THEY LEARNED THEIR

01:03 - 04.709 LESSON FROM THE AIR TO BE IN

01:03 - 05.710 THE FIRST PLACE.

01:03 - 07.409 THEY DON'T DRIVE DRUNK AGAIN,

01:03 - 08.760 THEY DON'T GET CONVICTED

01:03 - 10.379 AND THEY DON'T END UP GETTING

01:03 - 11.569 US MORE THAN HAVE BEEN ON THE

01:03 - 12.909 GO APPLICATION OF THE LAW IF

01:03 - 13.260 YOU'RE.

01:03 - 15.569 BRINGING BACK THE A ARE D

01:03 - 16.929 MORE THAN 10 YEARS LATER FOR

01:03 - 18.889 SOME PEOPLE ARE YOU KNOW IT'S

01:03 - 20.749 JUST IT'S A MORE OF A RECORD

01:03 - 21.750 KEEPING

01:03 - 24.079 AND IT'S ALL I DON'T SEE IT A

01:03 - 24.440 COUPLE

01:03 - 27.399 OF TIMES FOR THE PERSON WHO HAS

01:03 - 29.130 KNOWN WAR WOULD BE WISE.

01:03 - 31.689 AFTER 10 YEARS IT IS 6 PONCE

01:03 - 32.310 IT'S GOING.

01:03 - 33.550 BECAUSE MY DAD MY

01:03 - 34.709 UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THEY ARE

01:03 - 35.710 DUE TO ITS NOT LIKE

01:03 - 37.569 WITH THE TRIAL COURT DOES GIVE

01:03 - 39.879 YOU AN OPTION THAT YOU NORMALLY

01:03 - 41.609 THE INDIVIDUAL IS MAKING THE

01:03 - 43.209 REQUEST THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING

01:03 - 44.349 THEY KIND OF WANT TO PLEAD OUT

01:03 - 46.059 THE CASE SO IT'S SOMETHING THAT

01:03 - 47.889 THE LICENSEE AN ISSUE THAT'S

01:03 - 49.379 WHY WELL IT'S IT'S SOMETHING

01:03 - 50.799 THE PROSECUTOR HAS TO AGREE TO

01:03 - 52.319 AS WELL IT'S A IT'S A JOINT

01:03 - 53.689 IT'S A JOINT SUBMISSION TO THE

01:03 - 55.509 COURT AS A DISPUTE THIS

01:03 - 56.809 POSITION RIGHT. YEAH, I

01:03 - 00.539 SAID IT. BUT IT'S NOT

01:04 - 02.169 IT'S NOT GUILTY TO TERMINATION

01:04 - 03.949 OR DISTANT YOUR HAND AND YOU

01:04 - 07.609 KNOW. I GUESS I GUESS IF IT'S

01:04 - 08.010 IF IT'S

01:04 - 09.919 IT'S JOINTLY AGREED TO BY THE

01:04 - 11.459 PROSECUTOR BY THE COMMONWEALTH

01:04 - 12.460 AND THE AND

01:04 - 18.369 CHARGED INDIVIDUAL. THEN BOTH

01:04 - 19.370 GIVE SOMETHING UP.

01:04 - 21.679 THE PROSECUTOR GIVES UP THE

01:04 - 22.540 OPPORTUNITY TO GET

01:04 - 23.540 THE CONVICTION.

01:04 - 27.819 AND OFFENDER THE CHARGED

01:04 - 31.199 INDIVIDUAL. GIVES UP THE RIGHT

01:04 - 34.089 TO FIGHT IT. SO WHAT YOU HAVE

01:04 - 36.950 IS SORT OF A STALEMATE.

01:04 - 39.990 NO EDUCATION

01:04 - 43.009 OF GUILT. NO EDUCATION OF NOT

01:04 - 45.689 GUILTY. YET. THE

01:04 - 47.809 STATUTE SAYS. IF IT HAPPENS

01:04 - 48.810 AGAIN.

01:04 - 50.680 GOING TO HAVE A LICENSE

01:04 - 51.680 SUSPENSION.

01:04 - 54.649 I THINK THAT'S WHERE MISTER LAI

01:04 - 56.499 SAID IS HAVING THE ISSUE WHICH

01:04 - 01.309 IS HOW CAN THAT BE. THERE'S A

01:05 - 02.310 STALEMATE.

01:05 - 04.220 WELL LITTLE HISTORY AND YOUR

01:05 - 07.070 PRIOR TO FEBRUARY FIRST

01:05 - 08.700 2004.

01:05 - 10.879 EVERY DUI CONVICTION RESULTED

01:05 - 12.279 IN A ONE YEAR SUSPENSION UNDER

01:05 - 14.820 SECTION 1532, THE GREAT

01:05 - 16.599 THAT WAS WHEN THE DUI WAS

01:05 - 19.349 SECTION 3731. ACT

01:05 - 22.909 242003. ENDED A WHOLE BUNCH OF

01:05 - 23.720 PROVISIONS IN THE

01:05 - 26.299 VEHICLE CODE AND IT REWROTE THE

01:05 - 27.890 D YOU ARE NORTH AND 2

01:05 - 30.780 ADDED CHAPTER 38 TO TO THE LAW.

01:05 - 33.289 PUT IN THIS PROVISION ABOUT THE

01:05 - 35.109 EXCEPTION TO SUSPENSION FOR A

01:05 - 36.619 CONVICTION WHERE THERE'S NO

01:05 - 39.309 PRIOR OFFENSE. AND 30 THEN

01:05 - 41.789 SECTION 38 OF SEX. IT INCLUDED

01:05 - 45.249 A ARE D AS. ONE OTHER

01:05 - 47.919 TYPES OF SANCTIONS THAT

01:05 - 49.739 WE ARE THE FACTS ARE FOR

01:05 - 51.829 A FACT THAT WOULD CONSTITUTE A

01:05 - 53.079 PRIOR OFFENSE, SO IT'S BEEN

01:05 - 55.619 AROUND SINCE FEBRUARY FOR FIRST

01:05 - 58.309 OF 2004. NOBODY'S EVER HAD A

01:05 - 58.770 PROBLEM

01:05 - 01.159 WITH THAT SUPERIOR COURT I

01:06 - 02.749 THINK CORRECTLY DECIDED CHURCH

01:06 - 05.069 TOO. IN LIGHT OF THE U.S.

01:06 - 06.359 SUPREME COURT DECISIONS THAT

01:06 - 07.750 ARE FROM THE LINE

01:06 - 11.140 YOU COULD USE A PRIORITY OR D

01:06 - 12.429 THAT WASN'T PROVEN BEYOND A

01:06 - 14.579 REASONABLE YOU REASONABLE

01:06 - 17.590 DEGREE OF WILL TOO A JURY

01:06 - 19.959 ENHANCING FACTOR

01:06 - 21.839 FOR SENTENCING. BUT THAT'S ON

01:06 - 24.099 THE CRIMINAL SIDE. AND THIS IS

01:06 - 25.190 A CIVIL SANCTION

01:06 - 27.449 AND IT IS ONE THAT THE PURPOSE

01:06 - 28.859 OF WHICH IS PUBLIC SAFETY

01:06 - 31.169 EXACTLY PURPOSES WHICH IS YOU

01:06 - 32.130 KNOW IT'S SO THE

01:06 - 34.529 IDEA BEING I THINK THE DRAFTERS

01:06 - 37.050 SAID IF SOMEONE TAKES A R D

01:06 - 38.559 WE'RE GOING TO ERR ON THE SIDE

01:06 - 40.340 OF PUBLIC SAFETY.

01:06 - 41.649 AND IF THEY HAVE

01:06 - 44.679 ANOTHER OFFENSE. THEN WE'RE

01:06 - 45.380 GOING TO ERR ON THE SIDE OF

01:06 - 46.729 PUBLIC SAFETY IN TREAT THAT AS

01:06 - 47.859 A SECOND OFFENSE, YES, YOU'RE

01:06 - 49.610 ON THAT THAT THAT'S CORRECT.

01:06 - 50.680 AND IT

01:06 - 52.809 MAKES SENSE. SOMEONE WHO WAS

01:06 - 55.559 ARRESTED FOR DUI AND WHAT'S NOT

01:06 - 56.560 TO FIGHT IT.

01:06 - 59.600 THERE'S SOMETHING

01:06 - 01.569 WRONG I I'M NOT A CRIMINAL

01:07 - 03.089 TRIAL OR MISTER LIGHTFOOT KNOWS

01:07 - 04.109 MUCH MORE ABOUT THAT THAN

01:07 - 06.349 I KNEW, BUT I THINK YOU CAN SEE

01:07 - 07.350 THERE WAS

01:07 - 10.189 I THINK YOU CAN SEE NOT FORGET

01:07 - 11.459 FORGET WHERE WHAT CAME AFTER

01:07 - 13.089 THE DECIMAL POINT OF 99 POINT

01:07 - 14.829 SOMETHING BUT IT WAS 9 FOR A

01:07 - 16.490 HAS PRETTY SUBSTANTIAL.

01:07 - 19.209 AS FAR AS SUBSTANTIVE DUE

01:07 - 21.329 PROCESS I JUST HAVE A HARD TIME

01:07 - 22.479 FOLLOWING THAT ARGUMENT

01:07 - 23.140 ALTOGETHER.

01:07 - 24.649 AS WE POINTED OUT AND WE

01:07 - 26.659 DRESS UP THE PROCESS ARE BRIEF

01:07 - 27.290 AND JUST LEAVE IT

01:07 - 27.890 AT THAT.

01:07 - 29.479 COUNCIL CAN I ASK YOU GOING

01:07 - 30.669 BACK TO JUDGE CROPS AND THE

01:07 - 31.220 QUESTION ON

01:07 - 34.069 THE STALEMATE OPPOSING COUNSEL

01:07 - 36.279 SAID SOMETHING ABOUT THE FORM

01:07 - 36.440 THAT

01:07 - 39.629 IS USED. IN COOPERATION WITH UN

01:07 - 41.239 WANT TO GET TOO FAR FIELD BUT

01:07 - 43.059 IN COOPERATION NOW WITH A

01:07 - 45.679 R D IS THAT YOUR UNDERSTANDING

01:07 - 47.209 AND WHAT WHAT IS THIS FORM

01:07 - 48.529 BECAUSE I'M WORRIED THAT THIS

01:07 - 49.270 FORM IS

01:07 - 51.949 TAKING AWAY. WE STILL ME AND

01:07 - 53.739 YOU'RE TRYING TO BETTER YOUR

01:07 - 55.309 POSITION OF THE CONVICTION

01:07 - 57.049 WHICH ACTUALLY DID OCCUR

01:07 - 57.490 BECAUSE OF

01:07 - 58.770 RD.

01:07 - 00.229 YOUR HONOR I HAVE NO IDEA

01:08 - 01.859 WHAT THAT IS HAS NOT FOUND

01:08 - 04.269 THAT FORM. I HEARD THAT IN SOME

01:08 - 06.399 POUNDS AND THE A'S TO AVOID THE

01:08 - 07.859 PROBLEM WITH CHURCH GUNNED DOWN

01:08 - 09.179 THE LINE. WE ARE

01:08 - 10.180 NOW HAVING.

01:08 - 12.119 PEOPLE WHO ARE REQUEST THEY ARE

01:08 - 13.669 THE 2 SIGNED SOME KIND OF FORM

01:08 - 15.169 I'VE NEVER SEEN ONE BECAUSE IT

01:08 - 16.479 SHOULD BE A FORM THAT SAYS

01:08 - 18.159 YOU'RE CONVICTED. I DON'T MEAN

01:08 - 19.209 YOU'RE RIGHT. I'VE NEVER SEEN

01:08 - 21.859 WHAT'S OK THANK YOU. YEAH,

01:08 - 22.860 AGAIN.

01:08 - 29.089 AND AS FAR AS WHETHER

01:08 - 31.079 OR NOT. A SUSPENSION

01:08 - 33.729 IS PUNITIVE. WE JUST LIKE TO

01:08 - 35.249 COME OFF THE BUTLER RESERVE

01:08 - 36.699 BRIEF WHERE THAT'S A

01:08 - 38.200 PENNSYLVANIA SUPREME COURT

01:08 - 39.140 APPLIED THE

01:08 - 41.859 YOUNG MENDOZA KENNEDY DENIES

01:08 - 43.159 THOSE THE 7 FACTORS TO

01:08 - 45.699 DETERMINE THAT WHAT IS IT IS

01:08 - 48.019 NOT WE'VE SEEN AT THE SAME

01:08 - 49.989 THING IS TRUE WITH REGARD SPENT

01:08 - 52.300 THE SUSPENSION. IN ORDER

01:08 - 56.649 SECTION TO

01:08 - 58.989 BE HELD UNCONSTITUTIONAL WITH

01:08 - 01.040 REGARD TO A CIVIL SUSPENSION.

01:09 - 02.569 IT WOULD HAVE TO CLEARLY

01:09 - 03.120 PLAINLY

01:09 - 05.039 AND PALPABLY VIOLATE THE

01:09 - 05.910 CONSTITUTION OF THE

01:09 - 07.189 COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA,

01:09 - 08.659 AND WE RESPECTFULLY SUBMIT THAT

01:09 - 10.919 DOES NOT AND LET'S OR ANY

01:09 - 11.920 OTHER QUESTIONS.

01:09 - 13.399 THANK YOU YOUR HONOR, THANK

01:09 - 14.380 YOU. MISTER EDWARDS, MR.

01:09 - 15.290 LAY SAID, I'LL GIVE YOU A

01:09 - 17.239 FEW MINUTES. WELL, YOUR HONOR

01:09 - 18.709 I'VE TAKEN A FOR YOUR TIME AND

01:09 - 21.019 I APPRECIATE YOUR YOU CAN'T

01:09 - 22.020 QUESTION THIS ONE.

01:09 - 26.400 I HEARD MISTER EDWARDS SAY THAT

01:09 - 28.450 THERE'S EXPUNGEMENT OF THESE

01:09 - 31.219 RECORDS THEY ARE D AFTER 10

01:09 - 33.130 YEARS. SO

01:09 - 34.499 I JUST WANT TO GET A TIMELINE

01:09 - 36.359 DOWN. CHICKEN WITH

01:09 - 37.700 DECIDED IN

01:09 - 40.679 20 TO 2020 ISH OR SO WHAT WE'RE

01:09 - 42.519 TALKING ABOUT HERE FOR THE

01:09 - 45.940 CASES THAT YOUR ISSUE APPLIES

01:09 - 48.259 THE UNIVERSE. THIS CASE IS FROM

01:09 - 51.600 MAY OF 2010 TO MAY OF 2020.

01:09 - 57.439 THIS FORM THAT IT'S NOT IN THE

01:09 - 58.989 RECORD AND I DON'T WANT TO

01:09 - 59.610 SPEAK OUT OF

01:09 - 01.059 THE RECORD. BUT WHAT THE

01:10 - 02.459 DISTRICT ATTORNEYS ARE DOING

01:10 - 03.939 NOWADAYS IS THE GENERAL IS

01:10 - 04.890 MAKING SOME KIND

01:10 - 05.890 OF ADMISSION.

01:10 - 08.179 WHEN YOU GO INTO TALKING

01:10 - 10.039 ABOUT WITH MISTER EDWARDS SAID

01:10 - 12.630 THAT PENNDOT LOOKS AT R D'S.

01:10 - 14.000 AND SAYS AFTER

01:10 - 15.979 10 YEARS, WE'RE WIPING ABOUT

01:10 - 17.049 THAT SO IT'S NOT EVEN AN

01:10 - 18.649 OFFENSE SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING

01:10 - 19.959 AT THAT IS JUST A 10 YEAR

01:10 - 22.889 PERIOD FROM MAY OF 2010 TO MAY

01:10 - 25.279 OF 2020. YEAH DECISION MAY

01:10 - 26.779 APPLY TO. YES, BUT

01:10 - 28.109 JUDGE WERE TO WHAT'S HAPPENING

01:10 - 29.719 IS WHAT HE'S SAYING AND I

01:10 - 31.049 BELIEVE WITH WHAT TERRY MEANT

01:10 - 32.480 TO SAY RAISE SAYING.

01:10 - 34.079 IS THAT THERE'S A COMPUTER

01:10 - 35.569 AND PENNDOT AND IT HAS YOUR

01:10 - 37.189 DRIVING RECORD ON IT AND

01:10 - 38.579 MAGICALLY BELIEVE IT OR NOT

01:10 - 41.189 HE'S CORRECT. AT 10 YEARS LATER

01:10 - 42.220 YOU'LL CHECK YOUR DRIVING

01:10 - 45.169 RECORD ONE DAY IT WILL HAVE RD

01:10 - 46.479 PEOPLE ARE ON YOUR DRIVING

01:10 - 47.999 RECORD THEN THE NEXT DAY YOU

01:10 - 49.279 LOOK AT THAT 10 YEAR RECORD

01:10 - 50.849 THAT LIFETIME RECORD IT WON'T

01:10 - 52.199 BE THERE IT GETS TO THE

01:10 - 53.989 COMPUTER TAKES IT OFF. AND I

01:10 - 55.009 DON'T KNOW IF THEY'RE FOLLOWING

01:10 - 55.570 UP AND

01:10 - 58.049 DESTROYING PHYSICALLY THE OTHER

01:10 - 59.869 FORMS IN THE VAULT OR WHEREVER

01:10 - 01.649 THEY ARE PENNDOT DOWN AND SELL

01:11 - 03.459 HERZBERG MY ANSWERING MAKE YOUR

01:11 - 05.429 QUESTION I THINK I THINK YOU'RE

01:11 - 07.369 AGREEING THAT THIS IS ONLY

01:11 - 08.819 GOING TO AFFECT PEOPLE WHO HAVE

01:11 - 10.029 AN A R D AND A

01:11 - 11.949 2ND HALF HER FOR ANOTHER

01:11 - 13.679 OFFENSE WITHIN A 10 YEAR PERIOD

01:11 - 15.009 BECAUSE OTHERWISE RD WOULDN'T

01:11 - 15.530 BE THERE.

01:11 - 17.809 YES, BOY YOU HAD SAID THAT

01:11 - 19.650 THEY'VE CHANGED THE RULES.

01:11 - 22.439 POST CHICKEN. YES ON THE

01:11 - 24.879 CRIMINAL SIDE THAT THAT RD THE

01:11 - 25.960 RECIPIENTS

01:11 - 28.289 WE ARE WHAT FILING WHAT WOULD

01:11 - 30.009 YOU CALL IT A CONFESSION JUDGE

01:11 - 31.949 ALMOST THAT ADMISSION THAT THAT

01:11 - 32.570 THEY COMMITTED

01:11 - 34.649 THE OFFENSE. SO GOING FORWARD

01:11 - 35.969 AND TALK TO BE AN ISSUE SO NOW

01:11 - 37.399 IT'S JUST A LOOK AT WHAT THEY

01:11 - 38.789 REALLY DID THAT CHURCH PROPS

01:11 - 39.120 AND

01:11 - 39.790 YOUR HONOR.

01:11 - 41.919 FOR FOR FOR THE CRIMINAL

01:11 - 43.179 CASE. WELL THEY'RE DOING IT

01:11 - 44.020 THEY'RE NOT DOING IT'S NOT A

01:11 - 45.689 STATUTE OR REGULATION AS I

01:11 - 47.199 UNDERSTAND IT LEADS TO THE A'S

01:11 - 48.709 ARE DOING IT AS PART OF THEIR

01:11 - 51.519 CONCESSION TO ALLOW A PERSON TO

01:11 - 53.249 GO INTO A ARE D THAT'S CORRECT

01:11 - 55.309 OR RIGHT SO SOME PROSECUTORS

01:11 - 56.929 ARE SAYING UNLESS YOU SIGN THIS

01:11 - 58.299 CONFESSION WERE NOT AGREEING TO

01:11 - 00.039 ALLOW YOU TO GO INTO R D AND

01:12 - 01.509 THEY'LL HAVE THAT DOCUMENT THEN

01:12 - 02.310 WHICH WILL

01:12 - 04.169 DO AWAY WITH THE SUBSTANDARD

01:12 - 05.419 CUT CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUE

01:12 - 06.849 BECAUSE THEY SAY GARY OR

01:12 - 08.740 WHOEVER YOU ADMITTED TO IT

01:12 - 10.009 AND WE DON'T HAVE TO DEAL WITH

01:12 - 12.109 THIS NOW IT'S NOT EVEN AN ISSUE

01:12 - 13.249 BECAUSE IT BECAUSE OF THAT

01:12 - 14.679 QUOTE FOR HIM, BUT THAT'S NOT

01:12 - 16.209 IN THE RECORD AND I APOLOGIZE

01:12 - 17.979 FOR BRINGING MATTERS BEFORE YOU

01:12 - 19.579 I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT THIS

01:12 - 20.889 IS NOT GOING TO BE A FOREVER

01:12 - 23.119 PROBLEM THANK YOU AGAIN HAPPY

01:12 - 24.219 SOME SOMETIMES WE'RE HAPPY TO

01:12 - 25.220 CHASE THE BODY.

01:12 - 26.839 I'M SORRY ARE SOMETIMES WE'RE

01:12 - 27.860 HAPPY TO CHASE THE MONEY.

01:12 - 31.469 MISTER EDWARDS AND MISTER

01:12 - 32.470 LANYARD.

01:12 - 36.609 UNIVERSITY OF PITTSBURGH BIG

01:12 - 37.610 GAME THIS WEEKEND.

01:12 - 40.339 IT'S NOT OFTEN THAN NOT OFTEN

01:12 - 41.640 WHERE RANK SO I'M VERY HAPPY.

01:12 - 44.609 DAUGHTER WENT THERE. AND SO

01:12 - 46.039 DID YOUR MONEY WHAT YOU CAN

01:12 - 48.349 SAY I I HAVE ONE DAUGHTER GO TO

01:12 - 49.950 MANY OTHER GO TO THAT

01:12 - 52.020 AND THOSE WITH TO BE ANOTHER

01:12 - 55.730 DO YOUR PAIN THAT HAS TO WAIT.

01:13 - 02.200 THANK YOU GENTLEMEN.

01:13 - 06.450 THIS CASE IS NUMBER

01:13 - 08.779 29 UPMC BENEFIT MANAGEMENT

01:13 - 11.009 SERVICES VERSUS UNITED PHARMACY

01:13 - 12.010 SERVICES.

01:13 - 15.699 WORKERS COMPENSATION

01:13 - 16.610 MATTERS AND ENSURE

01:13 - 18.169 MUST PAY PROVIDERS EXPENSIVE

01:13 - 19.279 FOR TREATMENTS RENDER TO AN

01:13 - 21.029 INJURED WORKER WITHIN 30 DAYS

01:13 - 22.349 OF THE RECEIPT OF THE PROVIDERS

01:13 - 24.029 BILLS AND RECORDS. IF

01:13 - 25.659 AN INSURER AN EMPLOYER DISPUTES

01:13 - 26.759 THAT THE TREATMENT IS RELATED

01:13 - 27.850 TO THE WORK INJURY.

01:13 - 29.899 WE MAY FILE A PETITION FOR

01:13 - 31.089 UTILIZATION REVIEW WITH THE

01:13 - 32.579 BUREAU WORKERS COMPENSATION

01:13 - 33.779 WHICH WILL BE HEARD BY WORKERS

01:13 - 34.970 COMPENSATION JUDGE.

01:13 - 36.919 ADDITIONALLY A PROVIDER MAY

01:13 - 37.870 DISPUTE THE AMOUNT OR

01:13 - 39.239 TIMELINESS OF A PAYMENT BY AN

01:13 - 40.719 INSURER EMPLOYER BY FILING WHAT

01:13 - 41.690 IS CALLED A FEE REVIEW

01:13 - 43.449 APPLICATION WITH THE BUREAU OF

01:13 - 45.039 WORKERS COMPENSATION FEVER VIEW

01:13 - 47.149 SECTION WHICH MAY BE EVENTUALLY

01:13 - 48.699 DECIDED BY THE REVIEW HEARING

01:13 - 50.609 OFFICER. IN THIS CASE, THE

01:13 - 52.079 EMPLOYER EXCEPT IN AN INJURY AS

01:13 - 53.489 WORK-RELATED BY ISSUING A

01:13 - 54.719 MEDICAL ONLY NOTICE OF

01:13 - 56.659 COMPENSATION PAYABLE THE

01:13 - 57.719 INJURED WORKERS TREATMENT

01:13 - 59.349 PROVIDER PRESCRIBE A COMPOUND

01:13 - 00.869 CREAM ON 3 OCCASIONS AND THE

01:14 - 01.680 PROVIDER BILLED THE

01:14 - 03.269 INSURANCE COMPANY. THE

01:14 - 04.389 INSURANCE COMPANY DENIED

01:14 - 05.899 PAYMENT FOR THE COMPOUND CREAMS

01:14 - 07.159 ON THE BASIS THAT THE CREAMS

01:14 - 08.130 WERE NOT PRESCRIBED FOR

01:14 - 09.770 TREATMENT OF THE WORK INJURY.

01:14 - 12.119 THE PROVIDER FILED 3 THE

01:14 - 13.689 REVIEW APPLICATIONS. THE

01:14 - 14.989 MEDICAL FIELD REVIEW SECTION

01:14 - 16.269 DENY THE APPLICATIONS AS

01:14 - 17.679 PREMATURE BECAUSE THERE WAS AN

01:14 - 19.099 OUTSTANDING ISSUE AS TO THE

01:14 - 21.209 CAUSAL RELATED THIS OF THE WORK

01:14 - 22.389 INJURY TO THE TREATMENTS

01:14 - 23.390 PROVIDED.

01:14 - 25.339 PROVIDER APPEAL TO A FEE REVIEW

01:14 - 26.869 HEARING OFFICER WHO CONSIDERED

01:14 - 27.790 WHETHER THE FEE REVIEW

01:14 - 28.490 APPLICATIONS

01:14 - 30.479 WERE PREMATURE. WE'RE HEARING

01:14 - 31.829 OFFICER CONCLUDED THAT THE THI

01:14 - 32.899 REVIEW APPLICATIONS WERE

01:14 - 34.969 NOT PREMATURE AND DIRECTED THE

01:14 - 36.189 INSURANCE COMPANY TO PAY THE

01:14 - 37.439 PROVIDERS BILLS FOR THE

01:14 - 39.779 COMPOUND CREAMS. THE INSURANCE

01:14 - 40.919 COMPANY SEEKS REVIEW OF THE

01:14 - 42.469 HEARING OFFICER DETERMINATION

01:14 - 43.909 AND ARGUES THAT THIS COURT HAS

01:14 - 44.979 ISSUED DECISIONS THAT ARE

01:14 - 46.649 INCONSISTENT WITH PRECEDENT OF

01:14 - 47.240 THE SUPREME COURT

01:14 - 48.969 OF PENNSYLVANIA, WHERE THIS

01:14 - 50.459 COURT HAS HELD THAT IN ORDER TO

01:14 - 51.999 CHALLENGE THE CAUSAL RENEE DID

01:14 - 53.459 IT RELATE IN THIS PARTICULAR

01:14 - 55.439 TREATMENT. THE EMPLOYER OR THE

01:14 - 57.229 INSURER MUST INITIATE THE

01:14 - 58.699 UTILIZATION REVIEW PETITION

01:14 - 00.949 PROCESS WHEN SURE ARGUES THAT

01:15 - 02.099 THE SUPREME COURT EXPRESSLY

01:15 - 03.539 STATED THAT WE'RE LIABILITY FOR

01:15 - 04.779 PARTICULAR TREATMENT IS AN

01:15 - 06.939 ISSUE. THE INJURED WORKER AND

01:15 - 08.389 NOT THE MEDICAL PROVIDER MUST

01:15 - 09.529 PURSUE PAYMENT DURING

01:15 - 10.889 PROCEEDINGS BEFORE WORKERS

01:15 - 13.129 COMPENSATION JUDGE WITH THAT

01:15 - 14.249 WE'LL HEAR THE ARGUMENT FROM

01:15 - 15.709 THE ACCOUNT. THANK YOU.

01:15 - 16.819 PRESIDENT JUDGE DROPS AND

01:15 - 18.589 JUDGES MINUS CHRISTOPHER SCOTT,

01:15 - 21.049 I REPRESENT THE PETITIONER UPMC

01:15 - 23.020 BENEFIT MANAGEMENT BUT UPMC.

01:15 - 24.580 FOR PARTNERS.

01:15 - 27.499 ESSENTIALLY THAT'S A THAT'S A

01:15 - 29.159 PERFECT RECITATION OF THE FACTS

01:15 - 30.160 I TRY.

01:15 - 33.019 THANK WHAT WHAT THE PETITIONER

01:15 - 35.179 IS ARGUING HERE. I APOLOGIZE I

01:15 - 36.260 LIKE TO RESERVE 2 MINUTES.

01:15 - 37.470 YOU HAVE.

01:15 - 39.179 THE PETITIONERS ARGUING

01:15 - 40.770 ESSENTIALLY WE LIKE TO KEEP

01:15 - 43.109 THE SEA REVIEW AS PURELY

01:15 - 44.359 A FEE REVIEW AND KEEP

01:15 - 46.179 UTILIZATION PURELY AS AN

01:15 - 47.189 ARGUMENT REGARDING

01:15 - 49.249 REASONABLENESS AND NECESSITY

01:15 - 50.359 NOT CONFLATED WITH

01:15 - 52.819 CAUSAL RELATIONSHIP AT THE

01:15 - 54.019 SCHOOL THE PETITIONER WOULD

01:15 - 56.209 LIKE TO SEE THIS COURT REVISIT

01:15 - 57.839 THE DECISION THAT WAS REACHED

01:15 - 00.539 IN THE WORKERS FIRST CASE WHICH

01:16 - 02.699 IS PRIMARILY THAT JEN BUT THE

01:16 - 04.259 GENESIS OF WHERE THIS CASE CAME

01:16 - 06.510 FROM IN WORKERS FIRST

01:16 - 08.999 THIS COURT. I BELIEVE IF PANEL

01:16 - 10.909 OF THIS COURT DID THE RIGHT

01:16 - 12.909 THING, HOWEVER, THE INTO

01:16 - 14.839 UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES THAT

01:16 - 16.189 GENERATED OUT OF THAT NEED TO

01:16 - 18.229 BE ADDRESSED WHEN I SAY DID THE

01:16 - 20.859 RIGHT THE THE JET THAT THE

01:16 - 22.549 GENESIS OF THAT WORKERS FIRST

01:16 - 23.569 CASE CAME OUT OF

01:16 - 26.639 A SCHEME TO ESSENTIALLY BUILD

01:16 - 29.040 THE PROVIDER OUT OF TREATMENT,

01:16 - 31.019 THE WORKERS COMPENSATION

01:16 - 32.919 CLAIMANT AN EMPLOYER ENTERED

01:16 - 34.710 INTO A COMPROMISE IN RELEASE.

01:16 - 35.990 BUT ENDED UP.

01:16 - 38.599 SHIFTING ALL OF THE MONEY AWAY

01:16 - 40.129 FROM THE PROVIDER THIS COURT

01:16 - 41.719 DID THE RIGHT THING BY MAKING

01:16 - 43.539 SURE THE PROVIDER HAD SOME

01:16 - 44.540 MEASURE OF.

01:16 - 46.939 ABILITY TO RETURN TO GET THE

01:16 - 48.419 MONEY, HOWEVER, THE UNINTENDED

01:16 - 50.009 CONSEQUENCES THAT CAME OUT OF

01:16 - 51.430 THE OPINION OF THAT CASE

01:16 - 53.729 ESSENTIALLY MEANS THAT EVERY

01:16 - 56.939 TIME THE EMPLOYER. 40 UNDER A

01:16 - 58.620 FEW REVIEW, THE INSURER

01:16 - 00.579 WOULD LIKE TO CHALLENGE THE

01:17 - 03.389 CAUSAL RELATED THIS OF AN

01:17 - 06.019 INJURY IN THE AREA OF THE

01:17 - 07.749 INJURY THAT IT NEEDS TO RESORT

01:17 - 09.579 TO A UTILIZATION REVIEW WHICH

01:17 - 11.379 HAS NEVER BEEN IT IS A REVIEW

01:17 - 12.999 THE INJURY OR DO THEY REVIEW

01:17 - 16.149 THE REASONABLENESS OF THE CREAM

01:17 - 17.600 OF THE MEDICATION OR.

01:17 - 20.679 WELL IF WHAT IF ONE WERE TO

01:17 - 21.380 DISCUSS THIS IN

01:17 - 22.140 TERMS OF.

01:17 - 23.839 THE ACTUAL STATUS OF THE

01:17 - 25.279 INJURY YOU CAN TALK ABOUT THE

01:17 - 26.579 REASONABLENESS AND CITY,

01:17 - 27.589 HOWEVER IT'S ALWAYS BEEN

01:17 - 30.229 AN OPTION AS AS INDICATED BY

01:17 - 31.739 THE SUPREME COURT INTO

01:17 - 34.539 CROZIER'S CHESTER IS WITHIN THE

01:17 - 35.540 LAST YEAR

01:17 - 37.279 RE CITED BY THIS COURT

01:17 - 39.789 THE CARRIER OR THE EMPLOYER

01:17 - 41.239 ALWAYS HAS THE ABILITY TO

01:17 - 43.089 CHALLENGE A TREATMENT UNDER

01:17 - 47.229 CALLS A THE TO TAKE IT IT IS

01:17 - 48.939 AXIOMATIC OBVIOUSLY WE'VE GOT

01:17 - 49.880 THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY DOESN'T

01:17 - 51.019 WANT TO HAVE UP SEARCH RESULTS

01:17 - 52.329 BUT TO TAKE THIS TO AN ABSURD

01:17 - 53.949 RESULT IF WE HAVE AN INJURED

01:17 - 56.249 WORKER THAT HAS AN ANKLE INJURY

01:17 - 57.359 AND YOU'RE ONLY AS LEE AN

01:17 - 59.669 ASTHMA MEDICATION COMES TO THE

01:17 - 01.419 CARRIER AND THE CHALLENGE IT ON

01:18 - 02.679 THE BASIS OF CALLS THE

01:18 - 03.749 RELATIONSHIP THIS IS NOT

01:18 - 05.099 CLOSELY RELATED TO THE ANKLE

01:18 - 06.269 INJURY. THE

01:18 - 08.689 WORKERS FIRST CONSTRUCT WOULD

01:18 - 10.799 REQUIRE THEM TO GO THROUGH AND

01:18 - 11.630 REASONABLENESS AND

01:18 - 13.359 NECESSITY ARGUMENT FIRST IS

01:18 - 15.199 JUST SIMPLY DENYING IT ON THE

01:18 - 18.329 BASIS OF OF NOT NOT CLOSELY

01:18 - 19.330 RELATED.

01:18 - 22.589 WHY WHAT IS THE WHAT IS THE

01:18 - 25.389 DISTINCTION BETWEEN BECAUSE ALI

01:18 - 28.190 RELATED IN REASONABLE.

01:18 - 29.950 THIS ESSAY, REASONABLE FOR

01:18 - 32.649 CITY, REASONABLE NECESSITY AND

01:18 - 33.799 SAYS HE IS DISCUSSING

01:18 - 36.099 A AND ACCEPTED WORK INJURY AND

01:18 - 37.479 WHETHER THE TREATMENT THAT'S AT

01:18 - 39.359 ISSUE IS IN FACT A REASONABLE

01:18 - 41.139 AND ASSESSED AND NECESSARY FOR

01:18 - 42.809 THAT PARTICULAR INJURY FACT THE

01:18 - 44.999 CALL SO RELATIONSHIP WAS IS IN

01:18 - 45.850 FACT THAT

01:18 - 47.499 TREATMENT THAT'S BEING RENDERED

01:18 - 48.629 RELATED TO THAT

01:18 - 50.779 INJURY WAS IF IT IF A TREATMENT

01:18 - 52.159 IS NOT RELATED TO THE INJURY

01:18 - 53.549 EARLY IN ALL IT WOULD NEVER

01:18 - 54.679 SATISFIED A REASONABLE

01:18 - 57.829 NECESSITY TEST. IF CORRECT IT

01:18 - 59.079 WOULD NOT SO WHY ARE WE WHY ARE

01:18 - 00.469 WE TREATING THEM TO DIFFERENT

01:19 - 02.620 WAYS WHY ISN'T IT. A DOCK.

01:19 - 04.469 IT'S SIMPLY A QUESTION OF

01:19 - 06.479 WHETHER THE TREATMENT SHOULD BE

01:19 - 07.820 PAID FOR FOR THE INJURY

01:19 - 09.859 PERIOD, CORRECT AND WE HAVE SO

01:19 - 10.750 WHY SHOULD THERE BE DIFFERENT

01:19 - 12.119 SCHEMES TO CHALLENGE THOSE

01:19 - 13.519 THINGS WHY SHOULD THERE BE 2

01:19 - 15.569 DIFFERENT SCHEMES BECAUSE THE

01:19 - 16.629 LEGISLATURE CREATED THE

01:19 - 18.289 UTILIZATION REVIEW SCHEMES AND

01:19 - 19.510 YOU PROCESS.

01:19 - 21.189 NO I KNOW THAT THAT'S WHAT I'M

01:19 - 22.999 SAYING IS WHY I GUESS I GUESS

01:19 - 25.220 I'M MAYBE I'M.

01:19 - 27.529 I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND WHY

01:19 - 29.129 THAT PROCESS IS NOT THE PROCESS

01:19 - 30.669 THAT SHOULD HAPPEN WHY WHY

01:19 - 32.419 SHOULD THAT BE IF THE EMPLOYER

01:19 - 33.839 IS CHALLENGING THE

01:19 - 36.130 REASONABLENESS NECESSITY OR.

01:19 - 38.219 CAUSAL RELATED MESS WHICH I

01:19 - 40.210 THINK IS JUST THE SAME THING

01:19 - 42.889 WHY SHOULD WE WHY SHOULDN'T BE

01:19 - 44.549 GOING THROUGH THE U R PROCESS I

01:19 - 46.119 RESPECTFULLY DISAGREE WITH YOUR

01:19 - 47.179 ASSESSMENT THAT IT'S THE SAME

01:19 - 48.929 THING BECAUSE OF THE

01:19 - 50.039 DISTINCTION THAT I LAID OUT

01:19 - 51.789 BEFORE THAT IT'S NOT RELATED TO

01:19 - 53.519 THE INJURY VERSUS IT'S RELATED

01:19 - 54.659 TO THE INJURY, BUT IT'S JUST

01:19 - 55.909 NOT REASONABLE AND NECESSARY.

01:19 - 57.259 THOSE ARE 2 DIFFERENT THINGS

01:19 - 58.359 AND SO I KNOW THEY'RE GET

01:19 - 59.449 ANOTHER DIFFERENT THINGS BUT

01:19 - 01.249 THE BOTTOM LINE IS SHOULD BE

01:20 - 02.230 SHOULD BE PAID SHOULD BE

01:20 - 02.870 COVERED OR SHOULDN'T

01:20 - 03.380 BE COVERED.

01:20 - 04.889 THE BLAST. BUT THAT'S THAT'S

01:20 - 06.239 CORRECT THAT'S CORRECT. SO WE

01:20 - 07.409 WERE SO SHOULD WE HAVE 2

01:20 - 08.629 DIFFERENT BODIES MAKING THE

01:20 - 09.989 SAME COVERAGE DETERMINATION,

01:20 - 10.940 BUT IT'S NOT THE SAME COVERAGE

01:20 - 12.759 DETERMINATION BECAUSE THE ROADS

01:20 - 14.529 ARE GIVEN SPECIFIC INSTRUCTIONS

01:20 - 15.799 TO NOT ADDRESS CALLS A

01:20 - 17.619 RELATIONSHIP IN FACT IN THEIR

01:20 - 19.449 IN THEIR FORMS IN THE IN THE

01:20 - 20.959 CODE ITSELF. IT SAYS DON'T

01:20 - 22.349 ADDRESS THE CALLS ARE RELATED

01:20 - 24.399 THIS. THE WORKERS COMPENSATION

01:20 - 25.839 JUDGES THROUGH PETITIONS THAT

01:20 - 26.810 GO THROUGH THE WORKERS

01:20 - 28.890 COMPENSATION COURT ADDRESS

01:20 - 30.809 THOSE TYPES OF ISSUES AND IN

01:20 - 32.000 THIS SITUATION WE HAVE

01:20 - 35.119 INABILITY FOR THE PROVIDER TO

01:20 - 36.210 ADDRESS THAT ALONE.

01:20 - 38.169 BUT IN FACT IN

01:20 - 40.409 CROZIER CHESTER THE THE COURT

01:20 - 41.769 THAT SUPREME COURT SAYS IN

01:20 - 43.119 CASES WHICH LIABILITY FOR

01:20 - 44.349 PARTICULAR TREATMENT IS AT

01:20 - 46.389 ISSUE THE CLAIMANT AND NOT THE

01:20 - 47.719 MEDICAL PROVIDER MUST PURSUE

01:20 - 49.119 THE COMPENSATION BEFORE WORKERS

01:20 - 50.070 COMPENSATION JUDGING,

01:20 - 52.429 REGULAR COURSE THAT THE PANEL

01:20 - 54.309 UNDER WORKERS FIRST AND WITHIN

01:20 - 55.310 THIS COURT.

01:20 - 58.239 ABOUT HALF OF THE COURT'S

01:20 - 59.689 REASONING FROM CROZIER CHESTER

01:20 - 01.729 AND I UNDERSTAND THE COUNCIL

01:21 - 03.079 MAY SAY THE CRUISER CHESTER

01:21 - 04.499 CAME UPON A MANDAMUS ACTION BUT

01:21 - 06.379 IT REALLY IS IN FACT IT'S AMID

01:21 - 07.719 FEED DISCUSSION AND WORKERS

01:21 - 08.750 FIRST DOESN'T EXIST

01:21 - 10.839 WITHOUT CROZIER CHESTER SO WE

01:21 - 12.400 CAN LEAST DISPENSE WITH THAT

01:21 - 15.149 CROZIER CHESTER. THEY DID

01:21 - 16.150 REFERENCE

01:21 - 18.849 DICK THAT THE INSURER MAY SEEK

01:21 - 20.039 TO MODIFY OR SUSPEND OR

01:21 - 21.519 TERMINATE THE NCP OR SEEKING

01:21 - 23.219 UTILIZATION REVIEW AND THAT'S

01:21 - 24.220 WHAT THE COURT THAT'S WHAT THE

01:21 - 25.699 PAN LATCHED ON TO AND WORKERS

01:21 - 27.339 FIRST AND SAID OK WELL THEN GO

01:21 - 28.719 AHEAD AND DO THAT YOU MAY SEE

01:21 - 30.249 THE MODIFICATION PETITION OR

01:21 - 32.079 YOU MAY SEE UTILIZATION REVIEW

01:21 - 33.099 FOR SOMETHING THAT COMES UP

01:21 - 34.439 THROUGH FEVER VIEW AND THIS IS

01:21 - 35.440 CREATED THIS.

01:21 - 37.069 THE REASON THAT WE'RE HERE

01:21 - 38.249 HOWEVER YOU THINK WHAT DO YOU

01:21 - 39.879 THINK THE RULE OF LAW THAT THIS

01:21 - 41.809 COURT SHOULD ISSUE IF YOU THINK

01:21 - 42.140 THAT THERE'S

01:21 - 43.829 A CONFLICT. IF THERE'S A

01:21 - 44.979 CONFLICT I THINK THE COURT THIS

01:21 - 47.149 COURT SHOULD ADDRESSED THE

01:21 - 49.249 REVISIT WHAT WAS DISCOVERED

01:21 - 50.569 WHAT WAS WHAT WAS ULTIMATELY

01:21 - 52.389 OPINED IN BOTH WORKERS FIRST

01:21 - 53.949 AND ON THE BOTH FROM PANELS OF

01:21 - 54.670 THIS COURT IN THE

01:21 - 57.009 ONGOING SESSION. ADDRESS THAT

01:21 - 58.259 AND THE IN CONSISTENCIES

01:21 - 59.150 BETWEEN THOSE

01:21 - 00.899 2 CASES AND WHAT IS SAID IN

01:22 - 02.349 ENCROACHING CHESTER WHICH AND

01:22 - 03.689 THERE IS AN EXCITING APPEAR IN

01:22 - 05.059 YOUR WRITING THE OPINION WHAT

01:22 - 06.729 WOULD THE RULE OF LAW BE THE

01:22 - 08.459 RULE OF LAW IS THAT THE INSURER

01:22 - 10.059 IS ENTITLED TO CHALLENGE

01:22 - 11.429 INDIVIDUAL TREATMENTS UNDER

01:22 - 13.569 CAUSAL RELATIONSHIP AND IN THE

01:22 - 15.209 CONTEXT OF A FEE REVIEW A FEW

01:22 - 15.970 REVIEW OFFICER

01:22 - 18.359 IS NOT PERMITTED TO ADDRESS

01:22 - 19.439 CULTURE RELATIONSHIP AND

01:22 - 21.199 THEREFORE IF IN FACT THERE IS

01:22 - 23.229 AN INTEREST IN DISCUSSING THE

01:22 - 24.449 CAUSAL RELATIONSHIP THAT REALLY

01:22 - 26.339 BROUGHT UP THROUGH A WORKERS

01:22 - 28.799 COMPENSATION JUDGE ADJUDICATION

01:22 - 30.119 WHATEVER PETITION THAT LOOKS

01:22 - 32.089 LIKE IT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER

01:22 - 34.289 BECAUSE IT THERE'S THERE IS A

01:22 - 35.509 REMEDY. THERE'S A REMEDY IN

01:22 - 37.210 FACT IF THE IF THERE IS

01:22 - 40.510 A BILL THAT IS

01:22 - 42.299 JUST COMPLETELY

01:22 - 44.089 DENIED FOR A RONI IS REASONS OR

01:22 - 45.799 BAD REASONS THERE'S A REMEDY

01:22 - 47.169 THAT WORKERS COMPENSATION JUDGE

01:22 - 48.419 CAN ASSESS COUNSEL FEES CAN

01:22 - 50.089 ASSESS PENALTIES ALL OF THOSE

01:22 - 52.349 THINGS ON THE ENSURE IF THEY IF

01:22 - 53.579 THEY DENY TO BUILD A ROAD

01:22 - 56.029 EASLEY OR DENY THE BILL FOR THE

01:22 - 57.649 FOR BAD FAITH REASONS SO THERE

01:22 - 58.700 IS A REMEDY THERE.

01:22 - 00.569 IT SHOULDN'T BE THROUGH THE FEE

01:23 - 01.749 REVIEW OFFICE TO MAKE THOSE

01:23 - 02.869 DETERMINATIONS AND MAKE A

01:23 - 04.919 DETERMINATION OR IMPORTANT PUT

01:23 - 06.769 THE ONUS ON THE EMPLOYER OF THE

01:23 - 08.929 INSURER TO GO THROUGH A FEW

01:23 - 10.219 REVIEW PROCESS BEARING THE COST

01:23 - 11.859 THEMSELVES AND I I THINK THE

01:23 - 13.660 PROBLEM IS THERE'S NOTHING

01:23 - 17.069 EASY ABOUT IT BECAUSE BECAUSE

01:23 - 18.210 AGAIN YOU WERE.

01:23 - 20.989 IN THE PROCESS YOU'RE SEEING

01:23 - 24.369 THE SAY YOU WANT TO SAY YOU GET

01:23 - 25.370 A BILL.

01:23 - 29.629 AND THE INSURER SAID WHERE THE

01:23 - 31.769 EMPLOYER SAYS WE'RE NOT

01:23 - 33.070 CONTESTING THE AMOUNT

01:23 - 34.459 WE'RE NOT CONTESTING THE

01:23 - 36.279 CLASSIFICATION WHERE WE'RE

01:23 - 38.920 CONTESTING RELATED MISS OF IT

01:23 - 40.330 AND YOU FOLD YOUR ARMS.

01:23 - 44.519 AND BECAUSE YOU FOR SOME REASON

01:23 - 45.780 YOU DON'T WANT TO FILE

01:23 - 47.829 REALIZATION FOR REVIEW. YOU'RE

01:23 - 48.640 GOING TO SET YOU'RE GOING TO

01:23 - 50.439 SIT AS LONG AS YOU HAVE

01:23 - 52.139 TO SET BUT UTILIZATION REVIEW

01:23 - 53.269 WOULDN'T HELP IN THAT SITUATION

01:23 - 54.240 BECAUSE WE'RE SAYING IT'S NOT

01:23 - 56.039 CLOSELY RELATED PERSON WAS NOT

01:23 - 57.099 RELATED TO THE INJURY THAT'S

01:23 - 58.289 BEEN EXTENDED SO FAR SO YOU

01:23 - 59.549 WANT TO SEE YOU WANT TO REVIEW,

01:23 - 01.630 BUT IF YOU READ OR WHAT HE WANT

01:24 - 02.310 WHAT WHAT'S THE

01:24 - 04.699 NEXT STEP. THE CLAIMANT AS AS

01:24 - 06.659 THE AS THE SPORT SUPREME COURT

01:24 - 09.239 SAID IN THE PROTESTER CASE IT'S

01:24 - 10.819 ON THE CLAIMANT TO FILE A

01:24 - 12.029 PETITION IN FRONT OF A WORKER'S

01:24 - 12.670 COMPENSATION FOR

01:24 - 14.299 WANT TO TO ADDRESS THE

01:24 - 15.319 LIABILITY FOR PARTICULAR

01:24 - 16.389 TREATMENT FOR WHAT WHAT'S THAT

01:24 - 17.020 PETITION WAS

01:24 - 18.699 A CALL. IT CAN BE A CLAIM

01:24 - 19.849 ADDITION TO THE REVIEW PETITION

01:24 - 21.120 TO BE ANY OF THOSE PETITIONS

01:24 - 22.400 WHERE'S THAT.

01:24 - 27.749 IN THE STATUTE THAT THEY

01:24 - 31.609 THEY THE COURTS SITES 5316,

01:24 - 33.649 4, IN RELATION TO THEIR

01:24 - 35.269 THEIR HOLDING. OKAY YOU'RE JUST

01:24 - 36.959 SO BASICALLY THE WAY THE PING

01:24 - 37.460 PONG

01:24 - 40.349 IT WORKING. THEY FILE THE FEE

01:24 - 41.609 REVIEW PETITION BECAUSE YOU

01:24 - 43.179 DIDN'T OR THEY THEY SEND YOU

01:24 - 45.039 A BILL. YOU DENY IT AND YOU

01:24 - 46.519 TELL THEM YOU'RE DENYING IT ON

01:24 - 47.830 CAUSE A RELATED THIS

01:24 - 49.869 AND YOU SIT BACK AND THE BALL

01:24 - 51.390 IS IN THEIR COURT TO INITIATE

01:24 - 52.130 AND

01:24 - 53.900 THE PROCEEDING ON A

01:24 - 56.809 ON THE PLANET TO FISH ON THE

01:24 - 58.119 CLIMATE THREAT THAT'S WHAT YOU

01:24 - 59.309 WANT IS THE CLAIMANT IN THE

01:24 - 00.690 PROVIDER ARE ENTWINED.

01:25 - 03.469 SO THEY HAVE A THERE'S A VESTED

01:25 - 04.979 BENEFIT IN HAVING THE CLAIMANT

01:25 - 06.549 FILE THAT PETITION ON BEHALF OF

01:25 - 08.849 THE PROVIDER. THE FEAT MEDICAL

01:25 - 10.389 FEAT REVIEW STRUCTURE WAS SET

01:25 - 11.980 UP BY THE LEGISLATURE WITHOUT

01:25 - 13.869 THE ABILITY FOR THE PROVIDER

01:25 - 15.999 TOO CHALLENGE THE AURA THAT

01:25 - 17.849 WITHOUT THE ABILITY FOR THE THE

01:25 - 19.400 CLAIMANT TO INTERVENE AND THE

01:25 - 21.159 WORKERS COMPENSATION POSITIONS

01:25 - 22.549 OF THE 2 PATIENTS WERE SET UP

01:25 - 23.569 WITHOUT THE ABILITY FOR THE

01:25 - 24.020 PROVIDER

01:25 - 25.849 TO INTERVENE. IT'S IT'S 2

01:25 - 27.219 SEPARATE SYSTEMS, THE COUNCIL

01:25 - 29.049 YOU SAID GOING BACK A COUPLE

01:25 - 30.479 MINUTES THAT YOU ARE WOULDN'T

01:25 - 32.649 HELP. IN THAT SCENARIO THAT

01:25 - 33.950 YOU'RE HAVING WITH JUDGE PROPS.

01:25 - 35.520 I'M CONFUSED WHY.

01:25 - 38.479 BECAUSE THERE ISN'T THAT THE

01:25 - 39.310 RIGHT FOR HIM TO

01:25 - 42.389 DO THIS. 2 FOR THE DISPUTE

01:25 - 43.399 BECAUSE THAT WOULDN'T BE

01:25 - 45.939 INTRINSICALLY CHANGE THE THE

01:25 - 47.549 UTILIZATION REVIEW PROCESS THAT

01:25 - 48.649 WOULD BE IF IF THIS COURT

01:25 - 49.650 HELD THAT.

01:25 - 50.530 THE UTILIZATION REVIEW

01:25 - 51.729 PROCESS WHICH THIS COURT HAS

01:25 - 52.690 ADDRESSED AGAIN AND AGAIN AND

01:25 - 54.289 AGAIN IT'S NEVER TO ADDRESS

01:25 - 56.450 CAUSAL RELATIONSHIP. IT'S IN IN

01:25 - 58.570 DECISIONS

01:25 - 00.169 FROM THIS COURT IT'S IN THAT IS

01:26 - 01.589 UNFIT AND SPRINT THE IN THE EU

01:26 - 02.959 ARE PROCESS YOU PRESUME WORKER,

01:26 - 04.289 LATENESS YOU PRESUME

01:26 - 05.469 WORK-RELATED THAT YOU NEVER

01:26 - 06.899 ADJUDICATING YOU EVER ADDRESSED

01:26 - 08.190 THAT IN FACT THE THE BROKE

01:26 - 10.699 THOSE WHO ARE REVIEWING IT THAT

01:26 - 11.909 WERE SPECIFICALLY TOLD ON THE

01:26 - 13.219 FORM DO NOT ADDRESS THAT AND

01:26 - 14.939 NOT USE IT OR THAT SO YOU ARE

01:26 - 16.489 YOU ARE PRESUMED WORK-RELATED

01:26 - 18.529 AS THE REVIEW YOU ONLY WANT TO

01:26 - 20.160 TALK ABOUT MONEY, CORRECT

01:26 - 23.199 WHATEVER'S LEFT THIS CAUSAL

01:26 - 25.069 RELATED MISTAKE FOR WORKERS

01:26 - 26.389 COMPENSATION JUDGE BECAUSE

01:26 - 26.680 THAT'S

01:26 - 28.069 THE DEFAULT BECAUSE THERE'S

01:26 - 29.319 NOTHING THERE'S NOTHING THAT'S

01:26 - 30.720 THE 3RD AND THEN SET UP.

01:26 - 33.010 IS THAT A 3RD PAST THEM.

01:26 - 35.759 THOSE ARE THE PASTORS OF HAVE

01:26 - 36.879 ALWAYS BEEN ADDRESSED BECAUSE

01:26 - 39.249 THE REVIEW IT IS HAS BEEN ONLY

01:26 - 40.919 SET UP TO DEAL WITH THE MONEY

01:26 - 42.069 ASPECT OF HAVE HAD THE

01:26 - 43.240 PROVIDERS BEEN PAID ENOUGH,

01:26 - 45.289 NOT AGAIN THE THE REFEREES ARE

01:26 - 46.959 NOT DESIGNED TO GET THE DRESS

01:26 - 48.809 CODES RELATIONSHIP UTILIZATION

01:26 - 50.599 REVIEW SIMILAR NOT ADDRESSED

01:26 - 52.329 NOT REGARDING COST LEGACE PART

01:26 - 53.909 OF THIS THOUGH IS WHAT WE'RE

01:26 - 54.530 ACTUALLY

01:26 - 57.010 SPECIFICALLY DISPUTING WHEN YOU

01:26 - 00.069 THERE'S A DISPUTE ON WHETHER OR

01:27 - 01.070 NOT.

01:27 - 03.469 WHAT ASPECT

01:27 - 06.379 OF THE CREAM IF I WILL IS BEING

01:27 - 07.380 CHALLENGED.

01:27 - 10.259 IS IT THAT THE EFFECTIVENESS

01:27 - 12.729 IS IT THE CAUSAL RELATIONSHIP

01:27 - 14.000 IS IT THE PRICE.

01:27 - 15.869 I MEAN I GUESS I JUMPED A

01:27 - 16.760 LITTLE BIT AHEAD OF THE

01:27 - 20.329 GAME BECAUSE I I PRESUME THAT

01:27 - 22.499 WE WERE GREEN WHAT ASPECT OF

01:27 - 24.379 THIS WAS ACTUALLY BE BEING

01:27 - 26.569 CHALLENGED THE THE CHALLENGE

01:27 - 27.979 HERE AND THE CHALLENGE THAT WAS

01:27 - 30.079 IN FRONT OF THE MEDICAL FEAT

01:27 - 32.429 REVIEW OFFICER WAS ONLY ON ALSO

01:27 - 34.009 RELATED THIS THE PARTIES NEVER

01:27 - 35.789 ADDRESSED WEATHER WAS EFFECTIVE

01:27 - 37.150 WHAT PART OF THE BODY. IT WAS

01:27 - 38.609 IT WAS A SIMPLY A COMPOUND

01:27 - 39.999 CREAM THAT WAS FOR AN ACCEPTED

01:27 - 41.000 BACK INJURY.

01:27 - 43.560 WE COULD LITIGATE THAT THREAT

01:27 - 45.820 YOU KNOW THE STORY THROUGH A

01:27 - 47.579 WORKERS COMPENSATION JUDGE

01:27 - 48.929 PROCEEDING BECAUSE IT WAS

01:27 - 49.350 CHALLENGING

01:27 - 51.429 RELATED MESS. WELL WOULD YOU

01:27 - 53.279 NOT DID YOU ASK FOR USE THE

01:27 - 54.939 STATION REVIEW, NO KNOWN

01:27 - 55.940 UNKNOWN WAS ASKED

01:27 - 57.589 BECAUSE AGAIN WE WERE

01:27 - 58.969 CHALLENGING IT ON CALLS ARE

01:27 - 00.089 RELATED THIS WERE SAYING IT'S

01:28 - 01.500 NOT RELATED TO THE INJURY.

01:28 - 02.700 WELL.

01:28 - 06.579 VERSUS NOT REASON I'M NOT EVEN

01:28 - 08.729 REASONABLY NECESSARY FOR THAT

01:28 - 10.419 INJURY SAYING WITH SAYING IN

01:28 - 11.899 FACT IT WAS CULTURALLY RELATED

01:28 - 13.149 BUT WE DON'T BELIEVE THAT IT'S

01:28 - 14.549 REASONABLE AND NECESSARY FOR

01:28 - 15.559 THAT INJURY. THOSE ARE THE 2

01:28 - 16.640 SYSTEMS THAT WE HAVE.

01:28 - 17.969 SO YOU'RE SO BASICALLY WE

01:28 - 20.480 HAVE IT IN YOUR WORLD, WE HAVE

01:28 - 22.520 3 DIFFERENT DISPUTES.

01:28 - 23.800 WE HAVE.

01:28 - 26.529 THE FEAR YOU HAVE A DISPUTE

01:28 - 27.639 OVER PRICING TONIGHT BILL

01:28 - 28.839 BECAUSE THE PRICE YOU AGREE

01:28 - 29.840 THAT GOES TO THE THEATER REVIEW

01:28 - 32.219 PROCESS. YES, OKAY. YOU HAVE A

01:28 - 34.389 DISPUTE OVER REASONABLE IS IN

01:28 - 36.279 THE CESSA DI OF A TREATMENT

01:28 - 38.749 THAT BY DEFINITION IS COSTLY

01:28 - 40.419 RELATED BECAUSE YOU GUYS THAT'S

01:28 - 42.139 PRESUME CAUSALLY RELATED YES

01:28 - 43.739 AND THAT GOES THROUGH YOU ARE

01:28 - 45.649 CORRECT. THEN YOU HAVE THIS 3RD

01:28 - 47.420 THING WHICH IS

01:28 - 49.189 WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU HAVE A

01:28 - 51.319 TREATMENT THAT IS NOT CAUSE OF

01:28 - 53.949 THE RELATED. YOU SAY THAT GOES

01:28 - 55.339 TO THE DEFAULT CLAIM IT HAS TO

01:28 - 56.829 FILE IF YOU'RE TO EVEN THOUGH

01:28 - 59.460 YOU'RE HE YOU'RE THE ONE

01:28 - 01.739 JOINING THE ISSUE WAS SAYING

01:29 - 03.829 THE BILL RIGHT AND

01:29 - 04.830 INFORMING THEM THE REASON

01:29 - 06.699 YOU'RE DENYING IT IS A RELATED

01:29 - 09.229 TO THIS. THEY ARE THE ONES THE

01:29 - 10.880 CLAIMANT HAS TO INITIATE

01:29 - 12.639 THE BURGER HAS 2 INITIATED AND

01:29 - 14.069 THEY BUY AS IF IT'S A CLAIM

01:29 - 15.829 PETITION AND THEY HAVE THE

01:29 - 17.379 BURDEN BECAUSE OF THE FILE OF

01:29 - 18.750 THE CLAIM PETITION TO PROVE

01:29 - 20.969 RELATED THIS THAT IS IN FACT

01:29 - 22.559 THE SCHEME THAT YET. YES THAT'S

01:29 - 23.709 WHAT YOU WANT TO YES THAT'S

01:29 - 24.580 EXACTLY WHAT I WANT BECAUSE

01:29 - 25.550 THAT'S THE WAY IT'S ALWAYS BEEN

01:29 - 27.179 WORKERS FIRST CHANGE THAT OKAY

01:29 - 29.019 WHAT IF THE CLAIMANT WON'T FILE

01:29 - 30.020 THE PETITION.

01:29 - 31.909 THAT IS THE ADDRESS BY THE

01:29 - 33.199 COURT AND THE LEGISLATURE AS TO

01:29 - 35.029 WHAT WHAT THE PROVIDERS REMEDY

01:29 - 35.340 IS IN

01:29 - 37.869 THAT SITUATION THAT THE THE

01:29 - 39.239 EVEN IF IN FACT THE LEGISLATURE

01:29 - 40.210 WANTS TO JUMP IN AND GIVE THE

01:29 - 42.039 PROVIDER A RIGHT OR REMEDY WITH

01:29 - 43.949 THE REVIEW OR THE YOU THAT'S UP

01:29 - 45.079 TO THE LEGISLATURE, BUT RIGHT

01:29 - 46.219 NOW THERE'S NO SAYS THERE'S NO

01:29 - 47.649 SCHEME SET UP FOR THAT TO

01:29 - 48.150 OCCUR.

01:29 - 49.749 THIS WORKERS FIRST CASE AND

01:29 - 52.719 I'M JUST SAID OKAY, THEN THAT'S

01:29 - 53.889 I'M GLAD JUDGE COACHABLE ARE

01:29 - 55.449 POINTED THAT OUT THAT'S THE

01:29 - 56.680 PROBLEM WITH YOUR SCHEME.

01:29 - 58.759 THE PROBLEM WITH YOUR SCHEME IS

01:29 - 01.489 THEN THEIR PROVIDER IS BOXED

01:30 - 02.490 OUT.

01:30 - 05.390 FOR ALL INTENTS AND

01:30 - 07.329 PURPOSES, IT IS ISN'T THAT AN

01:30 - 08.330 ABSURD RESULT.

01:30 - 10.859 NO BECAUSE IT IN THE

01:30 - 12.179 SITUATION OUTSIDE OF WHAT

01:30 - 14.009 HAPPENED IN WORKERS FIRST WHERE

01:30 - 15.709 THE CLAIMANT AND THE EMPLOYER

01:30 - 17.619 BOXED OUT THE PROVIDER WE'VE

01:30 - 19.039 IT'S TO BE ASSUMED THAT THE

01:30 - 20.839 CLAIMANT AND THE PROVIDER OR IN

01:30 - 22.379 INTERTWINED AND THAT THERE IS A

01:30 - 24.209 VESTED INTEREST IN THE CLAIMANT

01:30 - 25.210 TO PROCEED

01:30 - 27.499 AS GEORGE GREER INDICATED THERE

01:30 - 29.579 MAY BE A SITUATION I BELIEVE

01:30 - 30.320 THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE AN

01:30 - 32.429 OUTLIER SITUATION WHICH WAS

01:30 - 33.990 WHAT CAME UP AND WORKERS FIRST

01:30 - 35.109 WHERE THE CLAIMANT WOULD HAVE

01:30 - 36.139 NO INTEREST IN STEPPING INTO

01:30 - 37.359 THOSE SHOES BECAUSE THEY

01:30 - 38.559 ALREADY COMPROMISED IN RELEASED

01:30 - 39.180 THEIR CASE.

01:30 - 40.719 BUT THAT IS A SITUATION I

01:30 - 41.799 BELIEVE TO BE AN OUTLIER I

01:30 - 42.889 BELIEVE THE MAJORITY OF THE

01:30 - 44.419 CASES THE CLEANING AND THE

01:30 - 45.999 PROVIDER OR INTERTWINED AND THE

01:30 - 47.120 CLAIMANT WOULD HAVE TO FILE.

01:30 - 49.190 THANK YOU COUNCIL. THANK YOU.

01:30 - 56.609 GOOD MORNING MAY PLEASE

01:30 - 58.589 THE COURT DANCING ON BEHALF OF

01:30 - 01.249 UNITED PHARMACY. I THINK WHERE

01:31 - 01.610 WE NEED

01:31 - 03.509 TO START IS TO LOOK AT SOME

01:31 - 06.419 CONTEXT AND UNDERSTAND THE

01:31 - 08.439 CONTEXT IS CRITICAL IN THE PEER

01:31 - 09.510 REVIEW PROCESS.

01:31 - 11.259 BECAUSE EVERYTHING AND THE

01:31 - 13.619 QUESTIONS HERE WHICH LITERALLY

01:31 - 15.469 MIRROR THE QUESTIONS THAT WERE

01:31 - 17.019 ASKED WHEN THIS COURT ABOUT

01:31 - 19.289 DECIDED THE ARMOR PHARMACY CASE

01:31 - 19.530 ARM

01:31 - 22.699 OR 2. REDRESS THOSE ISSUES

01:31 - 25.439 REALLY WELL. WE ONE WHICH

01:31 - 27.379 WAS THE FIRST OF THE FEE REVIEW

01:31 - 29.099 CASES TO FINALLY REACH THIS

01:31 - 31.930 COURT ADDRESSED THE CONCERN

01:31 - 33.859 THAT THE FEE REVIEW PROCESS AND

01:31 - 35.689 IT WAS IN YOUR QUESTION JUDGE

01:31 - 37.859 ROGER, THAT THERE REALLY IS NO

01:31 - 39.970 DUE PROCESS TO A PROVIDER.

01:31 - 42.439 THEY HAVE NO REMEDY OTHER

01:31 - 43.859 THAN THE LIMITED REMEDY.

01:31 - 45.419 A FILING A FEE REVIEW

01:31 - 47.649 APPLICATION WITHIN 30 DAYS OF

01:31 - 48.750 THE DENIAL OF TREATMENT.

01:31 - 50.749 THEY HAVE NO RIGHT TO GO IN

01:31 - 52.289 FRONT OF THE UTILIZATION REVOKE

01:31 - 54.189 THE REVIEW ORGANIZATION THEY

01:31 - 56.030 CAN'T PARTICIPATE IF

01:31 - 59.119 THEY ARE. PHARMACY A MEDICAL

01:31 - 00.699 EQUIPMENT COMPANY OR ANYTHING

01:32 - 00.970 THAT IS

01:32 - 04.469 A MEDICAL. PROVIDER THAT DOES

01:32 - 06.369 NOT PROVIDE MEDICAL SERVICES

01:32 - 08.039 SUCH AS A DOCTOR. THIS

01:32 - 10.949 COURT'S CASES THAT WE HAVE SEEN

01:32 - 12.159 THAT HAVE BROUGHT US TO THIS

01:32 - 14.409 DAY HAVE ADDRESSED AND

01:32 - 16.029 TRY TO FIX

01:32 - 19.019 THOSE FLAWS AS WELL AS TAKE THE

01:32 - 21.570 CONTEXT OF THE CROZIER CASE

01:32 - 24.769 BECAUSE CROZIER WASN'T MANDAMUS

01:32 - 26.749 ACTION AND WHILE THE COURT SAID

01:32 - 27.230 THAT THE FEE

01:32 - 30.429 REVIEW PROCESS WAS WHERE THE

01:32 - 31.050 MATTER

01:32 - 33.959 SHOULD BE THE THE ISSUE THERE

01:32 - 35.540 WAS CONTEXT AND THE COURT

01:32 - 37.969 CLAIMANTS CAN JUST GET TO FILE

01:32 - 39.379 THE PETITIONS CLAIMANTS

01:32 - 41.240 INTERESTS AS SEXUALLY HARASSED

01:32 - 43.559 ARE NOT NECESSARILY A WINE WITH

01:32 - 44.340 THOSE OF A

01:32 - 46.179 MEDICAL PROVIDER THERE ARE LOTS

01:32 - 48.169 OF REASONS THAT A CLAIM IT HAS

01:32 - 49.539 NO INTEREST WHATSOEVER IN

01:32 - 50.889 GETTING INTO LITIGATION,

01:32 - 52.019 INCLUDING THE FACT THAT IT

01:32 - 52.900 OFTEN LEADS TO

01:32 - 56.419 RETALIATE TORY. IN MIAMI'S THAT

01:32 - 57.769 CAN LEAD TO TERMINATION

01:32 - 59.279 PETITIONS THAT CAN LEAD TO LOTS

01:32 - 01.129 OF THINGS WHERE THEIR INTERESTS

01:33 - 03.100 ARE ALLIED ALIGNED

01:33 - 05.600 PROVIDERS INTEREST. WE

01:33 - 08.889 OR 2. THIS COURT FURTHER

01:33 - 10.759 ACKNOWLEDGE THE DUE PROCESS

01:33 - 11.999 ISSUES AND THAT WAS AN

01:33 - 14.679 INTERESTING CASE I'VE APPEAR

01:33 - 15.989 OBVIOUSLY BEFORE THIS COURT AND

01:33 - 16.990 MANY OF THESE

01:33 - 19.319 THAT ARGUMENT WITH THAT MISTER

01:33 - 20.910 MAKHMOUR AND I

01:33 - 23.459 WAS LITERALLY A CONVERSATION

01:33 - 25.659 WITH THIS COURT ABOUT THE FLAWS

01:33 - 25.930 IN

01:33 - 28.829 THE PROCESS. AND THE DECISION

01:33 - 29.710 IN THE CONTEXT OF

01:33 - 32.459 A PROVIDER REALLY HELPED

01:33 - 35.329 CREATE CLARITY BUT WHAT WE HAVE

01:33 - 37.779 HERE IN THIS SITUATION IS THE

01:33 - 39.409 PROBLEM THAT COMES THROUGH IN

01:33 - 41.120 YOUR QUESTIONING BECAUSE

01:33 - 44.579 MY USE OF THE WORD CAUSAL

01:33 - 46.359 RELATED IN SOMEONE ELSE'S USE

01:33 - 48.410 OF REASONABLE AND NECESSITY

01:33 - 50.429 HAVE AN ENORMOUS IMPACT IN THE

01:33 - 52.790 SYSTEM. IT IS A HUGE IMPACT

01:33 - 54.869 BECAUSE AS SOON AS THE WORDS

01:33 - 57.229 CAUSAL RELATED TO THIS ARE

01:33 - 59.659 HONORED UNDER THIS THE WAY THE

01:33 - 02.379 SCHEME WAS PRIOR TO WORKERS

01:34 - 04.919 FIRST ME MONEY IN THE

01:34 - 07.209 PENULTIMATE PARAGRAPH BY THEN

01:34 - 09.429 PRESIDENT JUDGE LEVITT REALLY

01:34 - 11.130 TRUE HONED IN ON IT.

01:34 - 12.939 THE PROBLEM IS AS SOON AS YOU

01:34 - 14.959 SAY PUZZLE RELATED IN THIS AS

01:34 - 16.769 IN THIS CASE. THIS PROVIDER HAS

01:34 - 17.430 NO REMEDY.

01:34 - 19.169 THIS PROVIDER HAS NO DUE

01:34 - 20.939 PROCESS RIGHTS THIS PROVIDER

01:34 - 23.139 HAS NO PLACE TO GO IN

01:34 - 24.789 ORDER TO BE

01:34 - 26.739 BECOME COMPENSATED OR SEEK

01:34 - 28.369 COMPENSATION FOR MISTER SEGAL

01:34 - 30.079 YOU SHOULD HAVE A PLACE TO GO

01:34 - 32.579 FOR THE QUESTION IS WE

01:34 - 36.089 DO OUR ARE WE ABLE TO FIND IT

01:34 - 38.329 IN THE STATUE. YES, OR DOES IT

01:34 - 39.330 HAVE TO BE

01:34 - 40.800 SOMEWHERE ELSE.

01:34 - 42.939 I MEAN YOU HAVE

01:34 - 45.469 I MEAN I THINK WHERE WE WERE

01:34 - 46.509 TRYING TO OPERATE WITHIN THE

01:34 - 48.459 STATUE BUT BUT I'M WONDERING

01:34 - 50.400 WHETHER AFTER HEARING FROM

01:34 - 52.919 PETITIONERS ARGUMENT WHETHER

01:34 - 54.619 THE STATUTE REALLY WAYS WHERE

01:34 - 55.959 THE PROVIDERS REMEDY IS IN THE

01:34 - 57.939 SITUATION MAY BE REMEDY IS AND

01:34 - 58.940 COMMON PLEAS COURT.

01:34 - 59.660 WELL.

01:34 - 01.299 THERE'S NO REMEDY IN COMMON

01:35 - 03.509 PLEAS COURT BECAUSE THE WORKERS

01:35 - 05.099 COMPACT DOESN'T PROVIDE THAT I

01:35 - 06.070 UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S THERE'S

01:35 - 08.070 OBVIOUSLY THERE AS WELL

01:35 - 10.119 ACTIVE I'M THINKING OUTSIDE THE

01:35 - 11.279 BOX WHAT I'M TRYING TO BE

01:35 - 13.289 CAREFUL OF IS IF WE HAVE TO IF

01:35 - 13.940 WE'RE GOING PROVIDE THE

01:35 - 15.969 PROVIDER REMEDY. IT HAS TO BE A

01:35 - 17.199 REMEDY THAT THE LEGISLATURE

01:35 - 19.399 PROVIDED IT CAN'T WE WE CAN'T

01:35 - 21.149 FILL A GAP THAT THE

01:35 - 22.989 LEGISLATURE DIDN'T PUT IN

01:35 - 25.270 THERE. CORRECT AND THAT'S

01:35 - 26.440 WHERE.

01:35 - 30.649 THE SYSTEM DECISION ME REALLY

01:35 - 32.189 GETS TO THE POINT BECAUSE IT

01:35 - 33.610 TALKS ABOUT THE FACT

01:35 - 36.590 THAT IN MANY CASES, THE DENIAL

01:35 - 38.080 OF.

01:35 - 40.539 BECAUSE ALI RELATED REALLY IS A

01:35 - 42.509 REASONABLE A NECESSITY DENIAL

01:35 - 44.029 THIS CASE HERE. THAT'S THE

01:35 - 45.719 SITUATION THAT THIS COURT HAS

01:35 - 47.450 IN THIS CASE BECAUSE

01:35 - 50.319 THIS CASE THERE IS NOTHING IN

01:35 - 52.469 THE RECORD NOTHING AT ALL THAT

01:35 - 53.440 SUPPORTS THE

01:35 - 55.719 DEFENSE ASSERTED THAT IT'S NOT

01:35 - 57.249 CAUSLEY RELATED TO HOW DO YOU

01:35 - 58.650 RESPOND TO THE IDEA THAT.

01:35 - 59.989 CAUSAL RELATING THIS IS

01:35 - 01.270 ASSUMED YOU ARE

01:36 - 01.830 ROLLING.

01:36 - 04.659 WE CALL SO RELATED MISSES

01:36 - 05.260 REASONABLE

01:36 - 07.229 AND NECESSARY ISN'T SO

01:36 - 08.299 OBVIOUSLY THEY'RE 2 DIFFERENT

01:36 - 10.119 BANKS SAY THEY ARE UNDER THE

01:36 - 11.939 STATUTE. IT'S YOU I THINK WE

01:36 - 13.299 CAN ALL AGREE IT'S A MAIN

01:36 - 15.469 ARTFULLY DRAWN STATUTE THAT

01:36 - 16.620 WE'RE ALL TRYING.

01:36 - 20.419 2 ADDRESS WHILE ALSO ASSURING

01:36 - 22.399 THAT PROVIDERS WHOMEVER THEY

01:36 - 23.500 ARE HAVE RIGHTS

01:36 - 24.350 BUT.

01:36 - 26.459 ONE OF THIS IN THIS CASE, IT

01:36 - 28.119 IS THE LITERALLY THE POSTER

01:36 - 28.700 CHILD.

01:36 - 31.139 FOR WITH THE FLOOR IN THE

01:36 - 33.679 CAUSAL RELATED THIS DEFENSE IN

01:36 - 35.569 THE RECORD YOU WILL SEE THAT

01:36 - 38.869 THE NCP IS FOR A LOWER BACK

01:36 - 39.680 INJURY AS MISTER

01:36 - 41.399 SCOTT ACKNOWLEDGED, YOU'LL ALSO

01:36 - 43.449 SEE THAT ALTHOUGH PHARMACIES

01:36 - 44.340 AND PHARMACY IS REALLY

01:36 - 46.479 UNIQUE POSITION BECAUSE THEY'RE

01:36 - 48.289 ASKED TO PROVIDE A DIAGNOSIS

01:36 - 49.290 UNDER THE REGS

01:36 - 51.039 WHEN PHARMACIES BY STATE LAW

01:36 - 52.589 AND FEDERAL LAW DON'T RECEIVE

01:36 - 54.489 DIAGNOSES SO THESE PHARMACIES

01:36 - 55.360 ACTUALLY HAVE TO GO OUT OF

01:36 - 56.859 THEIR WAY BECAUSE IF YOU THINK

01:36 - 58.099 ABOUT IT WHEN YOU GO TO THE

01:36 - 00.000 PHARMACY THEY DON'T

01:37 - 01.549 TELL THAT YOUR DOCTOR DOESN'T

01:37 - 03.169 SAY I'M PRESCRIBING THIS

01:37 - 04.359 MEDICINE FOR WHATEVER

01:37 - 06.099 CONDITION, PHARMACIST DOES

01:37 - 08.829 DISPENSE BUT THAT SAID IN

01:37 - 11.159 THIS CASE, THE PICK FOR THE

01:37 - 12.410 MEDICAL BUILDING FOR

01:37 - 13.759 ALSO LISTED THE

01:37 - 17.449 SAME DIAGNOSIS OF LOWER BACK

01:37 - 19.290 INJURY DIAGNOSIS CODE MATCH.

01:37 - 22.249 WHAT'S ON THE N C WHEN ITS FACE

01:37 - 24.529 THEIR IDENTITY WHICH LEADS TO

01:37 - 26.239 THE QUESTION REALLY

01:37 - 28.549 IS THAT THE MEDICATION THAT WAS

01:37 - 30.769 PRESCRIBED BY A DOCTOR WHO CAN

01:37 - 31.809 BE CHALLENGING

01:37 - 33.519 UTILIZATION REVIEW. BUT THE

01:37 - 35.189 PHARMACY CAN IT CAN EVEN

01:37 - 36.050 PARTICIPATE AND

01:37 - 39.019 IT LOSES COMPENSATION EVEN THE

01:37 - 40.589 SUPPOSED TO DOCTOR JUST DOESN'T

01:37 - 42.830 PARTICIPATE THE PHARMACY LOSES.

01:37 - 45.579 BUT WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT IT IF

01:37 - 47.819 THE ON ITS FACE THAT THE

01:37 - 49.689 MEDICATION AND THE INJURY ARE

01:37 - 52.509 THE SAME. THEN AS WE SECURE

01:37 - 54.210 THIS COURT SAID IN THE ARMY.

01:37 - 56.849 THOUGH IT REALLY IS A QUESTION

01:37 - 58.240 OF WHETHER THAT

01:37 - 00.579 MEDICATION PRESCRIBED WAS

01:38 - 01.689 REASONABLE IN THE SENATE

01:38 - 04.389 NECESSARY FOR THAT CONDITION IT

01:38 - 05.489 REALLY ISN'T A QUESTION OF

01:38 - 06.779 WHETHER IT WAS BECAUSE

01:38 - 09.059 ALI RELATED THERE'S THERE WOULD

01:38 - 10.849 BE A SIGNIFICANT DIFFERENCE IF

01:38 - 12.429 YOU KNOW IT WAS EVER A LEFT

01:38 - 14.499 SHOULDER INJURY. AND THERE WAS

01:38 - 14.560 A

01:38 - 16.799 DIET DOSIS OR SOMETHING IS

01:38 - 18.149 PRESCRIBED FOR THE RIGHTS A

01:38 - 20.599 CASE I APPRECIATE THE

01:38 - 22.159 DISTINCTION BETWEEN CAUSE A

01:38 - 24.009 RELATED THIS AND REASONABLE

01:38 - 27.119 NECESSITY. IF THERE IS

01:38 - 30.570 A QUESTION OVER PROVIDERS

01:38 - 33.629 OBJECTION IS TRUE CAUSAL WERE

01:38 - 34.630 THEY IN THIS

01:38 - 37.109 VERSUS REASONABLE AND THAT IS

01:38 - 39.369 REASONABLENESS NECESSITY WHO

01:38 - 41.560 RESOLVES THAT DISPUTE

01:38 - 43.789 THE PROVIDER BUT THE PROVIDER,

01:38 - 45.409 THE CARRIER ALWAYS HAS

01:38 - 46.519 THE RIGHT TO SEE THE

01:38 - 47.849 UTILIZATION REVIEW FIND OUT

01:38 - 49.209 THAT THEY'RE SAFE BUT OKAY, BUT

01:38 - 50.939 THEY SAY THAT THERE'S THERE'S

01:38 - 52.319 AN IMPASSE YOU KNOW THEY

01:38 - 52.990 THEY SAY.

01:38 - 54.379 WE'RE NOT GOING TO YOU ARE

01:38 - 55.979 BECAUSE WE'RE NOT CHALLENGING

01:38 - 57.529 REASONABLENESS NECESSITY AND

01:38 - 58.759 YOU ARE WHAT RISING CAUSE

01:38 - 00.709 RELATION YOU AS THE PROVIDERS

01:39 - 01.660 SAYING NO YOU'RE NOT YOU'RE

01:39 - 02.689 CHALLENGING REASONABLE

01:39 - 03.690 NECESSITY.

01:39 - 05.579 WHO RESOLVES THAT DISPUTE

01:39 - 07.040 BETWEEN THE PROVIDER.

01:39 - 09.580 AND CARRIER.

01:39 - 11.989 BEFORE THIS COURT BEFORE I

01:39 - 14.349 MEAN WORKERS FIRST THE PROVIDER

01:39 - 16.659 OF NO ABILITY TO RESOLVE

01:39 - 18.030 ANYTHING. EITHER

01:39 - 20.279 IT WAS GOING THROUGH THE U THE

01:39 - 21.829 FEE REVIEW PROCESS WHERE THEY

01:39 - 23.009 MAY THINK YOU'RE IN AN ISSUE

01:39 - 24.519 WITH THE REVIEW PROCESS CORRECT

01:39 - 26.859 SO DO SO LET'S SAY, LET'S SAY

01:39 - 27.860 YOU HAVE A DISPUTE.

01:39 - 29.719 HE SAYS THEY HAVE STARTED TO

01:39 - 32.209 SAY HE THAT YOU'RE THE BIG BAD

01:39 - 33.489 INSURANCE COMPANY SO I'M GOING

01:39 - 34.709 TO SEE THE BIG BAD INSURANCE

01:39 - 36.129 COMPANY. SO THE INSURANCE

01:39 - 37.529 COMPANY SAYS WE RECEIVED YOUR

01:39 - 39.599 BILL PROVIDER WE'RE DENYING IT

01:39 - 42.089 ON RELATED THIS. THE PROVIDER

01:39 - 43.409 GO BACK AND SAY NO

01:39 - 44.839 YOU'RE NOT YOU'RE DENYING ALL

01:39 - 46.089 REASONABLE NECESSITY YOU NEED

01:39 - 48.029 TO GO YOU ARE THEY SAY NO CAUSE

01:39 - 49.379 OR RELATED THIS. YOUR

01:39 - 51.509 ONLY OPTION. UNDER

01:39 - 52.689 THE AS THE PROVIDER NOT THE

01:39 - 54.149 CLAIMANT YOUR ONLY OPTION AT

01:39 - 56.219 THAT POINT IN TIME IS TO FILE

01:39 - 57.480 WITH THE REVIEW PROTECTION.

01:39 - 00.819 AND IS THEN IT SEEMS

01:40 - 01.820 TO ME.

01:40 - 04.109 THAT THAT'S THE ONLY PLACE

01:40 - 06.159 THAT THAT ISSUE CAN BE RESOLVED

01:40 - 07.519 AND THAT THE FEE REVIEW

01:40 - 08.520 OFFICERS GOING TO HAVE TO

01:40 - 09.629 DETERMINE THE NATURE OF THE

01:40 - 11.739 DENIAL. IF IT'S CAUSAL RELATED

01:40 - 13.210 MISTER REASONABLENESS I MEAN IT

01:40 - 14.819 AND HOW ELSE POWERLESS DOES

01:40 - 16.789 THAT ISSUE GET DECIDED THAT

01:40 - 18.700 DISPUTE THAT'S CORRECT.

01:40 - 20.569 AND WHEN WE FIRST CAME BEFORE

01:40 - 22.599 THIS COURT ON THE

01:40 - 24.229 THIS ISSUE THAT WAS THE

01:40 - 26.039 QUESTION THAT WAS ESSENTIALLY

01:40 - 27.799 WHAT WE ARE ASKING THIS COURT

01:40 - 30.309 TO DO THAT'S WHAT THE COURT DID

01:40 - 31.909 SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT VERBIAGE BUT

01:40 - 33.549 REACHING THAT WHEN THE CLOSURE

01:40 - 34.550 BUT THE PROBLEM IS UNDER THE

01:40 - 36.869 STATUE FOR REVIEW DOES NOT HAVE

01:40 - 38.119 THE ABILITY TO DECIDE ANYTHING

01:40 - 39.220 OTHER THAN PRICE.

01:40 - 41.480 BUT THERE IS NOTHING

01:40 - 44.059 AND IT'S NOT IN THIS BRIEF BUT

01:40 - 45.339 IT WE'VE BRIEFED THAT BEFORE

01:40 - 46.639 THIS COURT MANY OF THESE OTHER

01:40 - 47.370 CASES.

01:40 - 49.140 IS THE FACT THAT

01:40 - 52.979 ANY COURT ALWAYS HAS AND ANY

01:40 - 55.329 JUDICIAL OFFICER FROM FEE

01:40 - 57.299 REVIEW HEARING OFFICERS TO THE

01:40 - 58.789 PENNSYLVANIA SUPREME COURT WE

01:40 - 00.729 ALWAYS HAVE THE RIGHT TO MAKE

01:41 - 02.570 THAT INITIAL DETERMINATION

01:41 - 04.100 WHETHER THEY HAVE JURISDICTION

01:41 - 06.439 TO LOOK AT THE RECORD AND SAY

01:41 - 08.139 YES WE HAVE JURISDICTION.

01:41 - 09.559 THIS COURT CAN LOOK AT THE CASE

01:41 - 11.989 LOOK AT THIS CASE AND TURNS OUT

01:41 - 13.669 WE DON'T HAVE JURISDICTION AND

01:41 - 15.249 DISMISSED THE CASE THERE'S

01:41 - 17.159 NOTHING THAT HAS HER HAS

01:41 - 19.459 EVER PREVENTED THIS CORRIDOR

01:41 - 21.489 HEARING OFFICER FROM MAKING

01:41 - 23.160 THAT INITIAL DETERMINATION

01:41 - 25.289 AND WE'VE ALWAYS SUGGESTED THAT

01:41 - 26.889 WAS APPROPRIATE BECAUSE

01:41 - 27.890 OTHERWISE.

01:41 - 31.019 WHERE DO WE GO AND WHERE TO

01:41 - 33.439 PROVIDERS GO BECAUSE THE

01:41 - 35.419 STATUTE FOR WE ALL KNOW THAT

01:41 - 36.749 BUT NONE OF US HERE SINCE THE

01:41 - 37.809 GENERAL ASSEMBLY CAN

01:41 - 40.129 CHANGE THAT WHAT THE FEE REVIEW

01:41 - 41.699 OFFICER CAN ALWAYS MAKE THAT

01:41 - 43.619 INITIAL DETERMINATION. LOOK AT

01:41 - 45.049 IT AND SAY YES, THIS IS THE

01:41 - 47.039 U.S. AND IN THIS CASE THERE'S

01:41 - 48.240 NOTHING IN THE RECORD

01:41 - 50.369 THAT WOULD SUPPORT THE POSITION

01:41 - 51.870 THAT'S BEING ASSERTED YOU

01:41 - 54.060 MOREOVER CROZIER

01:41 - 56.559 SUGGESTED YES YOU COULD FILE

01:41 - 58.839 OTHER PETITIONS BUT I WOULD

01:41 - 00.710 SUGGEST THAT THE SUPREME COURT

01:42 - 02.129 IS ALREADY THAT THERE ARE

01:42 - 04.669 QUESTIONS ABOUT WHETHER CROZIER

01:42 - 05.999 REALLY APPLIES HERE FOR A

01:42 - 08.620 NUMBER OF REASONS THE FIRST IS

01:42 - 09.340 THAT

01:42 - 11.669 IN CASE OF OMNI SUPREME COURT

01:42 - 13.479 TONIGHT. THE ALEC OTTER

01:42 - 15.080 PETITION THAT WAS FILED.

01:42 - 16.859 SO THAT THEY CHOSE

01:42 - 20.769 NOT TO THE CROZIER CASE WAS A 4

01:42 - 22.759 TO 3 SPLIT DECISION OF THE

01:42 - 25.909 COURT AND SO THERE WAS THERE

01:42 - 27.999 WERE QUESTIONS AND AND

01:42 - 30.089 ALL 3 JUSTICES WHO WERE IN THE

01:42 - 32.059 DISSENT REMAIN ON THE COURT AND

01:42 - 33.289 THE ONLY JUSTICE IN THE

01:42 - 34.929 MAJORITY STILL ON THE COURT IS

01:42 - 35.930 JUST A SAILOR.

01:42 - 37.259 SO I WOULD SUGGEST THAT IF THE

01:42 - 39.489 COURT HAS AN OPPORTUNITY SEEING

01:42 - 40.929 THE CONTEXT OF THIS COURT'S

01:42 - 41.930 DECISIONS

01:42 - 44.079 AND HEARING IT NOT IN THE

01:42 - 45.479 CONTEXT OF SOMEONE BRINGING A

01:42 - 47.149 MANDAMUS ACTION BUT HEARING IT

01:42 - 48.319 IN THE CONTEXT OF WHAT WE'RE

01:42 - 50.289 DISCUSSING HERE WHAT HAPPENS IN

01:42 - 52.459 A REAL WORKERS COMP CASE NOT

01:42 - 53.510 WHERE YOU HIRE,

01:42 - 54.570 YOU KNOW SOMEONE WHO HASN'T

01:42 - 55.839 HANDLED COMPEAN THEY FILE A

01:42 - 57.759 MANDAMUS ACTION. THE SUPREME

01:42 - 59.449 COURT MAY WELL RECONSIDER AND

01:42 - 01.359 I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT

01:43 - 03.679 YOU COULD READ INTO THE DENIAL

01:43 - 06.319 OF ALEC OTTER ESPECIALLY THIS

01:43 - 07.819 IS A SINCE THIS COURT

01:43 - 10.489 HAS DEVELOPED A CONSISTENT BODY

01:43 - 11.849 OF LAW TRYING

01:43 - 15.119 TO CREATE. THE WHATEVER DUE

01:43 - 17.139 PROCESS PROVIDERS HALF. IF

01:43 - 19.839 WE TAKE AND I AND I CAN SUM

01:43 - 20.540 HERE UNLESS THERE ARE OTHER

01:43 - 21.779 QUESTIONS NOT USE ALL

01:43 - 24.699 MY TIME. BUT IF WE ALLOW THE

01:43 - 26.169 ARGUMENT THAT'S BEING ASSERTED

01:43 - 29.099 HERE AND A LIMP AND ESSENTIALLY

01:43 - 29.310 HAVE

01:43 - 31.569 THIS COURT REVERSE ITS

01:43 - 33.300 DECISIONS AND WORKERS FIRST

01:43 - 35.679 MONEY THEN WE'RE RIGHT BACK TO

01:43 - 36.560 WHERE WE WERE

01:43 - 38.229 WHEN THIS COURT FIRST STARTED

01:43 - 39.620 CONTEMPLATING THESE CASES IN

01:43 - 42.230 20172018 WHERE

01:43 - 44.989 PROVIDERS, PARTICULARLY THOSE

01:43 - 47.489 WHO PROVIDE MEDICAL SERVICES AS

01:43 - 48.430 OPPOSED TO THOSE WHO

01:43 - 50.269 PROVIDE TREATMENT. WE ARE LEFT

01:43 - 51.829 WITH NO REMEDY THEY ARE LEFT

01:43 - 53.399 WITH NO DUE PROCESS BECAUSE

01:43 - 55.369 WHETHER IT'S AN M R I PROVIDER

01:43 - 57.020 PHARMACY OR ANYONE ELSE.

01:43 - 58.429 THERE'S NO ABILITY FOR

01:43 - 00.789 THEM TO ASSERT THEIR RIGHTS

01:44 - 02.200 OTHER THAN IF THE REVIEW

01:44 - 04.099 AND IF THEY'RE NOT A MEDICAL

01:44 - 06.350 TREATMENT PROVIDER OR A DOCTOR

01:44 - 08.719 WORK. A HOSPITAL OR SOMEONE WHO

01:44 - 10.520 ACTUALLY PROVIDES TREATMENT.

01:44 - 12.489 THEY CAN EVEN PARTICIPATE IN

01:44 - 13.940 THE UTILIZATION REVIEW.

01:44 - 16.179 SO THEY'RE LEFT WITH NO REMEDY

01:44 - 17.579 AND IF THERE IS A PETITION

01:44 - 19.429 FILED BEFORE A JUDGE OR WORKERS

01:44 - 20.430 COMP JUDGE.

01:44 - 22.849 THEY HAVE NO REMEDY EITHER THEY

01:44 - 24.380 HAVE NO RIGHT TO PARTICIPATE

01:44 - 26.600 AND IN EVERY ONE OF THOSE CASES

01:44 - 27.729 THESE ENTITIES THAT ARE

01:44 - 29.689 PERFORMING DISPENSARY FUNCTIONS

01:44 - 31.240 DISPENSING MEDICAL EQUIPMENT.

01:44 - 32.450 YOU KNOW A TECHNICIAN

01:44 - 34.719 PERFORMING THE MRI THE PHARMACY

01:44 - 35.950 DISPENSING MEDICATION,

01:44 - 38.009 FIND THEMSELVES WITH NO ABILITY

01:44 - 39.130 TO PROTECT THEIR RIGHTS.

01:44 - 42.229 AND THAT'S WHY THIS COURT ONE I

01:44 - 43.840 DON'T BELIEVE THIS IS A PROPER

01:44 - 45.410 CASE BASED ON THE FACTS.

01:44 - 47.469 THIS SCOPE AND STANDARD

01:44 - 50.239 OF REVIEW IN IN PETITIONER'S

01:44 - 52.139 BRIEF SAYS YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT

01:44 - 53.849 THE ENTIRE RECORD TO SEE IF

01:44 - 54.999 THERE'S EVIDENCE TO SUPPORT THE

01:44 - 56.709 RECORD. THERE'S NO EVIDENCE TO

01:44 - 58.869 SUPPORT A DECISION IN OR

01:44 - 00.419 REVERSAL IN FAVOR OF THE

01:45 - 02.360 CARRIER BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY.

01:45 - 04.859 THIS COURT THIS CITED THE

01:45 - 08.079 CASES PROPERLY ME AND

01:45 - 11.119 WORKERS FIRST AND WHEN THEN

01:45 - 11.580 PRESIDENT

01:45 - 14.049 JUDGE LEVITT STATED IN HER

01:45 - 16.659 DECISION THAT ESSENTIALLY WE'RE

01:45 - 18.719 TALKING ABOUT WORDS HERE THAT

01:45 - 20.310 ONE PERSON'S USE OF.

01:45 - 23.319 ALSO RELATIONSHIP REALLY IS

01:45 - 25.209 IT IT'S THE ISSUE THAT YOU'VE

01:45 - 27.229 RAISED THAT IS IT'S THE ISSUE

01:45 - 30.299 OF REASONABLENESS NECESSITY AND

01:45 - 32.569 THAT'S THE WHY WE'RE HERE THANK

01:45 - 33.820 YOU. THANK YOU COUNCIL.

01:45 - 38.489 VERY BRIEFLY JUST LIKE TO

01:45 - 39.490 ADDRESS A FEW POINTS.

01:45 - 42.859 IN BOTH WORKERS FIRST IN ON THE

01:45 - 44.770 THIS THE PANELS OF THIS COURT.

01:45 - 46.220 SEEM TOO

01:45 - 47.450 CONFLATE OR

01:45 - 50.079 POTENTIALLY SUBSUME CALLS ARE

01:45 - 52.189 RELATED NUS INTO REASONABLENESS

01:45 - 53.789 IS A NECESSITY RELATED TO THE

01:45 - 54.929 COMPOUND CREAMS THAT WEIGHT

01:45 - 55.920 ISSUE. I BELIEVE THE

01:45 - 57.489 TERMINOLOGY THAT WAS USED WAS

01:45 - 02.069 BEFORE FOR 30 HENRI FOR SHERRY

01:46 - 03.339 I APOLOGIZE FOR THE MIKE

01:46 - 04.939 BURLING THE LAST CAME MY LATIN

01:46 - 05.560 THIS TERRIBLE

01:46 - 08.549 MY LIFE IT'S PROBABLY THAT AND

01:46 - 10.399 I BELIEVE THAT'S INCORRECT WAY

01:46 - 11.439 TO LOOK AT THESE THINGS,

01:46 - 13.259 ESPECIALLY WHEN WHEN COUNCILS

01:46 - 16.869 AS SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSING THE

01:46 - 18.899 RECORD IN THIS CASE. THE RECORD

01:46 - 20.600 IN THIS CASE. IT IS

01:46 - 23.489 A DENIAL AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE

01:46 - 24.679 LOOKING AT A DENIAL FOR

01:46 - 26.379 CULTURE RELATED THIS AND IF

01:46 - 28.559 THIS COURT WERE TO UPHOLD

01:46 - 30.339 WORKERS FIRST AND ON THE IT

01:46 - 32.439 WOULD DEPRIVE THE EMPLOYERS IN

01:46 - 33.769 THE INSURANCE COMPANIES OF THE

01:46 - 35.339 ABILITY TO DENY THINGS FOR

01:46 - 37.159 CULTURE RELATEDNESS I ADDRESS

01:46 - 38.160 THE ISSUE

01:46 - 42.109 ANKLE IN AN ASTHMA MEDICATION

01:46 - 43.909 BEFORE, AGAIN IT JUST HOLDS

01:46 - 46.189 THAT THERE WILL BE NO REMEDY AT

01:46 - 47.869 THAT POINT FOR THE ABILITY TO

01:46 - 50.129 USE A CALLS ARE RELATED MISSING

01:46 - 51.859 SOUNDS TO ME LIKE THE AND WHAT

01:46 - 53.629 YOU BOTH OUT OF LUCK. AND THE

01:46 - 55.739 QUESTION IS HOW ARE WE GOING TO

01:46 - 56.740 INTERPRET FOR.

01:46 - 00.180 AGAIN THERE'S THERE IS.

01:47 - 04.679 PROBABLY SAID ENOUGH. THANK

01:47 - 05.680 YOU.

01:47 - 16.089 NEXT CASE ON LIST AS NUMBER 30

01:47 - 17.090 COMMONWEALTH OF

01:47 - 20.130 VARIOUS AGENCIES

01:47 - 23.709 VERSUS MONSANTO COMPANY A INK

01:47 - 26.110 AND A FARM AISHA LLC.

01:47 - 31.800 THE COMMONWEALTH OF

01:47 - 32.839 PENNSYLVANIA THROUGH VARIOUS

01:47 - 34.429 AGENCIES HAS FILED A COMPLAINT

01:47 - 35.400 IN THIS COURT'S ORIGINAL

01:47 - 36.489 JURISDICTION AGAINST THE

01:47 - 38.019 DEFENDANTS ALLEGING THAT THEY

01:47 - 39.479 ARE LIABLE FOR DAMAGE TO THE

01:47 - 40.480 ENVIRONMENT

01:47 - 43.199 CALLS BY POLYCHLORINATED

01:47 - 46.399 BIPHENYLS OR PCBS DEFENDANTS

01:47 - 47.449 HAVE FILED PRELIMINARY

01:47 - 48.810 OBJECTIONS TO THE COMPLAINT

01:47 - 50.450 ARGUING THAT THE COMMONWEALTH

01:47 - 51.509 HAS BROUGHT THIS ACTION IN

01:47 - 52.779 ORDER TO CONVERT TRADITIONAL

01:47 - 54.270 COMMON-LAW TORT REMEDIES

01:47 - 56.149 INTO A NEW VEHICLE TO RECOVER

01:47 - 57.639 PURPORTED NATURAL RESOURCE

01:47 - 58.889 DAMAGES AND ENVIRONMENTAL

01:47 - 00.300 RESPONSE COSTS AGAINST

01:48 - 03.289 PRODUCT MANUFACTURER. DEFENSE

01:48 - 04.469 ALSO LED TO THE COMMONWEALTH

01:48 - 06.219 LACK STANDING THAT THE RELIEF

01:48 - 07.649 REQUESTED THE COMPLAINT WITH UP

01:48 - 08.729 AND THE PUBLIC NUISANCE

01:48 - 10.599 DOCTRINE AND PRODUCT LIABILITY

01:48 - 12.459 LAW BY EXPANDING THE PRODUCTS

01:48 - 13.819 MANUFACTURERS DUTY TO THE

01:48 - 15.009 PROTECTION OF THE ENVIRONMENT

01:48 - 17.119 AT LARGE FROM ITS PRODUCT LONG

01:48 - 18.040 AFTER IS LEFT THE

01:48 - 19.650 MANUFACTURERS CONTROL

01:48 - 21.089 DEFENDANTS ASSERT THAT THE

01:48 - 22.279 COMMONWEALTH IS EMPOWERED TO

01:48 - 23.150 PROCEED AGAINST THE

01:48 - 24.649 MANUFACTURER FOR ENVIRONMENTAL

01:48 - 26.139 HARM ALLEGEDLY CAUSED BY ITS

01:48 - 27.849 PRODUCT. THE AUTHORITY SHOULD

01:48 - 29.649 COME FROM LEGISLATION NOT

01:48 - 32.079 JUDICIAL INNOVATION. THE

01:48 - 33.469 COMMONWEALTH MAINTAINS THAT AS

01:48 - 34.679 A TRUSTEE WITH THE DUTY TO

01:48 - 36.619 PREVENT AND REMEDY HARM TO

01:48 - 37.869 PENNSYLVANIA'S PUBLIC NATURAL

01:48 - 39.789 RESOURCES. IT HAS STANDING TO

01:48 - 40.790 BRING THIS MATTER THROUGH ITS

01:48 - 41.130 PARENTS

01:48 - 43.289 PANTRY DOCTRINE AND AS THE SUN

01:48 - 44.509 POWER TO BRING AFFIRMATIVE

01:48 - 46.200 LITIGATION AGAINST DEFENDANTS

01:48 - 47.799 FOR THE HARM TO THE ENVIRONMENT

01:48 - 49.539 THAT WAS CAUSED BY THE PCB IS

01:48 - 50.599 THAT THE DEFENDANTS

01:48 - 51.600 MANUFACTURED.

01:48 - 54.919 GOOD MORNING ON THIS MAY PLEASE

01:48 - 56.089 THE COURT AND HE WAS CAN CO

01:48 - 57.459 KERR AND I REPRESENT THE

01:48 - 59.499 DEFENDANTS FARMACIAS SOLUTION

01:48 - 59.930 AND.

01:48 - 01.549 WAS THERE TO PULL THE MIC

01:49 - 03.370 DOWN TO THAT THANK YOU.

01:49 - 06.959 I'D LIKE TO RESERVE 3 MINUTES

01:49 - 08.450 REBUTTAL PLACE YOU HAVEN'T.

01:49 - 11.439 WE HAVE FOUND THE DEFENDANTS

01:49 - 13.209 HAVE DONE YOUR TO ALL OF THE

01:49 - 14.849 CLAIMS AND ALSO CHALLENGE

01:49 - 16.159 STANDING I'D LIKE TO CAN THE

01:49 - 17.660 TIME CONSTRAINTS FOCUS ON

01:49 - 19.000 STANDING AND THE

01:49 - 21.679 PUBLIC NUISANCE CLAIMED TIME

01:49 - 22.829 PERMITS ADDRESS THAN THE OTHER

01:49 - 23.830 CLAIMS.

01:49 - 25.979 YOUR HONOR'S THIS IS A

01:49 - 27.649 LAWSUIT WHERE THE COMMONWEALTH

01:49 - 29.189 IS ASKING THIS COURT TO

01:49 - 30.869 JUDICIALLY LEGISLATIVE

01:49 - 32.159 ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATION

01:49 - 33.950 AGAINST A PRODUCT MANUFACTURER.

01:49 - 35.919 AND AFTER THAT PRODUCT

01:49 - 37.629 MANUFACTURER CEASE PRODUCTION

01:49 - 40.489 40 YEARS AGO THE SUPREME COURT

01:49 - 42.269 COUNCILS COURTS TO EXERCISE

01:49 - 44.769 RESTRAINT AND MONSANTO AND THE

01:49 - 46.280 OTHER DEFENDANTS ADMIT THAT.

01:49 - 48.819 THIS COURT SHOULD

01:49 - 51.459 EXERCISE RESTRAINT AND DEFER TO

01:49 - 52.889 THE LEGISLATURE, PARTICULARLY

01:49 - 54.749 IN THIS AREA OF ENVIRONMENTAL

01:49 - 57.629 LEGISLATION. WITH RESPECT

01:49 - 00.229 TO STANDING THE COMMONWEALTH,

01:50 - 02.289 ASSERTS THE PARENTS COUNTRY

01:50 - 03.889 DOCTRINE AND ITS

01:50 - 07.559 STATUS AS THE PUBLIC TRUST AS A

01:50 - 09.759 TRUSTEE OF NATURAL RESOURCES

01:50 - 11.159 UNDER THE ENVIRONMENTAL RIGHTS

01:50 - 11.820 AMENDMENT OF

01:50 - 13.180 PENNSYLVANIA CONSTITUTION.

01:50 - 14.919 NEITHER OF WHICH PROVIDE THE

01:50 - 16.639 COMMONWEALTH STANDING APART

01:50 - 19.289 FROM THE ABATEMENT OTHER PUBLIC

01:50 - 22.039 NUISANCE THE PARENTS PATRY

01:50 - 24.609 DOCTRINE IS PURELY A CONCEPT OF

01:50 - 26.660 STANDING IT DOES NOT PROVIDE

01:50 - 29.259 SUBSTANTIVE RIGHTS AND IN THIS

01:50 - 31.229 CASE THERE ARE NO UNDERPINNING

01:50 - 33.569 SUBSTANTIVE RIGHTS. IN THE

01:50 - 35.080 PUBLIC TO VINDICATE

01:50 - 37.029 ENVIRONMENTAL DAMAGE AND OR THE

01:50 - 38.139 OTHER TOWARD THEORIES THAT THE

01:50 - 39.440 COMMONWEALTH HAS PLED.

01:50 - 42.270 THE CASE OF

01:50 - 43.869 THE COMMONWEALTH RELIES ON

01:50 - 45.330 COMMONWEALTH VERSUS TAP.

01:50 - 47.809 ACTUALLY DEMONSTRATES WHY THE

01:50 - 49.449 COMMONWEALTH LAX PARENTS PANTRY

01:50 - 51.759 STANDING IN THAT COMMONWEALTH

01:50 - 53.219 REALLY HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO

01:50 - 55.249 ENSURE ARE THE PUBLIC'S HEALTH

01:50 - 56.670 AND WELFARE AND SAFETY.

01:50 - 59.199 SO THE THE UNDER THE PARENTS

01:50 - 01.259 PETRY DOCTRINE BECAUSE THE

01:51 - 02.639 COMMONWEALTH'S TO DO TO ENSURE

01:51 - 04.239 HEALTH AND SAFETY ALONE IS

01:51 - 05.319 INSUFFICIENT AND THE

01:51 - 06.429 PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF

01:51 - 08.380 BANKING CASE DEMONSTRATES THAT

01:51 - 10.489 IT CITED IN OUR PAPERS THERE

01:51 - 12.319 HAS TO BE AN UNDERPINNING RIGHT

01:51 - 13.440 SUBSTANTIVE RIGHT.

01:51 - 15.499 FOR THE COMMONWEALTH RUSSERT

01:51 - 16.959 PARENTS PATRY STANDING BECAUSE

01:51 - 19.159 IT'S ITSELF DOESN'T IT'S NOT A

01:51 - 21.449 CAUSE OF ACTION. BUT EVEN 2 IN

01:51 - 24.369 THE EXECUTIVE AGENCIES DOING

01:51 - 26.649 FOR US AND UPHOLD THE LAWS THAT

01:51 - 27.650 THEY'RE EMPOWERED.

01:51 - 30.709 THAT WOULD BE THE LEGISLATIVE

01:51 - 32.259 SCHEME TO COPY THE EXECUTIVE

01:51 - 33.919 AGENCIES ARE EMPOWERED TO FORCE

01:51 - 35.279 THE LEGISLATIVE SCHEME HERE.

01:51 - 36.690 THE COMMONWEALTH IS ACTING

01:51 - 38.550 WITHOUT LEGISLATIVE AUTHORITY.

01:51 - 41.329 IT'S IT'S TRYING TO

01:51 - 43.239 DRAW UPON IF YOUR

01:51 - 45.349 PARENTS PATRY AUTHORITY AND THE

01:51 - 47.099 ENVIRONMENTAL RIGHTS STACHE A

01:51 - 48.509 CONSTITUTIONAL PROVISION

01:51 - 50.459 TO DIRECTLY ENFORCE

01:51 - 52.519 ENVIRONMENTAL A REGULATION

01:51 - 54.279 AGAINST A PRIVATE PARTY WITHOUT

01:51 - 55.929 ANY IMPLEMENTING LEGISLATION

01:51 - 56.979 FOR THEY'RE NOT THEY'RE NOT

01:51 - 58.559 ASSERTING A CAUSE OF ACTIONS

01:51 - 00.550 UNDER THE CLEAN STREAMS LAW OR.

01:52 - 01.630 OR HAS OR

01:52 - 03.059 SUBSTANCE CLEANUP, BUT THEY'RE

01:52 - 04.320 NOT DOING ANY STATUTE

01:52 - 06.849 WHICH IS USUALLY WHAT WE SEE IS

01:52 - 08.859 THESE IS IS THEM AND FORCING

01:52 - 10.340 THE STATUTORY SCHEMES THAT.

01:52 - 12.089 WE ARE BACKED BY THE GENERAL

01:52 - 13.479 ASSEMBLY PASSED BY SIGNED BY

01:52 - 15.709 THE GOVERNOR 2 REMEDY

01:52 - 17.119 THESE THINGS. I THINK THE

01:52 - 18.989 REALITY OF IT IS NONE OF THOSE

01:52 - 21.119 PROVIDE DAMAGES. THEY PROVIDE

01:52 - 23.159 CIVIL REMEDIES. OUR CIVIL

01:52 - 24.779 PENALTIES AND CRIMINAL

01:52 - 26.359 PENALTIES. BUT THEY DON'T

01:52 - 27.829 REALLY PROVIDE THE DAMAGES

01:52 - 28.740 WHICH IS REALLY WHAT THE

01:52 - 30.030 COMMONWEALTH THE SEEKING.

01:52 - 32.559 IN THIS CASE WHICH IS WHY I

01:52 - 33.560 THINK THEY'VE ELECTED TO TRY

01:52 - 34.761 AND BRING THESE 2 ARE REMEDIES

01:52 - 35.680 WERE THEORIES.

01:52 - 37.959 CORRECTED THE ENVIRONMENTAL

01:52 - 39.480 THE REGULATORY SCHEME.

01:52 - 42.199 DOES NOT REGULATE PRAGUE MANY

01:52 - 43.419 FACTORS IN THE WAY THAT THEY'RE

01:52 - 45.279 TRYING TO USE COMMON LA TORRE

01:52 - 46.470 TO DO IN THIS CASE.

01:52 - 48.659 SO THEY'RE WELL THEY DO THEY DO

01:52 - 49.410 IF THE PRICE. THE

01:52 - 50.860 PRODUCT MANUFACTURER.

01:52 - 52.809 DAMAGES THE ENVIRONMENT IN

01:52 - 54.169 THE CONTEXT OF MANUFACTURING

01:52 - 55.459 THE PRODUCT OR DISPOSING THE

01:52 - 57.079 PRODUCT OR THINGS LIKE THAT IS

01:52 - 58.600 NOT A CASE ABOUT MENU

01:53 - 02.099 DISCHARGE FOR SPILLAGE FOR

01:53 - 03.439 DUMPING THIS IS A

01:53 - 08.050 CASE ABOUT AN ATTEMPT REGULATE

01:53 - 09.010 THE

01:53 - 11.579 THE USE AND THE PURE USE OF THE

01:53 - 13.639 PRODUCT THAT EVENTUALLY ENDS UP

01:53 - 15.589 IN IN THE ENVIRONMENT. IT'S

01:53 - 16.590 NOT ABOUT.

01:53 - 19.009 A NEW MANUFACTURING PROCESS

01:53 - 20.579 THAT DISCHARGED IT ISN'T THAT

01:53 - 22.529 PART OF THE QUESTION IS HOW DID

01:53 - 23.969 HE GET INTO THE ENVIRONMENT,

01:53 - 25.459 THE REPRESENTATIONS THAT WERE

01:53 - 27.289 MADE BY THE COMPANY REGARDING

01:53 - 28.290 THE PRODUCT.

01:53 - 30.509 AND TO THE USER'S AND THE

01:53 - 32.860 HARM THAT RESULTED THEY'RE FROM

01:53 - 35.299 NEEDS NOT SO. CUT

01:53 - 37.689 AND DRY. YOU JUST AS FAR AS

01:53 - 39.329 THOSE SUBSTANTIVE CLAIMS FOR

01:53 - 40.220 INSTANCE, THE PUBLIC

01:53 - 41.220 NUISANCE CLAIMS.

01:53 - 45.289 THE THAT IS BASED ON. THE

01:53 - 48.269 GENERATION OF PCP EASE AS A

01:53 - 50.119 PRODUCT DISTRIBUTION OF PCBS AS

01:53 - 51.909 A PRODUCT. THEY DO THE

01:53 - 53.610 COMMONWEALTH DOES ASSERT SOME.

01:53 - 57.679 ALLEGATIONS ABOUT DECEIVE

01:53 - 59.809 OR DECEPTION BUT THE TO THE

01:53 - 01.420 PENNSYLVANIA DEPARTMENT OF

01:54 - 04.059 PROTECTION, NEW HAD TO KNOW OR

01:54 - 05.060 KNEW OF.

01:54 - 07.389 THE ENVIRONMENTAL REGULATION OF

01:54 - 09.410 PCBS WHICH BEGAN IN THE

01:54 - 13.399 1970'S AND THE THAT MONTHS AND

01:54 - 14.400 2 IN FACT.

01:54 - 18.049 CEASE PRODUCTION OF PCBS CAN

01:54 - 19.480 USE IN 1970

01:54 - 21.009 AND THEN SEIZE PRODUCTION AND

01:54 - 22.449 THEN VOLUNTARILY WITHDREW

01:54 - 24.349 PRODUCTION OF THE CITY PCBS FOR

01:54 - 26.880 ALL USES IN 1976.

01:54 - 29.849 AND WAS OUT AS A RESULT

01:54 - 32.839 OF CONGRESS TAKING ACTION AND

01:54 - 33.840 OUTLAWING IT.

01:54 - 37.160 THE COMPANY

01:54 - 38.879 INITIALLY BEGIN ITS OWN

01:54 - 40.829 INTERNAL PROCESS TO SCALE BACK

01:54 - 42.589 AND PHASE OUT THE USE OF PCBS

01:54 - 44.209 AFTER THE DETECTION OF PCBS IN

01:54 - 45.210 THE ENVIRONMENT.

01:54 - 46.070 AND EVENTUALLY AT

01:54 - 48.109 CONVERGED WITH ENVIRONMENTAL

01:54 - 49.879 REGULATION IN THE BAN ON PCBS

01:54 - 51.429 BODY. THE TOXIC SUBSTANCES

01:54 - 53.160 CONTROL ACT IN 1978.

01:54 - 55.869 BUT WE LOOK AT WHETHER THERE

01:54 - 57.759 HAD BEEN A CONTINUING NATURE

01:54 - 59.590 CONDUCT CONTINUE NATURE.

01:55 - 02.069 AND WEATHER IT PRODUCED A

01:55 - 03.439 PERMANENT OR LONG LASTING

01:55 - 06.339 EFFECT UNDER THE SAND AS

01:55 - 08.529 FAR AS AGAIN AS FAR AS PUBLIC

01:55 - 10.549 NUISANCE LIABILITY GOES MONTHS

01:55 - 12.850 AND HIS CONDUCT CEASED.

01:55 - 15.919 WHEN IT CEASED PRODUCING PCB

01:55 - 17.099 THESE WHAT ARE YOU SAYING

01:55 - 19.279 CONDUCT DOESN'T CONTROL THEY

01:55 - 21.759 STOPPED DISPENSING IT THEY STOP

01:55 - 23.629 PRODUCING PC BEANS, ALL THAT

01:55 - 24.809 THEY THEY REALLY PUSHED THE

01:55 - 26.919 START OF THAT WOULD BE IGNORING

01:55 - 28.579 THAT THE CONCEPT OF THE

01:55 - 29.790 LONG-TERM EFFECT.

01:55 - 32.539 OF THE NEWS AFTER IT

01:55 - 34.809 HAD CONTINUED. THERE IS ON THE

01:55 - 35.959 MARKET UP UNTIL

01:55 - 38.209 THAT POINT THERE IS NO UNDER

01:55 - 40.049 PENNSYLVANIA LAW SUAREZ PUBLIC

01:55 - 40.450 NUISANCE

01:55 - 42.779 LAW GOES THERE'S NO DUTY

01:55 - 43.919 THERE'S NO PUBLIC NUISANCE

01:55 - 46.310 LIABILITY. 4

01:55 - 48.599 A DEFENDANT AFTER THE NEWS IS

01:55 - 49.430 CAUSING INSTRUMENT

01:55 - 51.719 HOWDY HAS. AFTER THE DEFENDANT

01:55 - 53.129 HAS RELINQUISHED CONTROL OVER

01:55 - 54.479 THE NUISANCE CAUSING INSTRUMENT

01:55 - 55.909 HALLADAY HER EAST A NON-CITIZEN

01:55 - 56.910 SAY THAT.

01:55 - 58.799 PENNSYLVANIA LAW DOES THIS

01:55 - 00.919 COURT'S DECISION AND YES TO US

01:56 - 02.709 AND IN THAT CASE THE CLAIM WAS

01:56 - 04.569 THE DEFENDING CREATED A NOXIOUS

01:56 - 06.509 SUBSTANCE WHICH EVENTUALLY WORK

01:56 - 07.749 ITS WAY INTO THE ENVIRONMENT

01:56 - 08.999 SAYS SHOULD BE HELD RESPONSIBLE

01:56 - 10.889 FOR IT. AND THIS COURT REJECTED

01:56 - 12.699 THAT ARGUMENT AND SAID

01:56 - 14.459 THE CAUSE WE DEFEND IT NO

01:56 - 15.639 LONGER HAD CONTROL OVER THE

01:56 - 17.069 SUBSTANCE COULD NOT BE HELD

01:56 - 18.370 LIABLE FOR NUISANCE

01:56 - 19.819 AND THE DEFENSE SUBMIT THAT

01:56 - 21.260 THIS COURT SHOULD FOLLOW THAT

01:56 - 23.339 THE D A S DECISION AND

01:56 - 25.089 CONSISTENT WITH DS HOLD A

01:56 - 26.249 PUBLIC NUISANCE DOESN'T

01:56 - 28.559 LIVE FOR PRODUCT MANUFACTURER

01:56 - 30.009 AGAINST A PRODUCT MANUFACTURER

01:56 - 31.359 AFTER HIM HAS RELINQUISHED

01:56 - 32.600 CONTROL OF ITS PRODUCT.

01:56 - 34.929 ONE OF THEIR ALLEGATION THAT

01:56 - 36.259 COME FROM ENDING COMPLAINT

01:56 - 38.749 CONCERNING HOW THE COMPANY WAS